I went back through D2 and D3 to check interactions between Meat and malus/Fat4All/Kitsu. I think I picked up all the posts from all three related to Meat before his claim (since then it became a lot of mechanics talk0 and they are in order (I think?) below.
Overall, all three didn't care much for Meatwad at all and only started paying attention after he already gathered some attention from other players. He was a low poster and not much of a discussion point at the start though, but it's still worth noting that all three didn't really interact initially with him.
I think the one that comes off worse is Kitsu, who literally didn't mention or talk about Meat during D2, but opened up D3 saying that "the Meatwad wagon seemed convincing" despite sticking with a Maol vote. Even so, she doesn't talk about Meatwad until later when Gorlak explained how Maol had called out the late Meatwad switch vote on D2.
It reads to me like she tried to ignore the wagon on D2 but wanted some credit when the day started. When things started getting rough for Meat she took the chance with Gorlak's post to start suspecting him for real.
Fat4All though also got my attention as he shaded Meat on D2 after Gorlak questioned him for other reads, but didn't talk about him until much later on D3. Differently from Kitsu though he discussed Meat's posts and interacted with him before his fake claim came off and his posts sound sincere to me.
malus said he didn't really have much of a read on Meat during D2 when he was a topic of some discussion, and later suspected him after a reread and an updated reads list. He prodded a bit during D3 and later had that post that Kalor quoted where he asked if anyone was actually town reading Meat.
Overall, all three didn't care much for Meatwad at all and only started paying attention after he already gathered some attention from other players. He was a low poster and not much of a discussion point at the start though, but it's still worth noting that all three didn't really interact initially with him.
I think the one that comes off worse is Kitsu, who literally didn't mention or talk about Meat during D2, but opened up D3 saying that "the Meatwad wagon seemed convincing" despite sticking with a Maol vote. Even so, she doesn't talk about Meatwad until later when Gorlak explained how Maol had called out the late Meatwad switch vote on D2.
It reads to me like she tried to ignore the wagon on D2 but wanted some credit when the day started. When things started getting rough for Meat she took the chance with Gorlak's post to start suspecting him for real.
Fat4All though also got my attention as he shaded Meat on D2 after Gorlak questioned him for other reads, but didn't talk about him until much later on D3. Differently from Kitsu though he discussed Meat's posts and interacted with him before his fake claim came off and his posts sound sincere to me.
malus said he didn't really have much of a read on Meat during D2 when he was a topic of some discussion, and later suspected him after a reread and an updated reads list. He prodded a bit during D3 and later had that post that Kalor quoted where he asked if anyone was actually town reading Meat.
I'm not sure. Possibly Meatwad? Their posts have been kinda lacking imo, kinda feels like they're just going along with the general vibe. coasting-ish.
not enough to throw me off maol or monkey at the moment
thanks
hmm, i need to look into Meatwad a bit more
before i dive even deeper into the Monkey hole i should prob do that first
This is sommit I kinda side-eyed from Meatwad. Sure there was plenty of justifiable reasons for any one person to vote Maol, but that doesn't make it any more or less likely that Scum votes for them.
While I don't think Scum would want to make their votes obvious, there's easily a reason a Scum might want to hide amount a crown for a justifiable lynch, even if they know Maol flips Town. It's an easy vote for Scum and Town to justify, while keeping any given train on that Town rolling along.
hmm, I'm not sure I would characterize this so much as 'opportunistic', VAs vote on Turmoil was only the third vote at the time, and for Day 1 play it doesn't seem that odd for people to latch onto other smaller trains for whatever justifications.
Was there anything on Day 2/3 that sticks out to you about VA/Rage? (sorry if you already answered this).
If anything, the pushback VA got from their Day 1 pressure vote on Meatwad seems more odd then their shift away from it.
I did some rereading last night, but didn't come away with any strong new reads.
At the moment I'm probably most suspicious of Fran and VA/Zeke. Though after Maols flip I'd say Fran went up on the town list by a few points. VA had some suspicious posts and Zeke hasn't done anything yet.
I found Meatwads vote to be quite strange. It came out of nothing and without any reasoning whether it was because of the "red check" or because of Maols behaviour.
Fat4All would be next on the list. He has expressed some doubt about Monkeys claim. To me it sounds like he wants to seed some suspicion there to discredit her without fully committing.
I still have a hard time reading Kalor and Kopite. I wouldn't be surprised to find scum among them.
Fandorin has given some good insight so far. I don't agree with everything he's said, but I think his effort to solve is genuine.
Gorlak has been very active and was in my opinion the one doing most of the work to solve the game. Solid town read.
I feel pretty good about Monkey. Her role claim was too out there to be made up by scum in my opinion although I think the truth test she did last night was really unnecessary and could have been used better to get the opinion of the dead on current events.
I'm inclined to believe Kits claim. Though I could see her actually being the neutral marking Gorlak.
Speaking of marking: Any new marks today?
The VA train on D1 only contained Monkey as not confirmed town. I'd say that makes either VA or Monkey highly suspect.
I still have a hard time scum reading Monkey after D2, so for me VA looks more suspicious.
That spike on turmoil with Meat, Monkey and Kalor really sticks out and I agree we will have to look there. In my opinion Meat looks the most suspicious of the bunch since Scum would probably not want to bring a wagon too much into the lead for fear of sticking out.
Still, Monkey has her fingers everywhere it seems...
Other things of notice are the complete inoffensiveness of Kopites and Fat4Alls votes. Day1 Kopite votes Fat and sticks there until the end while Fat doesn't vote at all. Day 2 both vote Maol who was basically a foregone conclusion anyway.
Is it just me or are there too many scum reads of Meatwad for how the votes are distributed? It sounds like everyone just accepted that Meat is scum and it makes me a bit antsy.
Is anyone town reading him?
I think the interesting part of D1 is the tie between Turmoil, Maolfunction and Meatwad. At this point scum votes were probably locked in because only Turm, Mao and you still changed votes (and me and Fran but that was a tie breaker and town->town).
So we had one town wagon (Turmoil) with Monkey, VA, Meat and Kalor as unconfirmed town, one town wagon (Mao) with me and Fran as unconfirmed town and one unknown Meat wagon with you and Fandorin as unconfirmed town. I believe you and me are town which leaves the two latter wagons with only Fran and Fandorin respectively as potential scum.
If Meatwad is scum Fran is almost certainly scum as well, especially considering his switch from Meatwad to Maol shortly before the stalemate.
Unaccounted for are Fat4All, Kits and Kopite who voted off wagon or didn't vote at all.
I'll have to think about something so give me a minute.
Fran pushed hard for a Mao lunch on D1 and D2. I don't see scum advocating that adamantly for a town lunch.
look at this progression from VA over the span of only a few posts
Wants to vote Turmoil to chase wagon.
Doesn't want to vote Turmoil because of the wagon.
Votes Meatwad because no wagon
Unvotes because people told him his vote was bad.
Then wants to vote Turmoil again because of the wagon
The arguments to vote for Meatwad seemed more convincing when I caught up with the game this morning but my brain's still in too much of a haze to go back and quote them individually.
Okay now that I'm back-- the point was that... I removed "me" from the modifier of "pocketing"? Meaning, "Pockety". Meaning, attatching on to easy things and not doing a lot of substance and just kind of stringing the game along while putting in the work to look like you're working. These repeated assertions that my game theory surrounding my role is baseless is part of that, because you and I both know I have a great deal of substance to base my conclusions on. Outside of this discussion, however, you've seemed more towny to me as of late.
The fact that you do not agree with my working set of facts does not mean that they don't exist. However, your stubborn insistance to ignore all of that in favour of throwing your hands in the air and saying "I don't know, man" and telling us we should do the same-- that's not dealing with game mechanics, that's flipping the table over and telling everyone else to pick up the mess.
That being said, given the current discussions of the Day (INCLUDING things that you've contributed to), this discussion doesn't seem to have much merit as far as game solving goes. When we actually have a new theory or a new idea, we can come back to it. Right now we're just discussing why we aren't working from literally nothing. That's... Kinda weird, to me. I honestly do not see the point of it.
Damn, this is a good catch. Makes me a bit more suspicious of Meatwad.
____
Dunno what to think about Fat's claim. It's kind of weird coming after Mao's roleswap yesterday. Perhaps the most powerful member of scum has some kind of X-Shot role adjusting ability designed to make it easier for them to win the game? F4A seems to be really quiet outside of a few small instances. I can't tell if that's just due to IRL circumstances or an attempt to lay low. Laying low almost makes sense with such a Town power, but if it's an important Town power I don't see why outing yourself like this wouldn't make yourself a heavy target for NK's. I suppose, if F4A was telling the truth, that power role means he's not a cop or a doctor and thus not necessarily the role Scum would need to worry about the most.
This, however, brings me to a reason I was hesitant to reveal my role D2 even though I wound up doing it. The more roles out there, the easier it is for Scum to pinpoint the Doc or Cop. (DocCop? DogCop! No. Dammit, brain.) However, at this point, the cop's had two N's to give us checks, and I hope that they haven't hit anyone who's died and that they've left behind some good breadcrums. Mmm. Breadcrums. Anyone suddenly just get really hungry?
Yes.
I'm an easy target. I'm visible, you've got a fun little coincidence in your corner, and you are using my absence to try and factor these into your decision to drive votes away from Monkey.
Your decision to do this isn't based on new information. There is no new information here! I didn't make a new vote, my vote's been on Monkey for ages. You're reacting to the amplified pressure on Monkey and trying to swerve on the mere assumption that I'm Scum based on the fact that you, a heavy poster, was targeted two times in one night (Shocker).
The only thing that changed was that I, another similarly active poster, mentioned they were going to bed. It's much easier for you to push the narrative that I'm scum so you must vote for meatwad(?????) when I'm not actually here to defend myself or point out that we've litigated this fact before.
This is an exceptionally bold move, and scum knows they're going to be in lylo tomorrow if they convince Town to lynch fellow Town. That and the fact that this is a bastard game, right now is the point where Scum might make bold moves. That, and the game hasn't been doing much moving over the past two or three irl days, so I predict scum might be getting overeager to get on with it.
Ding ding ding.
Claims are for tomorrow. Claiming now won't guarantee a change in votes, it will give Scum more power to choose who to NK tonight and make lylo more effective for them.