Super Smash Bros. announced for Nintendo Switch (2018, Inklings confirmed, Link has BOTW design)

Phendrift · Mar 24, 2018

yuoke said:
What if it was Pauline wearing cappy, but just in the form of pauline's hat?

I'd actually like that. Seems like something Sakurai would do, and they wouldn't have to overhaul Mario either. Pauline with just a random hat, or worse, Mario's hat would be offputting though.

Tsukinopio said:
Until Cappy becomes a recurring character like Rosalina, he's not going to be playable in Smash. As we've seen with Zelda (or rather, haven't seen), Sakurai doesn't like including one-off characters from major franchises.

J-Tier said:
I agree that Pauline kinda feels more like a flavor of the month type character due to her secondary role in a single game and that Cappy is a better representative. Though despite that, I think his chances are slim.

Yeah I don't think he's likely, just saying he'd be a better rep

TimeFire · Mar 24, 2018

Speaking of Odyssey representation, I hope we get Tux Bowser as a costume. I love that design.

ClickyCal' · Mar 24, 2018

Phendrift said:
I'd actually like that. Seems like something Sakurai would do, and they wouldn't have to overhaul Mario either. Pauline with just a random hat, or worse, Mario's hat would be offputting though.

Yeah I don't think he's likely, just saying he'd be a better rep

She already has a hat, and it's red, so it works.

Tsukinopio · Mar 24, 2018

Gartooth said:
I would argue Rosalina was a one-off based on Galaxy 1, since her appearance in Galaxy 2 was only an endgame cameo. Also Sakurai didn't seem to know anything about 3D World during the development of Smash 4.

Is there any evidence of this? Mario Kart 8 came out after 3D World and it has its own stage in Smash 4. Granted, stages are much easier to add, but Greninja's inclusion proves that Sakurai is privy to games that are in development.

BGBW said:
Like Sheik.

Sheik is a unique case because she was merely a transformation for Zelda, an established character. By the time Smash 4 rolled around and transformations were removed due to 3DS hardware limitations, they weren't going to scrap a unique character.

DecoReturns · Mar 24, 2018

Tsukinopio said:
Until Cappy becomes a recurring character like Rosalina, he's not going to be playable in Smash. As we've seen with Zelda (or rather, haven't seen), Sakurai doesn't like including one-off characters from major franchises.

Shiek tho.

Buuuuut Honestly she's the exception. Ocarina was a revelation when it came out, and I feel many of us thought Shiek would return in some form in Mainline Zelda. (She hasn't since).
I know I've been waiting for Shiek to return.

HibbySloth · Mar 24, 2018

Tsukinopio said:
Is there any evidence of this? Mario Kart 8 came out after 3D World and it has its own stage in Smash 4. Granted, stages are much easier to add, but Greninja's inclusion proves that Sakurai is privy to games that are in development.

Sheik is a unique case because she was merely a transformation for Zelda, an established character. By the time Smash 4 rolled around and transformations were removed due to 3DS hardware limitations, they weren't going to scrap a unique character.

I hope with Link and potentially Zelda getting BOTW designs that Sheik gets a shakeup. I'd say give her moveset to Impa and replace her.

Phendrift · Mar 24, 2018

yuoke said:
She already has a hat, and it's red, so it works.

Yeah, I figured you were talking about that

Phendrift · Mar 24, 2018

Honestly Sheik really just needs to be replaced by Impa

ILikeFeet · Mar 24, 2018

Golnei said:
Anything from X would just be a really forced, needless inclusion - if 2 wasn't a factor, most people wouldn't be talking about a new Xenoblade character at all. I obviously don't think we'll actually be seeing 3 Xenoblade 2 characters in the game, but I also don't think anything from X is a believable consideration.

this is the last series that anyone should complain about "forced inclusions" since it's damn near everything including the kitchen sink in regards to representation

lvl 99 Pixel · Mar 24, 2018

Phendrift said:
Honestly Sheik really just needs to be replaced by Impa

Thats like saying pikachu should be replaced by alolan raichu. Sheik is a veteran at this point who finally got a real down special

L Thammy · Mar 24, 2018

Here's a question. Which vets are most in need of a Bowser style revamp?

I feel that Donkey Kong and Samus should be next in line. With how common heavyweights and charge attacks have become, they feel less distinct now,

Gartooth · Mar 24, 2018

Tsukinopio said:
Is there any evidence of this? Mario Kart 8 came out after 3D World and it has its own stage in Smash 4. Granted, stages are much easier to add, but Greninja's inclusion proves that Sakurai is privy to games that are in development.

There's no 3D World content in Smash aside from a direct rip of the Super Bell Hill music, which could have been added late in development. If he knew of 3D World when he decided to add Rosalina it seems weird he wouldn't include any trophies or stages from the game.

Reminds me of how Galaxy was completely ignored in Brawl.

DecoReturns · Mar 24, 2018

Phendrift said:
Honestly Sheik really just needs to be replaced by Impa

Nah. Why get rid of a unique move set?
Or rather why replace a character like Shiek and give their moveset to Impa?
I've seen these ideas tossed around and frankly it's better to have both then have one replace the other.

Plus Shiek has three games under her belt. Why cut them after so long?

HockeyBird · Mar 24, 2018

I feel like you can't replace Sheik because she has transcended beyond being a Zelda character, she's a Smash Bros character. Smash Bros has kept her relevant well past Ocarina of Time. Think of it, some young people nowadays may only know her from Super Smash Bros.

TheFireman · Mar 24, 2018

L Thammy said:
Here's a question. Which vets are most in need of a Bowser style revamp?

I feel that Donkey Kong and Samus should be next in line. With how common heavyweights and charge attacks have become, they feel less distinct now,

Ganondorf needs to be brought back to his Melee self. He was slow in Melee, but still felt relatively fast cause Melee was a fast game. In Brawl and Smash 4, he's just painfully slow. I really want to see him be a viable character again.

I think Jigglypuff needs this kind of revamp to. He just has felt like shit to play in Brawl and Smash 4.

R.D.Blax · Mar 24, 2018

ILikeFeet said:
this is the last series that anyone should complain about "forced inclusions" since it's damn near everything including the kitchen sink in regards to representation

This too lol. Like, what do that even mean for Smash ?

Punchline · Mar 24, 2018

legitimately i hope they never cut r.o.b

Zippo · Mar 24, 2018

Ryce said:
The two characters really aren't comparable. Rosalina rules over Galaxy's hub area, and she appears all throughout the game's storyline -- she gives Mario his Luma, she's in a bunch of important cutscenes, and she even has her lore fleshed out through a storybook. Pauline is important to New Donk City, but that's just one of Odyssey's dozen-plus kingdoms. She means nothing to the game as a whole. Odyssey is the Mario, Cappy, Peach, and Bowser story. And unlike Rosalina and Luma, Pauline doesn't have a relationship with Odyssey's central mechanic, Cappy. I definitely agree that she'd feel forced, and I say that as someone who likes what Nintendo did with her character.

This. I see no real, logical reason to add her in.

Phendrift · Mar 24, 2018

lvl 99 Pixel said:
Thats like saying pikachu should be replaced by alolan raichu. Sheik is a veteran at this point who finally got a real down special

Not really comparable at all. Pikachu the most iconic and recurring character in his franchise. Sheik is a one off character that is just Zelda as a ninja. The series has an actual recurring character that would easily work with the moveset, while Sheik hasn't been relevant for 20 years. Just give the moveset to Impa.

DecoReturns said:
Nah. Why get rid of a unique move set?
Or rather why replace a character like Shiek and give their moveset to Impa?
I've seen these ideas tossed around and frankly it's better to have both then have one replace the other.

Plus Shiek has three games under her belt. Why cut them after so long?

I'm not saying get rid of the moveset, just give it to Impa.

Though I guess clones would work, yeah. But if it came down to one, I'd rather just have Impa inherit the moveset.

SS Impa's design is just too good to let rot, while we have Sheik who hasn't been relevant in years. There's just better ways to represent the series I think.

L Thammy · Mar 24, 2018

R.D.Blax said:
This too lol. Like, what do that even mean for Smash ?

A forced inclusion in Smash would be if a guy with spikey hair and an orange gi went into Sakurai's office and said "this is a nice place... would be a pity if anything was to, ah, happen to it."

HibbySloth · Mar 24, 2018

L Thammy said:
Here's a question. Which vets are most in need of a Bowser style revamp?

I feel that Donkey Kong and Samus should be next in line. With how common heavyweights and charge attacks have become, they feel less distinct now,

Donkey Kong in general just needs a lot. Smash 4 was a joke in terms of representation for him. His moveset feels so dated compared to Returns and Tropical Freeze, Diddy was broken, we had near 10 Jungle Hijinks remixes when they had a treasure trove of David Wise tracks to pick from, The DK rap was cut in half, and I was pretty surprised he didn't even get any assist trophies.

lvl 99 Pixel · Mar 24, 2018

Phendrift said:
Not really comparable at all. Pikachu the most iconic and recurring character in his franchise. Sheik is a one off character that is just Zelda as a ninja. The series has an actual recurring character that would easily work with the moveset, while Sheik hasn't been relevant for 20 years. Just give the moveset to Impa.

I'm not saying get rid of the moveset, just give it to Impa.

Though I guess clones would work, yeah.

the only time impa did anything was in Skyward Sword where shes more like a mage/wizard though?
Sheik might have only been in one game, but her smash brothers moveset is entirely unique and has repped in smash bros as a veteran for so long.

Relevance doesnt really affect any of the veterans, only potential newcomers. We're not going to replace Ganondorf with blight ganon either.

Ryce · Mar 24, 2018

Impa's overrated. She's cool in Hyrule Warriors, but that's not even a canonical Zelda game. She barely has any screen time in Ocarina of Time, and she's a feeble old woman in Breath of the Wild. The only game where Impa plays a major role is Skyward Sword, which has been all but forgotten at this point. There's no reason to add her. I think people are too hung up on representation for representation's sake -- it's as though Zelda arbitrarily needs additional characters shoehorned in just because it's a major series.

Gartooth · Mar 24, 2018

Sponge said:
Donkey Kong in general just needs a lot. Smash 4 was a joke in terms of representation for him. His moveset feels so dated compared to Returns and Tropical Freeze, Diddy was broken, we had near 10 Jungle Hijinks remixes when they had a treasure trove of David Wise tracks to pick from, The DK rap was cut in half, and I was pretty surprised he didn't even get any assist trophies.

To be fair, Returns gave Sakurai and the team barely anything to work with in regards to a new character. Also the stage hook was represented with the background element, even if it was set in yet another jungle.

I do agree that no Assist Trophy or new Final Smash for DK was garbage.

Tsukinopio · Mar 24, 2018

L Thammy said:
Here's a question. Which vets are most in need of a Bowser style revamp?

I feel that Donkey Kong and Samus should be next in line. With how common heavyweights and charge attacks have become, they feel less distinct now,

Donkey Kong is the best heavyweight in the game, so he's fine. If anything needs to be fixed, it's his atrocious Final Smash. Replace the bongos with Rambi.

HibbySloth · Mar 24, 2018

Gartooth said:
To be fair, Returns gave Sakurai and the team barely anything to work with in regards to a new character. Also the stage hook was represented with the background element, even if it was set in yet another jungle.

I do agree that no Assist Trophy or new Final Smash for DK was garbage.

Hopefully they pull from Tropical freeze this time around. That game should give Sakurai more to work with.

Zarzolaon · Mar 24, 2018

Gartooth said:
There's no 3D World content in Smash aside from a direct rip of the Super Bell Hill music, which could have been added late in development. If he knew of 3D World when he decided to add Rosalina it seems weird he wouldn't include any trophies or stages from the game.

Reminds me of how Galaxy was completely ignored in Brawl.

The final boss music is there, too. Still barely anything.

TheFireman said:
Ganondorf needs to be brought back to his Melee self. He was slow in Melee, but still felt relatively fast cause Melee was a fast game. In Brawl and Smash 4, he's just painfully slow. I really want to see him be a viable character again.

I think Jigglypuff needs this kind of revamp to. He just has felt like shit to play in Brawl and Smash 4.

Half of the reason I prefer how Melee plays is because of Ganondorf. Similar situation with Sheik... which is odd because Sheik is still really good, but I simply lost my ability to play well with her.

Uglier Rare Character · Mar 24, 2018

I hope they take all of the N64 veterans and do away with most of their old movesets in favor of something new. It would be nice to break the precedent of a Smash character's moveset never fundamentally changing from their debut game given how dramatically more interesting the Smash 4 newcomers are compared with their older counterparts.

Gartooth · Mar 24, 2018

Sponge said:
Hopefully they pull from Tropical freeze this time around. That game should give Sakurai more to work with.

I agree, TF putting more emphasis on different Kongs as well as avoiding generic jungle stages bodes well for its' Smash representation.

TheFireman · Mar 24, 2018

Tsukinopio said:
Donkey Kong is the best heavyweight in the game, so he's fine. If anything needs to be fixed, it's his atrocious Final Smash. Replace the bongos with Rambi.

Oh god. Donkey Kong's final smash was the one that's convinced me that they've never even attempted to balance final smashes. It's so completely trash, it has no range and the damage it does is minimal. I wish they'd at least attempt to balance final smashes a little, because right now Smash Balls are the only item in Smash 4 I turn off.

KtotheRoc · Mar 24, 2018

Sponge said:
Hopefully they pull from Tropical freeze this time around. That game should give Sakurai more to work with.

TF is the reason why so many (including yours truly) expect at least another playable DK character. There's a lot more to pull from now.

ILikeFeet · Mar 24, 2018

R.D.Blax said:
This too lol. Like, what do that even mean for Smash ?

Greninja maybe? only to promote Gen 6. hell, I can see Greninja being replaced (or at least made a DLC character) with a Gen 8 rep

DecoReturns · Mar 24, 2018

Phendrift said:
Not really comparable at all. Pikachu the most iconic and recurring character in his franchise. Sheik is a one off character that is just Zelda as a ninja. The series has an actual recurring character that would easily work with the moveset, while Sheik hasn't been relevant for 20 years. Just give the moveset to Impa.

I'm not saying get rid of the moveset, just give it to Impa.

Though I guess clones would work, yeah. But if it came down to one, I'd rather just have Impa inherit the moveset.

SS Impa's design is just too good to let rot, while we have Sheik who hasn't been relevant in years. There's just better ways to represent the series I think.

If your basing all this on SS impa's design then I can follow as well with Ocarina's Shiek design. Why let such a great Design rot?

Impa typically doesn't have a set design at all. she's old in BOTW and LBW. A strong Warrior in Ocarina that you see very little off and a more slim version in SS and HW.

Makes more sense to give her a unique moveset, but honeslty. Shiek is more relevant then Impa Today. Base solely on the fact she's a favorite in Smash. Plus she's also in Hyrule Warriors. The only game Impa is playable.

Punchline · Mar 24, 2018

TheFireman said:
Oh god. Donkey Kong's final smash was the one that's convinced me that they've never even attempted to balance final smashes. It's so completely trash, it has no range and the damage it does is minimal. I wish they'd at least attempt to balance final smashes a little, because right now Smash Balls are the only item in Smash 4 I turn off.

have you ever hit it in the rhythm, because it does way more damage and has more range if you hit it at the right time

MrSaturn99 · Mar 24, 2018

Exotoro said:
have you ever hit it in the rhythm, because it does way more damage and has more range if you hit it at the right time

Not to mention it's an amazing edgeguard tool.

yap · Mar 24, 2018

Where many veterans got updated final smashes, DK Bongos in Smash 4 kinda weirded me out. Rather than something from DKC/R or even the more famous Donkey Kong arcade game, it centered around a peripheral that hadn't seen usage since 2006. Even NoJ denied supporting the thing for the Wii.

Deleted member 2618 · Mar 24, 2018

Look at this bullshit I saw at gamestop lol

DecoReturns · Mar 24, 2018

I think Ubisoft is gonna get a rep. I feel They've been pushing for one

NinjaCoachZ · Mar 24, 2018

DK's Donkey Konga final smash is funny but I wouldn't complain at all if they change it to Kong Pow or PUNCHING THE MOON.

DecoReturns · Mar 24, 2018

Menitta said:
Look at this bullshit I saw at gamestop lol

100 fighters!?

And still no Ridley or Waluigi I bet

KtotheRoc · Mar 24, 2018

DecoReturns said:
I think Ubisoft is gonna get a rep. I feel They've been pushing for one

Rabbids coming at ya!

MrSaturn99 · Mar 24, 2018

Ryce said:
Impa's overrated. She's cool in Hyrule Warriors, but that's not even a canonical Zelda game. She barely has any screen time in Ocarina of Time, and she's a feeble old woman in Breath of the Wild. The only game where Impa plays a major role is Skyward Sword, which has been all but forgotten at this point. There's no reason to add her. I think people are too hung up on representation for representation's sake -- it's as though Zelda arbitrarily needs additional characters shoehorned in just because it's a major series.

Always felt this way too, really. She's always been a weird choice to me.

DecoReturns · Mar 24, 2018

KtotheRoc said:
Rabbids coming at ya!

I like the Rabbids better then Rayman

So I'll be happy.

yap · Mar 24, 2018

Menitta said:
Look at this bullshit I saw at gamestop lol

modern pac-man though

David Kjellson · Mar 24, 2018

Honestly, if Ezio got in I would cry tears of joy.

MrSaturn99 · Mar 24, 2018

Menitta said:
Look at this bullshit I saw at gamestop lol

Oh hey, it's the Pac-Man design Sakurai didn't want! Lol

Don't these fake mock-ups always pop up in game stores and the like whenever a new Smash's coming out? I distinctly recall another one that had Birdo and Rayman on it.

Deleted member 2618 · Mar 24, 2018

MrSaturn99 said:
Oh hey, it's the Pac-Man design Sakurai didn't want! Lol

Don't these fake mock-ups always pop up in game stores and the like whenever a new Smash's coming out? I distinctly recall another one that had Birdo and Rayman on it.

Wouldn't surprise me. I had never seen a fake Smash cover in a Gamestop before though. They gotta do anything to get those preorder numbers up!

It's the 100+ fighters and Shovel Knight that gets me lol

Gartooth · Mar 24, 2018

Gotta be honest, I always felt like the Impa requests felt more like the community settling on a recurring character rather than her actually being the Zelda character the fans wanted in Smash. I think 4 not adding a newcomer broke spirits.

NinjaCoachZ · Mar 24, 2018

MrSaturn99 said:
Oh hey, it's the Pac-Man design Sakurai didn't want! Lol

Don't these fake mock-ups always pop up in game stores and the like whenever a new Smash's coming out? I distinctly recall another one that had Birdo and Rayman on it.

There was a preorder card for Brawl at Best Buy with Sonic from Sonic Heroes on it.

Nocturnowl · Mar 24, 2018

Part of me thinks they kept the bongo final smash for DK because Konga was Namco's baby, and they just so happened to be the guys behind Smash 3DS/WiiU.
I mean, they spent a year making a Starfox Assault stage long after the game was relevant, Assault being another Namco collab.

Well I'd rather it was Namco repping themselves than Sakurai just being like "what's a Kong?"

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