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Digital Foundry - Doom Switch Patch 1.1.1 Tested: Better Performance And Less Blur?
- Thread starter Deleted member 8112
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The audio mix issue is very interesting. Maybe higher quality audio is more taxing for the CPU? Or maybe the PS4 version used uncompressed audio and as a result the codec may be tanking performance?
Guys, come on, I had one day to make this video and I wasn't even going to do it at all until yesterday. I don't play Doom multiplayer and don't like it so I'm sorry I couldn't cover it but it would have pushed beyond what was possible for this video. This is the best I could do in the given timeframe.
I really appreciate you doing this! Paints a clear picture for the performance of the game!
Thanks for the video ;) Really appreciated! Just a question out of my curiosity - have you ever thought about creating simple software that would on fly calculate rendering resolution from a given video or so? I guess using neural nets to find some "edge-like" objects and then some simple algorithms it could be possible, and perhaps that would be really helpful for your work.
Don't take it personally, people here had no idea what kind of constraints you were working with. You did great with what you had, much like panic button when they porting Doom to the x1.
Also, who cares about Doom Multiplayer on the Switch ... like seriously? That mode's playerbase must be as small as Lawbreakers' :P
Great video. While more and more games implementing dynamic resolution are great for players, i figure it makes you guys' job so much harder - especially when the game's not entirely predictable with regards to its slowdowns and framedrops.
I wonder whether this is as good as its gonna get or whether Panic Button are going to keep tweaking the game's performance even more.
Usually the other way around. If the audio is compressed it takes more CPU time to decompress vs running it raw.
I think the overal performance will be better on Normal / Hard more as DF tested in Very Hard mode (which I guess is the less played mode overall)
That would make sense. DF tested a second area where the performance was bad at the start because of the large number of enemies on screen, and performance cleared up significantly after several enemies were down. I heard that lower difficulties have fewer enemies on screen, so that should allow for higher performance.
Still a great job Dark1x . Thx for listen the community.
Back to the topic, its a very minor upgrade and like John sayed, 'don't make miracle', but still nice to see they trying to improve the game.
That's interesting, is there a reason they'd want to scale more in one axis than the other in some situations?
I understand the idea behind testing the most taxing areas, but for a better Average purpose and for the average game population I believe game should be tested on the difficulty most people will play it, this is like they testing Bayonetta on "∞ Climax"
Cant tell if Sarcasm or not as I have found games pretty easy since I got it last week.
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Thanks for looking into this, it's greatly appreciated.
That sounds like a very good idea, I'd actually be kinda surprised if something like this doesn't currently exist...
It's actually surprisingly active. It never takes more than like 30 seconds to find a match.
That sounds like a very good idea, I'd actually be kinda surprised if something like this doesn't currently exist...
It's actually surprisingly active. It never takes more than like 30 seconds to find a match.
Well, i guess i shouldn't have been quite that dismissive, but my point still stands, in principle :P
Its good that i kept my expectations in check. When the patch dropped, i saw a lot of (Very) positive messages on performance and gyro, but its good to see my Hero in video game land John sets the record straight: Good patch, but not perfect. And it shows.
Still, one has to consider its still DOOM we are talking about, running at near 30 FPS on a hybrid device. This game really has no reason to exist on a device like this, yet it does.. and then there is Wolfenstein 2 on the way.
Dark1x i tagged you already earlier today but this thread is more appropiate since its an FPS, i hope you guys will get a shot at Payday 2 for Switch aswell. Might be a nice change of things given that game is out on a ton of platforms :)
John, David, Thomas, Richard, they aren't just mindless drones pumping out content on-the-fly, just like video game developers or anyone else for that matter working in this industry, they are people and people need a break. From experience, i know that comments like the ones you are making can be very demotivating for the recipient. Writing content, or in this case, filming/editing content is not an easy task, especially when you are a smaller outlet. But outlets like DF cater to a specific niche in the industry, for those who want to know more. As such, and because they are only one of very few who take up this task on a professional standard, they are on a lot of pressure and deadlines to deliver said content. Have some respect will you?
Still, one has to consider its still DOOM we are talking about, running at near 30 FPS on a hybrid device. This game really has no reason to exist on a device like this, yet it does.. and then there is Wolfenstein 2 on the way.
Dark1x i tagged you already earlier today but this thread is more appropiate since its an FPS, i hope you guys will get a shot at Payday 2 for Switch aswell. Might be a nice change of things given that game is out on a ton of platforms :)
Hey! Instead of instantly presenting any minus, perhaps start off with a compliment or things this video did do right? Or heck, if you have to be criticial of this video, perhaps elaborate?
John, David, Thomas, Richard, they aren't just mindless drones pumping out content on-the-fly, just like video game developers or anyone else for that matter working in this industry, they are people and people need a break. From experience, i know that comments like the ones you are making can be very demotivating for the recipient. Writing content, or in this case, filming/editing content is not an easy task, especially when you are a smaller outlet. But outlets like DF cater to a specific niche in the industry, for those who want to know more. As such, and because they are only one of very few who take up this task on a professional standard, they are on a lot of pressure and deadlines to deliver said content. Have some respect will you?
Don't take it too harshly John, there were always be that one user that will notice a missing thing and make his voice heard. See it this way: Despite his delivery, you need critiques like his aswell, albeit more elaborated. See it as an opportunity to be even better than the day before. The fact that you made this piece whatsoever as pure fan service to us, the community that wants to discuss the technical side of things, we cannot thank you and your team at DF enough for it. Thank you John, as always.
First off I'm very grateful that you did a follow-up and highly respect your work.
However, I'm not sure I think the response of "I don't play DOOM multiplayer and don't like it so I'm sorry" is a great one, unless I am incorrectly understanding what DF actually does. One would assume that your opinions of the quality of games wouldn't actually matter in a performance video, would it? DOOM multiplayer is a part of the package and if it saw significant performance increases (I have no idea if it did or not), then I think that is worth exploring.
Again, not trying to be overly negative because I do really appreciate the work that you do, I just found that response to be a little knee-jerk.
Most people would not keep re-evaluating a game either. Also I think this video validates his gut instinct that the re-evaluation video was not entirely necessary. With such a slight average resolution and fps bump I wouldn't do a full redo video either. You can't please the entire internet John lol. Thanks for all that you do and keep up the great work!
Yes, I think you misunderstand a touch. Opinions are a huge part of my content and I'm not afraid to state them. They certainly determine what I cover 75% of the time. You can bet that if I do a video, it's because I found it interesting (for any reason) or love the game. It makes for better content when you're passionate about something. I covered this because A) a lot of people were curious and I wanted to help out and B) I love Doom (the id Software portion at least).
The thing is, since I don't play multiplayer Doom at all, I'm not familiar with it pre-patch. I don't have any assets or knowledge of it so I wouldn't even know what's been addressed. Hence why my dislike of it is relevant here. It was a knee-jerk reaction, though, no doubt. Just tired of those types of responses.
I'm sorry, the video feels kind of... half-hearted
Not the analysis of course, that's as good as always, but it kinda feels like a here's your video, now shut up situation. The general tone surprises me after the enthusiasm the ports was originally received with, labelled as the impossible port and spawning a 1 hour DFRetro going through every single classic Doom port.
Oh how the mighty (Switch Doom) has fallen?
Not like it really shocks me after some of John's comments here regarding the update, but it's still baffling.
Not the analysis of course, that's as good as always, but it kinda feels like a here's your video, now shut up situation. The general tone surprises me after the enthusiasm the ports was originally received with, labelled as the impossible port and spawning a 1 hour DFRetro going through every single classic Doom port.
Oh how the mighty (Switch Doom) has fallen?
Not like it really shocks me after some of John's comments here regarding the update, but it's still baffling.
The patch just isn't exciting to me. I mean, it's great they're improving it but it's still often under 30, the frame pacing is still bad and the sound mix isn't good. I just don't have the enthusiasm for it right now. It's an amazing port that is a tiny bit better but still ultimately worse than every other version. It's such a weird situation, though, as Panic Button did such an amazing job considering the very harsh limitations.
The Doom Retro episode wasn't made in response to Doom Switch, though. Totally unrelated.
Some of the comments here are baffling. Dude does a new video despite having a shit ton of other work and people are nit picking and complaining?
Maybe he shouldn't take community requests at all if this is the response.
Maybe he shouldn't take community requests at all if this is the response.
Everyone is entitiled to their own opinion, I guess, but you do realize that although it was a nice update, it was not a significant as an update that would normally warrant a new video analysis. The contents of the analysis reflect the quality of the update, which was good, but not earth shattering. For Dark1x to say more or exaggerate how big of an update this was would have been disingenuous.
Oh yeah, that's totally fair, especially if you didn't have any knowledge of it pre-patch.
I guess I see DF used as the end-all for judgments of performance. While I think it's totally fine for you to not want to cover whatever you don't want to, maybe in a case like this people should acknowledge of the caveat of "well this is totally ignoring any multiplayer improvements that may have been made."
I appreciate the elaboration on your end though.
Well, it does not seem to be that easy, despite the process of pixel counting being fairly easy. However it definitely should be possible up to some point in terms of precision.
Wow at some of the responses and entitlement in this thread, if you think you can do better sitting in your arm chair then go ahead! Just be glad videos like this exist because as John says there really isn't all that much to talk about with this patch and whilst it's nice it's hardly a dramatic change that's made the game go from unplayable to the best version ever. It's slight tweaks most people probably won't notice too much but it's still nice a quick video was made to point out the benefits.
Keep up the good work John!
Keep up the good work John!
Thanks for the follow up on the patch, and especially for the time you took to make the new video although you mentioned on the other thread that you have not noticed any major improvements regarding the resolution. Still it is nice to see you took the time to make the video as well.
I really wish I understood what was happening with the audio in this game. I have only interacted with this version 2x now, and the first time the audio cut out when in handheld mode, and the second time saw the bass over compressing out (sounding kind of farty and crackly) and the combat audio seemingly disappearing into a background layer. It is quite odd!
Maybe it has to do with the audio in Doom being, comparatively heavier CPU wise than other games? It does mix in more audio layers the more combat continues, and it slows and inserts new musical cues often on the fly as you do things (like glory kill, take damage, or deal damage). Curious.
Maybe it has to do with the audio in Doom being, comparatively heavier CPU wise than other games? It does mix in more audio layers the more combat continues, and it slows and inserts new musical cues often on the fly as you do things (like glory kill, take damage, or deal damage). Curious.
Random question, but have you guys considered doing a follow-up to your Rayman Legends Switch video? A patch was released last November that dramatically improved the loading times.
Hey man, I'm grateful you made it. Thanks G.
If all they improved was the loading time, I'm not sure if there's enough for them to make a video about it. Games usually only get revisited when numerous issues have been resolved (or created) by a patch.
Considering there's such a little amount of you and big games get patched almost every day, I'd say you're doing a great job.
I hope the Pateron support is going well.
Had a reply but my internet connection failed. Well, fair enough in any case.
The Doom DFR video obviously couldn't be a reaction if anything for the time spent in its making, but it really had curious timing. I'll let the idea live in my headcanon, it's more fun xD
PS: I hope i'm not being harsh. It's not my intention :/
I'm not asking John to exaggerate it, but the video left me with an... okay, i guess? feeling. Something in it doesn't feels right to me.
Nobody here is being disrespectful enough to be faced with such comments. A video was made, it IS fair to give some negative impressions about it.
Just ignore them. The people that hold your work at the value it deserves are the ones that would not be making those comments anyway. Sadly you can't eradicate drive-bys, although i do have to say that this could be done better.
Even when there is nothing suggestive to the whole video, its good to see people make up questions anyways. Yeah, the tone was different, but i interpreted it as paying lipservice to the fans, a bonus if you will, rather than a geez do i really need to do this, well guess i have to because fans want to. The video sets a more realistic tone to the patch, which, atleast here, was almost seen as some kind of holy grail, as it improved performance that much. John's video shows that such exaggeration is not the case here, and i think it reflects well on the overall package: It's neat, Panic Button deserve props, but for a patch itself, its hard to be really excited over (Except for the gyro aiming) from DF's POV.
The fact John made this anyway says less about his lack of enthusiasm, but rather, more about his absolute love for the DOOM series in general. I feel that's the catch here.
Being realistic, i think the video also speaks volumes about how 2 o 3 fps make such a huge difference, something that these days sees to have been forgotten. Kind of like how 12 to 15 to 18 to 20 fps made the difference between unplayable, barely playable, enjoyable and playable for the original Doom ports. But that's a thing for another day.
Still, well, i'll leave it at that. I understand Dark1x and why he made the video. It just doesn't sits well for me (the video, not the reasons), that's all.
Now i'll just wait for the next DFRetro. No matter what's about, it's always gold :3