I still can’t get over the lack of Virtual Console on Switch.

Ygqora · Jul 10, 2018

It must have not made enough money to justify doing it the same way, otherwise it would already be there. They're trying other things like the online service and how some third parties are releasing legacy collections. I said this in another thread recently but Tom Phillips was one of the ones claiming we'd get GameCube games on the switch and was asked if he still believed it would happen after Nintendo announced the VC brand wouldn't be returning and he said yes, that it just wouldn't be called VC but you'd still be buying sunshine no matter what it was called.

As for me, to be perfectly honest I love the idea of having legacy games on the switch... But thinking realistically in a situation where they were available, there are actually very few I would want to get (and most of those are gamecube games) and I also never really bought VC games on the Wii or Wii U. Think I bought just two Wii U vc games and none on the Wii. I'm not generalizing or everything, just saying I might be in that area of player who outwardly wants to be able to buy legacy games... But when they are available to there aren't many I actually do.

Gimme TTYD though and I'll buy that in a heartbeat.

SinCityAssassin · Jul 10, 2018

Terraforce said:
I question the validity of this, but even if it's true, hard to use this as a discernible reason when the Wii U was a flop and 3DS was very limited in scope. The Switch is very much different.

Even on the best Wii years, it's been estimated that most VC titles average at less than 10k sales. They aren't doing this a 4th time.

TheMisterManGuy · Jul 10, 2018

Megatron said:
They didn't imply that they were either. People hoping for first party GameCube, Wii and n64 games on the switch, I mean, let's face it, there no reason to think any of that is ever coming.

In an interview last year, Koizumi was asked about GameCube Virtual Console coming to Switch and his response was literally "we're working on something like that". So we do know that Nintendo has other systems in mind for release, but they won't be available immediately or in a way that people may expect. Really, they're still releasing classics, they're just not doing it through the old "Virtual Console" system. Depending on how the Free NES games with Switch Online goes, I think most people will forget about missing Virtual Console, and grow to like the new system. Thus, Nintendo will then later roll out more games plus games from other systems in the future.

treasureyez · Jul 10, 2018

TrickyAssist said:
I guess, but even then just a cut and dry statement like "We're working on bringing more legacy content to the Switch." is all that's needed. No fluff or filler, just something clear and concise.

Reggie, via IGN:

"The Virtual Console successor is Nintendo Switch Online, right? With the mentality that says we're going to be offering a slate of games, and it's a slate that's going to increase over time," Fils-Aime said. "For many of these games, there's going to be additional online capability provided in those games. That's the vision we have for how to best bring our legacy content to Nintendo Switch."

They've been really clear that Nintendo Switch Online (great name ...) that it's their approach to classic games on the Switch. I sure hope the library expands beyond the NES pretty quickly, though!

Bman94 said:
The Switch Online service has only mentioned modified NES games. Which assumes most games would have to go under this modification to push the multiplayer angle which possibly means less games available overall due to having to spend time on those modifications.

Reggie says "many" above, which seems to imply it's at least optional. I wouldn't worry that this is what will block them from bringing more games over to the service.

Deleted member 21709 · Jul 10, 2018

SinCItyAssassin said:
Even on the best Wii years, it's been estimated that most VC titles average at less than 10k sales. They aren't doing this a 4th time.

That would be mind boggling. Sorry. Just ridiculous.

And I'm going to need a source for that.

Bman94 · Jul 10, 2018

ScottyJayMan said:
It's coming in the form of Nintendo Switch online, where you be able to download old games starting from September. And don't forget you've got the Arcade classics as well.

The Switch Online service has only mentioned modified NES games. Which assumes most games would have to go under this modification to push the multiplayer angle which possibly means less games available overall due to having to spend time on those modifications. And while the Arcade Archives line is great, it literally only covers arcade games, which leaves a lot of games out of that loop.

Bjones said:
I think it has more to do with third parties want to sell thier own " classics " packs and make more money. Capcom, Sega , and snk all three are doing so.

Problem is not even some of those companies are fully invested to the Switch for those collections. SEGA's latest genesis collection skipped Switch and Capcom had strange omissions like the Disney Afternoon Collection missing the Switch.

Ehoavash said:
It didn't make them enough money on Wii/3ds/ U

So a Netflix like sub for fucking $20 a year ( what a steal! Who the fuck wants to pay $5 for NES Golf ) is coming op..so fucking relax.

Again, stating only NES games. They've showed no plans for GameCube, N64, Gameboy Advance, Gameboy or Super Nintendo in that subscription service. And that's just naming Nintendo consoles. The Virtual Console platform also had games from Turbo Graffix, Neo Geo, SEGA Master System, SEGA Genesis, SEGA GameGear, MSX. The Virtual Console had a huge variety of consoles and games to choose from available for purchase to play at anytime rather than a subscription service where only a small number of games will be available at a time.

thewienke · Jul 10, 2018

SinCItyAssassin said:
Dude. Portability.

Especially on a screen that isn't trash like the 3DS.

808s & Villainy · Jul 10, 2018

TheMisterManGuy said:
We already have different brands for older content. Arcade Archives, Sega Ages. These companies are doing the branding themselves. They don't need to go through Nintendo just for the "privilege" of having the Virtual Console name.

You keep saying "going through Nintendo" and I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Does that fact that the eShop has genres filter mean those companies are "going through Nintendo"? No. So why would another filter/categorization be any different?

Terraforce · Jul 10, 2018

SinCItyAssassin said:
Even on the best Wii years, it's been estimated that most VC titles average at less than 10k sales. They aren't doing this a 4th time.

I'd argue the Wii was also a very different time. Especially since the Wii Shop Channel wasn't the best service. I know I didn't buy many VC games on the Wii for several different reasons.

Also where did you get those estimates from? I can't seem to find those exact numbers.

Braaier · Jul 10, 2018

Ingueferroque said:
Playing Final Fight 2 on my 3DS is neat, but uh.. I want to play them on my Switch. With proper 2-player support, a larger screen, and allowing me to play docked/undocked. And forget about SNES/GB/NES.. give us additional consoles like N64/Gamecube.

Why do I even have to explain this? The Switch is the best hardware Nintendo has ever released for the purposes of VC.

And no, buying the NES or SNES Mini is not the same.

Yeah but like you said you could play a lot of these games on the 3ds, I'm sure the vita had homebrew with emulation support, emulation on laptops, phones, etc. Plenty of portability options.

I just don't get it. I played these games when they released, have played many of them since. I don't need to keep playing them for the rest of my life.

I'm the outlier here though apparently.

TrickyAssist · Jul 10, 2018

brad-t said:
Reggie, via IGN:

They've been really clear that Nintendo Switch Online (great name ...) that it's their approach to classic games on the Switch. I sure hope the library expands beyond the NES pretty quickly, though!

Reggie says "many" above, which seems to imply it's at least optional. I wouldn't worry that this is what will block them from bringing more games over to the service.

That's still vague. You really can't say if he's talking about just NES games or not.

Deleted member 21709 · Jul 10, 2018

Braaier said:
Yeah but like you said you could play a lot of these games on the 3ds, I'm sure the vita had homebrew with emulation support, emulation on laptops, phones, etc. Plenty of portability options.

I just don't get it. I played these games when they released, have played many of them since. I don't need to keep playing them for the rest of my life.

I'm the outlier here though apparently.

I want to play them on my Switch. I don't care if I bought them before when they released on the original platform, or if I bought them on 3ds/wii vc, or have access to the roms/unofficial emulation options. I want to play them on my Switch. Without hacking anything. Take my money.

(I bought almost all ACA/Zerodiv releases on Switch so far, so I also need folders.)

SinCityAssassin · Jul 10, 2018

Terraforce said:
Also where did you get those estimates from? I can't seem to find those exact numbers.

Forecasting and Analyzing Digital Entertainment (FADE). The estimate came from 2009.

justiceiro · Jul 10, 2018

About the title, dont worry, op, you can and you will!

About everything else, seeing the small number of companies transiotioned from wii to 3ds and wiiu, yes, vc was a dead end, a unsutainable model to the modern market, and we all agreed that was stupid that you had to pay for rom dumps. Wouold not be better to pay for emulator, and get exicited knowing that improvment to the emulator affet a range of range of game instead of just the new ones? What motivation was for a company to improved alreadly released games?

This is from the market perspective, of course. On the consumers perspective, yes, switch is lacking and even fricking wii u is much better in this reagard. That's why buying one switch ritgh now is simply throw money at nintendo for their mediocricy. I hope more people realize that soon.

Zaro · Jul 10, 2018

Nintendo could make lot of bucks if they offer their games with an online services for all their console in the future.

Terraforce · Jul 10, 2018

SinCItyAssassin said:
Forecasting and Analyzing Digital Entertainment (FADE). The estimate came from 2009.

So what made you think the Wii U and 3DS were also that low?

TheMisterManGuy · Jul 10, 2018

808s & Villainy said:
You keep saying "going through Nintendo" and I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Does that fact that the eShop has genres filter mean those companies are "going through Nintendo"? No. So why would another filter/categorization be any different?

Virtual Console had a different system in place for releases. Unlike the traditional third party licensing method, Nintendo is the one who approached third parties to put their games on Virtual Console, not the other way around. Third parties could turn down the offer, and Nintendo could simply not approach certain companies. With the eShop, the publisher submits the game to Nintendo, and after approval, has it released within a short time frame. By adding Virtual Console, you add another step for publishers to get their games on the system, and that won't fly today.

Deleted member 6949 · Jul 10, 2018

Good riddance. It's beyond me why anyone wants to rebuy the same limited selection of NES games with questionable emulation.

Deleted member 21709 · Jul 10, 2018

SinCItyAssassin said:
Forecasting and Analyzing Digital Entertainment (FADE). The estimate came from 2009.

Haha, that's almost a decade ago..

hippopotamus said:
Good riddance. It's beyond me why anyone wants to rebuy the same limited selection of NES games with questionable emulation.

1. Even on 3DS, the emulation was awesome. I think we can assume it would be terrific on Switch.
2. The selection on 3DS wasn't that limited
3. Good riddance? Why?

SinCityAssassin · Jul 10, 2018

Terraforce said:
So what made you think the Wii U and 3DS were also that low?

The drip feed was incredibly slow compared to Wii so that was a factor, also using VC as Club Nintendo rewards certainly took a chunk of possible profit out.

Android 18 · Jul 10, 2018

This is part of why I hold on to my Wii U. Wii U's VC is missing some key titles that were great on the original Wii, but it still has some great ones that I can play. The GBA and DS offerings aren't huge, but they're really nice to have. I wish they had gotten around to releasing Castlevania Dawn of Sorrow on there, because Aria of Sorrow is.

BDubsLegend · Jul 10, 2018

Honestly if they had digital policies like Xbox, purchases carry over, wanting to get everything out there digitally, they would blow up industry up with 30 years worth of meaningful content. Nintendo seems to have this fetish for only selling things at top value. They end up making less trying to maximize each unit.

MidnightCowboy · Jul 10, 2018

The fact that I can play Super Metroid, Chrono Trigger, and A Link to the Past on a fucking Wii and not my Switch is just dumb.

Deleted member 5535 · Jul 10, 2018

I still can't get over this fixation with Virtual Console. This brand is dead and the format too.

Hadok · Jul 10, 2018

it's actually better.You've got a lot of arcade and neogeo games on Switch.

Cup O' Tea? · Jul 10, 2018

I just think it's a bit of a shame really. For me a big part of the Switch's allure was the thought of being able to play classic games on it. I just thought business wise it would be an absolute no-brainer for Nintendo. I'm guessing they make more money selling crappy little toys like the SNES mini.

MP! · Jul 10, 2018

Virtual console doesnt exist anymore... sadly

Android 18 · Jul 10, 2018

Nemesis162 said:
I still can't get over this fixation with Virtual Console. This brand is dead and the format too.

Because people liked it? Just because the company in charge of it decided to shit can it, doesn't mean we didn't really like the service. In fact it's frustrating that they did kill it.

Terraforce · Jul 10, 2018

SinCItyAssassin said:
The drip feed was incredibly slow compared to Wii so that was a factor, also using VC as Club Nintendo rewards certainly took a chunk of possible profit out.

We still don't know the metrics definitively though. VC games generally charted at the top for months, and still even to this day on the eshop, so I think you're definitely understating them. And if they can do that on the Wii U, they should be able to do marvels on the Switch.

Deleted member 21709 · Jul 10, 2018

Nemesis162 said:
I still can't get over this fixation with Virtual Console. This brand is dead and the format too.

But.. you understand why people want to play SNES etc. games on Switch, right?

SinCityAssassin · Jul 10, 2018

Terraforce said:
We still don't know the metrics definitively though. VC games generally charted at the top for months, and still even to this day on the eshop, so I think you're definitely understating them. And if they can do that on the Wii U, they should be able to do marvels on the Switch.

In this instance I think you're overestimating the possible quantity of things being sold on the wii u for old Nintendo video games to overtake modern games on the Wii U.

bear force one · Jul 10, 2018

They'll do anything to avoid actually letting people buy their classics and have them account locked so we have them across gens.

Eolz · Jul 10, 2018

It really sucks yeah.

808s & Villainy · Jul 10, 2018

TheMisterManGuy said:
Virtual Console had a different system in place for releases. Unlike the traditional third party licensing method, Nintendo is the one who approached third parties to put their games on Virtual Console, not the other way around. Third parties could turn down the offer, and Nintendo could simply not approach certain companies. With the eShop, the publisher submits the game to Nintendo, and after approval, has it released within a short time frame. By adding Virtual Console, you add another step for publishers to get their games on the system, and that won't fly today.

It's exactly the same system. Nintendo still does approach devs for games. It's just that it typically isn't for their old console titles. A modern day "Virtual Console" would be exactly the same as any other digital title nowadays, with extra categorizations for people specifically looking for older console titles.

We're splitting hairs at this point

Terraforce · Jul 10, 2018

SinCItyAssassin said:
In this instance I think you're overestimating the possible quantity of things being sold on the wii ufor old Nintendo video games to overtake modern games on the Wii U.

In the end it's just conjecture on both sides, but the retro Mario games currently on the eshop go for like 8 freaking dollars and it was top three on the eshop for months. And again there's the point of how much VC games charted on the Wii U/3DS eshops. So seems more like you're the one vastly underestimating what we've literally seen first hand, and you're relying too much on data nearly a decade old. Not even to mention the Classic Console craze. The fervor definitely exists and can be capitalized upon.

Jahranimo · Jul 10, 2018

Zaro said:
Nintendo could make lot of bucks if they offer their games with an online services for all their console in the future.

I believe that is the primary reason why the Virtual Console will become the classic game offering with the online subscription. I think over time they will add more of their games to the service for more and more platforms.

Everyone else is selling their classic games in a collection of their choosing and selling them at that.

Terraforce · Jul 10, 2018

Jahranimo said:
I believe that is the primary reason why the Virtual Console will become the classic game offering with the online subscription. I think over time they will add more of their games to the service for more and more platforms.

I'd be fine if they just made different tier levels. Let the NES games stay with the base online subscription, and charge $5 or $10 more per month for every additional console you want access to. Online is cheap enough as is, so I think they would be able to get away with it.

Deleted member 4034 · Jul 10, 2018

Zippo said:
It's driving me crazy.

I just want to play Galaxy and F Zero GX on my Switch.

That's an entirely different request.

Deleted member 5535 · Jul 10, 2018

LegendofLex said:
Sad fact is the vast majority of VC games have a quick day in the sun and get buried, never to be cared about again.

The subscription library model they're going to use going forward is much better suited to making sure Nintendo is incentivized to maintain a large and growing classic games catalog (and making sure customers are incentivized to play those games).

Exactly.

Hero_of_the_Day said:
They finally have the perfect system for it, and an actual online account system. So, now they don't do it, of course!

Except that they're doing it beginning in september.

Android 18 said:
Because people liked it? Just because the company in charge of it decided to shit can it, doesn't mean we didn't really like the service. In fact it's frustrating that they did kill it.

I don't care if you like it. That model needed to die and I'm glad they did for a subscription model which is much better. I prefer to pay 20$ for it than to pay 50$ or more for the same catalogue available.

Ingueferroque said:
But.. you understand why people want to play SNES etc. games on Switch, right?

I understand, because I want too. But I'm not crying over VC and it's old model when I can pay less for an entire catalogue instead.

treasureyez · Jul 10, 2018

TrickyAssist said:
That's still vague. You really can't say if he's talking about just NES games or not.

There's no reason to think that their "Virtual Console successor", their "vision for how to best bring our legacy content to Nintendo Switch" only includes NES games. All they've said is that NES titles are the launch titles.

Ororo · Jul 10, 2018

It's total BS and anticonsumer but Nintendo gotta Nintendo. Thankfully the Switch is hacked and we'll have our VC one way or another. Between the WIi U and the VC treatment I feel really burned by Nintendo and I won't ever be buying another digital game from theirs in the future.

SinCityAssassin · Jul 10, 2018

Terraforce said:
So seems more like you're the one vastly underestimating what we've literally seen first hand, and you're relying too much on data nearly a decade old. Not even to mention the Classic Console craze. The fervor definitely exists and can be capitalized upon.

I haven't commented on anything regarding the current climate for potential sales in retro games on the Switch. Only data related to whatever possible reasons third party and later Nintendo decided to step away from the Virtual Console umbrella.

The positive sales on whatever current retro titles available on the Switch points to a demand for such titles, which is what Nintendo is banking on for that step in the door for the Online Subscription.

RowdyReverb · Jul 10, 2018

Shoichi said:
If only the Classic line never took off. I really think that is part of the reason VC (as we knew it with the Wii/WiiU/3DS) has taken so long to appear (and may never appear again).

I don't mind if a Netflix-like subscription model appears. Where games are added over time to build a large library. That you can download or stream to your system but just like PS+ lose access to anything you download when your sub ends. I hope that is what Nintendo plans with their Nintendo Online Service by starting with NES games, and slowly work up over the generations.

I think you're right. Those classic consoles sold very well, and if I were in Nintendo's shoes, I might hold off on selling those games again on a new platform so quickly. Wait til those classic consoles gather some dust and nostalgia thirst returns

Mr. Wonderful · Jul 10, 2018

Nintendo really needs to start going the platform vendor and App Store model, similar to Microsoft, Apple, and Google, where with each system, they're providing new hardware, but the operating system is the same, and all your games you purchased 2 years ago still work for the most part. With hardware settling around ARM and x86 processors, there's no hardware reason not too anymore, and it's the right thing to do for consumers.

secretanchitman · Jul 10, 2018

Mr. Wonderful said:
Nintendo really needs to start going the platform vendor and App Store model, similar to Microsoft, Apple, and Google, where with each system, they're providing new hardware, but the operating system is the same, and all your games you purchased 2 years ago still work for the most part. With hardware settling around ARM and x86 processors, there's no hardware reason not too anymore, and it's the right thing to do for consumers.

Unfortunately I don't see them doing this because they want you to keep buying the same game over and over again, regardless of platform.

TheMisterManGuy · Jul 10, 2018

sdp said:
It's total BS and anticonsumer but Nintendo gotta Nintendo. Thankfully the Switch is hacked and we'll have our VC one way or another. Between the WIi U and the VC treatment I feel really burned by Nintendo and I won't ever be buying another digital game from theirs in the future.

Except the classic titles are still getting released. Nintendo just created a new method of distributing them. Classic games aren't going away just because the VC name isn't returning.

secretanchitman said:
Unfortunately I don't see them doing this because they want you to keep buying the same game over and over again, regardless of platform.

Funny, when the iOS model is exactly what Nintendo described before the Switch was even a thing. With the Switch, Nintendo has to start over again because they're completely changing how distribution works regarding classic titles. Which means something has to give, and the old Nintendo Network ID and Virtual Console services had to die with the Switch.

iswasdoes · Jul 10, 2018

Nintendo have scored a home run with the switch. But the lack of VC at launch is an own goal, and no decent online is a complete gutterball. Here's hoping they get a hole in one come September

Hero_of_the_Day · Jul 10, 2018

Nemesis162 said:
Except that they're doing it beginning in september.

For the price, I am certainly intrigued to see what they have to offer. But, a subscription isn't what I want. In my crazy ideal world, we would have had every Wii, WiiU, and 3DS VC game on the Switch a long time ago.

Deleted member 21709 · Jul 10, 2018

Nemesis162 said:
Exactly.

Except that they're doing it beginning in september.

I don't care if you like it. That model needed to die and I'm glad they did for a subscription model which is much better. I prefer to pay 20$ for it than to pay 50$ or more for the same catalogue available.

I understand, because I want too. But I'm not crying over VC and it's old model when I can pay less for an entire catalogue instead.

Do you mean the online system? From what we know that will only contain a handful of NES games..

Ororo · Jul 10, 2018

TheMisterManGuy said:
Except the classic titles are still getting released. Nintendo just created a new method of distributing them. Classic games aren't going away just because the VC name isn't returning.

No reason for VC not to return, also the service of classic games will launch with how many games? Nes/Snes? A year and a half after the console launch? How many games do you really think they'll get running before the next console?

They're not comparable, imagine if itunes told you all your music you bought won't be available anymore on your new computer but you can sign up for their new streaming service that only has a few songs on it.

The more you defend their anti-consumer ways the more they're going to do it. If people had complained to Nintendo from the beginning maybe we could've gotten some type of VC but instead people defended it. "Just wait", "They said it would come back later". and now it's too late, it's not coming. Nintendo has shown to change their bad decisions when there's enough backlash.

I still can’t get over the lack of Virtual Console on Switch.

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