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Nier: Automata Mafia - To serve mankind... up on a platter via vote.
- Thread starter lokiduck
- Start date
vote: Dr. Monkey
With c4's claim and flip, the puzzle of what happened to Sorian is solved. No bus drivers or switchers need to be involved. Monkey used a healing ability on herself, stopping HP's shot, and night-killed Sawneeks. Just like I said. She didn't use the ninja kill because it probably couldn't be used the same night as her self-heal ability and she knew HP was going to shoot her. This theory accounts for everything, including how she acted in the thread, while her claim doesn't even make sense with Maol's track result. She is mafia. We should have voted her out yesterday, but at least it wasn't wasted since we got the serial killer. So let's flip this obvious scum today.
With c4's claim and flip, the puzzle of what happened to Sorian is solved. No bus drivers or switchers need to be involved. Monkey used a healing ability on herself, stopping HP's shot, and night-killed Sawneeks. Just like I said. She didn't use the ninja kill because it probably couldn't be used the same night as her self-heal ability and she knew HP was going to shoot her. This theory accounts for everything, including how she acted in the thread, while her claim doesn't even make sense with Maol's track result. She is mafia. We should have voted her out yesterday, but at least it wasn't wasted since we got the serial killer. So let's flip this obvious scum today.
this sounds callous but it's true, all in all; he proved himself and soaked a kill, so good job hp.
good news: we do get Ephi off that at least.
This isn't an inconsistency? Sparks did visit Sorian. It wouldn't have protected him. The inconsistency isn't with me, it's with y'all believing something a killing neutral said after a turbo - a killing neutral who also killed another neutral for shiggles. Yes, very credible.
Y'all can do that conversation without me today. Have fun. I'm gonna do a little backreading before bed and then tomorrow I have a full day so I will be absent for a stretch.
This part does not track Ninja Kill is a faction ability I see no reason why both could not be used.
Everything else seems plausible.
I am buying into the Tiny scum teams theory now that I have seen multiple Neutrals.
Can you not? You hammer before I got chance to participate in EOD
That's my guess, but yeah, I might be wrong about why she used an ability on herself instead of using the ninja kill. Impossible to tell exactly without saying the flip. But it should be BEYOND obvious at this point that we need to flip Monkey. BEYOND OBVIOUS! She herself would be saying so, if she was town and talking about someone else. She was tracked to a dead town player, she admitted that the track was real, and her claim does not account for the results. That alone, outside of her other mafiesque behavior, should be more than enough.
Dont like setting things in stone 10 minutes into the day However
We are most likely killing Monkey Today the timing lines up just right if we are lucky enough that shes the last Even Mafia
But here's the thing, guys. You hashed all this out yesterday. You already made your arguments. You don't particularly care if they fit, you just want the flip at this point to check and see. Whatever. I don't like it, but I get it and I don't have to like it. But you shouldn't turbo at least until everyone has checked in, and in the meanwhile, why not do something else besides repeating the same things you did yesterday?
EC, why DID you hammer? I get that you don't care about... uh, anything? But the rest of us value the time. Can you at least respect that unless you actually had a reason to hammer? and since c4 was a neutral, I doubt that you did.
EC, why DID you hammer? I get that you don't care about... uh, anything? But the rest of us value the time. Can you at least respect that unless you actually had a reason to hammer? and since c4 was a neutral, I doubt that you did.
otherwise I might work my spooky magic and... point out logical inconsistencies and how arguments fall apart.
Like your literally saying we are too Dumb to be trusted to play a full day.
Too often end of day ends with a voting polka. We had two great options, and nothing else of value was going to be learned or discussed in those final minutes, so boom, lights out.
And also, hey, instead of focusing on me, why not focus on the person who put c4 one away from turbo? Why should I be punished for someone else's voting haste? Ridiculous.
The arguments do fit. They don't need to know exactly how the mafia powers work, something that is unknowable by town at this point, in order to fit. I wish it wasn't necessary to repeat all these arguments again, but unfortunately I believe that it is-- I don't want to see another day going by with you slipping out of being voted.
You can be very persuasive, even when you're obviously mafia (that's a compliment!) and I do not want to spend another 48 hours rehashing why you need to go.
As I said earlier, we do need to wait for everyone to check in, out of courtesy. After that, I hope to see a turbo, and I hope the rest of the town agrees with me that it's called for.
I hope that comment didn't come off as insulting, Jman. As a lawyer, I am very familiar with the fact that even very smart people can be talked into bad decisions.
I mean do you think voting out C4 over monkey yesterday was a mistake then?
Your protective hack?
What do you mean by this? I thought you gave out vests..................?
Now I'm being yelled at for other people breaking the rules?
Refresh the fuckin' page before you post.
Honestly, I feel like it was only C4 because I wasnt a good option.
I think it was a great result, so I can't say I regret that it happened that way, but I think it makes it all the more important to vote Monkey out today. Let's say I don't think votes for c4 were a mistake, but I think hesitation on voting out Dr M was a mistake.
Maol also claimed to have tracked c4 N1 and got not result while c4 claims to have moved (to Sorian)
"no result" seems to imply that Maol was blocked, I think?
Dr. Monkey
I mean you were seen leaving a Murder.
I feel bad that this could be a wrong place wrong time situation and I think you're arguments make sense but the game needs your slot gone and while Yesterday was the wrong time Imo (which is why I fought to keep you.)
However the Today seems pretty good from where I'm sitting
I mean you were seen leaving a Murder.
I feel bad that this could be a wrong place wrong time situation and I think you're arguments make sense but the game needs your slot gone and while Yesterday was the wrong time Imo (which is why I fought to keep you.)
However the Today seems pretty good from where I'm sitting
Ironic that so much time was spent on finding who's teamed with scum and we end up eliminating scum...but not teamed.
Not sure how relevant this is but I was targeted by someone last night that forced me to either target Maol or be role blocked for the entire night so I ended up being role blocked for the entire night. There is a lot of role blockers in this game by the sounds of it.
Possible, but Sorian also survived if you believe c4.
But it's not important.
Ok. Back one last time to night 2.
We have three statements, 2 deaths and two confirmed causes:
Sawneeks and Sorian died
Confirmed facts
Unconfirmed facts:
Extra facts:
So, either Monkey is lying about her ability or Maol is lying about his.
At this point I think that there are only a coupe of explanations:
We have three statements, 2 deaths and two confirmed causes:
Sawneeks and Sorian died
Confirmed facts
- C4, the serial Killer, openly admitted to targeting Sorian on both N1 and N2.
- Hp, a confirmed 1 shot vigilante claimed to have targeted Monkey on N2.
Unconfirmed facts:
- Monkey calimed to have delivered a bulletproof vest to Saw during N2 as her ability.
- Maolfunction claimed to have tracked Monkey and saw her visiting both herself and Saw.
Extra facts:
- Monkey later clarified that her ability worked only on androids, hwile Saw and Sorian were machines.
- Maol says to have tracked C4 and gotten no result hwile C4 claimed to have moved against Sorian on N1.
So, either Monkey is lying about her ability or Maol is lying about his.
At this point I think that there are only a coupe of explanations:
- Monkey used her protecting power on herself and did the night kill on Sneeks (this would mean Maol is teling the truth).
- Maol is lying and is setting up Monkey for the lynch (which would imply that Monkey is telling the truth about her power).
Ok so I was wrong about not thinking there could be another party involved but I'm just more confused right now. This is a pre-typed post mostly to get my own thoughts down to try to work through what is going on so if it feels a little stream of consciousness that's because it is.
Night 1:
A single kill on Random who is revealed to be scum who can kill on Even Nights according to the flipped role PM. c4 claims he took a shot at Sorian.
Night 2:
Double kill: Sorian (machine neutral) and Sneeks (machine town).
Day 3:
On Night 2 Maol claims that he tracked Monkey and saw Monkey targeted herself and Sneeks.
Maol also claims on Night 1 that he tracked c4.
HP claimed to use a vig shot against Monkey on Night 2.
Monkey claimed to be an Android Doctor who gave a BP vest to Sneeks (who was a machine). Also claimed that Sparks gave Sorian (also a machine) a BP vest on N1.
c4 flips as a SK without any odd/even night restrictions on when he can kill. Claims he shot Sorian both nights.
So now questions:
The leading theory before the c4 flip was that there were two scum teams, each with a kill on even and odd nights respectively. Based on what c4 said that's still holds but there is a missing kill every night.
Night 1: c4 claimed he attacked Sorian which means Odd Team would have targeted Random. Maol claims to have tracked c4 on N1 but never saw any movement, c4 did not have a ninja ability in their flipped role. So we have an unknown reason why Sorian was not killed and an unknown reason why Maol did not see c4. Monkey claimed Sparks gave Sorian a BP vest but they are specifically claimed android doctors. I can 1000% see Sparks giving Sorian a BP vest but would a presumed machine doctor give a neutral one?
Night 2: c4 claimed to have killed Sorian, HP claimed to have shot Monkey who didn't die, and then there is another potential 3rd kill floating out there. Hawthorn's theory at the end of the day yesterday kind of fits. c4 kills Sorian, Monkey gives herself a BP vest and kills Sneeks, and HP attempts to kill Monkey. That could work but we also know from c4's admission that he did move on N1 and Maol did not see it so it implies Maol some manipulation or Maol is being untruthful there.
Also weird flavor thing, Random flipped as Eve and listed as An Android. Adam and Eve are canonically machines. I went through and double checked all of the other PMs and they line up correctly but the fact that our flipped scum has a wrong designation there seems like it could be something? Flavor is flavor and I can see how LoVe could rule those two as androids but that feels like a weird decision from the Flavor Queen.
Night 1:
A single kill on Random who is revealed to be scum who can kill on Even Nights according to the flipped role PM. c4 claims he took a shot at Sorian.
Night 2:
Double kill: Sorian (machine neutral) and Sneeks (machine town).
Day 3:
On Night 2 Maol claims that he tracked Monkey and saw Monkey targeted herself and Sneeks.
Maol also claims on Night 1 that he tracked c4.
HP claimed to use a vig shot against Monkey on Night 2.
Monkey claimed to be an Android Doctor who gave a BP vest to Sneeks (who was a machine). Also claimed that Sparks gave Sorian (also a machine) a BP vest on N1.
c4 flips as a SK without any odd/even night restrictions on when he can kill. Claims he shot Sorian both nights.
So now questions:
The leading theory before the c4 flip was that there were two scum teams, each with a kill on even and odd nights respectively. Based on what c4 said that's still holds but there is a missing kill every night.
Night 1: c4 claimed he attacked Sorian which means Odd Team would have targeted Random. Maol claims to have tracked c4 on N1 but never saw any movement, c4 did not have a ninja ability in their flipped role. So we have an unknown reason why Sorian was not killed and an unknown reason why Maol did not see c4. Monkey claimed Sparks gave Sorian a BP vest but they are specifically claimed android doctors. I can 1000% see Sparks giving Sorian a BP vest but would a presumed machine doctor give a neutral one?
Night 2: c4 claimed to have killed Sorian, HP claimed to have shot Monkey who didn't die, and then there is another potential 3rd kill floating out there. Hawthorn's theory at the end of the day yesterday kind of fits. c4 kills Sorian, Monkey gives herself a BP vest and kills Sneeks, and HP attempts to kill Monkey. That could work but we also know from c4's admission that he did move on N1 and Maol did not see it so it implies Maol some manipulation or Maol is being untruthful there.
Also weird flavor thing, Random flipped as Eve and listed as An Android. Adam and Eve are canonically machines. I went through and double checked all of the other PMs and they line up correctly but the fact that our flipped scum has a wrong designation there seems like it could be something? Flavor is flavor and I can see how LoVe could rule those two as androids but that feels like a weird decision from the Flavor Queen.
These are the FACTS.
HP the flipped townie shot Monkey. Monkey didn't die. The shot instead went to Neeks, who monkey just so happened to visit that same night.
Monkey has been trying to link the Sorian stuff to her to just distract from the fuckery of the tracking results.
Monkey on the other hand was desperately trying to link Sorian to her.
Monkey DOESNT want us to look at the situation involving her/Neeks/Maol
HP the flipped townie shot Monkey. Monkey didn't die. The shot instead went to Neeks, who monkey just so happened to visit that same night.
Monkey has been trying to link the Sorian stuff to her to just distract from the fuckery of the tracking results.
Monkey on the other hand was desperately trying to link Sorian to her.
This is also Monkey planting the seeds to vote me
Again, HP had to be redirected. Pay attention to the argument Monkey is making. She knows she can say this because the real kill WILL NOT claim the Sorian kill to throw dirt on this speculation.
Again it has to be redirection of HP's shot that killed Sorian, not 3p scum killing Sorian.
It's all DEFLECTION
Monkey DOESNT want us to look at the situation involving her/Neeks/Maol
I don't have a problem with that. I asked to be shot. Twice. I know it's going to come to this. That doesn't make it less frustrating, but it doesn't mean I have a problem with the death. What I do have a problem with is people hiding in that like it's the only thing in the game. Get them out of the tunnels. It'll be a while before everyone checks in regardless.
I also have an issue with being treated like my very presence is a problem, but that's separate.
Zeke, I explained this repeatedly. You are desperate to catch me in a gotcha on this and it's not the cleanest claim but I rarely play in games where I don't know the flavor and this one I find particularly strange. You are hung up on this. It's not going to solve anything. You don't 'even WANT to solve me. You just want the flip. Just say that and move on.
But here, for you:
I am 9S, Android Doctor.
My command is a protective hack. It operates like a vest. Why? idk. Why is the role name doctor? idk.
I left a post for Lone_Prodigy yesterday I'd love answered. His reads and progression yesterday don't make sense.
The shot did not go to Neeks , Monkey probably just protected herself while Stabbing Neeks to death.(if shes scum)
There was No switch if there was Malfunctions Track was useless as it comes after other actions.
I brought this up earlier as being an oddity on D2 but I think the lines are blurred between machines and android in Automata. Androids are somewhat autonomous and independent in their line of thinking and actions despite serving a higher power (YoHRa) while machines are either entirely a hive mind that is controlled by AI or programmed to do specific functions. Adam and Eve definitely blur the lines because in-game they begin experiencing human emotions and pondering philosophy making them closer to androids than machines at that point. There also exists the free machine village with Pascal who are entirely cut off from the network that also begin to experience some limited form of emotions but are still considered machines. So I don't think saying Adam/Eve are androids are wrong given the classification of what defines an android and what defines a machine in-game.
^^^^^maybe we shouldn't be trying to make these judgements, especially considering what loki herself said in the thread to Stan and others. There are clearly things that people who are into the flavor don't agree with. anex said it. Stan said it. Maybe also Neki. So either on purpose or not, flavor here is not a reliable lens.
YES, there is a missing kill NO MATTER WHAT. As for Sparks, I 100000% do not find it surprising that he went to Sorian, regardless of Sorian's claim, which who knows if Sparks even saw. But it definitely wouldn't protect him based on the flip.
I handed out one last night, by the by, but I won't say to whom. Anyway, I'm gonna finish this longer post and then I have to go to bed.
Yea, I meant to put a rolling eye emoji after that
Monkey typin this post
So there are missing kills.
Why does that matter? That obviously means there is a real protection role somewhere else, so leave it alone.
Why does that matter? That obviously means there is a real protection role somewhere else, so leave it alone.
It could explain Maol's roleblock on Night 1. That adds a rouge secondhand-roleblocker of an unknown faction to the potential players list.
Sorian didn't die N1, that implies c4 was blocked, hence my result
Btw. My vote is firmly on Monkey unless something truly outlandish happens. But I'd like for everyone to chime in before we do anything about it.
Monkey is no doubt a real protection role even if Scum
Theres a serial killer that has unlimited shots and a Vigilante, we probably got protection out the wazoo in this game.