Recent Movement that has been in South Africa Called - #FarmsLivesMatters (Movement addressing primarily white Farmers being killed by raiders)

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Recently, there has been a movement going on in South Africa relating to Farmers (primarly white) that have been killed on mass scale raids on farmers. There have been hundreds of attacks on farmers with the most recent one happening today today.

Three members of the same family were kidnapped in a horrific attack on a farm in South Africa then driven out into the wilds in their own cars to be be brutally slaughtered.
Daniel Brand, 82, his wife Hybrecht, 73, and their daughter Elizabeth, 53, went missing from their rural home near Hartswater in the Northern Province on Sunday night.
Elizabeth, known by her nickname Elzabie, had been visiting for Sunday lunch - but her body was found on Tuesday morning by a drone operator.

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This is not the first time this has happened with in the first 6 months - In the first six months of the year, 139 attacks and 26 murders have taken place on farms in South Africa. Due to this, there have been recent movements in order for the goverment to do more to help protect farmers from attacks. Naming itself Farms Life Matters - based on the recent Black Lives Matters. Support is being raised about this issue.

South Africa hit by new spate of farm murders amid COVID-19 pandemic

A new spate of farm murders hit South Africa in recent days, prompting urgent calls

africa.cgtn.com

https://www.sapeople.com/2020/07/18...pe-town-against-farm-murders-in-south-africa/

Farm killings surge across the country

A new spate of farm murders has hit South Africa, prompting urgent calls for the government to curb the surge exacerbated by the Covid-19 pandemic.

www.iol.co.za

 

[CharlesAznable]

I feel like we had this exact thread a few years ago, then it was revealed that it was bullshit created by white supremacists trying to stir shit. Back then the murder rate went up for whites in SA but that was because the murder rate for the entire country went up, not just for white South Africans. I'll look into this, but I'm always skeptical when people bring up the racial politics of SA in this manner, because a lot of white supremacists try to frame the country as an example of reverse racism, when the truth is a lot more complex than that.

 

[Mammoth Jones]

Not going to scoff at anyone being kidnapped/killed. It's a shame that's happening. And it shouldn't.

I think they need another reconciliation to deal with where this animus towards these farmers are coming from. I'm assuming stolen land/economic disparity?

That all being said "Farm Lives Matters" is the most tonedeaf way to try and co-opt someone else's shit for your own ends.

 

[Soundscream]

Wasn't this racist bull shit from years ago?

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Not going to scoff at anyone being kidnapped/killed. It's a shame that's happening. And it shouldn't.

I think they need another reconciliation to deal with where this animus towards these farmers are coming from. I'm assuming stolen land/economic disparity?

That all being said "Farm Lives Matters" is the most tonedeaf way to try and co-opt someone else's shit for your own ends.

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It's likely that the stolen land/economic disparity problem considering most of the time when these happen - money is not stolen, just pepole being killed

 

[Strike]

This shit again? Weren't conservatives trying to push this as a thing a few years ago?

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Wasn't this racist bull shit from years ago?

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Nope, there have been direct pictures and images of white farmers being brutalised

Spoiler

This shit again? Weren't conservatives trying to push this as a thing a few years ago?

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Yes but this is absoultly happening.

 

[Soundscream]

Nope, there have been direct pictures and images of white farmers being brutalised

Spoiler

Yes but this is absoultly happening.

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I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but that it is being sensationalized into a bigger issue than it is.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

In pictures: South African farmers protest attacks

The farmers want improved security from the police and better prosecution rates of crimes

gulfnews.com

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but that it is being sensationalized into a bigger issue than it is.

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At the end of the day - a lot of Farmers have been murdered and those who are alive feel terrified and scared that their families will be dragged out and killed. It's gotten to the point where there is mass protsts in South Africa because of this.

 

[Kino]

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but that it is being sensationalized into a bigger issue than it is.

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Kind of a shitty thing to say when people are being murdered and beaten alive

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Let me ask everyone this question - in this hypothetical scenario the exact same thing happened but it was black farmers being killed by whites - would you be a lot more angry towards this act happening then compared to the white farmers being murdered by blacks

 

[captmcblack]

I don't know enough about this, but I'm engaging with this in good faith. Are there any other/larger global media sources with content related to this?

 

[Soundscream]

Kind of a shitty thing to say when people are being murdered and beaten alive

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A few years ago this was being passed around by well known racist, and now co-opting on the BLM movement sets off all sorts of alarm bells.

 

[ReplacementPelican]

Let me ask everyone this question - in this hypothetical scenario the exact same thing happened but it was black farmers being killed by whites - would you be a lot more angry towards this act happening then compared to the white farmers being murdered by blacks

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Where your ends, mate?

There is no evidence it's disproportionately affecting white people so why is this post making it about race?

The reason people are replying to you with skepticism is that this has been used by right wing grifters in the United States who give absolutely no fuck about this occurence other than pushing bollocks right wing race-based narratives.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

I don't know enough about this, but I'm engaging with this in good faith. Are there any other/larger global media sources with content related to this?

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Farm attacks 'have increased ten-fold' in SA - but race isn't to blame

Brutal criminals have only seen this pandemic as an opportunity, and according to the stats, farm attacks have skyrocketed in South Africa.

www.thesouthafrican.com

Agricultural sector hit by 26 farm murders, 2020 midyear data shows

The agricultural sector has been hit by 26 farm murders since the start of the year, TLU SA said on Tuesday.

www.timeslive.co.za

KZN farm attacks and murders on the increase - TLU SA

According to TLU SA, the country has already recorded 141 farm attacks and 26 farm murders.

www.iol.co.za

 

[molnizzle]

Let me ask everyone this question - in this hypothetical scenario the exact same thing happened but it was black farmers being killed by whites - would you be a lot more angry towards this act happening then compared to the white farmers being murdered by blacks

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ah, now I see what's going on here.

 

[Soundscream]

Let me ask everyone this question - in this hypothetical scenario the exact same thing happened but it was black farmers being killed by whites - would you be a lot more angry towards this act happening then compared to the white farmers being murdered by blacks

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And then framing a question like this is also bullshit. The problem is this was used years ago by racist and questioning it's authenticity when it's being raised again years later isn't us being racist. It's insuring it's not the same people spreading bullshit again.

 

[HeartlessNobody2134]

Where your ends, mate?

There is no evidence it's disproportionately affecting white people so why is this post making it about race?

The reason people are replying to you with skepticism is that this has been used by right wing grifters in the United States who give absolutely no fuck about this occurence other than pushing bollocks right wing race-based narratives.

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Was thinking the same, especially after OP's latest post.

Farm murders and the lie of white victimhood - Thought Leader

THOUGHTLEADER: Violence menaces all sectors and people in our society. Yet the reality of rural crime and farm murders is being exploited and engineered into a political narrative to advance a sinister agenda.

thoughtleader.co.za

"Statistics from the Western Cape crime report of 2018-19 show that 1,014 children and 2,271 women were murdered in the province. Across the Western Cape 3,974 people were murdered. In this financial year only 47 farm murders were counted across the country. The most recent national statistics on crime show that a total of 21,325 people were murdered between April 1 last year and the end of March this year. Forty-nine farm murders occurred in this time.

The violence endured by people employed on farms, as well as the violence endured by black citizens living in rural areas, are often omitted from the politicisation of farm killings. Placed in a larger context, farm murders can be seen as one of the numerous issues which plague the country. But facts don't matter to proponents of white genoicde."

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

And then framing a question like this is also bullshit. The problem is this was used years ago by racist and questioning it's authenticity when it's being raised again years later isn't us being racist. It's insuring it's not the same people spreading bullshit again.

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Okay fair enough, i apologise for saying that.

 

[L Thammy]

Let me ask everyone this question - in this hypothetical scenario the exact same thing happened but it was black farmers being killed by whites - would you be a lot more angry towards this act happening then compared to the white farmers being murdered by blacks

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If things are different, things are going to be different. Never bring up this hypothetical because it doesn't really work.

At any rate, South Africa's racial tensions are their own and shouldn't be confused with those of somewhere like America. If we want to understand this better, we should try to understand specifically in the South African context.

 

[CharlesAznable]

Let me ask everyone this question - in this hypothetical scenario the exact same thing happened but it was black farmers being killed by whites - would you be a lot more angry towards this act happening then compared to the white farmers being murdered by blacks

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This is a dumbass hypothetical that completely ignores the different context between the 2 situations....

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

There has been:

"There was a decrease in violent crimes since the inception of the lockdown," the commercial farmers' union said. "Between January and March this year, TLU SA recorded 71 farm attacks and 14 murders. Since then violent crimes started increasing to levels on par with those before the lockdown, and between April and June there were 68 attacks and 12 murders."

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Agricultural sector hit by 26 farm murders, 2020 midyear data shows

The agricultural sector has been hit by 26 farm murders since the start of the year, TLU SA said on Tuesday.

www.timeslive.co.za

It has led to mass scale protests aka FarmLifeMaters that has led to protests from primarly white pepole who are against the white farmers

Also i freely admit that was an extremely bad hypothetical to use. I do admit it's odd how the media is focusing on the attacks from white farmers when there surely are black farmers in Zimbawbe

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I have been looking everywhere and there is no staistic relating to the difference between white farmer murders and black farmer murders. Only that the majority of it has been white farmers which is what the news has been pushing

 

[gillian03]

The history of South Africa's racism is pretty dense. And I haven't even scratched the surface of what's actually happening. Been reading about it for a few weeks and it's... infuriating.

 

[Elegant Weapon]

Let me ask everyone this question - in this hypothetical scenario the exact same thing happened but it was black farmers being killed by whites - would you be a lot more angry towards this act happening then compared to the white farmers being murdered by blacks

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You just showed your hand.

from apartheid to white genocide... big oof

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

You just showed your hand.

from apartheid to white genocide... big oof

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and that i apologise for, it was an completly ignorant statement that i made of the wider context of the suitation. The suitation is much more complex then i realised. I am a white scottish person who has family in South Africa who were forced to move from Zimbawabe to South Africa. So when i saw what was happening in Zimbawabe i got heated and didn't think things through and for that i apologise.

I am just an ignorant white scot who only knows information from news sources and my aunt and uncles own discussion about the racial histories going on in South Africa who are are all white.

 

[PostModernMaybe]

Not condoning this at all but I'm going to hazard a guess that part of the issue leading to this is how the white farmers got that land in the first place (and the resulting inequality in SA)

 

[Dullahan]

Doubt.

 

[Cantaim]

*on second thought time to peace out of this thread I don't think it was made with good intentions.

 

[bye]

Doubt [2]

 

[krazen]

I feel like we had this exact thread a few years ago, then it was revealed that it was bullshit created by white supremacists trying to stir shit. Back then the murder rate went up for whites in SA but that was because the murder rate for the entire country went up, not just for white South Africans. I'll look into this, but I'm always skeptical when people bring up the racial politics of SA in this manner, because a lot of white supremacists try to frame the country as an example of reverse racism, when the truth is a lot more complex than that.

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Yeah, I was going to see the idea of these hordes murdering poor farmers has been dis-proven before and like you said, is white supremacist catnip

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Not condoning this at all but I'm going to hazard a guess that part of the issue leading to this is how the white farmers got that land in the first place (and the resulting inequality in SA)

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Yes even after apartheid there is still racial tension between the white farmers and the blacks especially considering some of them still have servents and helpers which had led to these farm attacks between the white farmers and the blacks.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Yeah, I was going to see the idea of these hordes murdering poor farmers has been dis-proven before and like you said, is white supremacist catnip

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Farmers are being murdered - there's factual evidence for that but overall the majority of focus has been on the white farmers and not anything else which is inapporiate of them. Ultimately what it comes down to is that these farmer attacks have been created

 

[Conmex]

Was thinking the same, especially after OP's latest post.

Farm murders and the lie of white victimhood - Thought Leader

THOUGHTLEADER: Violence menaces all sectors and people in our society. Yet the reality of rural crime and farm murders is being exploited and engineered into a political narrative to advance a sinister agenda.

thoughtleader.co.za

"Statistics from the Western Cape crime report of 2018-19 show that 1,014 children and 2,271 women were murdered in the province. Across the Western Cape 3,974 people were murdered. In this financial year only 47 farm murders were counted across the country. The most recent national statistics on crime show that a total of 21,325 people were murdered between April 1 last year and the end of March this year. Forty-nine farm murders occurred in this time.

The violence endured by people employed on farms, as well as the violence endured by black citizens living in rural areas, are often omitted from the politicisation of farm killings. Placed in a larger context, farm murders can be seen as one of the numerous issues which plague the country. But facts don't matter to proponents of white genoicde."

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47 farm murders seems like a lot.

 

[Taker34]

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www.facebook.com

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Nice job linking to a racist facebook group. Do you check the stuff you post every now and then?

 

[krazen]

Farmers are being murdered - there's factual evidence for that but overall the majority of focus has been on the white farmers and not anything else.

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Gimmie a legit source then.

China Global Television Network (CGTN) - Bias and Credibility

QUESTIONABLE SOURCE A questionable source exhibits one or more of the following: extreme bias, consistent promotion of propaganda/conspiracies, poor or no

mediabiasfactcheck.com

 

[captmcblack]

I don't know how to reply to that post without it functionally being like "no, not those sources", heh.

I see the Sky News link, and based on my understanding of Sky News as an outlet worldwide I'll watch that video and move forward. The others are local SA news, right? Out of curiosity, is there something from say...the BBC or Al Jazeera or even the Guardian or something like that?

Alternatively, would you be willing to explain why these sources would be good enough to gain a full understanding of what's going on without being like "decide for yourself" or anything? I'm doing my own research and it's very strange that I can't find much of any content related to this outside of these sites - and literally if I search the hashtag, all that comes up is this thread and Gab.

I did find this:

South African farm attacks - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/05/15/tucker-carlson-those-south-african-white-rights-activists-arent-telling-you-whole-truth/

Land expropriation through the eyes of South African farmers

We speak to South African farmers about land expropriation and hear their personal views on this divisive issue.

www.aljazeera.com

The growing fight in South Africa over land and identity

A government proposal sparks racial tensions between white and black South Africans, suggesting the government should seize land from white owners, without payment.

abcnews.go.com

But I'm also trying not to lean on these sources because I know they may also not be providing full information (because aside from Al-Jazeera they're US sites).

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Nice job linking to a racist facebook group. Do you check the stuff you post every now and then?

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I have never posted there in my life and i apologise for linking it

 

[Elegant Weapon]

and that i apologise for, it was an completly ignorant statement that i made of the wider context of the suitation. The suitation is much more complex then i realised. I am a white scottish person who has family in South Africa who were forced to move from Zimbawabe to South Africa. So when i saw what was happening in Zimbawabe i got heated and didn't think things through and for that i apologise.

I am just an ignorant white scot who only knows information from news sources and my aunt and uncles own discussion about the racial histories going on in South Africa who are are all white.

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I already know where you're coming from posting this bullshit, no need to explain

 

[ReplacementPelican]

Yes even after apartheid there is still racial tension between the white farmers and the blacks especially considering some of them still have servents and helpers which had led to these farm attacks between the white farmers and the blacks.

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They're not being attacked because they're white. Stop saying 'white farmers' and 'the blacks.'

You've been sold an inaccurate portrayal of events and you keep apologising when people point out you're wrong but then repeat the same old bollocks.

 

[FormatCompatible]

"The blacks". Fucking oof.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

You know know, everyone is completly right - i thought i was knowledgeable about the information and i wasn't. I meant no harm and only wanted to talk about this issue that my family had been discussing. I thought i was knowledgeable enough about this issue but i wasn't. I was an ignorant person who thought i knew about this but i don't. I apologise for all the harm i have done. I am not looking for forgiveness but saying my intentions came out of sheer ignorance not malice.

I also apologise for using terms that i had no buisness in using. If you want be banned from this site then that is completly fair.

 

[krazen]

Considering the dubious sources, one apology for racism by the OP and it's only page 1

You had better....stick to gaming, news guy.

 

[bye]

Farmers are being murdered - there's factual evidence for that but overall the majority of focus has been on the white farmers and not anything else.

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sounds like you ate the catnip and are moving the goal posts now. the entire premise of the thread was created with questionable pretense (that you at first took no issue with) given anyone co-opting BLM can vary from disrespectful to racist.

farmers being murdered is a problem. framing it was some reverse-racism is a problem of a different kind. there seems to be little evidence it's a majority black on white crime. been disproven once already and co-opted by white supremacists before.

 

[TheAndyMan]

This is Nazi bullshit. Stop promoting it!
(Literally the "white genocide" argument used by White Supremacists)

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

sounds like you ate the catnip and are moving the goal posts now. the entire premise of the thread was created with questionable pretense (that you at first took no issue with) given anyone co-opting BLM can vary from disrespectful to racist.

farmers being murdered is a problem. framing it was some reverse-racism is a problem of a different kind. there seems to be little evidence it's a majority black on white crime. been disproven once already and co-opted by white supremacists before.

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You are right, the media kept on parrading it being white farmers. I didn't look at the context of the suitation. All the sites kept saying it was white farmers and i took that as fact. It was complete and utter ignorance on my part and for that i apologise

 

[Morrigan]

As even the OP acknowledges that they didn't have the facts and were just regurgitating racist propaganda, we don't think this thread is likely to recover from its faulty premise.