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Patrick Klepek: "Writing about VR is a giant waste of time" (in terms of website business)

Wollan

Wollan

Mostly Positive
Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,814
Norway but living in France
I thought Patrick wrote an interesting and on point review about Moss for PSVR where he in addition jumps into the practical (or rather, impractical) aspects of the current generation of VR headsets.
He also talks about the business side of running a website and why we are seeing so few articles and reviews from the mainstream outlets.
It's an interesting read and it touches upon the issues many VR enthusiasts (and non-enthusiasts) have.



The review article: https://waypoint.vice.com/en_us/art...ey-buying-a-vr-headset?utm_source=wptwitterus
 
MattAces

MattAces

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,212
Malaysia
This might be a breach of privacy but since this was shared in the subreddit of psvr, I'll just share it anyway.
Not my image of course.
DWt374iVQAEKs8K.jpg
DWt374qVQAAikla.jpg
 
tomofthepops

tomofthepops

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,547
Isn't this a chicken and egg situation ? You don't write vr reviews because no one reads them but poeple need reviews of vr games to consider buying a vr headset.
 
Shauni

Shauni

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,728
tomofthepops said:
Isn't this a chicken and egg situation ? You don't write vr reviews because no one reads them but poeple need reviews of vr games to consider buying a vr headset.
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There was definitely more VR content in the beginning, but I think it's tapered off because not many people read about after the initial hype was over.
 
HandsomeCharles

HandsomeCharles

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,918
tomofthepops said:
Isn't this a chicken and egg situation ? You don't write vr reviews because no one reads them but poeple need reviews of vr games to consider buying a vr headset.
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I don't think people particularly need reviews right now to consider buying, they need a hefty price drop.

Of course, a "Killer App" would go a long way to driving interest, but the fact of the matter is that these setups cost at least the same amount of money as a console, without nearly the same level of support. For the average consumer, that isn't a good deal.

Although I understand how unrealistic the proposition is, in my own opinion I would not consider buying a VR headset/setup for anything more than £100. I would not be surprised if several others feel the same.
 
funky

funky

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,527
We are nearly 2 years out from Rift and Vive launch and the initial excitement has subsided.

VR didnt blow up into a huge must have thing (that was never the plan for the first gen) so now are in a cycle. No one is really buying VR games because no one is really releasing notable interesting VR games so no one is really looking for coverage of VR games.


Maybe this is just the state of things until whatever next gen VR comes and we get another big push from the VR platform holders.
 
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Haunted

Haunted

Banned
Nov 3, 2017
2,737
It's a damning sign when virtually all of the most interesting/relevant articles I've read about VR lately have come from the VR developers themselves on their personal/studio blogs. No outside/third party sources aside from individual user/forum impressions.

But yeah, there's no sense for traffic-driven journalist websites to cover something which has no audience. Also see: why many movie reviewers have stopped giving impressions on how well the 3D is implemented in a 3D movie, something they spent a great deal of time on when 3D was still new.

After the new!! factor has worn off and the market hasn't embraced something, it's tough to still find reasons to write about it on traffic-driven websites.

Eurogamer (or was it RPS?) had an interesting article up discussing why they created dozens and dozens of low-to-medium-effort Fallout 4 features (the first 10 minutes, 5 tips to get you started, 10 things you didn't know, 5 easter eggs you've missed, 10 most overpowered weapons etc etc etc) while many other games went completely without coverage - because even the 53rd article about Fallout 4 generated so much more attention and clicks than the first about an interesting indie-game released during that timeframe did.
 
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Aztechnology

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,138
Static said:
It needs to be in journo's interest to incubate that egg though. And I can't think why it would be.
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It's a business when we're talking about the waypoint or IGN level. They won't do it. It will basically come down to smaller niche networks, like youtubers. It also doesn't help that VR outside of a few titles hasn't had a lot worth talking about recently. Something like Sprint Vector is a blast, but it doesn't indicate strong industry support. Bethesda is pretty much it on that front. And it was a relatively safe bet for them. (Well at least lower risk than making a new game/ IP with VR in mind). Obviously what we need is more titles that can be played with or without VR made by larger studios. Capcom was a splash in the pond with RE7, which it still hasn't even talked about for PC over a year later.
 

Deleted member 21693

User requested account closure
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Oct 28, 2017
4,139
I wonder how many people watch Giant Bomb's VRodeo to learn about potential VR purchases and how many are just "let's see people do dumb stuff in VR".

It's really interesting to see how the media's hype bubble for VR just imploded post release. Not surprising at all, though.
 
Shinobido Heart

Shinobido Heart

Member
Dec 23, 2017
8,123
I own a PSVR and an Oculus Rift. I bought the PSVR about a month after launch and had a lot of fun. After a year, I bought the Oculus Rift. Unfortunately, my PSVR now collects dust.

The only time I read VR game reviews was when I hung out at the PSVR sub reddit daily. Of course, I don't do that anymore as I spend so much time on the Oculus Rift.
 

Deleted member 23094

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,217
I was absolutely blown away by VR when I first tried it, then after a few weeks I just found it to be a hassle and haven't touched it since. It's just not good enough as it is, every aspect needs to be improved.
 
scourge_of_tirany

scourge_of_tirany

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
362
User Banned (3 days): Console wars post, thread derail, driveby
I love how klepek or vice write about all ramdom Things and talking about vr is now a waste of Time, sure dude.sure

And lol to. People who said there are not interesting releases on vr when moss its one of the best games of early 2018

Sometimes i wish Nintendo was the creator of some. Vr console to see. How the double standars will Apply to this tech
 
Brink

Brink

Member
Dec 18, 2017
512
I'd be interested to know which articles get the moat clicks (and are therefore worthwhile). My suspicion is that it would not be what we'd 'want' to be popular content.
 
Evolution of Metal

Evolution of Metal

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
tomofthepops said:
Isn't this a chicken and egg situation ? You don't write vr reviews because no one reads them but poeple need reviews of vr games to consider buying a vr headset.
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More like the amount of hype for launch VR games was ludicrous. It amounted to a few ok games and a bunch mediocre garbage which was $20, $30 and even $40. However, every game had potential to reinvent gaming if you bought into the hype.

2 year into the headset lifecycle Valve hasn't announced anything more than the fact that they are working (maybe, but who knows) on those 3 VR games. You have to keep pumping the information and hype into the press in order to interest the public, small indie studios making VR games is a boring story. Sony is fading with their VR hype, gotta pump those announcements and trailers if you want to interest people.
 
El-Suave

El-Suave

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,831
Altano does a great job covering VR on their podcast. At Easy Allies Kyle Bosman plays some PS VR games but you have to wait till he's on their Frame Trap podcast to hear about it since he doesn't review games.
There are many releases still but traditional reviews aren't the best way to cover them. You have to look hard to find the few gems that are still coming out, but the experience is still a bit personal. Quite frankly a lot of stuff that comes out is average at best and the incentive to read middling reviews just isn't there.
 
Fahzzy

Fahzzy

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Jan 21, 2018
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VR is strange. It certainly feels great to sit in a car at high speeds and experience that immersion. However, it is not something I want to experience very often. It's cumbersome, can give you a headache, can't wear glasses easily, games often require tinkering, etc. The only time I whip out VR is when I have a full day of nothing to do. This is coming from a dude that plays at least 4 hours of games a day.
 
Acidote

Acidote

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Oct 26, 2017
4,973
I have used VR and liked it to a certain degree, but since I don't have one I skip everything VR related until/unless it becomes a mass product.
 

Deleted member 18568

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VR by it's own nature needs to be experienced; not written or talked about by others.

I wouldn't see why anyone would actively cover anything but the major news makers (new player enters market, Kojima making a VR exclusive game) or B2B news (M&A activity).
 
Potterson

Potterson

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,414
1. You write about VR games.
2. No one reads it.
3. You stop writing about VR games unless something really big is happening.

Yup.
 
TheFireman

TheFireman

Banned
Dec 22, 2017
3,918
What about VR on Youtube channels? VR is something difficult to understand without experiencing, and while Youtube doesn't do a perfect job showcasing VR, it certainly does better than just words and pictures.

I think VR's probably going hit a downward curve before it spikes up again. It's currently too expensive, and the technology's so close to being where it needs to be. But it's not where it needs to be yet, especially for the price and time commitment needed. 5-15 years and it'll be huge.
 
TSM

TSM

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Oct 27, 2017
5,823
I think the biggest issue is that traditional reviews aren't the primary vehicle people get their information about games from any more. A traditional review for an extremely niche audience like VR is unlikely to get much traffic.

KonFot said:
It's really interesting to see how the media's hype bubble for VR just imploded post release. Not surprising at all, though.
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I think there are a few factors that VR needs to solve. Pricing needs to be far more reasonable. There need to be killer apps. The headsets need to be completely wireless. The technology is apt to make people motion sick. And lastly there's the one I'm not it's possible to overcome. People just don't like having things on their face. Look at what people will go through with contact lenses and lasik just to avoid having to wear glasses. The technology as currently conceived is a non starter for most of the population.
 
Mechaplum

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Oct 26, 2017
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To be honest VR demos informs purchases helluva lot more than reading about it because it's heavily leaned into the whole experience of it. I mean I can read all about Moss for instance and wouldn't be too interested but the demo blew me away immediately.
 
SageShinigami

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Oct 27, 2017
30,472
scourge_of_tirany said:
You nailed, people Just want to pile on on vr
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How did you miss this? Those people during E3 saying "Why is Sony wasting our time with a VR segment?" Are the reason Klepek said these articles don't make money. People aren't interested.

IDreamOfHime said:
...while Kinda Funny just started a VR specific show.
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Cult of personality. I'll eventually watch KF's show because I wanna see Greg, Andy, Nick, etc. I don't care about VR.

News sites don't get that privilege. That's why Greg's doing it, he's trying to help push VR.
 
Raijinto

Raijinto

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scourge_of_tirany said:
I love how klepek or vice write about all ramdom Things and talking about vr is now a waste of Time, sure dude.sure

And lol to. People who said there are not interesting releases on vr when moss its one of the best games of early 2018

Sometimes i wish Nintendo was the creator of some. Vr console to see. How the double standars will Apply to this tech
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...what?

What are you saying in that last part in particular?
 
Laser Man

Laser Man

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Oct 26, 2017
2,683
VR coverage is basically a few dedicated youtubers, that's where I mostly get my impressions of games from.
 
pagrab

pagrab

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Oct 27, 2017
1,005
I guess that it became a niche thing. I own PSVR and Oculus Rift but stopped expecting major sites to cover them. I go to Reddit subfora and to Upload VR.
 
TSM

TSM

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Oct 27, 2017
5,823
Evolution of Metal said:
Probably a strange way to express the idea that gamers don't see Facebook or HTC as the leaders of gaming. Wii U happened, but Nintendo pushing VR would result in way more people being interested in it.
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I wouldn't hold my breath on Nintendo supporting VR. I'm sure the last thing they want is their brand being linked to families experiencing extreme motion sickness with a new product.
 

Pokémon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,681
scourge_of_tirany said:
I love how klepek or vice write about all ramdom Things and talking about vr is now a waste of Time, sure dude.sure

And lol to. People who said there are not interesting releases on vr when moss its one of the best games of early 2018

Sometimes i wish Nintendo was the creator of some. Vr console to see. How the double standars will Apply to this tech
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Yeah because Nintendo have never failed with their "innovative" consoles before right? Virtual Boy and Wii U want to have a word with you.
 
Brau

Brau

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Oct 26, 2017
283
Finland
I have been very keen to write a thread about my experience with VR. How 90% of people that try our game think its one of the most immersive and fun experiences they've tried and yet, VR is not for a casual consumer and even the most excited people are not that invested into it.

I think it would make an interesting thread that no one would read.
 

Deleted member 2652

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scourge_of_tirany said:
I love how klepek or vice write about all ramdom Things and talking about vr is now a waste of Time, sure dude.sure

And lol to. People who said there are not interesting releases on vr when moss its one of the best games of early 2018

Sometimes i wish Nintendo was the creator of some. Vr console to see. How the double standars will Apply to this tech
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Do you have data that proves otherwise?
 

Deleted member 21693

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TSM said:
I think the biggest issue is that traditional reviews aren't the primary vehicle people get their information about games from any more. A traditional review for an extremely niche audience like VR is unlikely to get much traffic.



I think there are a few factors that VR needs to solve. Pricing needs to be far more reasonable. There need to be killer apps. The headsets need to be completely wireless. The technology is apt to make people motion sick. And lastly there's the one I'm not it's possible to overcome. People just don't like having things on their face. Look at what people will go through with contact lenses and lasik just to avoid having to wear glasses. The technology as currently conceived is a non starter for most of the population.
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The current state of VR isn't surprising at all. It still follows basic economic principles. Tech needs to get cheaper and better. That takes time. It's just how new technologies evolve into mainstream-ready products.

It's just funny to me how media went all-in on VR that early, to the point of users getting annoyed even. And look where we are now.
 
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