Organic Webshooters > Mechanical

To me, the problem really comes down to his origin story. If you see Spider-Man as a guy who got a bunch of powers, then retrofitted them into a spider theme, mechanical makes sense. He'd need webs for the theme. But if you see him as a guy who got bit by a radioactive spider, got spider powers, but bizarrely didn't get the ability to do the one thing spiders are most known for, but also by complete coincidence happens to be specifically a genius at mechanically replicating webs, entirely independent of his run in with a spider... That's kinda dumb. It makes sense to prefer biological when you look at it like that.

And the thing about webs coming from his butt is dumb if you're willing to accept that the spider gave him clairvoyance and wall climbing abilities that work through shoes.

Jon Carter said:

This debate is useless. There is no convincing you guys. Enjoy your mechanical web shooters.

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Come back next time in a few months when this debate is brought up again

That little comic is great.

I assume the government, or some corporation (i.e. Oscorp), would have gotten a sample of the web left behind from Sipderman swinging around NYC.

If Peter could engineer and create a new, revolutionary material from his bedroom, I can't imagine the Oscorp and the government couldn't figure out how to reverse engineer the material with essentially unlimited resources.

So, organic is the only right answer.

Joe said:

To me, the problem really comes down to his origin story. If you see Spider-Man as a guy who got a bunch of powers, then retrofitted them into a spider theme, mechanical makes sense. He'd need webs for the theme. But if you see him as a guy who got bit by a radioactive spider, got spider powers, but bizarrely didn't get the ability to do the one thing spiders are most known for, but also by complete coincidence happens to be specifically a genius at mechanically replicating webs, entirely independent of his run in with a spider... That's kinda dumb. It makes sense to prefer biological when you look at it like that.

And the thing about webs coming from his butt is dumb if you're willing to accept that the spider gave him clairvoyance and wall climbing abilities that work through shoes.

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Well, there is the point that he is literally the only person on that school trip that is interested in the science. It's not like they retroactively ret-conned him into being a nerd or something.

Also, going organic would have it's own logical shortfall that would have to be made up.

Do you give him spinnerets that are useless and can't actually shoot webs, therefore nixing his most iconic trait (web-slinging)?

Or do you just asspull and say that his forearms are transformed into actual organic web shooters that don't actually exist in nature?

This argument has always just bothered me because the entire logic of the claim is based on a complete misunderstanding of how spider-webs actually work.
If the argument basically boils down to "his powers are biological so he should get organic web shooters as well!" then I want them to point out these organic web shooters that exist in nature.

To my knowledge, the only similar feature is in ground spiders which can do shotgun style blasts to catch prey.

I'd like a mixed idea, Spider-Man makes webbing organically, BUT it functions exactly like a spider's and so he has to use his sciencing to make it fly out of his wrist and do all the cool stuff he does with it.

he should be able to shoot webs from his nipples

davepoobond said:

he should be able to shoot webs from his nipples

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So much half knowledge in this thread.

Mechanical. I love the fact that Peter Parker is this (mostly)untapped scientific genius but never had the funds or the proper education to maximize his intellectual gifts. So he has to dumpster-dive to craft his web-shooters and spider-tracers.

Volimar said:

Yes. Hence why I replied in a joking manner.

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You should probably work on your jokes...

Blasphemy. Mechanical is much cooler in concept and execution.

I don't mind either way. Spidey 2 is my favourite film so I let organics slide.

MistaTwo said:

Well, there is the point that he is literally the only person on that school trip that is interested in the science. It's not like they retroactively ret-conned him into being a nerd or something.

Also, going organic would have it's own logical shortfall that would have to be made up.

Do you give him spinnerets that are useless and can't actually shoot webs, therefore nixing his most iconic trait (web-slinging)?

Or do you just asspull and say that his forearms are transformed into actual organic web shooters that don't actually exist in nature?

This argument has always just bothered me because the entire logic of the claim is based on a complete misunderstanding of how spider-webs actually work.
If the argument basically boils down to "his powers are biological so he should get organic web shooters as well!" then I want them to point out these organic web shooters that exist in nature.

To my knowledge, the only similar feature is in ground spiders which can do shotgun style blasts to catch prey.

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Nothing about Spider-Man exits in nature. All his powers are exaggerated for funsies.

He's supposed to be a mutated man-spider, so yeah, why not give him the main thing spiders do? Him just being a bit stronger and having quicker reflexes than a regular human is lame.

Sirhc said:

The mechanical ones give great opportunities for tension when he runs out.

Organic is kinda nasty and lack options to change it up.

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That yeah but Peter can also adjust the webbings components if need be like making it more sticky, giving it more strength (holding/lifting stuff), change how the webbing shoots in small burst or long wide shot....
Ben Reilly made webbing balls.

With organic webbing you are limited with your options.

No. Mechanical Web Shooters are integral to Peter's genius level Intellect. Something the Raimi films completely dropped.

Mechanical > Organic. It is known.

Also, he's not getting enough credit for the spider-tracers:

Agreed, OP.

Has Slayven or anyone mentioned the reason Peter came up with this formula before anyone else was because the radioactive spider gave Peter an instinctive knowledge/the scientific formula to make Web fluid?

I don't care either way. I get that the mechanical shooters are part of his character but I also get why Raimi went with his version.

I do find it funny though that Stan Lee gave Peter a bunch of Spider powers except for the most obvious one. Weird decision but it worked out I guess.

Joe said:

To me, the problem really comes down to his origin story. If you see Spider-Man as a guy who got a bunch of powers, then retrofitted them into a spider theme, mechanical makes sense. He'd need webs for the theme. But if you see him as a guy who got bit by a radioactive spider, got spider powers, but bizarrely didn't get the ability to do the one thing spiders are most known for, but also by complete coincidence happens to be specifically a genius at mechanically replicating webs, entirely independent of his run in with a spider... That's kinda dumb. It makes sense to prefer biological when you look at it like that.

And the thing about webs coming from his butt is dumb if you're willing to accept that the spider gave him clairvoyance and wall climbing abilities that work through shoes.

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But he's not specifically a genius at replicating webs. That's just the task he put his mind to. Necessity is the mother of invention and all.

The Hiveking said:

Nothing about Spider-Man exits in nature. All his powers are exaggerated for funsies.

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You know what I mean. While it is all pseudoscience at best, the idea of him getting the proportionate powers of a spider makes scene mathematically. It's not that they are actually stronger than humans of course, it's just how linear size/scaling works.

So from our perspective, even every day spiders (and other arachnids and insects)do seem super agile and strong because of their speed and ability to lift way more than their weight. That is where the entire basis for his power set comes from.

So, it's pseudoscience but the creators were drawing from specific spider traits for his power set.

I was just pointing out that web shooters are literal fantasy and even the pseudoscience they were using wouldn't easily explain. Of course they could have just made it up as a new thing.
Spiders, for the most part, don't have anything resembling a web shooter. Peter Parker did not invent mechanical web spinnerets, he invented web shooters.

Maybe all the organic web fans hail from Australia. If there is one place on earth where spiders can zip around on their webs through the air like spider-man, it's fucking Australia.

Of course I am probably giving the creators too much credit anyway as I remember in his origin story called spiders insects at least once.

Man I need to re watch the Raimi Spider-man movies. Organic all the way!

I prefer organic. just makes more sense

You wouldn't be able to do Spider-man 2 without organic.

Organic was always cooler.
Peter shooting the webs without even knowing he could do that is cool as hell.

I don't know anything about Spider-Man comics but in the films it seemed perfectly logical that one of the "powers" he acquires from the spider would be the ability to spin webs. It seems asinine to make him construct the web shooters himself.

Bishop89 said:

You wouldn't be able to do Spider-man 2 without organic.

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And a world where Spider-Man 2 isn't Spider-Man 2 is what we call a mistake.

Veelk said:

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Funny thing is, Ultimate Peter lived for only a year.

Bishop89 said:

You wouldn't be able to do Spider-man 2 without organic.

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He could lose all the other powers. Infact. he can only web swing through New York because of his enhanced strength, check the Anti-Venom arc for more on this.

Bishop89 said:

You wouldn't be able to do Spider-man 2 without organic.

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That movie is already heavily based upon the "Spider-Man No More" story from the comics, which got by just fine with the strain of being a superhero being a good idea on its own, and that was decades before James Cameron even put organic web shooters down on the page.

I like Spider-Man 2 also but oragnic webs are the signs of a trader. Mechanical for life.

Mechanical > Organic

It showcases his intelligence and it opens the possibility for countless situations where he has to adapt due running out of cartridges/webbing. One of my favourite sequences from Homecoming is where you realize how smart of a kid Pete is while he's working on manufacturing his webbing formula.

Scorpion Soldier said:

Mechanical > Organic

It showcases his intelligence and it opens the possibility for countless situations where he has to adapt due running out of cartridges/webbing. One of my favourite sequences from Homecoming is where you realize how smart of a kid Pete is while he's working on manufacturing his webbing formula.

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You mean the 10 seconds (that's not even an exaggeration) he looks at a piece of paper, pours orange into something and stirs.

You guys really exaggerate the "it shows how smart he is" aspect of it.

I swear, everything people compliment Homecoming for I swear Civil War did better with his intro.

CountAntonius said:

Why wouldn't they come out of his butt though?

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I remember a quote from Atomic Magazine that has always stuck with me.

People look up, and shout "OH MY GAWD IT'S THE ASSWEAVER!"

The problem with mechanical webshooters is that they raise the question of why Peter never shared them with his allies. Why doesn't every Avenger use them if they can be build and possibly mass manufactured?

introspective squid said:

The problem with mechanical webshooters is that they raise the question of why Peter never shared them with his allies. Why doesn't every Avenger use them if the can just be build?

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Kinda wanna see Captain America shooting webs from his shield.

introspective squid said:

The problem with mechanical webshooters is that they raise the question of why Peter never shared them with his allies. Why doesn't every Avenger use them if they can be build and possibly mass manufactured?

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Why doesnt build Tony Stark Iron Man Armors for everyone?

Organic is just too unrealistic

GAMEPROFF said:

Why doesnt build Tony Stark Iron Man Armors for everyone?

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Rhodes?

I dont really mind either one tbh, even if the Raimi movies are my favorite, but organic definitely works better logically

I just think it's a much harder sell to have the Parker we've seen in any of these films be able to invent such a revolutionary material capable of that much strength and elasticity

Like yeah the comics say hes a genius, but nothing in ANY of the movies has sold his capability of inventing something like this. Plus if hes making shit like this he wouldn't even be poor either.

Shin Bobo Dakes said:

Rhodes?

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Yo, Peter gave his Webshooters to Kaine, too. And to Miles Morales. Still. Why is it a problem for mechanical Webshooter that Peter doesnt make them for all of his allys, when Tony Stark also doesnt build Iron Man armors for every hero, too.

Spiderman should live on a farm out in Kansas.
And Iron man should have web shooters.

Parker making his own was demonstrative of his genius intellect and his ability to cleverly augment his organic abilities with technology.

Just another piece of evidence that Rami didn't really understand the character all that well.

(Don't even get me started on mopey, sad sack Peter Parker)

THErest said:

But he's not specifically a genius at replicating webs. That's just the task he put his mind to. Necessity is the mother of invention and all.

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Yeah, I thinks thats a perfectly valid reason why nobody ever invented webbing before him.
Because nobody was trying to.
There's literally new inventions every day that nobody ever thought of before, and the most successful inventions are of the "why did noone else think of that before?" variety.

Given his whole "great power..." ideology its not a huge stretch he wanted to invent non-lethal weaponry instead of just punching the shit out every criminal he met.

GAMEPROFF said:

Why doesnt build Tony Stark Iron Man Armors for everyone?

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At one point all the guards in the Vault had Iron Man level armour to deal with criminals, but to prevent anyone stealing it and becoming a super villain - because lets face it theres a real fucking risk of that actually happening with any technology in the formerly-known-as-the-616 - they didn't have their own power supply, they just ran off inductive charging supplied by the Vaults regular power supply.

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric said:

Just another piece of evidence that Rami didn't really understand the character all that well.

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I think thats unfair, Raimi is just a good enough film director to know what to cut for the sake of brevity.
Like... seeing peters eyesight fix itself without the need for glasses, or seeing him suddenly have a 6 pack overnight are just storybeats that work.
They work a lot better than the clumsy monologuing exposition of the original comics in fact.

Dr Wily said:

I think thats unfair, Raimi is just a good enough film director to know what to cut for the sake of brevity.
Like... seeing peters eyesight fix itself without the need for glasses, or seeing him suddenly have a 6 pack overnight are just storybeats that work.
They work a lot better than the clumsy monologuing exposition of the original comics in fact.

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I didn't care for his rendition of Spider-Man overall. The organic webshooters are just one of many reasons but I do think Peter's creation of mechanical webshooters is an important allusion to his genius and in that omission the character loses something valuable in the translation.

Tetra-Grammaton-Cleric said:

I didn't care for his rendition of Spider-Man overall. The organic webshooters are just one of many reasons but I do think Peter's creation of mechanical webshooters is an important allusion to his genius and in that omission the character loses something valuable in the translation.

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But it didn't, just like the 10 seconds (again, not exaggerating, it's literally 10 seconds) of Holland's Spider-Man stirring orange and clear to make "webs" didn't add anything to Homecoming. Who's the person in the theater that saw that and went "oh, NOW I know he's smart".

It's literally just a check box that you guys get excited about for no reason. The ONLY thing adding that accomplished was to get you guys to not bitch about the new movie.

No ass web, no deal. Mechanical and cartridges always.