Out of all the 3d Sonics that need re releases Shadow is probably the one that needs it last. I can't accept anything until we get the original Dreamcast version of Sonic Adventure and Sonic Unleashed re releases.
-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
-
We have made minor adjustments to how the search bar works on ResetEra. You can read about the changes here.
Sonic the Hedgehog Community |OT| There’s no end to this franchise!
- Thread starter Professor Beef
- Start date
Out of all the 3d Sonics that need re releases Shadow is probably the one that needs it last. I can't accept anything until we get the original Dreamcast version of Sonic Adventure and Sonic Unleashed re releases.
So I was going to Keep arguing with you.
But I read this.
You literally answered the question, and then said I can't use the answer to the question as an excuse. Its disingenuous as hell, and if you are gonna do some " don't throw that's cheating" type shit. Then we can end this shit like right now. The dude didn't show up in any of those games because it wasn't thematically appropriate. He didn't fit in a lot of those games, even knuckles didn't show up in some of those games. But also you know you wrong because he shows up in generations you fight a version from him from sonic adventure 2 because appropriate for him to be there. Also everyone shows up in colors DS for whatever weird reason.
But to solidify the point the first game with a thematically appropriate tone, for him to show up is forces, he's fucking playable. Because they knew exactly what they were doing. You can't be like " you can't the actual answer" when the last game that came out proves the actual answer to the question you said. Along with you just being wrong in general because he shows up in games, I just named 2. Oh also he's in sonic boom, forgot about that shit. Where they strait up say that's super popular.
you can't be like nah man you gotta tell me what's 2 + 2 but you can't say 4. Like what type of shit is this?
Also Just because a character's popular doesn't mean they show up in everything, maybe just maybe they didn't want to potentially fuck up this popular character because their last attempts at telling a story had been less then stellar but kept him out of narratives that didn't need him to be there. And then when the stories did, he showed the fuck up . Its called brand management
Like... what... dude
Edit: Ok so you say this
Because he's not. Being a side kick isn't a popularity metric, it changes how the character is presented to public. Shadow is his own guy doing his own thing, and that's consistent from his first day on the scene. Its part in why he's popular, because he can be his own dude.
You have a nice evening I hope you enjoy it. I'm done
Last edited:
Sonic Unleashed has so many problems but a ton are fixable. If they could just rework some stuff to be more in line with Generations/Forces it would feel a lot better. Add in all of the DLC, the Night of the Werehog and some other extras and you got a pretty solid package. In fact if I was in charge I would make that a big release for 2018.
They could just toss Colors online as a download game without doing much to it and it would sell alright I think.
I doubt Heroes, Shadow, Riders, Rivals or anything like that will ever get updated versions though. Some are available on PSN and a few will probably get added to Xbox BC.Sonic 06 never will be though. I personally have my fingers crossed to see Pocket Adventure be brought to something eventually. Really overlooked!
Tails did not fit in Unleashed but he was there, Classic Sonic does not fit into Forces but he is there. Amy and Knuckles are completely thrown into Lost World for no reason and Knuckles actually has an excellent reason for otherwise not showing up, Shadow has seriously none. Well, at least I can understand why he is not in Sonic Mania, but beyond that? Who said it had to be story focused either? He could have easily been an unlockable playable character in at least a dozen games but he never was. It is actually a bit bizarre he was not in the Game Boy Advance titles outside of Battle though.
You have to accept that there has to be reasons for Tails and Robotnik being in all recent games and Shadow almost only shows up for goofy spinoffs.
They could just toss Colors online as a download game without doing much to it and it would sell alright I think.
I doubt Heroes, Shadow, Riders, Rivals or anything like that will ever get updated versions though. Some are available on PSN and a few will probably get added to Xbox BC.Sonic 06 never will be though. I personally have my fingers crossed to see Pocket Adventure be brought to something eventually. Really overlooked!
Nonsense. If they wanted he would be in, even if just in small cameos. If he was so popular it would not matter. Sonic Team seriously could give two shits about tonal balance in this franchise.
Tails did not fit in Unleashed but he was there, Classic Sonic does not fit into Forces but he is there. Amy and Knuckles are completely thrown into Lost World for no reason and Knuckles actually has an excellent reason for otherwise not showing up, Shadow has seriously none. Well, at least I can understand why he is not in Sonic Mania, but beyond that? Who said it had to be story focused either? He could have easily been an unlockable playable character in at least a dozen games but he never was. It is actually a bit bizarre he was not in the Game Boy Advance titles outside of Battle though.
You have to accept that there has to be reasons for Tails and Robotnik being in all recent games and Shadow almost only shows up for goofy spinoffs.
Its not about tonal balance for the franchise, its about the characters are perceived. The franchise jumps from serious to silly, but the portrayals need to be consistent. Sega has always been particular about that. They want the characters to presented in a consistent way and this pretty much lines up for the direction given to the comics and sonic boom.
Tail's fit in unleashed fine. Shadow shows up in sonic forces, and classic sonic is there because they needed to release a video game they had made on short order and that was the last successful alternate playable character. They wanted to stray away from having alternate playable characters in these games, they felt the others weren't thematically appropriate what they were going for . Shadow is associated with more " serious" stuff in sonic land, so if it wasn't that he's not there. And they weren't making those games because last time they fucked it up real bad. And then they made a thematically appropriate game... and he's playable. And he was received rather well.
I gave you reasons, and you are choosing to ignore them. A long with you being wrong because he was in generations, and he was in forces. And was playable in the latter
If you are going to keep being disingenuous , i'm really done. You keep suggesting at some larger " conspiracy " as to why shadow isn't playable. When the simple answer is brand management. Instead of throwing him in everything, throw him in shit where people will really enjoy his inclusion.
Last edited:
haven't read all the replies yet but I just wanna say it's really frustrating when the watch/notification feature just randomly stops working lol
Edit - when Shadow was really popular they literally brought the character back to life after his on-screen death one game prior. And it was in the most colorful, cartoony, child-focused mainline game up to that point. The big secret conspiracy is he's not really that popular. It's not shocking, that kind of early-to-mid-2000's edge in general (looking at Jak and Daxter too) isn't popular anymore in general.
Edit - when Shadow was really popular they literally brought the character back to life after his on-screen death one game prior. And it was in the most colorful, cartoony, child-focused mainline game up to that point. The big secret conspiracy is he's not really that popular. It's not shocking, that kind of early-to-mid-2000's edge in general (looking at Jak and Daxter too) isn't popular anymore in general.
Last edited:
And thanks to the recent Bayonetta news, that game will sell even more than Shadow.Bayonetta 1 sold better than Shadow the Hedgehog.
I don't know what's the deal with Heroes, but I suspect the reason Sega isn't re-releasing Shadow is the same reason Sonic 2006 ain't getting one. Sega wants to bury that shit away.
This is like the least consistent franchise in all of gaming. Ignoring notable character personality changes between when Pontac was involved there are little problems all about, like how Knuckles is directly meant to protect the Master Emerald but is never near it in the 3D games anymore and does not even seem to care.
Conspiracy?? I only pointed out that he is not in most Sonic games in the past dozen or so years and all you can imagine is they save him for more serious games. You are acting like SEGA treats him like some precious golden goose when the most likely scenario is they simply value him less than you would prefer. I know what it feels like, I am a Blaze and Big fan after all.
You can love Shadow all you want, my original point was that in a case where SEGA makes another crossover game that if it were to have around 20 playable characters, Sonic characters should not be a third of the cast. That is all.
No No, You know what No. I'm done. I've made legitimate arguments I have given examples about how other brands do brand management and not over saturating the market with a character after mistakes. How this is a common practice . I gave you strait up examples about how " shadow's been gone for games for a dozen years" is actually wrong. You have ignored both of them. You have no interest in actually arguing and reading. I'm done.
You have have a nice day. Night whatever. I erased my argument, you quoted me before hand and are responding. I do not care. You have no interest in actually making an argument. Good night.
You have have a nice day. Night whatever. I erased my argument, you quoted me before hand and are responding. I do not care. You have no interest in actually making an argument. Good night.
Last edited:
Village bro... relax. It's okay for people not to agree, it doesn't mean they're ignoring you.
I've spent more downtime than I should say pondering about an ASR3, working out rosters, courses, gimmicks, etc. One thing I noticed is that a number of Sega franchises can somewhat neatly be represented by a trio of characters so the thought of a Double Dash-style 3-man vehicles crossed my mind and hasn't really left despite the fact that it would likely diminish the feeling of "having a character" so to speak. I'm mostly hung up on finding a way to one-up the transformation gimmick, though in reality I think a third game just being a solid racer like the first with a good amount of excellent stages and appropriate Sega themed items and modes would be a great thing.
I'll just say that if 3 ever did happen I'd love to see a course pull off Super Scaler visuals, or maybe even just be based on the original OutRun with path choosing that leads into paths themed after other scaler titles.
EDIT: ...and yeah no more Sonic characters are necessary lol. At this point I don't think any crossover can get away without those main 6 since even trying something like just Sonic and Tails leads into a chain of what-abouts. The only other option I can imagine would be Sonic only, which would never happen. Also I could totally see Classic Sonic begrudgingly becoming a Metal Sonic-tier piece of DLC.
I'll just say that if 3 ever did happen I'd love to see a course pull off Super Scaler visuals, or maybe even just be based on the original OutRun with path choosing that leads into paths themed after other scaler titles.
EDIT: ...and yeah no more Sonic characters are necessary lol. At this point I don't think any crossover can get away without those main 6 since even trying something like just Sonic and Tails leads into a chain of what-abouts. The only other option I can imagine would be Sonic only, which would never happen. Also I could totally see Classic Sonic begrudgingly becoming a Metal Sonic-tier piece of DLC.
A track with Super Scaler visuals would be really cool, but I was really disappointed that we never got some classic SEGA racing courses like the desert from SEGA Rally Championship or Big Forest from Virtua Racing.
Actually, Jacky from Virtua Fighter could be in a Virtua Racing low poly styled vehicle. That would be rad.
Actually, Jacky from Virtua Fighter could be in a Virtua Racing low poly styled vehicle. That would be rad.
I just decided to think about what Sonic games from Sonic Adventure and afterwards haven't gotten re-released (or were only re-released via something like PS2 Classics or some shit) and which of those either should get a re-release or I think actually have a chance (or both!).
Sonic Adventure(non-DX version)
Should it?- Yes, because outside of not being able to skip the cutscenes, it's the best version of the game.
Could it?- Only if Sega ever starts properly emulating Dreamcast games.
Sonic Shuffle
Should it?- Probably not. It's a pretty poor party game but it's so unique and bizarre that I kind of wish it did. It'd be one less reason to keep my Dreamcast.
Could it?- No way. The game has no following and is pretty much forgotten.
Sonic Advance Trilogy
Should it?- Absolutely. These were the closest things we had to a proper Sonic 4 for ages and they still hold up well.
Could it?- These games were published by THQ in the west so that might affect things. If Nintendo continues to allow GBA games on VC for the Switch then I could see it happening.
Sonic Heroes
Should it?- Maybe. Despite some exaggerations from fans, Heroes is actually a mostly decent game outside of some control problems and bugs. If Adventure 1 & 2 were allowed re-releases then I think Heroes is fair game.
Could it?- If Sega ever feel the need to re-release Adventure 1 & 2 again I could see them tackling this game too, but otherwise I doubt it, despite it being one of Sonic's best selling games.
Shadow The Hedgehog
Should it?- Pls no
Could it?- Outside of Twitter memes, Sega doesn't want you to remember this one.
Sonic Rush/Rush Adventure/Sonic Colors DS
Should it?- Absolutely. Great games all around that deserve another chance.
Could it?- If DS on VC for the Switch is a thing, probably.
Sonic Riders/Riders Zero Gravity/Free Riders
Should it?- No. The first two Riders are decent, if flawed, games. Free Riders was a mistake.
Could it?- There aren't too many big fans of these games so I don't think the demand is there.
Sonic The Hedgehog 2006
Should it?- Nah son.
Could it?- The day Sega decides to re-release this is the day Sega loses the little dignity they have left.
Sonic Rivals/Rivals 2
Should it?- Probably not. These weren't very good or noteworthy games.
Could it?- I can't see Sega ever bothering to port these.
Secret Rings/Black Knight
Should it?- Perhaps not. Secret Rings was... ok. Black Knight was completely unenjoyable.
Could it?- They'd be easy to port over to the Switch's VC, whenever that happens. I doubt Sega would, though.
Unleashed
Should it?- Definitely. Unleashed, on the HD systems at least, is a good game held back by a couple bad design decisions.
Could it?- I could see Sega doing a simple port job for this, but it'd be idle if they re-released this with a few updates, like lowering medal requirements and fixing the awful frame rate problems. The Wii/PS2 version will likely remain forgotten.
Chronicles
Should it?- No, it's awful.
Could it?- Probably not, considering Bioware made it and they're now owned by EA.
Colors
Should it?- Obviously, yes.
Could it?- I'm sure it'll happen at some point. Hopefully it gets a proper HD update but Sega will probably be contempt with a basic VC re-release.
Sonic 4: Both Episodes
Should it?- Probably not. Do people really need to remember these?
Could it?- Considering Sega is aware that Sonic 4 was a failure and a part of the reason Mania exists is so they could get some trust back in fans of Classic Sonic, probably not.
The Allstars Racing games
Should it?- These are great racing games and as long as we never get a new one, I'd love to see these get re-released.
Could it?- The first Allstars Racing will likely never see the light of day again, but I could see Transformed getting a re-release in the future.
Sonic Adventure(non-DX version)
Should it?- Yes, because outside of not being able to skip the cutscenes, it's the best version of the game.
Could it?- Only if Sega ever starts properly emulating Dreamcast games.
Sonic Shuffle
Should it?- Probably not. It's a pretty poor party game but it's so unique and bizarre that I kind of wish it did. It'd be one less reason to keep my Dreamcast.
Could it?- No way. The game has no following and is pretty much forgotten.
Sonic Advance Trilogy
Should it?- Absolutely. These were the closest things we had to a proper Sonic 4 for ages and they still hold up well.
Could it?- These games were published by THQ in the west so that might affect things. If Nintendo continues to allow GBA games on VC for the Switch then I could see it happening.
Sonic Heroes
Should it?- Maybe. Despite some exaggerations from fans, Heroes is actually a mostly decent game outside of some control problems and bugs. If Adventure 1 & 2 were allowed re-releases then I think Heroes is fair game.
Could it?- If Sega ever feel the need to re-release Adventure 1 & 2 again I could see them tackling this game too, but otherwise I doubt it, despite it being one of Sonic's best selling games.
Shadow The Hedgehog
Should it?- Pls no
Could it?- Outside of Twitter memes, Sega doesn't want you to remember this one.
Sonic Rush/Rush Adventure/Sonic Colors DS
Should it?- Absolutely. Great games all around that deserve another chance.
Could it?- If DS on VC for the Switch is a thing, probably.
Sonic Riders/Riders Zero Gravity/Free Riders
Should it?- No. The first two Riders are decent, if flawed, games. Free Riders was a mistake.
Could it?- There aren't too many big fans of these games so I don't think the demand is there.
Sonic The Hedgehog 2006
Should it?- Nah son.
Could it?- The day Sega decides to re-release this is the day Sega loses the little dignity they have left.
Sonic Rivals/Rivals 2
Should it?- Probably not. These weren't very good or noteworthy games.
Could it?- I can't see Sega ever bothering to port these.
Secret Rings/Black Knight
Should it?- Perhaps not. Secret Rings was... ok. Black Knight was completely unenjoyable.
Could it?- They'd be easy to port over to the Switch's VC, whenever that happens. I doubt Sega would, though.
Unleashed
Should it?- Definitely. Unleashed, on the HD systems at least, is a good game held back by a couple bad design decisions.
Could it?- I could see Sega doing a simple port job for this, but it'd be idle if they re-released this with a few updates, like lowering medal requirements and fixing the awful frame rate problems. The Wii/PS2 version will likely remain forgotten.
Chronicles
Should it?- No, it's awful.
Could it?- Probably not, considering Bioware made it and they're now owned by EA.
Colors
Should it?- Obviously, yes.
Could it?- I'm sure it'll happen at some point. Hopefully it gets a proper HD update but Sega will probably be contempt with a basic VC re-release.
Sonic 4: Both Episodes
Should it?- Probably not. Do people really need to remember these?
Could it?- Considering Sega is aware that Sonic 4 was a failure and a part of the reason Mania exists is so they could get some trust back in fans of Classic Sonic, probably not.
The Allstars Racing games
Should it?- These are great racing games and as long as we never get a new one, I'd love to see these get re-released.
Could it?- The first Allstars Racing will likely never see the light of day again, but I could see Transformed getting a re-release in the future.
At this point the Sonic Adventure DX modding community has covered so many of the issues that I don't think a port of the original game is really needed anymore. For all intents and purposes the PC version with the Dreamcast Conversion mod is the perfect version of the game. Now a remaster that updates the lighting and some of the graphics, alongside bug fixes would be welcome but I don't think it'll happen.
Unleashed desperately needs a PC port.
Unleashed desperately needs a PC port.
THQ's involvement was with all of SEGA's Game Boy Advance, but only in North America. SEGA for whatever reason had no interest in publishing for that platform over here so I think THQ signed an agreement that was just for the platform and not the games themselves. Anything THQ passed up was picked up by others, like Atlus. Ubisoft of all people published Advance Guardian Heroes over here.
I really do not like the Sonic Rush games but I think those could really use full-on remakes instead of ports. On a technical level those games have aged outrageously bad and the two screen format does not seem to be returning for awhile, unless Nintendo is working on a 3DS successor.
I really do not like the Sonic Rush games but I think those could really use full-on remakes instead of ports. On a technical level those games have aged outrageously bad and the two screen format does not seem to be returning for awhile, unless Nintendo is working on a 3DS successor.
I like the first one a lot, but idk how worthy it is for a remake honestly. Everything it brought to the table has been more or less improved on with the boost games, although the first Rush's approach to special stages was really smart and should have been brought back.
Really have to wonder why Sega didn't just publish those games themselves... They published all their titles on home consoles after all.
Any who, I'm not really sure how those games have aged that badly on a technical level. Like most DS games, they look a bit ugly in full screen but they still look appealing enough in their native resolution.
Sonic Rush Adventure still has, by far, the best selection of boss battles in any Sonic game. I'll always stand by that. The general level design is also better than the original. The problems with that game are similar to Unleashed, where the core gameplay is great but all the stuff you have to do in between levels is a chore that may kill your drive to finish the game (didn't stop me either when it came out or last year when I went back to replay it, but I wouldn't blame anyone who did).
Also, I agree that the first Rush game had great special stages. Sonic Rush in general did a great job of implementing the DS's special features without it feeling gimmicky.
This happened to me lol. I didn't like the boat building crap at all. Or finding maps? I don't even remember anymore, it's been so long. I just remember being really underwhelmed by it as a kid.
I was moreso referring to how Rush had the cool idea of using those boost things to enter special stages. I liked that. But also yeah its half-pipe was the best one.
Both All-Star Racing games are available via Steam and Humble Bundle so even if they don't recieve current console ports, at least they will live on via PC.
Sonic Heroes had a physical PC version, but it is probably hard to find and it may not run properly with the newest OS'. The strange thing is is that Sega never bothered to release a Steam version of that game. Wonder why?
Shame All-Stars Racing 1 on PC is a somewhat mediocre port and doesn't even contain Metal Sonic.
The portable Dimps games are my jam, and probably the games I'd love to see remade or remastered most (well at least the Advance games, if only for the sake of widescreen and sexy music rearrangements) though I'm down for a good re-release if Switch ever gets VC started. I'm not sure I'd double dip since I've never been fond of VC but the more exposure the better.
Unleashed and Colors are the obvious first practical picks, with Unleashed kinda needing the performance boost compared to Colors. Outside of those I don't think any of the other titles would have a good chance at being re-released honestly. I really like stuff like Heroes, Riders and Black Knight, but I can't see them making a decent return. Heck I even think the novelty of something like Shadow or Shuffle could possibly be a bigger draw than most of what came between SA2 and Unleashed, at least from a business/meme angle (real talk, kill those load times and I'm day one on Shuffle though).
And of course, obligatory Sonic 1 and 2 iOS port begging. Except now Mania exists so I find even less reason as to why there's not a peep of them leaving phones yet.
Yeah there are a lot of cool ideas that I feel probably fell to the wayside for the sake of the the namesake of Transformed and maybe at the mercy of budget/asset reuse. Granted Transformed is still a beast of a game at the end of the day, but there's definitely potential for a lot more in terms of being a more well-rounded and polished package.
Also bring back Opa-Opa.
Unleashed and Colors are the obvious first practical picks, with Unleashed kinda needing the performance boost compared to Colors. Outside of those I don't think any of the other titles would have a good chance at being re-released honestly. I really like stuff like Heroes, Riders and Black Knight, but I can't see them making a decent return. Heck I even think the novelty of something like Shadow or Shuffle could possibly be a bigger draw than most of what came between SA2 and Unleashed, at least from a business/meme angle (real talk, kill those load times and I'm day one on Shuffle though).
And of course, obligatory Sonic 1 and 2 iOS port begging. Except now Mania exists so I find even less reason as to why there's not a peep of them leaving phones yet.
Also dammit I'm still salty the first All-Stars Racing doesn't have online on Steam, especially considering the Transformed community is still kicking.
Yeah there are a lot of cool ideas that I feel probably fell to the wayside for the sake of the the namesake of Transformed and maybe at the mercy of budget/asset reuse. Granted Transformed is still a beast of a game at the end of the day, but there's definitely potential for a lot more in terms of being a more well-rounded and polished package.
Also bring back Opa-Opa.
I think Opa-Opa would be best as the flagman for every level instead of a playable character, even if he is effectively the original SEGA mascot.
But yeah it is an actual tragedy that Sonic 1, 2 and CD mobile versions are not on modern consoles. I figure all of those plus Mania will get bundles together on future consoles though.
But yeah it is an actual tragedy that Sonic 1, 2 and CD mobile versions are not on modern consoles. I figure all of those plus Mania will get bundles together on future consoles though.
Sonic Jam Plus, complete with 1, 2, 3, K, CD, and Mania. And a neat lil Sonic World 3D minigame by the Mania team.
Make it happen SEGA pls I have $20
Make it happen SEGA pls I have $20
Isn't there some legal issue with Sonic 3 music that makes it impossible for Sega to re release?
PS3 was missing some of the things the 360 one had, but it still solid.
Gonna go through the entire world adventure of the greatest Sonic game ever made? Have you bought the amazing DLC?
Gonna go through the entire world adventure of the greatest Sonic game ever made? Have you bought the amazing DLC?
They cannot use several songs from 3 & Knuckles outside of their original context. So direct emulation is fine, but a Christian Whitehead styled remaster is for now out of the question... Unless you guys would be okay with having some of the PC version's music.
I'd be cool with a completely, and I mean COMPLETELY new soundtrack: ENTIRELY new.
It CAN work, just look at DKC 3 GBA for an example of it being done well.
It CAN work, just look at DKC 3 GBA for an example of it being done well.
I mean, there are Green Hill levels for Sonic, Buddy, and a pint-sized Sonic from another dimension in Sonic Forces, and NONE of those are the original Green Hill theme, but the songs fit perfectly. Completely new music isn't bad if done right.
I think Tee Lopes could whip up something awesome for all the stages that can't have their music reused. For some reason I vaguely remember Simon Thomley implying that SEGA if hesitant to greenlight a remaster because they're afraid fans will take an all or nothing stance on the music? Maybe now that they've (hopefully, god) won some good graces with SEGA higher-ups they can make a push for it. Tee's work on Mania was one of the highest praised parts of the game so maybe they could make it happen.
God I want them to do a new Sonic Jam so bad.
God I want them to do a new Sonic Jam so bad.
Eh that DKC3 soundtrack on the GBA was...interesting. Not sure if that was really well done. Too many of the GBA tracks didn't really fit with the levels.
Dear god I hope the custom avatar doesn't return until they've fixed the core gameplay, same with 'classic' sonic.
Well... that sounded pretty bad, but I'd rather Sonic 3K had its due with the same treatment that the other games have gotten. Maybe they could re-do them again to something serviceable.
Well... that sounded pretty bad, but I'd rather Sonic 3K had its due with the same treatment that the other games have gotten. Maybe they could re-do them again to something serviceable.
I hope the build a bear feature never comes back because it's stupid and ruins the game, and Classic Sonic's only return in a 3D game is if he becomes the default design again. If we're dropping hot takes.
How can you hate buddy if they can be anything you want them to be, even you, and then double Boost and OMG...
I need to play more Forces.
I need to play more Forces.
Because the only thing that these splinter modes to is allow Sonic Team to get away with half assing everything like they did in Forces and ignoring core problems. If they can't make a game that can stand on its own merits then maybe they should take another look at why that is.
You can make an avatar, that would be nice if the core gameplay and levels had anything to them and maybe whatever comes next is more thought out, but Forces has probably done a lot of damage to the brand. Things like Boom and List World could be ignored as offshoot projects, but Forces wasn't.
Since Generations there have been nothing but dissapointing 3D Sonic Games (Boom, Lost World, Forces, if my timeline is right). We're in a situation where whatever comes next will have a lot to prove, not unlike the post 06 landscape
Really they should consider icing 3D for a bit. Bring out Mania 2 or whatnot and let Sonic Team do whatever they actually want to do next before taking another crack at Sonic.
Build a bear has potential as a framework to be employed in the future regardless of Gameplay. Spinning it out into its own weapon based thing could work, but again Forces had to Forces.
Regardless of if it's a physics based game or a boost game, or if it was just Sonic or the game has an Adventure like set up, build a bear could just be swapped in.
Agreed that classic should only come back if he's default. Which I wouldn't mind at this point. It's probably the writting, but man, playingLost World andForces back to back really makes me what everyone to just shut the fuck up.
There's more actual character in the Sonic Mania intro for the core trio than Forces and Lost World put together.
You can make an avatar, that would be nice if the core gameplay and levels had anything to them and maybe whatever comes next is more thought out, but Forces has probably done a lot of damage to the brand. Things like Boom and List World could be ignored as offshoot projects, but Forces wasn't.
Since Generations there have been nothing but dissapointing 3D Sonic Games (Boom, Lost World, Forces, if my timeline is right). We're in a situation where whatever comes next will have a lot to prove, not unlike the post 06 landscape
Really they should consider icing 3D for a bit. Bring out Mania 2 or whatnot and let Sonic Team do whatever they actually want to do next before taking another crack at Sonic.
Build a bear has potential as a framework to be employed in the future regardless of Gameplay. Spinning it out into its own weapon based thing could work, but again Forces had to Forces.
Regardless of if it's a physics based game or a boost game, or if it was just Sonic or the game has an Adventure like set up, build a bear could just be swapped in.
Agreed that classic should only come back if he's default. Which I wouldn't mind at this point. It's probably the writting, but man, playingLost World andForces back to back really makes me what everyone to just shut the fuck up.
There's more actual character in the Sonic Mania intro for the core trio than Forces and Lost World put together.
Last edited:
OP
OP
That's not really a high bar since the original DKC3 soundtrack was fairly underwhelming.
Sonic Pocket Adventure used different songs for classic levels. They were other classic songs but it was still neat to see.
That said, fans would react extremely poorly to an even slightly different soundtrack to 3 & Knuckles. Look how much crap people give the Sonic CD US soundtrack even now. Now imagine if the US soundtrack was made today to replace the original how much more negative that reaction would be.
Unless they can secure the full music rights they might as well get Christian Whitehead and his team to work on another original game instead. 3 & Knuckles has problems they can fix obviously, but nothing too significant like 2's special stages or CD's framerate issues.
That said, fans would react extremely poorly to an even slightly different soundtrack to 3 & Knuckles. Look how much crap people give the Sonic CD US soundtrack even now. Now imagine if the US soundtrack was made today to replace the original how much more negative that reaction would be.
Unless they can secure the full music rights they might as well get Christian Whitehead and his team to work on another original game instead. 3 & Knuckles has problems they can fix obviously, but nothing too significant like 2's special stages or CD's framerate issues.
Shruuuuuuug
If I ever find myself wanting to create a Sonic OC for the first time I'll just... you know, draw it. I think it's stupid and pandering to have it infect the games especially when Tails has been relegated to bitch status and nobody else has been playable in like ten years. Maybe when I actually get to be the characters I give a shit about again I'd be chill with having an OC option
If I ever find myself wanting to create a Sonic OC for the first time I'll just... you know, draw it. I think it's stupid and pandering to have it infect the games especially when Tails has been relegated to bitch status and nobody else has been playable in like ten years. Maybe when I actually get to be the characters I give a shit about again I'd be chill with having an OC option
ok not really, I really really really hate the character creator and never want to see it again unless it's some dumb spinoff I can ignore
I'd like them to make a 3D Sonic game that has multiple playable characters that function within the same game design and levels again.
I mean I know that Sonic Team is busy sabotaging other projects using their IP and don't want to try anything but boost to win and a homing attack, but seriously:
All characters have the same base movement system but are differentiated by unique abilities
Sonic
Clearly in another class of speed
Roll
SpinDash
Peelout
Water Run
Homing Attack (Sonic Utopia style)
Parkour
Maybe some sort of drift or hard turn system
Best potential Verticality and traversal
Has to be earned through speed, rolling, momentum and Parkour
Tails
Flight
Water Run(using tails as propellers)
Botnick Overide
Radar
The radar can be upgraded to function somewhat similarly to the radars in Adventure. Gives an indication of nearby items.
Botnick Override allows tails turn into energy a la Star Trek to take control of an enemy a la Mario Odyssey
Knuckles
Gliding
'Boost' - at higher speeds knuckles can plow through some enemies
Digging
Climbing
Fists
Grab
Emerald connection - indicates when bonus stage portal or emerald shards are close
Slowest
Weakest Jump
FISTS
fight enemies
Break walls
Hidden areas
GLIDE
Maybe do something with gliding, increasing speed on descent then pulling up can give you more air time
GRAB
Can grab and use items or environment? Maybe...
Amy Rose
Slower than Tails
Faster than Knuckles
Roll (limited, makes her dizzy if used for too long)
Curl jump (limited, again makes her dizzy)
Hammer
Null Space
NULL SPACE
Amy can store a powerup for later use
HAMMER TIME
Throw at enemy (has to be touched to get it back? Or on cool down?)
Charge in/Homing (Sonic Utopia style)
Explosive Charge - trigger hammer to propel Amy in any direction from any position. Sort of like a double jump or air dash but physics based
Charge has a 1 use per cool down or recharges when she makes contact with something.
Timing Hammer explosion with Jumps can create best Jump height in game (higher than tails can fly in 1 go) (giving Amy a nsmb like Jump system)
- Hammer Ledge Grab - the only character that can ledge grab aside from Knuckles, ledge grabs from a considerable distance.
- Hammer perch - Amy can plant her hammer in the ground or a wall to use as a platform
Then you can have a build a bear that you assign to mimick any of these characters.
Or take it a step further, there's the ability to mix and match all of the abilities through point allocation, including abilities that aren't in the main trio that are call backs to other games.
Dump everything into SONIC and you can do everything he can almost as well.
But maybe you want to make a character that can glide but have the base level or Amy's hammer for bashing botnicks and has tails botnick scrambler ability.
It could be that certain abilities are locked by species, but you can get more expensive items made that replicate them.
EDIT
While I can't sleep I might as well include a Metal Sonic there's something there with a metal gear riding like system and being on the clock but I can't figure it out at this hour
Metal Sonic Rising Revengance
Limited Battery
Power Source: Rings
Power Source: Botnicks
Homing attack (Lost World multi chain style or Modern Sonic Style)
Boost (allows water run)
Rocket Slingshot (Spin Dash in any direction from anywhere)
Boosters (Double Jump) (no energy usage)
Rev it up
Self repair
Sensor System
MAIN BATTERY
Metal Sonics main power decreases over time
If main power reaches Zero Metal Sonic Shuts down
Replenish at checkpoints
Can trade Ring Energy at a deficit
Main Battery no longer decreases at a boss
OVERTIME
If main battery reaches Zero Metal Sonic enters hyper powered state, consuming Ring Energy Bar at an ever increasing rate.
Metal Sonic gains Ring energy from Destroying enemies
Collecting Rings
Metal Sonic gains main Battery from
Checkpoints
Can convert Ring energy at a deficit
Metal Sonic drops ENERGY CUBES when hit
Takes visible damage (3 hits until destruction)
Power Up can heal him 1 level
REV IT UP
Metal Sonic can overcharge abilities
More Revs more power to ability
Revs increase energy usage
Max Rev Disables all other abilities for a set amount of time and makes him slower than normal
ROCKET BOOST
spend energy to become go faster and kill enemies on contact
(Uses energy over time)
Rev it up: Faster
ROCKET SLINGSHOT
Functions like spindash but can be used in any direction and in the air
Rev it up: Faster Farther
SELF REPAIR
Spend Ring Energy to repair physical damage (immobilized) (uses energy)
Rev it up: Instant Repair
Homing Attack (does not use energy)
Rev it up: by holding down the rev button you can lock on to multiple enemies at a time
Max Rev: all enemies in range
Metal Sonic has the same abilities as Sonic except Parkour and where otherwise noted.
I mean I know that Sonic Team is busy sabotaging other projects using their IP and don't want to try anything but boost to win and a homing attack, but seriously:
All characters have the same base movement system but are differentiated by unique abilities
Sonic
Clearly in another class of speed
Roll
SpinDash
Peelout
Water Run
Homing Attack (Sonic Utopia style)
Parkour
Maybe some sort of drift or hard turn system
Best potential Verticality and traversal
Has to be earned through speed, rolling, momentum and Parkour
Tails
Flight
Water Run(using tails as propellers)
Botnick Overide
Radar
The radar can be upgraded to function somewhat similarly to the radars in Adventure. Gives an indication of nearby items.
Botnick Override allows tails turn into energy a la Star Trek to take control of an enemy a la Mario Odyssey
Knuckles
Gliding
'Boost' - at higher speeds knuckles can plow through some enemies
Digging
Climbing
Fists
Grab
Emerald connection - indicates when bonus stage portal or emerald shards are close
Slowest
Weakest Jump
FISTS
fight enemies
Break walls
Hidden areas
GLIDE
Maybe do something with gliding, increasing speed on descent then pulling up can give you more air time
GRAB
Can grab and use items or environment? Maybe...
Amy Rose
Slower than Tails
Faster than Knuckles
Roll (limited, makes her dizzy if used for too long)
Curl jump (limited, again makes her dizzy)
Hammer
Null Space
NULL SPACE
Amy can store a powerup for later use
HAMMER TIME
Throw at enemy (has to be touched to get it back? Or on cool down?)
Charge in/Homing (Sonic Utopia style)
Explosive Charge - trigger hammer to propel Amy in any direction from any position. Sort of like a double jump or air dash but physics based
Charge has a 1 use per cool down or recharges when she makes contact with something.
Timing Hammer explosion with Jumps can create best Jump height in game (higher than tails can fly in 1 go) (giving Amy a nsmb like Jump system)
- Hammer Ledge Grab - the only character that can ledge grab aside from Knuckles, ledge grabs from a considerable distance.
- Hammer perch - Amy can plant her hammer in the ground or a wall to use as a platform
Then you can have a build a bear that you assign to mimick any of these characters.
Or take it a step further, there's the ability to mix and match all of the abilities through point allocation, including abilities that aren't in the main trio that are call backs to other games.
Dump everything into SONIC and you can do everything he can almost as well.
But maybe you want to make a character that can glide but have the base level or Amy's hammer for bashing botnicks and has tails botnick scrambler ability.
It could be that certain abilities are locked by species, but you can get more expensive items made that replicate them.
EDIT
While I can't sleep I might as well include a Metal Sonic there's something there with a metal gear riding like system and being on the clock but I can't figure it out at this hour
Metal Sonic Rising Revengance
Limited Battery
Power Source: Rings
Power Source: Botnicks
Homing attack (Lost World multi chain style or Modern Sonic Style)
Boost (allows water run)
Rocket Slingshot (Spin Dash in any direction from anywhere)
Boosters (Double Jump) (no energy usage)
Rev it up
Self repair
Sensor System
MAIN BATTERY
Metal Sonics main power decreases over time
If main power reaches Zero Metal Sonic Shuts down
Replenish at checkpoints
Can trade Ring Energy at a deficit
Main Battery no longer decreases at a boss
OVERTIME
If main battery reaches Zero Metal Sonic enters hyper powered state, consuming Ring Energy Bar at an ever increasing rate.
Metal Sonic gains Ring energy from Destroying enemies
Collecting Rings
Metal Sonic gains main Battery from
Checkpoints
Can convert Ring energy at a deficit
Metal Sonic drops ENERGY CUBES when hit
Takes visible damage (3 hits until destruction)
Power Up can heal him 1 level
REV IT UP
Metal Sonic can overcharge abilities
More Revs more power to ability
Revs increase energy usage
Max Rev Disables all other abilities for a set amount of time and makes him slower than normal
ROCKET BOOST
spend energy to become go faster and kill enemies on contact
(Uses energy over time)
Rev it up: Faster
ROCKET SLINGSHOT
Functions like spindash but can be used in any direction and in the air
Rev it up: Faster Farther
SELF REPAIR
Spend Ring Energy to repair physical damage (immobilized) (uses energy)
Rev it up: Instant Repair
Homing Attack (does not use energy)
Rev it up: by holding down the rev button you can lock on to multiple enemies at a time
Max Rev: all enemies in range
Metal Sonic has the same abilities as Sonic except Parkour and where otherwise noted.
Last edited:
Honestly, that seems a bit much to me. Whenever Tails and Knuckles and whoever else make their playable return, I kinda hope it's more like Mania: same "reach the goal" main levels with remixed layouts and different end points. No more emerald hunting or anything.
On the other hand... I've thought they could have the friends' levels take place in the many areas Sonic speeds past during his more racetrack-like levels, and play with that. So like maybe a scenario where Tails is scouting a new area and makes Sonic a path to race through quickly, or Knuckles is investigating above/below a level Sonic ran through previously and has to clean up his mess. Hell, an interesting use of Knuckles' climbing and digging could be for stealth, and when that fails he can always back em up with the fist metal crack'em. But again, even that seems a bit much...
Then Sonic's main levels can be used for multiplayer races.
as for Buddy, have them replace Emerl in Battle 2 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ still bring Emerl back tho
On the other hand... I've thought they could have the friends' levels take place in the many areas Sonic speeds past during his more racetrack-like levels, and play with that. So like maybe a scenario where Tails is scouting a new area and makes Sonic a path to race through quickly, or Knuckles is investigating above/below a level Sonic ran through previously and has to clean up his mess. Hell, an interesting use of Knuckles' climbing and digging could be for stealth, and when that fails he can always back em up with the fist metal crack'em. But again, even that seems a bit much...
Then Sonic's main levels can be used for multiplayer races.
as for Buddy, have them replace Emerl in Battle 2 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ still bring Emerl back tho
make Amy levels Musou maps
I was trying to envision a more adventure like setup except with more open environments and everyone sharing the same physics model and levels. knuckles wouldn't be playing emerald hunt, everyone would be going for the goal so to speak.
Some of it is pretty out there but That's what you get when it's a post on a message board :$
Some of it is pretty out there but That's what you get when it's a post on a message board :$
Last edited:
OP
OP
As someone who grew up playing S3&K through the PC collection primarily I am all on board for remastering these tracks. Launch Base 2 was my jam.
We (barely) survived not having the original Japanese opening/ending in CD, so I think this is a compromise people would be willing to make if it meant S3&K remastered could happen at all. Funnily enough I think this applies to a number of Sega IP's stuck in some licensing or legal hell, though Sonic fares better than most.