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Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
I'd rather the Dem candidate not touch that topic with a ten foot poll. Sorry but the culture war over guns is lost until old people really start dying off.
Sorry but no. Background checks poll extremely well, especially in the suburban areas where Democrats have been making gains. A gun control bill just passed the House easily with even a fair number of Republican votes.

Yeah there's a dead end contingent of extremists who will turn out to vote against it but if you don't think they were already coming out for the GOP you're deluding yourself. We can't keep living in fear of the fucking NRA.
 

Surfinn

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,590
USA
How did Beto responding to some dumb kid asking him to "please be nice" turn into this
He tweeted it himself with his own message.

There's a difference between saying "fuck the GOP and all their supporters" and actually recognizing/criticizing the people responsible for throwing children in cages/their sexual abuse.

We can and should criticize weak responses to serious issues.
 
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Sho_Nuff82

Member
Nov 14, 2017
18,391
Policy like HR1 or Medicare 4 All is shamelessly progressive and does not attack Republican voters. Enforcing prosecutions of people involved in criminal conspiracies for tens of millions of dollars is not an attack on Republican voters.

The incoming Dem candidate will have to be hard line against corruption from the executive or they may as well be Tulsi.
 

patientzero

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,729
My dad told me this as a teenager, though tbf he admitted he made it up to encourage me to shave my patchy neckbeard.

I should try that with my younger brother so that he'll get rid of the ridiculous muttonchops he sports.

Prince Charles shouldn't shave because he can't afford to get any dafter.

I only caught that typo when Aaron quoted me, but by god does it make me happy. It's easily the cleverest thing I'll say all week!
 
Oct 30, 2017
8,706
You can't just go out and say fuck Republicans and I'm going to arrest Trump when I get elected. That energizes the republican base and makes you look bad to moderates and independants. You will lose in a general election with that message. USA wants a uniter, not a divider. What he does once he gets in office is what matters. He's already said he would impeach Trump and he just laid out a list of horrible things Trump is doing in this video.
Actively being divisive might not be particularly useful. But the idea that we need a candidate to Unite us is basically nonsense.

We basically have a portion of our population locked into a rigid ideology of hatred, racism, xenophobia, and Reagonimic bullshit.
These people aren't going away. And that ideology will pretty much look the same for the next several decades.

We need to find a way to demoralize that vote and grow the Democratic coalition. The US will always have some sort of regressive, reactionary bunch of knuckle draggers. They have a strangle on American politics. They are not able to be united. They are welcome to enjoy the benefits of public healthcare, research, and infrastructure. But we can't unite.
 

futurevoid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,987
This is exactly why Beto is a no for me. I've said it before, he's not an empty suit, he's an empty rolled up dress shirt.
That's fair enough but I'll wait to see how the primaries play out before making that judgment call. The reality is that wherever these candidates stand on day one, that will shift as the primary process moves ahead and folks will be drawn to the left on many of these issues. Healthcare, income inequality, racial/identity politics, immigration, etc. These are issues where even a candidate like Biden will have to move mainly because the Overton window has shifted for the Democratic party.

Malleability isn't a bad word for me, personally. What is bad is Donald Trump getting a second term. That's my concern above all else.
 

Daria

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,879
The Twilight Zone
Only challenger to Susan Collins collecting cans and bottles to fund campaign

VanHelsing said she put out a call for supporters to collect cans and bottles to fund her campaign in part because it fits with her pro-environment agenda.

Plus, she said, "Maine is disgusting after winter" so anything people can do to clean up is admirable.

"Even if it just cleans up the trash, I'd be happy," VanHelsing said.

sorry, not sorry for laughing.

https://www.sunjournal.com/2019/03/...collecting-cans-and-bottles-to-fund-campaign/
 

BoboBrazil

Attempted to circumvent a ban with an alt
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
18,765
I don't want the candidate to actually support Republicans and work with them while in office. I'd rather he tell Republicans in the house and Senate to go fuck themselves, but a unity message is one you are going to see from anyone running for president that gets the Dem nomination. Especially when you want to win states like Ohio and Wisconsin.
 

Surfinn

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,590
USA
I don't want the candidate to actually support Republicans and work with them while in office. I'd rather he tell Republicans in the house and Senate to go fuck themselves, but a unity message is one you are going to see from anyone running for president that gets the Dem nomination. Especially when you want to win states like Ohio and Wisconsin.
I know, I watched the video. Every democratic candidate will at least mention Trump's infamous quote and associate him with family separations. He then quickly "we need to be civil"d the conversation in his tweet.

It's an overall bad response.

Also, I have no idea why criticism of an empty message of civility leads us to jump to "fuck the GOP and their supporters". It's not one or the other.
 

shadow_shogun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,727
@mkraju
Nielsen similarly today does not specifically call out white supremacists. Nielsen decries 'hate' without specifically mentioning white supremacy in remarks on domestic security - CNNPolitics …
Manu Raju

@mkraju
Pompeo today asked by Kansas radio about threat of white nationalism, calls NZ attack a "real tragedy," and says: "Look, the threat from extremists that comes from a broad spectrum is real. The State Department plays an important role ... to take down these kinds of threats."
15:50 - 18 Mar 2019
 
Jan 15, 2019
4,393
I think the balance to strike in the general election is to avoid demonizing Republicans and being seen as divisive, but also to not care what they think about our policies or how we frame them. Just say things in the way that most excites Democrats. The GOP has shown that strictly appealing to your base can be a winning strategy. In fact, the idea of Republicans worrying about how dems will interpret their messaging is pretty much absurd. They don't give a shit what dems think of their platfoem and we should respond in kind.
 

metalslimer

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,558
Kamala has done the best job in my opinion of not being afraid to call out bullshit when necessary but still having the platitudes about making things work for everyone
 

Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
I think the balance to strike in the general election is to avoid demonizing Republicans and being seen as divisive, but also to not care what they think about our policies or how we frame them. Just say things in the way that most excites Democrats. The GOP has shown that strictly appealing to your base can be a winning strategy. In fact, the idea of Republicans worrying about how dems will interpret their messaging is pretty much absurd. They don't give a shit what dems think of their platfoem and we should respond in kind.
Yeah I agree with this.

We'll always have the moral high ground because with the exception of rich people and corporations getting squeezed for more tax money, our policies don't really hurt anyone.

The GOP actively plots to make it harder to vote for minorities and to punish poor people for being poor, there's simply no equivalent to that on the left. It's not like the ACA works better for blue states by design (only in practice because GOP governors are mostly shitheads who won't pass the Medicaid expansion).
 

AnotherNils

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,936
Love the irony of people who mocked Obama for not saying radical islamic terrorism dancing as hard as they can around white extremists.
 

Vas

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,016
Now Bernie fans have moved on to "why hasn't he released the number of individual donors?"

I like the criticism "He couldn't beat Ted Cruz" like Bernie didn't lose badly to Hillary. I know the frustration, because when he came out of the gate and raised like 4 mil, that was supposed to be proof... validation, if you will, that he's the real front-runner. Everybody in America knows Bernie, his star will never be brighter than it is right now... to have a guy who a lot of America doesn't even know yet already overshadowing your candidate's validating moment is heartbreaking. It's like when your favorite pitcher pitches a no-hitter, but the next week a pitcher from a division rival pitches a perfect game.
 
Jan 15, 2019
4,393
Kamala has done the best job in my opinion of not being afraid to call out bullshit when necessary but still having the platitudes about making things work for everyone
I think she's the best candidate in the race in an all-around sense. She's campaigning more intelligently than most when you see her in interviews, town halls, etc. Does angreat job of spelling out beliefs and policies while still being personable and "human", but also stern and direct when needed.
 

Ithil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,364
I like the criticism "He couldn't beat Ted Cruz" like Bernie didn't lose badly to Hillary. I know the frustration, because when he came out of the gate and raised like 4 mil, that was supposed to be proof... validation, if you will, that he's the real front-runner. Everybody in America knows Bernie, his star will never be brighter than it is right now... to have a guy who a lot of America doesn't even know yet already overshadowing your candidate's validating moment is heartbreaking. It's like when your favorite pitcher pitches a no-hitter, but the next week a pitcher from a division rival pitches a perfect game.
That's usually dismissed with the usual "DNC rigged!!" shtick, so that Bernie losing doesn't count in their argument.
 

studyguy

Member
Oct 26, 2017
11,282
https://www.thisamericanlife.org/670/beware-the-jabberwock
Beware the Jabberwock

Have any of you listened to this ep of This American Life yet?
First half is an incredibly sad story of a father from sandy hook basically fighting the internet forever. The second half though is fucking insane. It's about Alex Jones, the lead up to his trial and his origin.

I always assumed Alex Jones was just about that grift money and nothing else, just a loser who said what he needed to. This dive into his childhood makes it EXCEEDINGLY clear that he's genuinely fucking insane. Guy said he started doing conspiracy theories because he was a victim of a police corruption scandal he uncovered and fled retaliation as a kid. In actuality, Alex Jones nearly fucking murdered a kid in high school, his parents paid the family off and he left town only after the kid and some friends he had harassed for years lured him to a party and beat the shit out of him.

Goes on to tell about all the people he terrorized, used to tell a girl he'd rape her. Used to run through the halls saying he was satan smashing his face into lockers. Used to sit in class, make his tongue go black somehow, roll his eyesback and say he was the devil speaking gibberish.

God damn I knew he was nuts, but this is beyond. That guy he nearly killed as a kid still has hearing loss and dealing with pain from the head trauma.
 
Oct 30, 2017
8,706
Someone needs to make a montage of Republicans saying, "Why won't Obama say radical Islamic terrorism!?"
And then dub Obama to say Trump and Islamic to say White.
 

Soul Skater

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,201
Kamala has done the best job in my opinion of not being afraid to call out bullshit when necessary but still having the platitudes about making things work for everyone
Problem is like Hillary I don't think when she says it the platitudes will resonate with the people they are intended for

She includes them like an after thought. Beto does the reverse. He leads in with platitudes and talks about what he wants to say when he has their attention
 

Vas

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,016
That's usually dismissed with the usual "DNC rigged!!" shtick, so that Bernie losing doesn't count in their argument.

I've yet to see a satisfactory explanation as to how the primaries were rigged. I feel like it was a Russian bot talking point and people saw enough noise and headlines that they just believed it. It works.
 

Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
I've yet to see a satisfactory explanation as to how the primaries were rigged. I feel like it was a Russian bot talking point and people saw enough noise and headlines that they just believed it. It works.
Hey man, one of the DNC emails showed one of their operatives asking if he could be attacked for his faith (which was immediately shut down by his superior). Sounds like solid enough proof to me.
 

Bronx-Man

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,351
In which Cuomo whines and moans that his plan for corporate welfare got egg on its' face:



It's the reptilian response: Amazon's coming, 'ooooh, they're a big corporation, we're against corporations, let's go out' grab a sign.'

Local politicians get scared because the activists and the socialists are going to be against it, now all the little local politicians run, and they pick up a sign and they put on a t-shirt.

'I'm like you, I'm like you! I'm going to get a tattoo and an earring and I'm growing a beard and I'm going to protest, I'm like you!'

Politician, small 'p.'
 

Daria

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,879
The Twilight Zone
Kamala has done the best job in my opinion of not being afraid to call out bullshit when necessary but still having the platitudes about making things work for everyone

She literally just sent out a fundraising email with a talking point of abolishing the death penalty at a federal level. She defended a state level death pentaly as California's A.G.

How is that making things work for everyone? Or her willingness to jail mothers of trunant children instead of implementing resources to help said child?

I think she's the best candidate in the race in an all-around sense. She's campaigning more intelligently than most when you see her in interviews, town halls, etc. Does angreat job of spelling out beliefs and policies while still being personable and "human", but also stern and direct when needed.

She's definitely still the type of person that would ask to speak to a manager
 

Deleted member 5666

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,753
According to Politico Beto plans to do a campaign event in each of the 10 NH counties...in the span of a single day. He has no off switch does he.
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,885
https://www.thisamericanlife.org/670/beware-the-jabberwock
Beware the Jabberwock

Have any of you listened to this ep of This American Life yet?
First half is an incredibly sad story of a father from sandy hook basically fighting the internet forever. The second half though is fucking insane. It's about Alex Jones, the lead up to his trial and his origin.

I always assumed Alex Jones was just about that grift money and nothing else, just a loser who said what he needed to. This dive into his childhood makes it EXCEEDINGLY clear that he's genuinely fucking insane. Guy said he started doing conspiracy theories because he was a victim of a police corruption scandal he uncovered and fled retaliation as a kid. In actuality, Alex Jones nearly fucking murdered a kid in high school, his parents paid the family off and he left town only after the kid and some friends he had harassed for years lured him to a party and beat the shit out of him.

Goes on to tell about all the people he terrorized, used to tell a girl he'd rape her. Used to run through the halls saying he was satan smashing his face into lockers. Used to sit in class, make his tongue go black somehow, roll his eyesback and say he was the devil speaking gibberish.

God damn I knew he was nuts, but this is beyond. That guy he nearly killed as a kid still has hearing loss and dealing with pain from the head trauma.

The only reason he has an audience is that he was a hanger-on of Bill Hicks and hit the conspiracy theory jackpot post-WACO
 

Schlep

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,770
According to Politico Beto plans to do a campaign event in each of the 10 NH counties...in the span of a single day. He has no off switch does he.

6Wvm08V.gif


Stamina.
 

Maxim726x

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
13,038
I think she's the best candidate in the race in an all-around sense. She's campaigning more intelligently than most when you see her in interviews, town halls, etc. Does angreat job of spelling out beliefs and policies while still being personable and "human", but also stern and direct when needed.

It's really way too early to get any meaningful idea of where the candidates stand at this point, but I've definitely been impressed with Harris to this point. Her and Beto just have 'it'. They will connect with voters on the national stage.

I'm sure he has a lot of upset "constituents" that would have benefited a lot from the deal.

You know what, I'm actually gonna defend him here.

Other states and governments are going trip all over themselves trying to get Amazon to open up shop in their locality. That's just the reality of the situation... If NYC didn't do enough to woo them over, someone else would have. Now, did LIC really need Amazon to open up shop over, say, West Virginia? Of course not. But let's not delude ourselves- wherever Amazon decides to open up shop it's going to immediately change the dynamic of where they go. That's undeniable.
 

Aaron

I’m seeing double here!
Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,077
Minneapolis
How is that making things work for everyone? Or her willingness to jail mothers of trunant children instead of implementing resources to help said child?
It's really hard to take arguments seriously when the crux of them are contextless and stupid talking points.

I mean what's your version of events here, Junior was out for a week and it went straight to the Attorney General whose first impulse was "jail that bitch?"
 

XMonkey

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,827
Trump ran on "lock her up" and made his political splash accusing Obama of being a secret Muslim while promising to ban Muslims from entering the country until we "figure out what's going on". Oh yeah, he also ran on dismantling the ACA.

The idea that the US won't elect divisive partisans is a joke.
What you're talking about works wonders, for Republicans. But that doesn't mean it's going to work for Democrats.

To be fair, I do think Democratic voters in general are more open to divisive "line in the sand" rhetoric after Trump, but Dems can't go full tilt on partisanship in the same way Republicans can, the voter groups are just too different.
 

OfficerRob

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,071
I'm interested to see who these "major endorsements" Biden is apparently ready to roll out when he announces, considering 99% of endorsements don't matter
 
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