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Neat

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,107
New York City
I say rumor because there's no article about it, but rather this is based on insights from another Era member who has been vetted.

They were struggling with halo infy developement. 2018 they rebooted the project based on the feedback. Now it's all good.

This user knows their Microsoft stuff, and has been deemed reliable by Transistor and the mod team:

We've verified this user's info to be reliable on the subject

Pretty interesting takeaway imo. Thoughts?

EDIT: As we know already, the creative director left 343i back in 2019, as reported by Jason Schreier, so the timing does make sense.
https://kotaku.com/halo-infinite-creative-director-leaves-company-1837312778

EDIT 2: More from Jason about three months ago:

I have heard from multiple people that Halo Infinite has had a long and rocky development cycle. (I broke the news that their CD left.)

Of course, all of 343's Halo games had long and rocky development cycles.
I'll be curious to see if Halo actually makes it. On one hand console launch games can't get delayed. On the other hand, games that lose their creative directors midway through development aren't exactly going through the most stable productions.
 
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UnluckyKate

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,545
If this isn't a launch year title, then its probably true; its been announced 3 years ago and still no gameplay was ever shown
 

Lyre

Alt Account
Banned
Feb 12, 2020
2,996
London
Good, to be honest. The old Microsoft would have sent it out to be mocked regardless of quality; looks like they're finally taking a (new) leaf from proper publishers (Nintendo, Rockstar Games).
 

asd202

Enlightened
Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,557
There were talks that Creative Director left in the middle of the project not that long ago and they never showed much of the game so I'm not surprised. Wonder if they will be able to deliver the game this holiday season.
 

Lant_War

Classic Anus Game
The Fallen
Jul 14, 2018
23,577
This makes me think Microsoft is confident in Infinite having to meet expectations. Hype.
 

Splader

Member
Feb 12, 2018
5,063
Taking this with a massive grain of salt, but even if true doesn't seem like dev issues are a new process for Halo games.

Still, not long to wait now...
 

thepenguin55

Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,815
They've struggled with Halo since day. I've never been convinced 343i knows what to do with the series.
 

Fiery Phoenix

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,838
I thought the writing was on the wall. It still looks to be targeting this fall, but I wouldn't expect a full product.
 

Nooblet

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,632
Suddenly it makes sense that we've barely seen anything from the game or had any info for a game that was supposedly coming out this year and announced a while ago.

Bungie Halo games had a similar story too, actually that's just the Bungie story now regardless of games.
 

ArchedThunder

Uncle Beerus
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,062
Keep in mind that rebooting it wouldn't mean they'd have to abandon everything, so if this is true a 2020 release is still very much in the cards. You'd be surprised how often games get rebooted a year or two before launch, hell it's happened with multiple Halo games.
 

UraMallas

Member
Nov 1, 2017
18,918
United States
The person who wrote that was not verified for this info. Just a FYI to all in this thread. The info verified was that XSX entered production last Monday.
 

Magic-Man

User requested ban
Member
Feb 5, 2019
11,454
Epic Universe
I think it's just the story, and it'll still be a launch title.

The gameplay is very consistent across all the games, and I'm pretty sure that they wouldn't change the graphics, but the story has had a very mixed reception in recent entries and Microsoft wants to make sure that they get it right this time. Another thing is the open world, but I wouldn't expect that to change much, either.
 

FatherOfTheCats

Alt Account
Banned
Apr 30, 2020
11
Halo has been a 'S' tier franchise since '01 but it's treading that line at the moment. It would be a huge boon for Series X if they can launch it alongside the game but with 15 studios, they don't need to rush.
 

Theorry

Member
Oct 27, 2017
61,016
The user was not verified for this info btw. He was verified with the Series X started production. Just letting you guys know. Thats why Transistor says "on the subject"
 

Kolx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,505
So it'd have been in the oven for only 2 years by the time it releases? Uhh that doesn't sound good. At least we're getting a better product than the pre-reboot one (hopefully).
 

ArchedThunder

Uncle Beerus
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,062
There were talks that Creative Director left in the middle of the project not that long ago and they never showed much of the game so I'm not surprised. Wonder if they will be able to deliver the game this holiday season.
The campaign creative director left last year, according to this poster development was rebooted in 2018 and tge development is good now.
 

Duxxy3

Member
Oct 27, 2017
21,728
USA
I'd rather they delay the game than get something with the same "quality" of Halo 4 or 5.
 

Brix

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,680
This is bad. Was going to be my first halo on launch day since the OG on Xbox.
 

Kaguya

Member
Jun 19, 2018
6,408
To be fair, you really don't need inside info to figure out 343i is struggling with Halo.
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
At the end of the day, with the console still a way off release, it's not actually that concerning or surprising they haven't shown more of the game.

What lends more credence to these rumours about troubled development are employee reviews like these on Glassdoor, which paint a pretty damning picture of management (which to be fair is a fairly common complaint among reviews of most studios), but more surprising, of the tech and engine side of things. Hell, this one is just from a couple of months ago.

Cons
"It's shocking how an organization with Microsoft's resources and has been around as long as 343 has could be so dysfunctional. 343 has serious systemic issues that will take a massive effort to correct. Some of these stem from Microsoft policies (more on that in a bit) but also from executives that seem badly out-of-touch with their team.

It definitely feels as though the higher-ups at 343 don't understand how their studio is doing in day-to-day operations, and worse, seem concerned only with pleasing their superiors at MS corporate instead of being advocates for the studio and its workers. This means not pushing back on unreasonable deadlines or demands from corporate.

The obvious, primary cause for many of 343's problems lies with its over-reliance on contractual labor, as others have mentioned. This appears to be a policy within all of Microsoft, but it is especially damaging to a game studio.

Firstly, there's a lack of continuity which is a recipe for a bloated, hacked-together project as devs have to quickly learn systems that were created or modified by their predecessors (most of whom no longer work at the company) and to make hasty changes as they only have 18 months (or less) to get their work done.

Second, as others have mentioned, there is nothing more detrimental to morale and work ethics than a lack of investment (as many devs won't be seeing the project they're working on through to the end), and since so few contractors are converted, it's easy to see how in combination with the first point how this might lead to bad habits. Expediency is over-favored at the expense of sustainability.

Speaking of, there's the tech debt, which is probably better summarized as "technical bankruptcy" in 343's case: a now decades-old, swollen codebase littered with thousands of duct-tape fixes and a development infrastructure so flimsy that it more frequently hurts productivity than helping it. There were times when the entire studio was unable to check in new code or content for *weeks*.

Communication is absolutely atrocious at 343. The "primary" channel for communicating to folks is email, which also gets populated with hundreds of automated messages a day, creating a terrible signal-to-noise ratio and as such many people just will never respond to it. Without any quality options as official policy, it meant that if you wanted to get in touch with someone you had to find out what means or service they do use, and everyone uses different things.

Combined with the high attrition rate mentioned above, this also means that as a new employee you have to navigate this wilderness in order to talk to collaborators or clients, and frequently have to "cold call" coworkers to get work done. Crunch. An overcrowded and noisy work environment. If you're someone who has difficulty working with people constantly moving around your workspace or have trouble focusing with loud ambient noise, good luck."


Even the positive reviews talk about the "tech debt" and issues with the engine, which is weird, as this is supposed to be their brand spanking new and improved engine, but it seems it still has lots of issues.

Cons
"There's a lot of tech debt. The engine is old and cumbersome and so are the workflows. They're working on it, but they're not where they need to be yet. The game they're trying to make is too ambitious for their current time and tools. They've scoped it down a lot, but I still predict a lot of crunch coming up for most folks on the production side around milestones. Things are broken a lot and there are days when getting work done is a challenge. They're iterating on their processes but it's going to take time. It feels like people leave a lot. With Microsoft's policies on contractors, some revolving door action is expected, but even senior full-time people and directors come and go fairly often. I think they just get burned out. It's not super good for morale. It's really hard to get hired or converted to full time. They typically don't have many openings because of Microsoft rules."

This isn't to say these things can't be worked on or that the game can't still turn out incredible (see Uncharted 4 which also had troubled development and similar complaints about a high contractor percentage and turnover). I'm actually hopeful it'll be the best and most ambitious 343i Halo yet, but it certainly does paint a less than ideal picture of how things are going with the project.
 
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Jan 11, 2018
9,653
Bummer, but makes sense. Seemed odd to go from 3 year dev cycles to 5 for a series they should be very comfortable with by now, unless they are completely reinventing the wheel here.
 

Gloam

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,492
These guys couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery.

Halo has a long way to go to get back to the glory days.
 

Deleted member 54073

User requested account closure
Banned
Feb 22, 2019
3,983
Halo has been a 'S' tier franchise since '01 but it's treading that line at the moment. It would be a huge boon for Series X if they can launch it alongside the game but with 15 studios, they don't need to rush.
I'd say its more of an 'A' tier franchise after the last 2 games but if they can get it back up to what it used to be then that would be a huge gain for Microsoft.

It'll be interesting to see how this turns out as they keep painting the game as special.
 

Prefty

Banned
Jun 4, 2019
887
I think they can still make it to launch, reboot doesnt mean throwing everythin to the trash can, I bet they can still use all the assets and a lot of code
 

Kittenz

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,156
Minneapolis
Well if they started full steam somewhere in 2016 and they had to build Slipspace engine first, they might not have been THAT far into it. Rebooting like take a different story approach or focus? Or reboot like trash all the art and assets and everything created in 18 months and flush it? One seems much less troubling than the other.
 
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