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Star Trek Franchise |OT| To Boldly Go.....
- Thread starter Deleted member 3812
- Start date
Strange New Worlds cast announcements:
trekmovie.com
Five Cast Members For ‘Star Trek: Strange New Worlds’ Announced
Watch a video of the new cast talking about boarding the Enterprise.
trekmovie.com
Judging by the comment about Star Trek: Prodigy, most of you aren't looking forward to it. I think it seems really neat. Though I don't think it's set in the distant future. I think it's set far in space from the federation. They find a ship, I think it's a Starfleet ship. And I think it's emergency command hologram is based on Janeway, and she teaches the kids the Star Fleet way it a rough and tumble part of the galaxy.
Kate said that it's has a great plot arc for season 1 and excellent writing. And I can completely see myself buying toys of those characters for my kids at Christmas.
Kate said that it's has a great plot arc for season 1 and excellent writing. And I can completely see myself buying toys of those characters for my kids at Christmas.
Not a lot of new information in the synopsis. Intended for the general public rather than forumsdwellers, I suppose.
That's a neat idea. I'll check Prodigy out, but it'll be secondary to a season of Disco/Picard/SNW, similar to how I watched Lower Decks only after Disco season 3.
That's a neat idea. I'll check Prodigy out, but it'll be secondary to a season of Disco/Picard/SNW, similar to how I watched Lower Decks only after Disco season 3.
i am, i'm just not sold on the art style which look a bit bleh hopefully it looks fine in motion
That would make sense why no humans at least, I'm looking forward to it
I kind of agree, although SNW is filling me with a rather unhealthy amount of hope that it's going to be the episodic, adventure of the week, mini morality play series that Trek is meant to be.
Can't wait for the synopsis so I can see if the plot for episode 2 is going to be mostly unrelated to episode 1!
I'm pretty sure the Galaxy is going to be in danger and Pike has exactly 10 episodes to save everyone before the Cyborgulans kill them all. :)
Goddamn it...
Still, if they're going to do episode of the week, this is the series to do it in. We already know where Spock and Pike wind up, so play around with the universe. Even the title implies that they're going back to the roots of Trek.
Or they spend a season explaining how Control evolved into the Borg. DAMN YOU MODERN TREK WRITERS!!!
they already said it's gonna be episodic
STRANGE NEW WORLDS To Be 'More Episodic' STAR TREK Series, Says Akiva Goldsman, With 'Closed-Ended' Stories
STAR TREK: STRANGE NEW WORLDS producer Akiva Goldsman talks about how the new series' storytelling will be different from DISCOVERY and PICARD
blog.trekcore.com
Oh thank goodness. The nice benefit here is that if a story doesn't work, they aren't tied to it for an entire season.they already said it's gonna be episodic
STRANGE NEW WORLDS To Be 'More Episodic' STAR TREK Series, Says Akiva Goldsman, With 'Closed-Ended' Stories
STAR TREK: STRANGE NEW WORLDS producer Akiva Goldsman talks about how the new series' storytelling will be different from DISCOVERY and PICARD
Not officially. However this is looking like it was on the money:
The name's are place holders used for casting. Biodun can only really be DoctorM'benga
So...if we're assuming that Biodun is actually M'benga...is Yeboah actually Uhura? If I was writing a modern character synopsis for her, it might kind of sound like that.
And is Miller Nurse Chapel? Hopefully played by Rebecca Romijn in a blond wig? ;)
Lots of people are assuming that Yeboah is Uhura. It's very similar to Uhura's character from the Kelvin verse
And miss Jess Bush's aussie accent? I hope not!
Lol...it was a play on Majel Barrett playing both Number One and Nurse Chapel. I am really wondering if we're getting multiple TOS characters though. There's nothing that says Uhura or Chapel didn't serve under Pike. M'benga would be kind of an odd one though. In TOS it was never stated but assumed that he was the second in command of medical under McCoy, and he was the resident Vulcan expert. It would be a bit odd if he was CMO on the Enterprise and then was under McCoy. But who knows!
Honestly it'd be kind of interesting to suggest that parts of Kirk's crew for the five year mission, beyond just Spock, were holdovers of Pike's crew. Like, you had a mix of people who were familiar with the ship, and then whoever Kirk could convince to join him for his first command, along with whatever additions Starfleet Command wanted to make.
It'd be a subtle thing, but I feel like would kinda be a neat touch to add to the background on how these things work, in-universe.
It would also feel far more realistic than the way it was handled in ST09. That was and still is one of my biggest gripes with the movie - the idea that pretty much the entire bridge crew were cadets together in the academy. It feels very "kid's show". It's like "hey Cadet Kirk, great job! We're going to make you a Captain, letting you skip years of training and experience! Oh, and hey, Cadet Chekov, great job on that midair beaming stuff! We're going to make you an Ensign!" There are no organizations that use a rank structure like Starfleet that would put someone into a position of authority and responsibility without years of experience. That one thing takes me out of the movie, and the universe, completely. I always preferred the way TOS approached it. Even though there wasn't a lot of backstory for the characters, there were enough hints that there was history and experience that they had gained through years of work.
Howdy! Sorry to chime in late here.
You encouraged me to seek out other parts of Trek in the Discovery thread some time ago. I'm still just beginning to get through the franchise, but I decided to start with TNG and have just wrapped up Family. First I wanted to say thanks for the guide you gave in the other thread and the encouragement to power through S1 of TNG. I actually ended up only skipping a couple of episodes, and didn't skip a single one in S2. I found most of S2 rather enjoyable. Secondly, I'm glad I bothered. TNG really does get better, and I must say that despite my newness to Trek, Yesterday's Enterprise has taken the spot as my favorite episode yet. It alone has made the watch worth it, and I'm nowhere near done!
I'm watching pretty casually, only a few episodes a week, so no clue when I will ever finish, but I am thoroughly enjoying the ride.
Anyway, obviously the Borg episodes of S3 and S4 (plus Family) are landmarks for the series and the entire universe. Finally getting to experience them made me want to reach out and say thanks.
Awesome! I'm really glad you're enjoying it! It's such a cool series. It's simultaneously comfort food TV, and smart, and thought provoking at the same time.
You'll be getting into DS9 before you know it!
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Battlefield promotions have always been a thing.....but yeah usually not in that quantity or for such a giant jump like Kirk got. Jumping to Ensign is plausible tho.
That's my problem with it. If they'd said at the hearing at the end of the movie that they were giving him a promotion out of the Academy to Lieutenant, I'd be ok with that. But you simply don't give a guy with a couple of days of actual experience in anything his own command, place the lives of the people under him in his hands and say "have fun and don't screw up!"
The thing is, I was in the Navy. I experienced good leadership and bad leadership. Good leaders aren't blessed by fate or destined to be Captains. They work hard, they make mistakes, and more importantly, they learn from those mistakes. Kirk in ST09 (and ID) was the worst sort of leader. The kind who is just sort of given leadership, makes mistakes, and rather than learning from them, is rewarded again, with no actual lessons being imparted. That's not the Kirk who inspired me as a kid. Kirk in TOS was an aspirational leader, who had flaws, made mistakes, but took those lessons and learned to become a better leader. He was not a cadet who was given a command because he knew the right guy (Pike) and had a destiny and a bloodline. He worked hard for it and earned it.
That's why that sticks in my craw so much. Lol
I can agree with that. Everything about the reboot movies was bad, although Pine was good casting. Quinto wasn't though.
I think the casting in those movies was fine across the board, even Quinto (unless he was being forced to do the Kaaaaaaaaaahn scream), but they weren't given good material to work with. Beyond was perhaps the closest to what I was looking for out of the reboots - a fun, two hour adventure featuring the crew working together in a story that wouldn't have felt out of place on one of the series - but the fact that it wasted two movies to get there was a shame. Well, wasted a movie and a half. There are parts of 09 I genuinely like, such as the beginning with the Kelvin (still the best looking ship, inside and out, in the Kevinverse), the Kobayashi Maru test, and the arrival at Vulcan and finding the fleet destroyed. All good stuff.
Pikes lil speech to convince kirk to sign up was great. 09 is the best of the three though, without doubt.
Just not the best material.
Casting felt pretty good across the board tbh.
Just not the best material.
Beyond is my favorite of the three. 09 turned me off for reasons I stated above, but you're right, Pike's speech was pretty good. If that had led to an arc where Kirk, you know, actually earned the Captain's Chair, it would even be great. The less said about Into Darkness, the better.
Still hate quinto!
Y'all don't have to agree, but I'd argue nimoy's spock showed more character in a single eyebrow raise than quinto showed in the entirely of trying to embody the role so far.
Y'all don't have to agree, but I'd argue nimoy's spock showed more character in a single eyebrow raise than quinto showed in the entirely of trying to embody the role so far.
I still wish we were in a universe where they'd gone with the 'montage of Kirk's career leading to him becoming Captain' ending that was originally proposed for 09. Like, it wouldn't have taken much and would have been the classier way out
Oh, without a doubt. I don't think there's an actor alive that can do what Nimoy did with Spock. Most people's eyebrow can't do what his did, and then there was his VOICE. Granted, his voice was the result of many years of heavy smoking, but it had a gravitas to it that is very rare. When he'd throw out a low, gravelly "Jim", you knew things were serious.
I don't think Quinto did a bad job, I just think he had giant shoes to fill, and it didn't help that Nimoy was in the same movie for a direct 1 to 1 comparison. I kind of like Ethan Peck's take, but I also wish they'd let him keep the beard.
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09 had its issues but it was generally a solid mass market action-y table setter. But of course since JJA is creatively bankrupt they had to go straight to an unearned 9/11 Truther Khan right after.
I've been making my way though the Star Trek shows, and I just finished Deep Space Nine. And I got to say, the Dominion War sucked. Like, all of it.
None of it made any sense, basically. Attempts to create drama or exciting action scenes were pointless when none of it mattered. Federation destroyed the Dominion drug factory and later the shipyards, but it had no impact on anything. I guess they did give them a planet where they could make more drugs to postpone the war, but you'd think that would have been their first target once hostilities broke out. To add some more drama we are told Betazed has fallen. "Hey, that's Troi's planet!" one might think, but nah, nothing happened. The whole idea of a "front line" in space in ridiculous anyway, or being bogged down in a single star system like with those Cardassian defensive platforms. Go around it, it's fucking space.
Of course the ending was the absolute worst. First there is the hilarious Breen-asspull, where a bunch of discount Bobba Fetts are supposed to be a threat. Then Space Hitler just decided to call it quits after linking with Odo because of, what? It wasn't the first time Odo linked with other changelings and every other time the reaction was pretty much "Oh Odo, you only care about the solids because you want to bang Kira," but somehow this time it was different? After linking the female changeling must also know the sickness was created by the Federation (I doubt she makes a distinction for Section 31, which is also another thing that was total trash, but whatever), but this was apparently not important enough to even be mentioned. The Founders really seem like the sort of people who will look past an attempted genocide against them.
Add all the Prophets/Chosen One Sisko bullshit, and I am shocked so many people seem to think this show was better than The Next Generation.
None of it made any sense, basically. Attempts to create drama or exciting action scenes were pointless when none of it mattered. Federation destroyed the Dominion drug factory and later the shipyards, but it had no impact on anything. I guess they did give them a planet where they could make more drugs to postpone the war, but you'd think that would have been their first target once hostilities broke out. To add some more drama we are told Betazed has fallen. "Hey, that's Troi's planet!" one might think, but nah, nothing happened. The whole idea of a "front line" in space in ridiculous anyway, or being bogged down in a single star system like with those Cardassian defensive platforms. Go around it, it's fucking space.
Of course the ending was the absolute worst. First there is the hilarious Breen-asspull, where a bunch of discount Bobba Fetts are supposed to be a threat. Then Space Hitler just decided to call it quits after linking with Odo because of, what? It wasn't the first time Odo linked with other changelings and every other time the reaction was pretty much "Oh Odo, you only care about the solids because you want to bang Kira," but somehow this time it was different? After linking the female changeling must also know the sickness was created by the Federation (I doubt she makes a distinction for Section 31, which is also another thing that was total trash, but whatever), but this was apparently not important enough to even be mentioned. The Founders really seem like the sort of people who will look past an attempted genocide against them.
Add all the Prophets/Chosen One Sisko bullshit, and I am shocked so many people seem to think this show was better than The Next Generation.
Although I enjoyed the Dominion stuff more than you, I'd still agree the overall story is poorly plotted and mostly exists to push the characters around similar to later TV shows like Lost, BSG and the current Treks.
That said, DS9 is mostly loved for its more self contained episodes, so I think you may have been overly dissappointed by listening to fans that over-hyped the Dominion War for wierd internet reasons (i.e. to dunk on Voyager).
I didn't even know that was a consideration. It makes so much more sense than what we got... did they think people wouldn't get it?
The writers didn't really have series-long plans for DS9 and it shows, add the fact that Berman absolutely hated serialization and pushed back on their attempts to go full serialized which also had an impact (although many of the best episodes of the series are standalone episodes, so perhaps he wasn't wrong).
As for the end of the war... wasn't the idea that the Founders surrendered because it was the only way to get the cure, and then Odo's hope was that he'd try to to convince the others not to fear 'solids' anymore?
Either way, Odo's actions did have consequences in the fictional season 8 books, but they probably didn't give it much thought about what happened after either. The fact that Behr and Moore left Trek shortly after is another sign of that too.
It was, IIRC, wrapped up partly in the idea of getting Shatner onboard to provide narration to play over it. Ie, one last message to Spock Prime, reflecting back on his career as a parallel for his counterpart's future, sorta deal. The biggest problem was that at the time Shatner had something of a moratorium on doing cameo roles, which kinda nixed it. That said, you don't really need Shatner's narration for such a concept, it just gets undercut a bit in its absence
I don't know if it needed Shatner at all, really. But oh well.
Presumably the plan was for Pine to continue playing the character, so why no have him do a similar voiceover? I always thought it could have been handle very simply.
- Kirk leaves the Academy and is heading for his first actual posting on a ship that is not the Enterprise. The Farragut, maybe?
- He longingly looks over and sees the Enterprise under repair in space dock.
- Cut to black. A card says "Ten Years Later". You hear Spock say "Welcome back, Captain Kirk"
- Then the scene where Kirk walks aboard the bridge and takes command.
Add some dialogue at the Starfleet hearing at the end about Kirk's natural talent for command and how he'll make a fine Captain someday, and it's good to go. No Shatner required.
DS9 wasn't as heavily serialized as most people seem to remember. It was most heavily serialized during the six episode stretch at the beginning of season 6 and the six episodes or so at the end of season 7. The "ebb and flow" of the war was mainly there to serve whatever the needs of the particular episode was...usually, it was the Federation suffers a setback and then they tell a story about the cost of the war. It wasn't plotted anything like Babylon 5, aside from the basic idea that the Federation would ultimately win.
Where DS9 excelled was in flipping the script on TNG. It became a counterpoint and counterpart to TNG where virtues that were extolled on TNG were more deeply examined on DS9.
The greatest achievement of DS9 was its rewarding and deep character arcs. Every character felt well served, including secondary characters like Rom, Nog and Garak. It had the most developed villain in Dukat. Worf really came into his own during his time on the series.
I wouldn't say that DS9 is better than TNG. DS9 couldn't exist without it, and I don't just mean that because it was a spin-off. DS9 served as a deeper examination of what was laid out in TNG, but it doesn't really work without that foundation. I do see it as a very important companion series to TNG. They work together as a 1-2 punch that represents peak Trek, and they both take inspiration from TOS in different ways. TNG had that "seek out new worlds and new civilizations" thing down, but DS9 had the frontier feeling that TOS so often had (see "Arena", "Balance of Terror" or "Errand of Mercy" for that proto-DS9 flavor), and I think the existence of DS9 makes TNG better and vice versa.
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Hey we are talking about DS9. That's great. As people have pointed out it was more fly by the seat of your pants than modern day TV shows, and some shows back in that time.
Hey John, you make some good points here, I think.
You are right that they didn't use developments, and that's a real shame. I don't recall details about the planet but yes, that would make sense. In space there can still be a front line. But it would be a little more nebulas. But it's where the bulk of your ships are that you can detect and intercept enemy ships. They wouldn't be able to fly past you. If you have taken out all of the ships in a system then you could by pass it even if you don't have the planets. Just keep your distance.
However, if the defence platforms are providing cover for the ships, then you cannot clear our the ships. As such, you cannot have those ships behind your advancing front. They could attack a planet behind your front lines before your ships could get there to defend. I doubt it would make a difference if they were behind your front lines to 'attack on both sides' in a space battle, but I haven't really thought that through.
Great points!
Breen stuff aside, you seem to be missing the entire point. The reason hostility was ceased was to prevent the genocide that was started. As you point out the Changelings care deeply about their own preservations. (That's the whole point.) It wasn't the joining. It was the fact that she needed the antidote. And the hostilities had to end to bring the antidote to the rest of the Changelings. Also, I thought it was pretty clear that the bioweapons was created by the Federation/31, so I don't think that was a surprise by the time they were face to face. I thought that was understood beforehand but I could be wrong. It doesn't change anything. She is not stupid enough to not stop fighting to save her entire race.
I understand that with your misunderstanding of the ending it could colour everything. Though you do bring up many great criticisms of the show.
Hey John, you make some good points here, I think.
You are right that they didn't use developments, and that's a real shame. I don't recall details about the planet but yes, that would make sense. In space there can still be a front line. But it would be a little more nebulas. But it's where the bulk of your ships are that you can detect and intercept enemy ships. They wouldn't be able to fly past you. If you have taken out all of the ships in a system then you could by pass it even if you don't have the planets. Just keep your distance.
However, if the defence platforms are providing cover for the ships, then you cannot clear our the ships. As such, you cannot have those ships behind your advancing front. They could attack a planet behind your front lines before your ships could get there to defend. I doubt it would make a difference if they were behind your front lines to 'attack on both sides' in a space battle, but I haven't really thought that through.
Great points!
Breen stuff aside, you seem to be missing the entire point. The reason hostility was ceased was to prevent the genocide that was started. As you point out the Changelings care deeply about their own preservations. (That's the whole point.) It wasn't the joining. It was the fact that she needed the antidote. And the hostilities had to end to bring the antidote to the rest of the Changelings. Also, I thought it was pretty clear that the bioweapons was created by the Federation/31, so I don't think that was a surprise by the time they were face to face. I thought that was understood beforehand but I could be wrong. It doesn't change anything. She is not stupid enough to not stop fighting to save her entire race.
I understand that with your misunderstanding of the ending it could colour everything. Though you do bring up many great criticisms of the show.
Finished enterprise and actually started enjoying it by Season 4, wish it wasnt cancelled by then now. I wouldve liked to see more.
Killing
out of nowhere was a weird choice.
Also finished Picard and pretty much hated it all around. On Season 2 of discovery and there are some genuinely good moments that are constantly ruined with this red angel stuff. And I personally have to skip through the klingon plots, could not care less about that. I didnt even like klingon episodes in older series, but this is insufferable. Several people I know have told me that season 3 is really good, so hopefully its worth watching 2 terrible seasons.
Never thought lower decks would be my favorite of the new shows, but here we are.
Killing
Trip
Also finished Picard and pretty much hated it all around. On Season 2 of discovery and there are some genuinely good moments that are constantly ruined with this red angel stuff. And I personally have to skip through the klingon plots, could not care less about that. I didnt even like klingon episodes in older series, but this is insufferable. Several people I know have told me that season 3 is really good, so hopefully its worth watching 2 terrible seasons.
Never thought lower decks would be my favorite of the new shows, but here we are.
Season 4 of ENT is such a weird season of Trek to me. It's fun, probably the most fun that series ever was, but it sure feels like they knew the writing was on the wall, so they decided to go all out and do whatever crazy idea popped into their heads. "Bring back Spiner as Data's evil great grandfather and have him be into Kahn style super soldiers? Do it! Spend three episodes explaining how the Klingons lost their forehead ridges? It's about time! End the series in the middle of an okayish season 7 TNG episode??? GREEN FRICKIN' LIGHT!"
Basically they embraced nostalgia in a way that no prior series had. They had episodes here and there, but nothing like the pure uncut nostalgia that was almost the entirety of S4. It's a fun season, but you can kind of tell they were writing it as their last.
I really loved the first three episodes of Picard, and then they made one baffling decision after another culminating in the most baffling of them all
turning Picard into an android
Discovery season 3 is...ok? It's not top-tier Trek, but it's an improvement, and I do like the soft-reboot of the series it seems to be pointed to. Lower Decks is indeed the best of the new shows (fingers very tightly crossed for SNW), because it wasn't pretentious, it was episodic, and didn't depend on an inevitable confrontation with the season's big bad in the last episode of the season. It was...well, a pretty traditional Star Trek show, in that respect.
Season 4 was when Enterprise was liberated from the complete direct control of Old Roddenberry holdouts. Coto was a good showrunner for the series. He just came in too late. I mean the hated finale was of course the work of the old Roddenberry team who wrote it as a farewell to the franchise.
IGN at the time had the perfect review quote for the finale of Enterprise.
IGN at the time had the perfect review quote for the finale of Enterprise.
He really wasn't, season 4 of Enterprise was way too fanboyish, the series lost its own identity and became nothing but TOS and TNG references, they did a Brent Spiner as Soong's identical grandpa/augments arc that led into "How klingons lost their ridges" answering a question that required no answer. They "fixed" the vulcans to make them more like Spock although Enterprise did a great job with the vulcans who were arrogant snots as far back as TOS, they did a mirror universe two parter which mostly existed to solve the "What happened to the Defiant" mystery, another question that required no answer.
Season 4 was where they gave up and just pandered to the remaining fans to get more episodes for syndication, I didn't like that. Season 3 was so much better.
I'm really curious to see more from this series. While this could be purely a kid's show (and I'd be ok if it was...not every aspect of Trek has to cater to me!), there is room out there for smart kid's shows that are enjoyable for people of all ages. I'm thinking of Gravity Falls specifically. A show with that level of writing, characterization and plot development, that's still very enjoyable by kids, would be very welcome.
It sure would be something if the CBS era Trek shows had a better track record with animated series than live action ones!
I'm hoping it's like with Doctor Who. The Sarah Jane Adventures was aimed as a kids show and while sometimes it was obvious, it had a lot of dark stories that older viewers could really appreciate, and the level of writing was high.
That's actually a pretty good comparison. If this is The Sarah Jane Adventures to Discovery or Picard's Torchwood, then I know what the superior spin-off will be. Torchwood was ok, but too dark and heavy for it's own good from time to time, while the Sarah Jane Adventures had a very similar mix of fun and scary as it's parent show. Seems kind of familiar...