To be fair, some (many?) are just duped by the false narrative and not intentionally spreading it. Or atleast that's how I believe.It fits their narrative that's really all that matters to them now.
To be fair, some (many?) are just duped by the false narrative and not intentionally spreading it. Or atleast that's how I believe.It fits their narrative that's really all that matters to them now.
It also doesn't mean there is something bad. This is dangerously close to implying that men are not allowed to be critical of anything a woman does, because if she doesn't like it she can label it "mansplaining" and it automatically becomes true. And if you aren't saying that, then I'll ask what is your criteria for judging whether something is actually a microagression or not?
Or perhaps we can simply say that ALL criticism is a micro-aggression (which could make a kind of intuitive sense) but follow that up with deciding that not all micro-aggressions are actually bad and sometimes can be actually good.
People are claiming that Deroir is a GGer? Fucking embarrassing
this is the statement released two days ago by game workers unite about this incident (bolded emphasis mine)
i haven't seen it posted elsewhere in the thread
Great statements. Can't disagree with a single sentence in eitheri added the game workers unite statement above to the opening post
today, they also released another statement about how arenanet's way of handling this issue has invited further harassment:
There's always another layer, there's always deeper, there is no bottomFunfact: Also Jebro isn't just some nobody streamer like Deroir. He's the husband of one of her coworkers and she reacted like that.
Some people will believe whatever they have to in order to convince themselves Price doesn't owe Derior an apology.
It fits their narrative that's really all that matters to them now.
Price was the one that escalated the situation when she RT'd Deroir's original tweet to make her followers know what an asshat she thought Deroir was. Why would he have to do anything to try to deescalate what she started?He has at least a bit of influence among the fandom. Even if it wouldn't stop the GG assholes, he should at least throw a few "back off you guys" out there. I don't have any on hand, but some other situations like this happened in the last few years were the Deroir-equivalent did their best to defuse the event that blew up.
That's hilarious reading this sentence on this forum.
- Were Deroir's comments condescending or rude? Yes. Any comment on professional work from non professionals is condescending outside of requested comments.
It's been going on here and at the other place forever. But this is the first case where it's just such a reach that I can't help but hope they're just trolling.Yep. Some people here are willing to believe (or claim) anything to support their argument. It's hilarious and scary to read
Then we wouldn't be having this whole debacle going off as is. :/It's been going on here and at the other place forever. But this is the first case where it's just such a reach that I can't help but hope they're just trolling.
It fits their narrative that's really all that matters to them now.
I wonder if the company asked her to delete the asshat tweet and make an apology via PM would she have done it. Probably would have saved a lot of drama.
Also what is with the "my dude" thing?
This is what I don't understand, even if you are with Jessica Price, why paint Deroir as the villain? What did he do?
Whether you are with ArenaNet or Jessica Price we should all agree that Deroir did nothing wrong here. Why are people suddenly shifting the blame towards him? It's really baffling.
This is what I don't understand, even if you are with Jessica Price, why paint Deroir as the villain? What did he do?
Whether you are with ArenaNet or Jessica Price we should all agree that Deroir did nothing wrong here. Why are people suddenly shifting the blame towards him? It's really baffling.
Baffling is definitely the right word. People doing insane gymnastics to paint him as a "toxic element" simply because his post was the catalyst for this incident.
It's like some sort of progressive catch-22. You don't want to admit someone might have been wrong to go off at someone else, because they are a victim of abuse in other instances, so you have to find a way to say someone who has been on the receiving end of an outburst here they shouldn't have been must somehow be in the wrong.
Because he was micro aggressive in his tweets. It was totally micro aggressive, micro condescending, and reeking of micro underlying sexist tones.This is what I don't understand, even if you are with Jessica Price, why paint Deroir as the villain? What did he do?
Whether you are with ArenaNet or Jessica Price we should all agree that Deroir did nothing wrong here. Why are people suddenly shifting the blame towards him? It's really baffling.
I agree that firing her was too extreme but I think we all know very well that the company didn't just fire her out of the blue, she did something that got her fired. You could argue that she didn't deserve to be fired but that's not really relevant anymore, it's already done.
She could've just ignore Deroir instead of attacking him, and besides that she could've at least said ''sorry dude I had a bad day'' or something like that, like she wasn't even remotely sorry about any of her behavior. I believe it is precisely that attitude that got her fired, not just the tweets.
Again I hate to see another female worker leaving the industry and I hate to see those GGers cheering over this but we can't deny that she brought this onto herself, she probably don't deserve the punishment but there's no doubt she is the one who started it all, in fact Deroir even gave her a chance to stop after her initial ''thanks for telling me what to do my dude'' response, but she just keep going.
Even if she started it, he seems like a decent guy and might be able to de-escalate this at least a little.Price was the one that escalated the situation when she RT'd Deroir's original tweet to make her followers know what an asshat she thought Deroir was. Why would he have to do anything to try to deescalate what she started?
Because he was micro aggressive in his tweets. It was totally micro aggressive, micro condescending, and reeking of micro underlying sexist tones.
This is what I don't understand, even if you are with Jessica Price, why paint Deroir as the villain? What did he do?
Whether you are with ArenaNet or Jessica Price we should all agree that Deroir did nothing wrong here. Why are people suddenly shifting the blame towards him? It's really baffling.
I agree that firing her was too extreme but I think we all know very well that the company didn't just fire her out of the blue, she did something that got her fired. You could argue that she didn't deserve to be fired but that's not really relevant anymore, it's already done.
She could've just ignore Deroir instead of attacking him, and besides that she could've at least said ''sorry dude I had a bad day'' or something like that, like she wasn't even remotely sorry about any of her behavior. I believe it is precisely that attitude that got her fired, not just the tweets.
What's even stranger is that nothing Deroir wrote could really be interpreted as telling Price or ArenaNet "what they do internally."
Anyone have Fries' tweets? I went to his twitter and just saw him and pictures of his cute puppies and other animals. Feel sad for the guy.
Definitely seems to be what's happening in this instance. Because a person has been the victim of abuse in the past, all of their actions and reactions are justified by default seems to be the argument.
I mean I can totally see why she would be upset about Deroir's feedback given how angry and on edge she usually are (even Jessica herself said that she is an asshole on twitter), but even then why can't she just ignore him? Why is she so pissed off?
"Why didn't she ignore it" Is a bad question to ask, even if you think she's completely in the wrong. This line of questioning is used in bad faith by the worst types of people in legitimate cases of sexual harassment on social media.
Except this is nothing close to sexual harassment..."Why didn't she ignore it" Is a bad question to ask, even if you think she's completely in the wrong. This line of questioning is used in bad faith by the worst types of people in legitimate cases of sexual harassment on social media.
Because if you start with the conclusion he must be sexist or being abusive, as the original accusation suggests so, then you have to find a way to support that being your conclusion.
I understand a debate around whether or not ANet are both entitled and justified to hand down disciplinary action, but going after Deroir is very ill-thought out for anyone actually reading and paying attention here. He genuinely didn't really do anything and even tried to calmly back off and apologise when things blew up. The same people going after him to try and make him fit as the villain here would probably rightfully call out others going on hunts to vilify people incorrectly in other instances.
It's like some sort of progressive catch-22. You don't want to admit someone might have been wrong to go off at someone else this one time, because they are a victim of abuse in other instances, so you have to find a way to say someone who has been on the receiving end of an outburst here they shouldn't have been must somehow be in the wrong. I'm sure his Twitter profile has been combed over 2000 times now to try and find something he's said or done in the past to use as evidence, but as far as I'm aware past transgressions haven't even been dug up to suggest he must secretly be GG or a harasser of women in gaming.
"Across multiple threads you've; ascribed hidden malicious motives to him and promoted others who did the same, said he didn't deserve to call himself a feminist, called him stupid, said he was playing "the victim card", called him an asshat multiple times across multiple threads, accused him of deliberately ordering his viewers to attack Price, when pointed out he did no such thing you back pedaled and said he did it deliberately while trying to make himself look like he wasn't doing it, ranted about how unfair it was for his audience to attack her despite her having a much bigger audience to rally and completely ignored her much larger audience dog piling onto Deroir when she very publicly put him on blast on her larger platform, said it was his fault she was fired. I can go on.
And I can back all of these up with direct links to your posts though I don't think mods appreciate people doing that sort of thing."
"These are our private social media accounts".People keep asking what Fries said. I have not seen anyone answer and I have not found any good "archive" of his deleted tweets other than an hour long video.
I decided to print screen and upload these for easier viewing, just to answer the question of "what did Fries say". Pardon the clumsy cuts and (lack of) quality.
This first one is just quoted on Reddit, I decided to take all of it as WP had it in the video. The actual quoted tweet is right there at the top. I saw that one myself before it was deleted so if you trust me I can assure you it's properly quoted.
The rest:
Not meant to paint a target on him or anything, just posting because people seem to not know about his tweets.
"Why didn't she ignore it" Is a bad question to ask, even if you think she's completely in the wrong.
This is the second time I've seen someone compare this situation to sexual harassment/rape. Fucking stop that. It's gross."Why didn't she ignore it" Is a bad question to ask, even if you think she's completely in the wrong. This line of questioning is used in bad faith by the worst types of people in legitimate cases of sexual harassment on social media.
This is one of the really baffling things to me. Like I mentioned to Relaxed Muscle a couple pages ago who has come out really hard against Deroir.
I really don't get the obsession with hating on the guy.
This is the second time I've seen someone compare this situation to sexual harassment/rape. Fucking stop that. It's gross.
Oh. I don't think what Deroir did was sexual harassment at all.
I don't think firing her was out of bounds; in my opinion she went from 0 to 100 real quick and then tried to paint the guy providing innocent feedback as a sexist for daring to have an opinion on what she does - which I might add affects the guy from twitter considering he's a content creator for the game. People get let go for far less infractions and I'd bet the state she works in (assuming she's American) has "at-will" employment meaning the company can fire her whenever and for whatever reason.Man, firing them was too far, especially poor Fries, man, that guy gently tried to give his coworker some cover and wasn't even rude about it.
Price should've been given an opportunity to apologize first. Given her defiant stance in subsequent interviews she probably would not have done it and then you can take it from there, and maybe that would turn into a performance review issue.
Firing someone right away like that was going nuclear, and you can already see what a mistake it was in terms of PR given the games journalism industry response.
Sheesh. That tweet is awful. I posted one earlier where the dude said "You're the type of man women fear being alone with." Like holy shit. And yeah, his twitter responses are a mess of people calling him a sexist/misogynist, congratulating him for taking her down or calling him a cuck and rubbing the entire situation in his face.He's the consequential reason Jessica/Fries lost their job, so there is a desire to put that blame on him. Kind of like a wrong place/wrong time blame situation. It's pretty unfair though as at a local level even after having some accusations thrown his way and getting a bit flustered he tried to de-escalate and apologize. Seems to have been completely silent since, so not celebrating and dancing on some grounds of "revenge". I think he's deleted all the tweets as well if this is the twitter account https://twitter.com/DeroirGaming
Just constant GW2 stuff. Clearly likes the game, likes the devs and tried to get involved. Shit blew up and now depending on who's @ replying to him it's probably congratulations or calling him a sexist/misogynist.
edit: Tweets still up, I got my dates a bit wrong.
It's especially hilarious when it comes to video games.Seriously, the idea that any comment from someone without the experience is automatically worthless coming from all of you is a serious display of cognitive dissonance. By this same logic if Donald Trump posts any fucking thing on his Twitter I can't come at him because I haven't had the experience of being President for two years.
Do you see how daft that is? To believe that nobody can give you a helpful suggestion because they don't have your so called experience level is arrogant. That's something I would expect from a GG'er quite honestly. In fact, I'm pretty damn sure they've used that argument before to defend their pig dog devs that make games like Hatred and that school shooter game whatever it was.
C'mon guys, we are better than this. I never expected to see the twisting of facts and logic to such a degree coming from here. Don't be like your enemies.
Fits the argument.Why does Price state that those are their private accounts when they're anything but?
You just can't tell your game's community that their feedback is unwanted, especially in an MMO, which are built around communities.