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Canto Bight (Star Wars) vs Stormbreaker (Infinity War)
- Thread starter FloatOn
- Start date
The Canto Blight arc feels like the only contribution Finn has to the film is to take a little sidetrip to a very disneyfied Casino-land to help free the horsies, and the justification that he needed to do that to learn a lesson assumes he's a complete idiot coward on the level of a small child were the concept of selflessness is something he's never heard until now.
And yes, I'm aware of the reapeated ad-nausea argument on this site that he stated in TFA that he only went to Starkiller to save Rey. That doesn't mean he has no hint of selflessness whatsoever. That's the most extreme interpretation of that line and actual character assasinatipn in order to try and prop up a terrible arc in TLJ.
Add to that the terrible payoff of that whole arc/lesson at the end of the film that makes no sense. Imagine if in Infinity War this happened:
Thor: "BRING ME THA-"
*Thor is rammed aside as he jumps by Natalie Portman crashing into him mid-air in a plane. Wakanda is swiftly over run behind them and the people slaughtered as he pulls her out of the wreckage.*
Thor: "Jane why?"
Jane: "This is how we win..."
And yes, I'm aware of the reapeated ad-nausea argument on this site that he stated in TFA that he only went to Starkiller to save Rey. That doesn't mean he has no hint of selflessness whatsoever. That's the most extreme interpretation of that line and actual character assasinatipn in order to try and prop up a terrible arc in TLJ.
Add to that the terrible payoff of that whole arc/lesson at the end of the film that makes no sense. Imagine if in Infinity War this happened:
Thor: "BRING ME THA-"
*Thor is rammed aside as he jumps by Natalie Portman crashing into him mid-air in a plane. Wakanda is swiftly over run behind them and the people slaughtered as he pulls her out of the wreckage.*
Thor: "Jane why?"
Jane: "This is how we win..."
Stormbreaker gave us Thor + Rocket's entrance using the Bifrost and the "BRING ME THANOS" line which cause audience cheers at both showings I went to.
Canto Bight didn't come close IMO.
Canto Bight didn't come close IMO.
That's something different, and entirely subjective (I find the casino scenes pretty fun, love how it builds the world. My only issue is that some effects shots of the chase aren't that great)
Canto BIght actually has a character arc changing who Finn is and how he views and reacts to the world, and it also adds to the themes of the movie.
Stormbreaker has Thor get a new weapon.
Canto Bight has story. Stormbreaker has plot.
Right, there's also that. Both Poe's and Rey's storylines leads into the salt planet where the mystic have to save the pew-pew laser fighters. It is very Star Wars, it works. Finn grows as a character, but for everyone else in the movie, he might as well have been in the bathroom this whole time.
I hope we see a lot more of Finn on Episode IX where this journey end up being very important for him as a character ("He wouldn't have saved everyone if not for the lessons learned on his road trip"), but right now it feels weird.
The Stormbreaker plot was terrible. We've already had the weakened Thor without a weapon plot in Thor 1 and Ragnarok.
Are you Thor, the God of <Insert Weapon>?
Are you Thor, the God of <Insert Weapon>?
I don't think that is the lesson learned, tho.
He being a coward or selfish was barely a thing in the whole thing. Finn is an ex-stormtrooper, his whole view of the world is "shoot people who are enemies".
His arc is that when he gives up being a stormtrooper in Ep. VII, that open the floodgates to questioning all sorts of things, including traditional notions of heroism.
He goes from a black and white world (which is in some ways the entire backbone of Star Wars) to at least 50 shades of grey.
I think the point was: Finn was a stormtrooper, the blind soldier who follows orders; what do we do so he is more than the stormtrooper for the rebels when he turns? And the answer is to drown him in something that stormtroopers doesn't have, which is doubt.
So he doubt himself, he doubts the cause, he goes to evil place, but that is in part funded by the rebels, he finds a Solo-esque character who ends up not having the heart of gold after all. I think one reasons people are genuinely confused with the whole Finn plotline is that it is meant to be sort of confunsing in a world where a major part of the mythology is that the light is good and the dark is bad.
But again, the execution is, oh boy.
My big problem with Canto Bight is that it sucked all the drama out of the chase because they demonstrated that people could come and go at will. It also demonstrated that there was zero chemistry between Finn and Rose. Because of this the kiss at the end felt like a groupie infatuated with a celebrity stealing a kiss at the least opportune moment.
You do realize characters viewpoints don't live in extremes do you? You can have a sense of selflesness, and still think: hell no, I'm not getting dragged into this fight. Since TFA Finn wanted to get as far away from the First Order as possible, you know, the guys that kidnapped and brainwashed him. That is, untill he starts to care too much for Rey to realy leave her. That's the point TLJ starts. Finn wants to get out of the war between FO and the Resistance and live in peace, but he also wants to be there for Rey. That's an understandable and human motive. Then, in TLJ he starts to see the bigger picture (remember that up until TFA he probably hasn't left a FO base in his life! This is the first time he sees the world) trough the events he takes action in, and he changes. He becomes a hero willing to die for a cause.
Your comparison is way off too. You missed a parameter. If Thor said "bring me Thanos", while everybody around him realises Thor is on a suicide mission that wouldn't help anyone at all, Jane would be right to crash into him...
But yeah, Stormbreaker has a cool pay-off. It's a big bang action scene and power fantasy. It's all shiny package and no content though. It's pure plot, without telling a real story. That's why I found Infinity War when all is said and done a pretty dull movie. Two days later I could hardly remember the details of what precisely happened, because it moves from one plot point to another, without meaningfull character development behind it. I could retell TLJ's story and what the character's went trough and how it affected them weeks after seeinig it.
I get what you're saying and I compeltely agree that it's a great way to approach his character.
But like you say, the execution is bad. The arc starts out with him asking were Rey is, then deciding to run away. He even says when told people are fleeing the same way he is "...well that's just disgraceful." Then he has to be tasered to force him not to leave. It's not very understanding or empathetic introduction towards him.
And I feel like the childishness of the whole Casino setting can't be ignored. Like it feels like something out of a small kids movie, far more than anything in the prequels or even the Jar Jar-centric clone wars episodes. The result is that it feels very condescendig towards Finn and the audience (or at least to me).
And this is the approach taken with both movies in a nutshell. TLJ prioritizes character arcs/progression that move the plot forward, IW is straight action plot beats. There are no character arcs to speak of. And I liked Infinity War a lot but one of these approaches is a better kind of art.
Would be curious to see the two side-by-side, but the Canto sequence seems like it's a lot, lot longer. The big difference, though, is that the Canto sequence has no real pay-off in the end - there's no moment that comes directly from that sequence that makes it feel worthwhile, except for possibly the final scene before the credits. Stormbreaker has a few different key pay-offs that are enormously heroic - the arrival into Wakanda is one, obviously, but equally good is moody teen Groot finally 'waking up' and doing something significant, etc
The thing is - and this was a realization that hit me like a lightning bolt the second time I saw IW - these big team-up movies aren't really about anything. I think this is where Ultron failed, actually - it tried to have some greater themes and ideas and there was actually no room for it once you'd done the character moments of these heroes interacting and established the greater threat. IW isn't really about anything, it doesn't really have a theme - but I suppose the point is that it doesn't really need to, because there's all these ancillary movies whose themes feed into it - that's what makes it so successful. I don't even think not being about anything is even a criticism you can level at IW at this point, because it's not intended to be.
I have no problem with it, fwiw - I loved Infinity War and saw it three times - it's just a thing about how these films are structured. I wonder if Avengers 4 will have more actual substance, given it's going to be juggling a much smaller cast, which theoretically should make some room.
The thing is - and this was a realization that hit me like a lightning bolt the second time I saw IW - these big team-up movies aren't really about anything. I think this is where Ultron failed, actually - it tried to have some greater themes and ideas and there was actually no room for it once you'd done the character moments of these heroes interacting and established the greater threat. IW isn't really about anything, it doesn't really have a theme - but I suppose the point is that it doesn't really need to, because there's all these ancillary movies whose themes feed into it - that's what makes it so successful. I don't even think not being about anything is even a criticism you can level at IW at this point, because it's not intended to be.
I have no problem with it, fwiw - I loved Infinity War and saw it three times - it's just a thing about how these films are structured. I wonder if Avengers 4 will have more actual substance, given it's going to be juggling a much smaller cast, which theoretically should make some room.
This. My fan edit would be to take all of that out and have the code breaker be on board and having to find them while not letting Holdo find out.
Storm breaker was worth it for Thor's entrance
It's challenging to compare the two since Stormbreaker logically followed from Thor losing Mjolnir in Ragnarok and will probably be relevant in future movies while Canto Bright was only really relevant to the overall plot in maybe a thematic sense.
How is this a sentence? Outside of the times he did an outstanding job, I don't think he did the movie any favors?
There's weekly TLJ threads here, I've seen the same group of posters constantly argue that Finn was a coward (that word specifically) who was only driven by his desire to save Rey.
Certainly Finn isn't fully for the Reaistances cause but I don't believe it's reasonable to say he'd run away like he tried to. Nor that he needs whatever lesson be got given to him how it was.
As for my comparison it was meant to be humorous but doesn't the scene in TLJ operate off the assumption that Finns suicide attack would suceed in stopping the weapon?
Infinity War had a complete character arc for Thanos and had a pretty strong underlying theme about sacrifice and how much the ends can ever justify the means. I also had a micro arc to develop Tony and Peter's relationship with one another as well as Gamora and her relationships with Thanos, Nebula, and Quill.
I think the problem with Ultron was that its themes were muddled and the movie had a difficult time balancing between its cast and its villain was far too underdeveloped.
Plus, y'know...
"It'll kill you!"
"Only if I die."
"Yeah, uh, that's normally what 'it'll kill you' means."
The actual emotional impact was impressive, with Thor trying to convince himself more than Rocket that Thanos is just next in line for a kick up the arse from Sparkles and that everything will be fine once he gets the weapon only to then show us just how far he can go to succeed, but Thor is just so adorably stupid and that line kills me every time.
But he wasn't running away from the fight, he was running torwards a fight he felt more important. I get that he might be selfish in a way that Rey is more important than the whole picture, but I never understood how he could be a coward. Him being tasered was a comedic scene because of the miscommunication of Rose thinking he is trying to just flee the battle.
Oh man, but I agree with this either regarding Stormbreaker.
Maybe because I enjoyed the whole unworthy arc on the comic books, but while Thor is not the hammer (as was the theme of Thor 1 and 3), a weapon makes him complete from a symbolic point of view, too.
Thor's arc isn't that he is useless without a weapon, but that he has to earn it. First he has to learn to live as a human on earth to truly earn Mjolnir and now he has to go into a journey to forge his own weapon, which is neat considering he just lost his father who forged his last one.
And it is a kind of classic heroic journey; he loses everything, then goes to a far away land, do some amazing feats of strenght and is rewarded; it could use more of an arc, like Thor is insecure after failling everyone in fighting against Thanos, but by the end he is screaming the "Bring me Thanos" line. Problem here is that he was cool and confident throught the whole movie. The line directed at Rocket that he is only going to the forge because that's where Thanos will not be could be directed at Thor. "Are you sure you need a new weapon or are you just avoiding Thanos?" I don't know who could have said it, but make Thor less of a ... god a little bit. He is at his lowest point, but he never really acts like it.
That said, the plot is there and it is satisfying. We open the movie with his brother giving him last words of hope before a cruel unjust death and we end with him triumphant and powerful. It is a power fantasy, but it not a free one.
Thor loses his father (the king), his weapon (which is part of identity) and the kingdom (his birthright); he then loses his friends, his people and the only family left. So the journey is about him rediscovering his identity. He forges a weapon that is his, not his father's present, which is good, so growing up and leaving his father behind. He finds new friends (the guardians), he fights for his new family (the avengers) and for literally all the universe instead of just his people. But again, as with TLJ, this could have been translated better in the execution of the movie.
Canto Bight also fails because it "grey areas" the conflict in a way that would make even Rogue One blush. The weapons manufacturing at Canto is totally legal, and the labor pool they exploit is being used by both sides of the conflict.
Combined with Rose's disastrous saving of Finn, the much better handled Luke fake-out, and Poe getting his comeuppance repeatedly for being a suicide soldier, it seems like the movie's message was "the only way to win is not to fight". Of course, it offers no narrative reason to believe the Republic/Rebellion has a chance or a even a good reason to exist, since they've been utterly decimated and their continued war is making everyone's lives worse. Stumbling upon Benicio Del Toro as the only other prisoner who just happens to have the exact skillset they need, and having a goofy CGI chase that wasn't even as good as the Obi Wan scene in Ep III, and having the entire trip be lamented by the characters in-universe as a waste of time due to terrible chain of command, didn't do it any favors.
Stormbreaker gave us one of the best random pairings of the entire movie series (Rocket and Thor), probably the most badass Thor scene in the six films he's been in (the Star forge), a memorable "big damn heroes" moment when he returns to Wakanda, and a genuine moment of suspense when he attacks Thanos all out.
Combined with Rose's disastrous saving of Finn, the much better handled Luke fake-out, and Poe getting his comeuppance repeatedly for being a suicide soldier, it seems like the movie's message was "the only way to win is not to fight". Of course, it offers no narrative reason to believe the Republic/Rebellion has a chance or a even a good reason to exist, since they've been utterly decimated and their continued war is making everyone's lives worse. Stumbling upon Benicio Del Toro as the only other prisoner who just happens to have the exact skillset they need, and having a goofy CGI chase that wasn't even as good as the Obi Wan scene in Ep III, and having the entire trip be lamented by the characters in-universe as a waste of time due to terrible chain of command, didn't do it any favors.
Stormbreaker gave us one of the best random pairings of the entire movie series (Rocket and Thor), probably the most badass Thor scene in the six films he's been in (the Star forge), a memorable "big damn heroes" moment when he returns to Wakanda, and a genuine moment of suspense when he attacks Thanos all out.
It absolutely does not have a character arc for Thanos. He's the same person in the beginning of the movie that he is at the end. His character doesn't see any growth or change from the events of the plot. He achieves his goal but he doesn't have a character arc.
Stormbreaker subplot is really good because it shows us how Thor is hurting, it give us more information about Thor's past before Earth (How he knows many places in the universe, how old he is, even his Asgardian education), and we finally get to see him at his most powerful state so far. The payoff is huge.
Stormbringer was epic but canto blight is probably one of the most unwanted and badly paced sequence ever put on movies.
It's also completely irrelevant. The First Order doesn't need a warmongering corporate sector to keep its war effort moving. They're zealots; they would do that all on their own. So the impact of this faceless corporation selling to both sides doesn't make any sense as a driving force behind the war. Aside from being a not at all subtle dig at the current war machine in the U.S., it doesn't fit at all in Star Wars. It's not like the First Order is just going to leave said corporation alone when it wins the war against the Rebellion. Canto adds absolutely nothing to the story, and adds almost nothing to the development of Finn or Rose, since the moment they're on the First Order ship we go right back to Rose shitting all over Finn. Finn similarly gets 0 real changes; those don't come until we're on not-Hoth.
Are you sure you didn't watch a porn parody version by accident?
Because it's not going for the same thing lol, this is baffling how people don't see how tonally different both arcs are
What a liked about Thor's arc in Infinity War is that he never felt at a low point or not confident (in a relative sense). He had this wearied, smoldering rage going on, buoyed by his confidence and his "nothing to lose" attitude. He saw his entire world crumble, so all he wanted to do was run that fade on Thanos. He fell back on his fundamental identity as a warrior God, and it drove him for the entire movie. It was pure momentum.
Canto Bright was a diversion. When you can say "it was better off if they never went," then it doesn't bode well for the story being told. And Canto Bright doesn't even justify its existence, because the payoff being "sometimes you fail" can be told in any manner of ways, specifically ones wherein they aren't separated from the majority of the cast. It's a momentum stopping setpiece that doesn't look good, and only offers boilerplate observations that war is a battle which mostly touches the poor masses, replete with a smattering of "both sides." Those themes are represented by Star Wars inherently and never required to be teased out and clumsily showcased. Canto Bright says a whole lot of nothing, and doesn't make much sense or - at the very least - look stunning while doing it.
Canto Bright was a diversion. When you can say "it was better off if they never went," then it doesn't bode well for the story being told. And Canto Bright doesn't even justify its existence, because the payoff being "sometimes you fail" can be told in any manner of ways, specifically ones wherein they aren't separated from the majority of the cast. It's a momentum stopping setpiece that doesn't look good, and only offers boilerplate observations that war is a battle which mostly touches the poor masses, replete with a smattering of "both sides." Those themes are represented by Star Wars inherently and never required to be teased out and clumsily showcased. Canto Bright says a whole lot of nothing, and doesn't make much sense or - at the very least - look stunning while doing it.
Canto Bight only showed the characters were idiots and accomplished nothing. Even if the side quest had proved to be successful, it was made utlimately redundant since Hold had a plan already, but for whatever reason, decided not to share with anyone.
I don't remember IW well enough to go into details. Only saw it once and I forgot so much about it so quickly. But I can see all those elements where there, but didn't get developped well enough (or didn't get the time too). It's like the plot points where there, without the connective tissue to have it feed a story.
I feel in that regard that Canto Bight in TLJ (which on return viewings, isn't as big a part of the movie as it seems) does way better what it sets out to do, not in the least because it pairs Finn with two characters who challenge his world view.
I rather have a movie trying to tell more and not getting there, than one that doesn't even attempt too. I don't believe it's impossible to do. TLJ has arcs for almost every character it features (Luke, Rey, Kylo, Finn, Poe, ...) while Infinity War manages the many characters by focussing on a few, and still doesn't pull off telling us something meaningfull about them (the closest we got was Starlord shooting Gamorra, but soon after this is nullified by him overreacting and fucking up when Thanos tells him he killed her.
Infinity War is just a big set-up movie. It's about getting Thanos his stones. And the real story only begins on the snap (that's interesting! That's an event that forces the character's who are left to react and evolve). And I personally find that pretty dull, no matter how cool the action may look.
And even when you accept that IW doesn't have to have a big theme or many arcs, I feel you can make a way more interesting movie. The characters almost all get paired with others they don't really clash with. Thor and the Guardians have the same kind of humor and world view, Tony and Strange are both narcisistic smart dudes. While you have so much potential elsewhere. I mean, Tony and Cap are in a cold war with each other. You can center a movie or at least a plotline around them having to get back together and overcome differences in an attempt to stop Thanos. That would get us to the meat of things: real, interpersonal conflict in stead of superheroes punching goons. (That's why the first Avengers works so well, these characters have to learn to work together. That's why Civil War is so good: it's personal this time!)
Or you could really do what some claim IW already does: have Thanos be the main character. Tell the movie really from HIS point of view, and have him struggle to achieve his goals in stead of ticking of a list of 5 stones, which he gets without too much oposition.
I found IW such a disapointment, especially after the cool streak MCU-movies were having. It was an empty movie, only setting up a potentally way better and more interesting Avengers 4. That's why halfway trough I already struggled to keep being invested, and forgot most of what happened soon after I left the theater.
Yeah, you can describe his actions as somewhat cowardly. That's just what value you give to what he does, and what the subtext tells us he feels. And that is: Finn wants to get out of the conflict, and wants to save Rey.
And what's wrong with the lesson he learns? He starts to see the world for what it is. He has two characters around him standing in for two viewpoints (fight for what you believe in and for the greater good versus literally Don't Join - keep out of it, as it's an endless cycle) and by what he experiences, he picks one of those sides. That's basically how you write a story arc. Have him want something, give him a worldview, make it hard for him to achieve what he wants, challenge his worldview, and then let him realise what he needs as opposed to what he wants, and adjust his worldview to it.
I know it was a joke, but you still missed the point :P And yes, it is stated quite clearly by Poe it's a useless action and we actually see his skiff speeder desintegrate way before he reaches the ram.
Indeed. Your last sentence even tells it all. He achieves his goal without too much opposition or struggle (only sacrificing Gamorra comes close, but their relationship is so underdevelopped it completely falls flat as a character beat). He doesn't have to learn something, he doesn't have to change. He has to fight some dudes and wins.
If Thanos has an arc or if he's supposed to be the main character, it's terribly written.
lol definitely not my thing.
I'm referring to, at the least, when they're discussing how to get off the FO ship and Finn comments "I know how to get to the escape pods from here", and Rose snarks back "of course you do". Get it? Because when they met he was trying to get into an escape pod? Get it? She thinks he's a coward? See the funny joke!? Ugh. So bad.
I kind of agree. "You don't know the First Order like I do." Defects after being asked to gun down innocents. Yet, suddenly he's supposed to be enlightened by the war economy?
Rose being a First Order soldier whom had a friendship with Finn would have worked much better. We could have avoided Canto and went straight for the ship sabotage mission. Finn is noticed by an old friend (Rose), whom feels betrayed by Finn's treachery but is also revealed to be a gray character herself. Their interaction could have brought up a lot of interesting things, such as their programming, their loss of identity, etc. She could have betrayed Finn just like DJ. Maybe ends up switching sides at the last minute. More potential interaction with Phasma, perhaps a choice to save Rey and escape once she arrives on the ship or complete the sabotage so the resistance can escape, and he chooses the sabotage.
Honestly, even if they wanted to stick with Resistance Rose, there are about a dozen better ways that it could have been done. Not turning Finn into the comedy punching bag of the movie would have been a good start. From his "walking around in a leaking suit" start to getting tazed on his way to find Rey, to running around a casino looking like a kid in a candy shop, the movie really only gave him a small bit of being an actual awesome character. Then it gets turned into that awful stalker "we fight for what we love, and I love you even though I've known you less than 24 hours and think you're a cowardly piece of crap I'm willing to die for you" hack moment. Uuuuuugh
That's just the one that sticks out in my mind. I haven't seen the movie since December, and much of it was forgettable noise.
The Stormbreaker subplot is actually relevant and has some effect on the main plot. You couldn't just remove it.
You could remove Canto Bight and nothing really changes.
You could remove Canto Bight and nothing really changes.
I know it's kind bad form to reference outside material but in the novelization they crash on the beach. Not sure if this was a deleted scene or not but they didn't land on the beach on purpose. Also, I wouldn't necessarily characterize their actual infiltration into Canto Bight as a covert op or anything. They could go there and gamble if they want to no problem. As long as they don't disturb the rich folks too much.
I would agree that Thanos doesn't go through an arc, but more, a gradually unveiled understanding to the audience. At the beginning of the film he's this mysterious tyrant who ruthlessly decimates the Asgardians and beats the crap out the most powerful heroes. As the film progresses, we learn that he's actually quite clever, not above emotionally manipulating or torturing his own children, that he mourns the loss of his followers/daughters, that he sees his mission as a mercy rather than a punishment for the universe, that he's not mustache-twirling evil, and that he relishes a good struggle.
He's a very different Thanos from the comics, but still a very intimidating and interesting villain. I'm actually pretty interested to see how he's handling Godhood after the inevitable timeskip coming before the next film, since he doesn't have the motivation of trying to win over Death or having every God in the universe trying to steal the gauntlet from him.
Now I wish that TLJ was more about taking down the rich profiting off of war and the exploitation of kids and the lower class.
Finn's plot is pretty bad, actually. He tries to leave a movement he never joined once at the beginning of the film and nothing he does afterwards shows any reluctance to stop helping that movement but it's supposed to be a earned arc when he's ready to kill himself for the movement? It's a very bad plot.
He literally left and came back to help the resistance in The Force Awakens when the First Order blew up the republic, before he knew Rey was taken so the "he never really joined the resistance" excuse is meaningless because he spent the majority of his screen time already helping them, completing Poe's mission and everything.
The problem is Finn's subplot is there to serve the themes of the film rather than actually explore Finn's character in any satisfying way. Finn goes to Canto Bight so RJ can world build, only. Finn's just along to keep the unsatistfying subplot moving.
I didnt mind Canto Bight on both viewings. It fleshed out Rose, introduced shades of grey to the SW lore, added some visual flair and adventure moments to the story and setup the post credits scene.
Sure, its not perfect but the degree of criticism it receives is a little hyperbolic for my taste.
Sure, its not perfect but the degree of criticism it receives is a little hyperbolic for my taste.
As others have said, one is important to the movie, the other is not.
One is a hero taking agency to stop the villain. Coming back from a heavy defeat to go at the antagonist full force.
The other is a diversionary trip brought on by a forced conflict between two characters so bad it makes day time soap operas seem clever...all because the writers couldn't figure out how to use anyone in the plot but Luke, Rey, and Kylo.
One is a hero taking agency to stop the villain. Coming back from a heavy defeat to go at the antagonist full force.
The other is a diversionary trip brought on by a forced conflict between two characters so bad it makes day time soap operas seem clever...all because the writers couldn't figure out how to use anyone in the plot but Luke, Rey, and Kylo.
I suspect Thanos will be doing exactly as he said; resting (farmer Thanos?). I don't think MCU Thanos cares for godhood or having the gauntlet and stones beyond being able to do the snap. And he will only re-enter the movie proper once he realises that the avengers are attempting to undo his efforts of the previous movie, through whichever means they try.
