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tuxfool

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,858
Playing online, automatic updates, exclusive deals, bonus games, etc. The most convenient thing, however, is knowing that I don't need to worry about other subscription service for the hardware I already own. Just like Spotify, you mindlessly pay for it and trust the company to do their stuff.
To be a mindless consumer, is asking people to take advantage of you. If everyone just trusted their service providers to get on with it, they'd never improve. I don't think anyone can be super vigilant about what they consume 24/7, but they shouldn't also take things as they are, especially if there is a lack of competition.
 

Alexandros

Member
Oct 26, 2017
17,799
Companies on PC don't have their customers by the balls because of the online multiplayer paywall.
 

Windu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,616
Playing online, automatic updates, exclusive deals, bonus games, etc. The most convenient thing, however, is knowing that I don't need to worry about other subscription service for the hardware I already own. Just like Spotify, you mindlessly pay for it and trust the company to do their stuff.
These conveniences are free on open platforms. Microsoft and Sony's cut of every game sold should cover these costs for these features anyway.
 

Suicide King

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,018
To be a mindless consumer, is asking people to take advantage of you. If everyone just trusted their service providers to get on with it, they'd never improve. I don't think anyone can be super vigilant about what they consume 24/7, but they shouldn't also take things as they are, especially if there is a lack of competition.
I'm not saying people shouldn't be critical. I just mean that people can pay a fair amount and get the service that they are promised without worrying about anything.

These conveniences are free on open platforms. Microsoft and Sony's cut of every game sold should cover these costs anyway.
You can also listen to music on YouTube and Soundcloud instead of paying for it. Same goes with Netflix. What you value and consider convenient for its price is not what everyone does in the same way.
 

Vorador

Member
Oct 28, 2017
463
Playing online, automatic updates, exclusive deals, bonus games, etc. The most convenient thing, however, is knowing that I don't need to worry about other subscription service for the hardware I already own. Just like Spotify, you mindlessly pay for it and trust the company to do their stuff.

The convenience is not having a choice to think about. There's only one, related to the manufacturer. You take it or leave it.

Which also means they can change anything about the service and you can do zilch. Sony started charging for online on PS4 and there's nothing you can do. You can't change "online provider" for a console.

If Steam did something that displeased me, there are alternatives like GoG.
 

Deleted member 31817

Nov 7, 2017
30,876
I'm not saying people shouldn't be critical. I just mean that people can pay a fair amount and get the service that they are promised without worrying about anything.


You can also listen to music on YouTube and Soundcloud instead of paying for it. Same goes with Netflix. What you value and consider convenient for its price is not what everyone does in the same way.
Saying you like it for the convenience is fine. Saying you prefer it because of features every other service has is strange.
 

Saty

Member
Oct 27, 2017
610
Dunno how Apple doesn't crumble under the weight of 9-figure players of the many online-enabled iOS games.

I want them to announce online-play charge for mobile titles just to see if that userbase accepts it in open arms as the console one did.
 

Windu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,616
I'm not saying people shouldn't be critical. I just mean that people can pay a fair amount and get the service that they are promised without worrying about anything.


You can also listen to music on YouTube and Soundcloud instead of paying for it. Same goes with Netflix. What you value and consider convenient for its price is not what everyone does in the same way.
Well, with music on consoles I have a choice. For console multiplayer, I don't. If you can't compete without a monopoly then you are doing something wrong.

Let them earn my money by competing with other digital stores and services. The customer will benefit from it.
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,131
My concern about digital titles on consoles, even with better sales etc. Is the ability to access them down the line, support for them if servers shut down etc. You have no options in a closed ecosystem. So even if things are improving, that will always be an issue.
 

Windu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,616
My concern about digital titles on consoles, even with better sales etc. Is the ability to access them down the line, support for them if servers shut down etc. You have no options in a closed ecosystem. So even if things are improving, that will always be an issue.
If these companies ever go under I'd expect someone to buy their catalog. So I doubt customers would lose everything. If they did there would probably be a lawsuit and laws would start to prevent stuff like that from happening.
 

Suicide King

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,018
Well, with music on consoles I have a choice. For console multiplayer, I don't. If you can't compete without a monopoly then you are doing something wrong.

Let them earn my money by competing with other digital stores and services. The customer will benefit from it.
It's part of their ecosystem. Just like Apple's App Store. Why would they offer another company the framework to make stuff for their own hardware if selling software is part of their business model? It's not subscription-based, but it is in the same vein as a monopoly and there are not a lot of people canceling their PS+ accounts because they can't buy games for cheaper in another marketplace.

But this is what their service is, anyways. Sony sells you the PS hardware and the PS Store and PS+ infrastructure. If people are going to complain that they won't let you buy stuff for the hardware that isn't curated by them, you might as well complain that they don't let you buy stuff from the PS Store and run it somewhere else.
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,131
If these companies ever go under I'd expect someone to buy their catalog. So I doubt customers would lose everything. If they did there would probably be a lawsuit and laws would start to prevent stuff like that from happening.
Well we already know that happens, by the removal of many older titles on stores years later. It's not about going under, it's just about them not caring anymore. And as we move forward from here with backward compatibility, that will be more of an issue.

Regardless, there's really no comparing PC online vs console. PC trumps console and it's closed ecosystem in every way possible, from software, to services, to competition/value.
 

Deleted member 300

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,669
PC monthly subscriptions like humblebundle are better as Gold & Plus?

Can I play PS4 Games on my PS4 and Xbox One games on my Xbox with them? No? Well.

r8pZmJe.gif
 

Bjones

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,622
The more fragmented pc gaming gets with companies creating their own stores and own account systems the more I am willing to buy games on consoles again.

But to answer the ops question.. those console subs are not just for free games.
 
Oct 27, 2017
999
I'm not a fan of all of these subscription services, but Humble Monthly has the most value. As a console centric player I think paying for online is stupid and hate Microsoft for starting this bullshit (also wtf is up with F2P game still requiring Gold on Xbox?) but I understand why they do it.

I adored PS+ last gen, this gen I barely even download the free games. I believe my PS+ expires in 6 days and I won't be renewing it. I don't play online enough to justify it. What will suck is losing cloud saves.

1. PS+ and Gold are mostly for the online paywall, the "free" games are there to distract you from the fact that you're paying for online for no reason other than they want you to so they don't have to give you the best games all the time.

2. No competition.
This.

PS+ has become paying for online multiplayer, and Gold always had that focus. GWG and PS+ Free games are distractions.

Between stuff like League and Dota, combined with higher amounts of piracy the PC centric services need to provide more value to pull people in.
 

Windu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,616
It's part of their ecosystem. Just like Apple's App Store. Why would they offer another company the framework to make stuff for their own hardware if selling software is part of their business model? It's not subscription-based, but it is in the same vein as a monopoly and there are not a lot of people canceling their PS+ accounts because they can't buy games for cheaper in another marketplace.

But this is what their service is, anyways. Sony sells you the PS hardware and the PS Store and PS+ infrastructure. If people are going to complain that they won't let you buy stuff for the hardware that isn't curated by them, you might as well complain that they don't let you buy stuff from the PS Store and run it somewhere else.
I don't give a shit about a company's bottom line. I care about what is better for me the customer. Anyway, Windows, MacOS, and Linux etc.. do just fine by allowing more than one storefront. (and Android to a lesser extent allows it).

Anyway, obviously you have a choice to not buy that platform but closed platforms imo can never be good for customers. No amount of arguing will convince me otherwise.
 

Deleted member 13560

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,087
The more fragmented pc gaming gets with companies creating their own stores and own account systems the more I am willing to buy games on consoles again.

But to answer the ops question.. those console subs are not just for free games.

Competition is always a good thing. It leads to better goods and services at a quicker pace. I'm glad there are multiple storefronts on PC.

But it seems a sizable amount of consumers find some kind of comfort in a closed ecosystem.
 

Deleted member 12790

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
24,537
"I pay for this subscription because it has FREE GAMES" is one of the most illogical posts I see repeated on these forums. If you pay, it's not free.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,846
Dunno how Apple doesn't crumble under the weight of 9-figure players of the many online-enabled iOS games.

I want them to announce online-play charge for mobile titles just to see if that userbase accepts it in open arms as the console one did.

This is a terrible analogy because Apple takes a cut (and a hefty one at that) from every dollar that is exchanged on their platform.

I think all these arguments are kind of pointless thought because it's entirely variable. PC gaming can certainly be cheaper than console gaming with the monthly subs, or you can be the equivalent of those people who spend twice as much because they had coupons on sale (witness: the "my wallet" bellyaching around steam sales for games lots of people will never play.)

Unless people are publicly posting their game time combined with total spends on platforms and hardware there's no actual way to compare apples to apples.
 

ShinUltramanJ

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,949
The more fragmented pc gaming gets with companies creating their own stores and own account systems the more I am willing to buy games on consoles again.

But to answer the ops question.. those console subs are not just for free games.

Fragmented? They all work on my PC. It's competition, which is something consoles don't have.

Console subs are because you have no choice. If you want to fully enjoy your purchase there's likely a locked out multiplayer portion. If you want to access it you have to pay.
 

Bjones

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,622
Competition is always a good thing. It leads to better goods and services at a quicker pace. I'm glad there are multiple storefronts on PC.

But it seems a sizable amount of consumers find some kind of comfort in a closed ecosystem.

On pc you have to have your personal information and credit card info on all those multiple stores/accounts. Separate friends lists in both. It's a huge hassle and privacy nightmare.
 

danGlokta

Member
Nov 1, 2017
277
Correction...$132 for 13 months (of 8 to 9 games)
or you can sign up for 5 months of humble monthly (of $12) which will equate to $60, the price you pay for a full year of PS+...

And in this 5 months you get 40 to 45 PC games. compare to 24 to maybe 30 PS4 games over 12 months.

8-9 games every month
And it's 132$ for 13 months and you keep the games.
96 games every year for 132$

You're right that there are more games but I don't think you get 13 months for the year subscription. This is what shows when you select a 12 month plan, it even mentions that it will renew after the 12 months. The "1 FREE Month!" message just means that since you're charged 11/month when you buy that subscription at the end you save $12 dollars which is the price of one month.
 

texhnolyze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,150
Indonesia
i didnt say it makes them holy, nor did i say there's zero pirating on consoles. there's nothing ignorant about it. piracy on PC's and consoles isnt even comparable. it's simply a thing companies look at when considering business plans on PC that they pretty much ignore on consoles.
All right, sorry I didn't mean to put words into your mouth. But I believe console piracy is tricky to track, unlike PC. It's because people will still have to buy the console to pirate, and the manufacturer would give no shit about it. You also have to live in a 3rd world country to see the reality of it. Secondhand 5.0 firmware PS4s (or the already hacked ones) sell almost as much as a brand new one, it's highly valuable because if it's not piratable people won't buy one. Switch is also selling like hotcakes now after being piratable.

"I pay for this subscription because it has FREE GAMES" is one of the most illogical posts I see repeated on these forums. If you pay, it's not free.

ERA: "I pay for subs mainly to play online games, not the free games."
Also ERA: "Online games are trash, offline single player games for life!"
 

Arthands

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,039
The more fragmented pc gaming gets with companies creating their own stores and own account systems the more I am willing to buy games on consoles again.

But to answer the ops question.. those console subs are not just for free games.

Yah those console subs are also for paying features that are literally free on pc.
 

Arthands

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,039
You're right that there are more games but I don't think you get 13 months for the year subscription. This is what shows when you select a 12 month plan, it even mentions that it will renew after the 12 months. The "1 FREE Month!" message just means that since you're charged 11/month when you buy that subscription at the end you save $12 dollars which is the price of one month.

So you're saying we will be essentially being charged 11 months for 12 months worth of humble monthly games for that package. Hmm.

But like you say, it didn't change the point. $60 worth of humble monthly gives you more games (that you get to keep without sub) than $60 worth of PS Plus.
 
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Echo

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
6,482
Mt. Whatever
Platform warz

I feel really bad for these people that need to close themselves off to one platform, then tattoo said platform on their chest like some tribal warrior. Eh, maybe they can't afford multiple gaming platforms and are just trying to make themselves feel better via fanboyism. But know you're missing out if you're console only or PC only.

As someone who owns a PC and a PS4 Pro, I actually feel like this gen has been making it really easy to be PC only. And since Sony's focus is trending more and more towards Western taste, I don't see that changing next gen either when I'll probably end up skipping PS5 wholesale.

That's just regarding games though. I also have a dislike for my PlayStation because of how shit Sony is in regards to PSN policy, network infrastructure, and lack of BC.

... But I mean yeah, it's just so much easier on the brain to boil everything down to "platform warz."
 
Oct 29, 2017
1,662
I love humble monthly. Probably the best ongoing deal in gaming.

I was gifted a year of PS+ (I don't play online on my ps4 pro) and it's ok for the discounts when there's game sales.
 

JaseC64

Enlightened
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,008
Strong Island NY
I agree.

I hope one day MP is axed from a sub. Also don't like how the games you get on PS+, you can never buy "back" as long as you are a member. I've seen some of them drop to $1 in the past (I think some PS3 games) yet I couldnt buy them out right. One day I may not have PS+ so I'd rather buy rhe ones I like when they go on sale. Screw Sony for not giving you the option.
 

PK_Wonder

One Winged Slayer
Member
Mar 22, 2018
1,102
"I pay for this subscription because it has FREE GAMES" is one of the most illogical posts I see repeated on these forums. If you pay, it's not free.

Obviously what people mean is they become essentially free after the break even point. On PS+ for example, if you like a minimum of 2 of the 40 or so games they offer over the course of the year and those 2 games would normally cost $30 each, you've broken even. Every game you enjoy beyond that is for all intents and purposes "free." You paid $60 to get X of unknown games, sure, but once it becomes better than a $60 value for an individual, it's saved money.
 

Bakercat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,154
'merica
This reminds me to not renew PS+ on my PS4. I rarely play online and it's bullshit I have to pay Sony for the key to it.

The only reason I'm interested in Nintedo's is for the Netflix still classic games, but if it turns to shit as well I'll drop them too.
 

Deleted member 13560

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,087
On pc you have to have your personal information and credit card info on all those multiple stores/accounts. Separate friends lists in both. It's a huge hassle and privacy nightmare.

I have discord so no to the friends list thing. And also a no to having my info spread out. All of my accounts for different platforms are 2 or 3 factor authentication, but my personal information is elsewhere.
 

Megasoum

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,562
You know what's an even better value than subscribing to Humble Monthly?

Checking the BST thread every month to only buy the games you actually want for super cheap.
 

Turtleboats

Member
Nov 13, 2017
1,797
It's precisely why I buy all my multiplat digital games on PC.

PCs are forever and anywhere, but I only use a console for that generation usually.

There is also steam family sharing and the bundles as you mentioned.
 

degauss

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
4,631
User Warned: System Wars
I think i'll start a thread...

"why on PC don't you have a unified friends/library/store where you buy everything, see what everyone is doing, party up with friends and voice chat, and it all just updates seamlessly, and as a bonus you get a bunch of free, sometimes pretty premium/expensive games per year. All this without maintaining or launching a litany of different libraries, shops, communication apps, WHY. Why am I dicking about with windows updates, graphics card drivers, steam, origin, battle.net, discord, various in game chat implementations, humble subscription, twitch prime, and various other shit, I'm also amassing a giant collection of crappy indy games I will never play"
 

BlacJack

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
1,021
Because that's not what people buy Gold and PS+ for.

Why are you paying then?

Oh right because they are closed systems and the users have no choice. Almost forgot.

I think i'll start a thread...

"why on PC don't you have a unified friends/library/store where you buy everything, see what everyone is doing, party up with friends and voice chat, and it all just updates seamlessly without maintaining or launching a litany of different libraries, shops, communication apps, and as a bonus you get a bunch of free, sometimes pretty premium/expensive games per year, WHY. Why am I dicking about with windows updates, graphics card drivers, steam, origin, battle.net, discord, various in game chat implementations, humble subscription, twitch prime, and various other shit"


We pretty much do though. Steam in many ways is better, and even though it's not our only store (good thing), 99% of PC players have it anyway, for your very reasons. So many people who have clearly never touched PC gaming talk on it, and it's painful.
 

Vuze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,186
ITT: "I proudly subscribe to PS+ to be able to access the multiplayer component of games that I already paid top dollar for, the 90% trash temporary freebies that come with it are just the icing on the cake"
Some people are too far gone.

That being said, Origin Access and Humble Monthly really are some good deals. The latter in particular given that you can even sell the game keys you don't need (or buy for cheap if you aren't subscribed).
 

Deleted member 8408

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
6,648
What's the point of this thread?

Does it hurt your feelings?

I think i'll start a thread...

"why on PC don't you have a unified friends/library/store where you buy everything, see what everyone is doing, party up with friends and voice chat, and it all just updates seamlessly, and as a bonus you get a bunch of free, sometimes pretty premium/expensive games per year. All this without maintaining or launching a litany of different libraries, shops, communication apps, WHY. Why am I dicking about with windows updates, graphics card drivers, steam, origin, battle.net, discord, various in game chat implementations, humble subscription, twitch prime, and various other shit, I'm also amassing a giant collection of crappy indy games I will never play"

Please start the thread. Make the thread title "let me show you my ignorance".
 

Subutai

Metal Face DOOM
Member
Oct 25, 2017
937
I think i'll start a thread...

"why on PC don't you have a unified friends/library/store where you buy everything, see what everyone is doing, party up with friends and voice chat, and it all just updates seamlessly, and as a bonus you get a bunch of free, sometimes pretty premium/expensive games per year. All this without maintaining or launching a litany of different libraries, shops, communication apps, WHY. Why am I dicking about with windows updates, graphics card drivers, steam, origin, battle.net, discord, various in game chat implementations, humble subscription, twitch prime, and various other shit, I'm also amassing a giant collection of crappy indy games I will never play"
This is just sad at this point.
 

Deleted member 1759

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,582
Europe
I think i'll start a thread...

"why on PC don't you have a unified friends/library/store where you buy everything, see what everyone is doing, party up with friends and voice chat, and it all just updates seamlessly, and as a bonus you get a bunch of free, sometimes pretty premium/expensive games per year. All this without maintaining or launching a litany of different libraries, shops, communication apps, WHY. Why am I dicking about with windows updates, graphics card drivers, steam, origin, battle.net, discord, various in game chat implementations, humble subscription, twitch prime, and various other shit, I'm also amassing a giant collection of crappy indy games I will never play"
Who hurt your feelings? Do you want to talk about it?