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Sandfox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,743
Okay, i see where are you getting at, but let's take a look at the titles that are releasing this holiday (or already released) to see what could be a possible Switch lineup, assuming they had read the market correctly. I will start from week 43 (late octomber) and i will be listing the new (significant in terms of brandname or sales so more than 30-40k) entries

Week 43 (Oct 23-29)
[NSW] Super Mario Odyssey (nothing to add here)
[PS4] Ark: Survival Evolved (first potential SW game)
[3DS] Shin Megami Tensei: Strange Journey Redux (Atlus is well known for supporting older systems despite the release of it's successor but let's put this in the list also)
[PS4] Assassin's Creed: Origins (you said unless it was a major western focused or AAA project so we are leaving this out)
[PS4] Taiko no Tatsujin: Drum Session! (We know a Switch game is coming since it was announced before this PS4 game. Not sure what happened here but i will put it in the list)

Week 44 (Oct 30-Nov 05)
[PS4] Call of Duty: WWII (you said unless it was a major western focused or AAA project so we are leaving this out)
[PS4] .hack//G.U. Last Recode (released on SW)
[3DS] Style Savvy: Styling Star (i don't think i should include first party games, since if i understood correctly your post isn't referring to Nintendo which is full supporting Switch)

Week 45 (Nov 6-Nov 12)
[PS4] Need for Speed: Payback (you said unless it was a major western focused or AAA project so we are leaving this out)
[PS4/SW] Sonic Forces (SW version exists)
[PS4/PSV] Occultic;Nine (SW version is coming but i will put it in the list)

Week 46 (Nov 13-Nov 19)
[3DS] Pokemon Ultra Sun / Ultra Moon (what i said about Style Savvy)
[PS4] Star Wars: Battlefront II (you said unless it was a major western focused or AAA project so we are leaving this out)
[PS4/WIIU/SW] Dragon Quest X: 5000-nen no Harukanaru Kokyou e Online (release on SW)

Week 47 (Nov 20-Nov 26)
[PS4] Hatsune Miku: Project Diva Future Tone DX (potential SW game)
[3DS] Apollo Justice: Ace Attorney (potential SW game)

Week 48 (Nov 27-Dec 3)
[NSW] Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (Switch game)
[3DS] Kirby Battle Royale (first party)
[PS4/SW] Nobunaga's Ambition (released on SW)
[3DS] Attack on Titan 2: Future Coordinates (potential SW game)
[PS4] Little Witch Academia (potential SW game)
[NSW] Resident Evil: Revelations Collection (Switch game)

Week 49 (Dec 4-Dec 10)
[PS4] Yakuza: Kiwami 2 (i don't think you expected this on SW)
[PS4] Earth Defense Force 5 (or this since a EDF game never appeared on any Nintendo system)
[PS4] Kamen Rider: Climax Fighters (potential SW game)
[PS4] Dead Rising 4 (potential SW game)
[NSW] Sumikko Gurashi: Sumikko Park e Youkoso (SW game)
[PS4] Nioh: Complete Edition (some deal with Sony probably makes this a console exclusive)

So we have 28 titles. 4 games from third parties also appeared on Switch (not counting first party). 10 out of these could have a Switch version and we are talking about games that sold at best 30k. The truth is that in the period Oct-Dec, third parties didn't released any significant games, so the support was shallow, not only for SW but for any other platform. Seriously the only game that could qualify after reading your post is YW Busters 2 which i can agree. There is also Atelier but this is coming to SW as well.
This is assuming 3rd parties would have the exact same lineup in that scenario.
 

v2_0

User requested permanent ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
556
There is no such thing as games on one platform that prevent other games to sell well. A big seller on the other hand helps of course to sell consoles which will lead to all other games to sell much more. Also these big sellers will attract people that like this kind of games and will help similar games to sell well.

So the problem with Nintendo games and third party games is certainly more that most of their games are too different from most third party ones and so as the result don't appeal to people that could buy most third party games. The "problem" is not that Nintendo games compete too much with third party ones it is actually that they don't enough.
 

schuelma

Member
Oct 24, 2017
5,901
So the problem with Nintendo games and third party games is certainly more that most of their games are too different from most third party ones and so as the result don't appeal to people that could buy most third party games. The "problem" is not that Nintendo games compete too much with third party ones it is actually that they don't enough.

Without getting too deep into the "Wii userbase bought no gamez" discussion, I think Nintendo made a conscious decision to focus on more traditional experiences with their initial first party software output and IMO has a userbase that is more receptive to 3rd party software.
 

Herb Alpert

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,033
Paris, France
There is no such thing as games on one platform that prevent other games to sell well. A big seller on the other hand helps of course to sell consoles which will lead to all other games to sell much more. Also these big sellers will attract people that like this kind of games and will help similar games to sell well.
Please don't break years of convenient narrative
 
OP
OP
Chris1964

Chris1964

SalesEra Genius
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,155
There is no such thing as games on one platform that prevent other games to sell well. A big seller on the other hand helps of course to sell consoles which will lead to all other games to sell much more. Also these big sellers will attract people that like this kind of games and will help similar games to sell well.

So the problem with Nintendo games and third party games is certainly more that most of their games are too different from most third party ones and so as the result don't appeal to people that could buy most third party games. The "problem" is not that Nintendo games compete too much with third party ones it is actually that they don't enough.
Many of DS and 3DS small/medium/big sellers have nothing in common with Nintendo's output.
 

Aters

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
7,948
You say all this, yet nowhere you even consider the 3rd party games that are actually out there. It makes a whole lot of sense that third parties don't take up a large share of sales (although, they take up almost half of total sales as can be seen above) since there are few titles worth their salt on the system at all.

You dismiss XV2 as "good for a cheap port" and go on to claim that big games can't sell because of Odyssey. You supplement that with stories about the organisation of store shelf space, yet you present no well-contextualised numbers to prove your sweeping statement. I would like to see anything of substance here personally, since there's little here that convinces me of your point.

I don't have concrete numbers and everything is anecdotal, and I don't want to convince you. We are here speculating why Switch hasn't got many 3rd party games despite selling well. Here's my proposition: 3rd parties are cautious, extremely risk-averse and afraid of competition. I'm not saying that's the right strategy, but I think it's understandable. And here's Vena's proposition: they are stupid; in other words, there's no justification.

You can take everything I posted as nothing but an expression of frustration triggered by people thinking they are more clever than every high executive in Japan who is, supposedly, destroying Japanese gaming market. Honestly I'm done with this topic. I knew Switch port begging would become prevalent, but I didn't know we are reaching "switch or die" narrative. I hope with more Switch games getting announced in the coming months we can stop crucifying 3rd parties.
 

Oregano

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,878
There is no such thing as games on one platform that prevent other games to sell well. A big seller on the other hand helps of course to sell consoles which will lead to all other games to sell much more. Also these big sellers will attract people that like this kind of games and will help similar games to sell well.

So the problem with Nintendo games and third party games is certainly more that most of their games are too different from most third party ones and so as the result don't appeal to people that could buy most third party games. The "problem" is not that Nintendo games compete too much with third party ones it is actually that they don't enough.

I think that line of thinking falls flat when you talk about Japan though. Sony has no significant IP in Japan and their portfolio has very little overlap with that of Japanese third parties.

JRPGs is an obvious genre where Sony has very little presence(Oreshika was the last one?) where Nintendo publishes several a year.
 

kickz

Member
Nov 3, 2017
11,395
Not sure why people are down on Switch numbers? I mean its damn near on pace to outsell PS4 in its first 2 years...
 

Sandfox

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,743
Without getting too deep into the "Wii userbase bought no gamez" discussion, I think Nintendo made a conscious decision to focus on more traditional experiences with their initial first party software output and IMO has a userbase that is more receptive to 3rd party software.
Yeah, 2017 saw a lot of games of games that appeal more to core gamers and 2018 will have more casual titles. There's also stuff like Bayonetta that will help diversify Nintendo's content.
 

silpheed-mcd

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,384
ComG! Week Sales, 2017 (Dec 11 - Dec 17)

header-logo.png



01/NEW [3DS] Yokai Busters 2 Hihou Densetsu Banbaraja Sword - 159 pt
02/NEW [3DS] Yokai Busters 2 Hihou Densetsu Banbaraja Magnum - 136 pt

03/04 [NSW] Splatoon 2 - 93 pt (+25 pt)
04/05 [NSW] Super Mario Odyssey - 91 pt (+30 pt)
05/02 [PS4] Earth Defense Force 5 - 60 pt (-174 pt)
06/06 [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Moon - 60 pt (-2 pt)
07/NEW [PSV] Digimon Story Cyber Saurus Hackers Memory (normal version) - 50 pt
08/01 [PS4] Yakuza Kiwami 2 (Normal version) - 45 pt (-208 pt)
09/NEW [3DS] Harvest Moon Futago no Mura + - 39 pt
10/03 [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Sun - 38 pt (-36 pt)
11/NEW [PS4] Digimon Story Cyber Saurus Hackers Memory (normal version) - 34 pt
12/11 [3DS] Kirby Battle Deluxe! - 32 pt (+8 pt)
13/07 [PS4] StarWars Battlefront 2 - 29 pt (-22 pt)
14/10 [NSW] Mario Kart 8 Deluxe - 28 pt (+2 pt)
15/18 [3DS] GIRLS MODE 4 Star Stylist - 26 pt (+9 pt)
16/NEW [PS4] RESIDENT EVIL 7 GOLD EDITION - 24 pt
17/R [PS4] Gran Turismo SPORT (Normal Edition) - 22 pt
18/14 [3DS] Animal Crossing: New Leaf - Welcome amiibo - 17 pt (-3 pt)
19/09 [NSW] Xenoblade 2 (Normal version) - 16 pt (-17 pt)
20/R [NSW] 1-2-Switch - 16 pt


ComG! Week Sales, 2017 (Dec 04 - Dec 10)
https://www.resetera.com/posts/1969576/
 
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DarkDetective

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,906
The Netherlands
Taiko Drum should have been on Switch this Fall/holiday and not PS4.
Taiko works differently. They always release exclusively to one platform, and there's always one home console game and one portable game each 12 months. For some reason the series got a 1 year break between Mystery Adventure (3DS, June 2016) and Drum Session (PS4, October 2017), but it's been the (unset?) rule for years.
I don't think there's anything wrong with Drum Session releasing in October for PS4 as the 'home console game' and a brand-new Switch game sometime in H1 2018 as the 'portable game'. My personal guess would be March or April, because that's a half year after Drum Session's release.

Also, I don't think Tales' and Taiko's appearance in the financial report wasn't any confirmation that those games will release this financial year. I doubted it back then, didn't really care later, but my doubt is back. It could simply some sign that indicates future support for a platform that's booming and will become important in the gaming market in both Japan and the rest of the world. Nothing to worry about; they're coming. It almost seems like some people here are thinking of Bandai Namco as some evil corporation that's trying to stretch the meaning of certain words and to befool everyone. That's not true. Come on, let them reveal and release their stuff at their own time. It'll come out eventually.
 

Mandos

Member
Nov 27, 2017
30,876
They tried to save Xenoblade by taking the Fire Emblem Awakening route and it did not work.

May Xenoblade forever rest in peace.
I mean, it's the mid tier pet project of their main large scale world development studio, on an existing engine along with being the best selling entry in the series yet. It may not be a blockbuster, but it's a modest success and a good library filler. So Xenos not dead by a longshot
 

test_account

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,645
No one is acting like they are going bankruptcy. People are just baffled at how unprepared software houses were, even those historically close to Nintendo. You would expect a company like Capcom would have been ready to support Switch from the get-go, Monster Hunter aside. Or Level-5. They basically wasted an entire year. That's why investors are not happy. They see the few third party games selling well, indie breaking records, Nintendo software exploding, hardware sales basically matching PS4 first year sales and what did they have? Ultra Street Fighter 2? Come on.
There hasnt been that many questions regarding Switch support in the Q&A for Capcom. I could only find two, one being how Capcom would go forward based on the sales of USF2, and the other what Capcom expects from the Switch going forward (where they said they were very positive and was going to do more multiplatform developement). Hard to know how the investors are thinking about this. No one knew how the Switch would sell, so all of that is in hindsight, so i hope that the inverstors dont think that games can be developed "just like that", and that if you make a bet on something that doesnt turn out as planned, things like this takes time to adjust.

One could also say that they wasted a year, but hopefully the Switch isnt declining a lot in popularity in the next 1-2 years (at least), so the opportunity should still be there. We could say "damn, they should have done that instead", but not much one can do about the past in this regards anyway.
 

MoonFrog

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
I just really hope that Switch makes it easier for these companies to see Japan as part of the globe :P.

I really think there is a defeatist/cut-our-losses type mentality and, often failed or half-hearted, efforts to join the winning team (mobile)
 

jnWake

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,108
They tried to save Xenoblade by taking the Fire Emblem Awakening route and it did not work.

May Xenoblade forever rest in peace.
Awakening made several changes to its gameplay and presentation that made it become succesful. It wasn't the "waifus" and "pandering" that made the game a success. If that was the reason, then Fates, which included a lot more of those, would have heavily outsold Awakening but... it didn't.

Xenoblade 2, on the other hand, mainly shifted the art style (to one that ended up being very divisive) and didn't change the core formula much. It was always going to be in a similar ballpark of sales to the other XB games, maybe with some help from the Switch audience.
 

v2_0

User requested permanent ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
556
Without getting too deep into the "Wii userbase bought no gamez" discussion, I think Nintendo made a conscious decision to focus on more traditional experiences with their initial first party software output and IMO has a userbase that is more receptive to 3rd party software.
Yes but I'm not sure that's totally deliberate: the Switch lacks a strong gameplay "gimmick"/innovation and as a result is a hard sale for casual gamers. They are clearly aiming at a more hardcore audience with the Switch imo... but that's actually certainly a good thing to please third party developers.

Many of DS and 3DS small/medium/big sellers have nothing in common with Nintendo's output.
Which one are you thinking of? Also having strong games like MH as exclusives on 3DS for a reason or another helped a lot to get these games that are quite different from their first party output. Also even if DS and 3DS sold much more units than the PSP and Vita those two still managed to have a lot of third party exclusives that just didn't match well with the usual image and genres of Nintendo games.

I think that line of thinking falls flat when you talk about Japan though. Sony has no significant IP in Japan and their portfolio has very little overlap with that of Japanese third parties.

JRPGs is an obvious genre where Sony has very little presence(Oreshika was the last one?) where Nintendo publishes several a year.
Sony has had Square Enix in the bag and especially FF and KH for a very long time. This helped them a lot to have JRPGs. Xbox of course not so much for cultural reasons probably.

Of course all kind of exclusives, either first or third parties, can help to attract the same kind of games. This seems like a given to me, is that controversial really?
 
Last edited:
Oct 27, 2017
9,792
Peru
That really isn't the same thing. Awakening was Fire Emblem making itself more casual and adding a bunch of nostalgia, while Xenoblade 2 didn't really do any of that.

Yeah, people tend to forget that Awakening did a lot to make the classic formula more accessible while still keeping what makes unique intact. I love XC2's battle system but I would call it anything but "accessible".

I just hope that MS learns a few lessons about simplification, they made the right step at mapping arts and blades to buttons but they added a bunch of other stuff on top of that that certainly made newcomers confused. The whole XC battle system and open world could be better implemented in a sequel and considering how better XC2 is selling compared to previous entries, I'm praying that Nintendo gives the studio more time and a bigger budget to produce it.
 

DecoReturns

Member
Oct 27, 2017
22,003
The Stars alinged for Fire Emblem Awakening.
It got an visually appealing art style.
Marketing was pretty good and CG cutscenes were well done.

Great reviews and word of mouth

Causal mode and casual friendly
interface.

And Came out at a perfect time (here in the states at least, couldn't even find a physical copy after launch)
 

Vena

Community Resettler
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,379
Not sure why people are down on Switch numbers? I mean its damn near on pace to outsell PS4 in its first 2 years...

No one is down on the Switch, and its not going to take two years to pass the PS4. The only thing we're generally down on is the industry's inability to capitalize on successes in Japan, and the low shipment/supply problems.

The Switch is the first breath of life the industry has had in years, we're not down on it.
 

Nirolak

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,660
Do you think this would be enough? I don't think so.

Also, virtually all relevant Japanese third party games have sold notably well overseas: Ultra Street Fighter II at 450k (a "smash hit"); Disgaea 5 Complete has already outsold the PS4 version; Super Bomberman R at 500k units at the end of April 2017; Dragon Ball XenoVerse 2 at 400k units worldwide. These are pretty good numbers considering the type of games they are. Would this push third parties to put some effort into their future Switch games? Hard to tell.
How can there be consistent third party Japanese sales oversea if... There aren't consistent Japanese releases with potential oversea sales?
We have been seeing notable sales of Japanese games overseas on a consistent basis though. Bomberman R, Disgaea 5C, Puyo Tetris, USF2, DBVX2 all being sound examples of that. If anything 3rd party sales overseas should be more encouraging than what they've seen domestically so far for Japanese publishers.
So this is going to sound very weird given how the much the Switch and PC differ in Japan, but I'd actually look at the way Japanese PC support evolved for how that might actually work.

At first, there were a few smaller titles that sold well, and that convinced a couple of publishers to try one or two larger games. When those sold, they tried a couple of games again to see if it was just a fluke, and then one or two other publishers decided to put out test titles as well. Around three years into this process, you started seeing uneven, but somewhat consistent support of the platform, and then it took another 3-4 years past that to get us to the present situation, where most publishers will support the platform, but there are still some notable absences like Sega or the lumpy output of Square Enix, along with the kind of questionable port quality still coming out of a publisher like Koei Tecmo.

Mind, part of the issue here is that the Switch isn't necessarily going to be around for seven years, but if publishers are generally sold on the system by the end of this generation, the odds of them showing up in force for the Switch 2 only 12 to 18 months in improves quite a bit, especially since the hardware should be pretty close to whatever else is out at the time.

We'd currently be in the "sea of test games" phase, and then entering the "let's try a handful of more notable ports" phase (I expect we'll see these throughout 2018). After that, they'll want to see try handful of more notable ports again to make sure it wasn't just a fluke, which should happen in like... early-mid 2019, and if that works out, we might see a sizable boost in output.

This is of course assuming that Japanese publishers maintain their continual very conservative stance on basically everything they do. Square Enix is a more ambitious company compared to most, and is trying a lot quicker than you might otherwise expect of a Japanese publisher.

It will be interesting to see how japanese publishers will behave when PS5 arrives around then (2019-2020). Stick to PS4? Stick to PS4 and Switch? Go full Switch support or PS4/PS5 like the first PS4 years (with PSV and PS3)?
I'd expect a mix of sticking with PS4 and/or Switch games with the most ambitious publishers making cross-gen titles.

Japanese publishers have tended to be nothing if not consistently glacial.
 
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ILikeFeet

DF Deet Master
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
61,987
They tried to save Xenoblade by taking the Fire Emblem Awakening route and it did not work.

May Xenoblade forever rest in peace.
simplification of game mechanics, casual mode, attractive art style, and daytime commercials on childrens' networks?

because Xenoblade aint ever have that stuff

I just hope that MS learns a few lessons about simplification, they made the right step at mapping arts and blades to buttons but they added a bunch of other stuff on top of that that certainly made newcomers confused. The whole XC battle system and open world could be better implemented in a sequel and considering how better XC2 is selling compared to previous entries, I'm praying that Nintendo gives the studio more time and a bigger budget to produce it.
a bigger budget would be nice, but Takahashi needs to learn that complexity isnt always good first. a AAA game that's as complex as Xenoblade 2 while being as poorly explain isnt going to improve anything other than being a money sink
 

Aters

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
7,948
They tried to save Xenoblade by taking the Fire Emblem Awakening route and it did not work.

May Xenoblade forever rest in peace.
Not really no. Mechanics wise FEA is a lot more casual and friendly to newcomers. They even added a non-permadeath mode. XB2 is as hardcore as it can get and the UI menu is enough to scare people off.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,909
I thought DQ11 was largely done in house? Especially compare to previous DQ games which were entirely outsourced.
No DQ is entirely outsourced, up through DQVIII they had Horii's planning team (Armor Project) working with an external developer. Starting with DQIX it became a more collaborative dev effort with both internal SE staff and a contract developer both working on the game together.

Developers
DQ: Chunsoft
DQII: Chunsoft
DQIII: Chunsoft
DQIV: Chunsoft
DQV: Chunsoft
DQVI: Heartbeat
DQVII: Heartbeat, ArtePiazza
DQVIII: Level 5
DQIX: Square Enix, Level 5
DQX: Square Enix, Orca
DQXI: Square Enix, Orca (PS4), Toylogic (3DS)
 

Mark H

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,679
If Nintendo seriously wanted to make Xenoblade into big league saleswise, they would have told Monolithsoft to remove anything that might turn off casual players.
Complex menu, battle system, hard enemies, etc., these will be all gone and essentially turned into a different game.
The fact that Monolithsoft is sticking to what they want to make should tell you that Nintendo seems to be fine with its sales.
 

Aters

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
7,948
No DQ is entirely outsourced, up through DQVIII they had Horii's planning team (Armor Project) working with an external developer. Starting with DQIX it became a more collaborative dev effort with both internal SE staff and a contract developer both working on the game together.

Developers
DQ: Chunsoft
DQII: Chunsoft
DQIII: Chunsoft
DQIV: Chunsoft
DQV: Chunsoft
DQVI: Heartbeat
DQVII: Heartbeat, ArtePiazza
DQVIII: Level 5
DQIX: Square Enix, Level 5
DQX: Square Enix, Orca
DQXI: Square Enix, Orca (PS4), Toylogic (3DS)
The thing is when you started DQVIII, you get a big L5 logo, indicating their involvement with the game. You don't have an Orca logo at the start of DQXI. I think the degree of Orca's involvement is more inline with regular outsource work, instead of the cases in previous of dq games where basically everything except planning is handled by outsource studio. DQX and DQXI are the only DQ games on wikipedia that have SE as the sole developer. Chunsoft, Heartbeat and L5 were listed as developer for DQI-IX.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,909
The thing is when you started DQVIII, you get a big L5 logo, indicating their involvement with the game. You don't have an Orca logo at the start of DQXI. I think the degree of Orca's involvement is more inline with regular outsource work, instead of the cases in previous of dq games where basically everything except planning is handled by outsource studio. DQX and DQXI are the only DQ games on wikipedia that have SE as the sole developer. Chunsoft, Heartbeat and L5 were listed as developer for DQI-IX.
Orca did major production and design work on DQX at least, yet they didn't have a splash logo on that game either. Don't just go by wikipedia.
 

MoonFrog

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,969
Tbh the list mostly makes me curious as to when and why exactly they moved on from Chunsoft and then Heartbeat and then Level 5.
 

Deleted member 2793

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,368
I just find ironic how people call third parties "ambitious" when they take the gamble of releasing japanese stuff only for PS4, but it's too much to say they should at least support the domestic market leader that has always the best hardware numbers in the country.

Franchises like Kamen Rider and Taiko no Tatsujin getting PS4 exclusive releases is fine, even if the games are being sent to death. Having zero third party for Switch this holiday is embarrassing.
 

Aters

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
7,948
Tbh the list mostly makes me curious as to when and why exactly they moved on from Chunsoft and then Heartbeat and then Level 5.
I remember Horii once said he was impressed by L5's graphic technology in Dark Cloud (or some other early PS2 game) and he wanted them to use that technology in DQVIII. The head of L5 is a big DQ fan so it worked like a dream.

I think there was a conflict between L5 and Horii during DQIX when Horii insisted to add a new character to the game which will result in much of L5's work need to be redone. L5 also established their own successful IPs on DS so they probably weren't interested in working for hire anymore. Thus the collaboration ended.
 

horuhe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
89
京都市
Rakuten Books Sales Ranking Week 50, 2017 (Dic 11 - Dic 17)

01./01. (001./001.) [NSW] Super Mario Odyssey <ACT> (Nintendo)
02./00. (004./000.) [3DS] Yo-kai Watch Busters 2: Magnum <RPG> (Level 5)
03./00. (005./000.) [3DS] Yo-kai Watch Busters 2: Sword <RPG> (Level 5)

04./02. (007./004.) [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Sun <RPG> (Pokémon Co.)
05./03. (008./006.) [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Moon <RPG> (Pokémon Co.)
06./04. (011./010.) [NSW] Splatoon 2 <ACT> (Nintendo)
07./05. (012./011.) [3DS] Kirby Battle Royale <ETC> (Nintendo)
08./07. (013./014.) [NSW] Mario Kart 8 Deluxe <RCE> (Nintendo)
09./00. (014./000.) [3DS] Yo-kai Watch Busters 2: Sword / Magnum Set <RPG> (Level 5)
10./08. (019./016.) [3DS] Animal Crossing: New Leaf - Welcome amiibo <ETC> (Nintendo)
11./11. (021./024.) [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Sun / Ultra Moon Dual Pack <RPG> (Pokémon Co.)
12./14. (024./036.) [NSW] The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild <ADV> (Nintendo)
13./13. (025./031.) [NSW] Sumikko Gurashi: Sumikko Park e Youkoso <ETC> (Nippon Columbia)
14./06. (026./012.) [PS4] Earth Defense Force 5 <ACT> (D3 Publisher)
15./09. (039./018.) [PS4] Yakuza: Kiwami 2 <ADV> (Sega)
16./15. (043./050.) [NSW] 1-2-Switch <ETC> (Nintendo)
17./18. (044./070.) [NSW] Pokkén Tournament DX <FTG> (Pokémon Co.)
18./10. (049./023.) [NSW] Xenoblade Chronicles 2 <RPG> (Nintendo)
19./17. (052./065.) [NSW] Arms <FTG> (Nintendo)
20./00. (057./000.) [PS4] Resident Evil 7: biohazard - Gold Edition (Grotesque Ver.) <ADV> (Capcom)

Rakuten Books Pre-Orders Ranking Week 50, 2017 (Dic 11 - Dic 17)

01./01. (002./002.) [PS4] Monster Hunter: World <ACT> (Capcom)
02./00. (036./000.) [PS4] Super Robot Wars X (Premium Edition) <SLG> (Bandai Namco)
03./00. (045./000.) [PS4] Monster Hunter: World (Collecotr's Edition) <ACT> (Capcom)

04./07. (056./118.) [3DS] Mario Party: The Top 100 <ETC> (Nintendo)
05./00. (092./000.) [PSV] Super Robot Wars X (Premium Edition) <SLG> (Bandai Namco)
06./00. (121./000.) [NSW] One Piece: Pirate Warriors 3 - Deluxe Edition <ACT> (Koei Tecmo)
07./20. (148./217.) [PS4] Dissidia: Final Fantasy NT <ACT> (Square Enix)
08./14. (150./196.) [3DS] Medabots Classics: 20th Anniversary Edition <RPG> (Imagineer)
09./00. (156./000.) [PS4] A-Train Exp. <SLG> (Artdink)
10./00. (161./000.) [PS4] Super Robot Wars X <SLG> (Bandai Namco)

Rakuten Books Ranking Week 49, 2017 (Dic 04 - Dic 10)

***WARNING***

* Note: Games on Rakuten Books Rankings are ONLY based on sales at Rakuten Books and does NOT count games sold by other retailers at Rakuten.
* Note: Games on Pre-Orders Ranking are counted as net sales, so it might possibly affect games listed on Sales Ranking, since those sales are NOT added afterwards.
 

LOCK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
465
Rakuten Books Sales Ranking Week 50, 2017 (Dic 11 - Dic 17)

01./01. (001./001.) [NSW] Super Mario Odyssey <ACT> (Nintendo)
02./00. (004./000.) [3DS] Yo-kai Watch Busters 2: Magnum <RPG> (Level 5)
03./00. (005./000.) [3DS] Yo-kai Watch Busters 2: Sword <RPG> (Level 5)

04./02. (007./004.) [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Sun <RPG> (Pokémon Co.)
05./03. (008./006.) [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Moon <RPG> (Pokémon Co.)
06./04. (011./010.) [NSW] Splatoon 2 <ACT> (Nintendo)
07./05. (012./011.) [3DS] Kirby Battle Royale <ETC> (Nintendo)
08./07. (013./014.) [NSW] Mario Kart 8 Deluxe <RCE> (Nintendo)
09./00. (014./000.) [3DS] Yo-kai Watch Busters 2: Sword / Magnum Set <RPG> (Level 5)
10./08. (019./016.) [3DS] Animal Crossing: New Leaf - Welcome amiibo <ETC> (Nintendo)
11./11. (021./024.) [3DS] Pokémon Ultra Sun / Ultra Moon Dual Pack <RPG> (Pokémon Co.)
12./14. (024./036.) [NSW] The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild <ADV> (Nintendo)
13./13. (025./031.) [NSW] Sumikko Gurashi: Sumikko Park e Youkoso <ETC> (Nippon Columbia)
14./06. (026./012.) [PS4] Earth Defense Force 5 <ACT> (D3 Publisher)
15./09. (039./018.) [PS4] Yakuza: Kiwami 2 <ADV> (Sega)
16./15. (043./050.) [NSW] 1-2-Switch <ETC> (Nintendo)
17./18. (044./070.) [NSW] Pokkén Tournament DX <FTG> (Pokémon Co.)
18./10. (049./023.) [NSW] Xenoblade Chronicles 2 <RPG> (Nintendo)
19./17. (052./065.) [NSW] Arms <FTG> (Nintendo)
20./00. (057./000.) [PS4] Resident Evil 7: biohazard - Gold Edition (Grotesque Ver.) <ADV> (Capcom)
3 PS4 games got on the Nintendo bestsellers, impressive.
 

Kriegshand

Member
Oct 28, 2017
516
Software almost down from last year.

Thanks for the graphs. But it is stressful to compare them because you use the same colours for different years in your graphs. For example in the "Total Software" - graph the year 2017 is marked with violet colour. But in the "Total Hardware" - graph the year 2015 is marked violet and the year 2017 is yellow.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,909
Tbh the list mostly makes me curious as to when and why exactly they moved on from Chunsoft and then Heartbeat and then Level 5.
Chunsoft wanted to make their own games but maintained a good relationship with Enix leading to the Torneko Mystery Dungeon games. Heartbeat went bankrupt and was revived as Genuis Sonority with capital from Nintendo. Level 5's reasoning for departure isn't known but DQIX's continually delayed and once restarted development history probably didn't help. DQIX was also the start of SE development staff being involved during production which might've been problematic for a company like Level 5 and maybe soured them after they did DQVIII alone.

Orca and Toylogic are both basically ex-Cavia, with some old Game Arts staff too in Toylogic's case, which is actually the larger studio of the two. I feel like the collaborative relationship with both seems pretty positive.
 

Kriegshand

Member
Oct 28, 2017
516
So this is going to sound very weird given how the much the Switch and PC differ in Japan, but I'd actually look at the way Japanese PC support evolved for how that might actually work.

...

I'd expect a mix of sticking with PS4 and/or Switch games with the most ambitious publishers making cross-gen titles.

Japanese publishers have tended to be nothing if not consistently glacial.

This is not how the entertainment industry works. Part of being successful is being early to the right party. It is all about timing and the right choices. Take for example Ubisoft. Ubisoft was successful on PS360 because it took the right gamble with Assassin's Creed releasing early at the beginning of the gen. Ubisoft still is milking this right gamble.

Ubisoft was also succesful on the Wii because it adapted really fast to the success of the Wii and was rewarded with a long lasting hit (Just Dance).

The PS1 could have never been succesful if developers took the approach you are describing.

Japanses publishers being this glacial will lose a lot of the domestic sales because the switch is the new Vita. Vita sales declined immediately and dramatically after the release of the switch.
 

Rainrir

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,337
For all its supposed ability to "sell software" (I have no doubt PS4 has a very good tie ratio in Japan), the PS4 isn't helping total software stay on level at all.

This year would have been even worse if DQ wasn't around to inflate numbers. PS4 got so much software support and can't even offset decline from a dying 3DS, a dead PSV and a very young and wobbly NSW that only has Nintendo output on it.

This goes to show the limits of a ~5 million user base, even if the "hardcore users" brought twice the number of games, they are never going to replace a 23+ million platform of "casuals".

Heck, the fact that a diminished Japan still sells circles around individual countries in Europe shows you how big dedicated gaming once was in Japan. If the companies don't act fast, this market will evaporate.

So this is going to sound very weird given how the much the Switch and PC differ in Japan, but I'd actually look at the way Japanese PC support evolved for how that might actually work.

At first, there were a few smaller titles that sold well, and that convinced a couple of publishers to try one or two larger games. When those sold, they tried a couple of games again to see if it was just a fluke, and then one or two other publishers decided to put out test titles as well. Around three years into this process, you started seeing uneven, but somewhat consistent support of the platform, and then it took another 3-4 years past that to get us to the present situation, where most publishers will support the platform, but there are still some notable absences like Sega or the lumpy output of Square Enix, along with the kind of questionable port quality still coming out of a publisher like Koei Tecmo.

Mind, part of the issue here is that the Switch isn't necessarily going to be around for seven years, but if publishers are generally sold on the system by the end of this generation, the odds of them showing up in force for the Switch 2 only 12 to 18 months in improves quite a bit, especially since the hardware should be pretty close to whatever else is out at the time.

We'd currently be in the "sea of test games" phase, and then entering the "let's try a handful of more notable ports" phase (I expect we'll see these throughout 2018). After that, they'll want to see try handful of more notable ports again to make sure it wasn't just a fluke, which should happen in like... early-mid 2019, and if that works out, we might see a sizable boost in output.

This is of course assuming that Japanese publishers maintain their continual very conservative stance on basically everything they do. Square Enix is a more ambitious company compared to most, and is trying a lot quicker than you might otherwise expect of a Japanese publisher.


I'd expect a mix of sticking with PS4 and/or Switch games with the most ambitious publishers making cross-gen titles.

Japanese publishers have tended to be nothing if not consistently glacial.

This type of mentality is why the Japanese console market is shrinking. You can't run your entertainment company like a manufacturer...

Japan console industry is stuck in a vicious cycle of diminished expectations, leading to conservative behavior, leading to less sales, which leads back to even more diminished expectations.

Some publishers and many market analyst in Japan is expecting Switch's performance to revive animal spirits in Japan. I hope for the sake for unique Japanese content that this happens, the market is ripe for some of that to revitalize itself. The revitalization of the console market cannot be carried by Nintendo alone, and if it fails, I can only say that 3Ps in Japan dug their own grave,
 
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