At this point, I know Rick is no better than Negan. Heck maybe worse. There are actually lot of people who have a legitimate reason to want to kill him as much as he want to kill Negan.
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‘The Walking Dead’ – Season 8 - Sundays on AMC
- Thread starter RatskyWatsky
- Start date
At this point, I know Rick is no better than Negan. Heck maybe worse. There are actually lot of people who have a legitimate reason to want to kill him as much as he want to kill Negan.
Had...had you been...expecting an end to Negan to be in sight? Even putting the source material aside, I'm not sure I can recall anything the show has ever telegraphed harder than the fact that they're not killing off Negan at the conclusion of the 'All Out War' arc.
Except that full hate on was clumsily executed when he had gone to blows with Daryl after what happened to Morales and seeing the baby and what he'd done. Nothing really triggered it. It just...happened, like the rest of his mood swings.
It's not Carl's death, with Rick even admitting to Negan it had nothing to do with the Saviors. And Daryl, Tara, Morgan, and Michonne were the ones to blow it and lead to Alexandria being firebombed. But nope, no reaction there. Nothing to really make Daryl accountable. Just a bro moment where Rick cements his sudden desire to be a prick.
And that's why the coming-to won't be earned, as his previous heel turn was not in the first place.
Edit: Same with Eugene. Not sure what exactly the reason he's gone from trying to survive to being downright malevolent to everyone. He'll probably make it out just fine as well.
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I just don't get a lot about this show anymore...like who are we supposed to root for or care about? Hardly anyone on this show is likeable at all IMO...and the people they portray as "bad guys" (The Saviors) to me aren't bad at all and way more interesting than the Hilltop, Rick's group, etc.
Really wish they'd quit putting characters in the forefront of stories that are just awful or completely forgettable...Henry, Jadis, Tara, Gabriel, Eugene, etc.
I don't know...pretty much just hate watching at this point until FTWD comes back.
Really wish they'd quit putting characters in the forefront of stories that are just awful or completely forgettable...Henry, Jadis, Tara, Gabriel, Eugene, etc.
I don't know...pretty much just hate watching at this point until FTWD comes back.
I'm actually expecting this season to end without any kind of resolution to Negan or All Out War.
Oh you know it will...they're gonna drag it out as long as they can, I don't expect resolution until the end of next season honestly...
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I think it would be awesome if the show finally caught up to the comic and then diverged wildly. It would give the show an unpredictable, "anything can happen" feel that would make it really exciting again.
I am getting strong "end-of-season-3" vibes with this season right now. I think it would be a huge mistake if Gimple chose not to end the All Out War arc this season.
I think it will end this season....there's still lots left time wise. Next week, plus some ridiculously extended finale I'm sure. And what's left really here? Negan is back, they have their ammo ready. All that's left is to clean up the Simon situation and then it's fight time.
My personal theory based on the trajectory of the show/comics is:
My personal theory based on the trajectory of the show/comics is:
The war ends, Rick imprisons Negan, AND we get a time skip just before the closing credits and that time skip will kind of act as the cliffhanger. Time skip is the only iffy thing in this theory, I do think we're seeing the end of the war and Negan jailed.
Loved all of the callbacks this episode. It was pointed out on Talking Dead that the place where Carol finds Henry was actually filmed in the same place we last see Sophia alive in S2.
Morgan's "Don't ever be sorry." line to Henry at the end of the episode is the same thing Morgan says to Carl when Carl apologizes for shooting him at the end of "Clear."
Rick's plea with the Saviors that a man's word has "Still gotta mean something." Was said by Rick earlier in the season to another Savior, promising to spare his life. He kept his word then, but Daryl took matters into his own hands.
I think Rick's "You know me." to Morgan when they meet in the woods may have also been in "Clear" but I'm not sure. There may have been others I missed as well.
This episode and the episode where Rick goes after Negan have easily been my favorites from 8B. Love me some crazy Rick.
Morgan's "Don't ever be sorry." line to Henry at the end of the episode is the same thing Morgan says to Carl when Carl apologizes for shooting him at the end of "Clear."
Rick's plea with the Saviors that a man's word has "Still gotta mean something." Was said by Rick earlier in the season to another Savior, promising to spare his life. He kept his word then, but Daryl took matters into his own hands.
I think Rick's "You know me." to Morgan when they meet in the woods may have also been in "Clear" but I'm not sure. There may have been others I missed as well.
This episode and the episode where Rick goes after Negan have easily been my favorites from 8B. Love me some crazy Rick.
Negan, for all his flaws, would have rewarded and appreciated somebody saving his life.
What Rick did in this episode was icy-bloodied. I'm not even certain what the point of that scene was, other than to demonstrate his maliciousness.
What Rick did in this episode was icy-bloodied. I'm not even certain what the point of that scene was, other than to demonstrate his maliciousness.
I get a filling like it's gonna be another "Someone big dies at the end of the season."
It seems that they've lost all the wind for letting characters go and think that they have to save that aspect for season finales and such.
I wouldn't mind if Rick bit the dust, he's really becoming unlikable, especially after what he did this episode to the saviors that legit helped save him and Morgan. That + leaving the trash woman to die and straight up going against Carl's last wishes, to me he's just as bad as the Governor and Shane these days, he no longer has empathy, sees people as a resource, and would rather put someone down then take the chance on helping them.
It seems that they've lost all the wind for letting characters go and think that they have to save that aspect for season finales and such.
I wouldn't mind if Rick bit the dust, he's really becoming unlikable, especially after what he did this episode to the saviors that legit helped save him and Morgan. That + leaving the trash woman to die and straight up going against Carl's last wishes, to me he's just as bad as the Governor and Shane these days, he no longer has empathy, sees people as a resource, and would rather put someone down then take the chance on helping them.
I can see it already.....Rick and Negan have their big battle and Rick has Negan in a spot where he's about to kill him or not and........fade to black. Classic TWD trolling.
Although if youre paying attention to recent pics of JDM, youll see that he's sporting a full on beard, just like someone who has been held in captivity for a long time, unable to shave. They are going to troll us to hell making us think Rick is going to kill Negan, but it will never happen.
No idea. Seems Jadis had some sort of exchange going on with that party, and was even going to hand over Negan to them.
I don't have any expectations for the finale. I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to skin this war another season, with Negan being the only bad guy interesting enough in the entire series. The Governor, for example, was trash. Last week's episode was pretty good, the new one was pretty meh again, they really have a problem with consistent storytelling without relying on clichès. Like, you can predict 2/3rds of scenes nowadays, and I haven't even read the comics. Sudden minor character background? That guy's going to die at the end of the episode. Bad guy suddenly shows a human side? It'll only be a ruse. And so on. With Carl's death and such I'm half hoping they ignore the comics and go full-on bonkers with stupidly high speed events to try and salvage viewers and ratings. Like, these past 2 seasons there has been material for like what, 5 episodes without all the useless fillers? I really hope that's what we'll eventually get with the new showrunners, but I'm not holding my breath.
Really? They're in the middle of a war and it's only been a few weeks since Glen and co were brutally murdered. Only days since Alexandria was destroyed. Dozens of their allies have been killed. Rick was betrayed twice in a matter of days by the same group, why would he start trusting Saviors in the middle of this conflict? That makes no sense given the situation they're in and what has been happening to them
He should be this ruthless at the moment.
The bad part isn't that, it's his out of nowhere desire to make deals and trust people and "my word still means something"; maybe not the best idea when you literally just rallied three groups to wage bloody war for your cause a few days ago and you keep telling Negan how you're going to kill him. (It's been three times now?)
It will almost certainly end at the end of the season. It's been heavily hinted at by writers and, most recently, in the marketing for Morgan joining Fear.
Not sure why people think it's weird that people are coming around on Negan. He's definitely awful as a person, and Rick is definitely not a saint. The thing that always separated Rick from these other "evil" characters are all about the shades of grey. Rick's particular shade is that he usually doesn't do anything to somebody innocent without provocation. Usually. Negan would and has done it multiple times. Once provoked though, Rick is capable of much more than any of these guys because his instinct for survival is off the charts. You don't live this long without developing some form of bloodlust and being just plain good at killin'.
With that said, the line separating them isn't huge so it's definitely not a big leap for people to "fall for" Negan's humanization. Throw in his charisma and whatnot and he's just a likeable dude. Not sure why people think it's farfetched. The problem was before we learned these other sides to him he was literally a cartoon character saying cartoonish things and doing cartoonishly evil things just to do them. But when you start seeing him vulnerable and as a more genuine person (i.e. grief over Carl, Lucille, angry at Simon, etc...) it gets much easier to accept him. This is a world filled with murderous psychos, you can't compare your morality scale in real life to a world that doesn't even have one. Negan does have a bit of a code that he lives by and is justified in his head, and he has definitely corrupted himself somewhere along the way, just as Rick has. They both just live by different shades when it comes to how to survive in the post apocalypse world.
I like to think the only thing stopping Rick from becoming a full baddy is #teamFamily. They've kept him grounded. If Negan had one or the governor had one they probably wouldn't have completely broken "bad" but they keep people at arms length because they see everyone as a resource since losing their immediately loved ones i.e. Lucille and whoever the governor was grieving over, his daughter I think. So now Rick is at a similar decision point after losing almost all of his loved ones. He even used Morgan as a tool. That's what the episode was getting at me thinks.
With that said, the line separating them isn't huge so it's definitely not a big leap for people to "fall for" Negan's humanization. Throw in his charisma and whatnot and he's just a likeable dude. Not sure why people think it's farfetched. The problem was before we learned these other sides to him he was literally a cartoon character saying cartoonish things and doing cartoonishly evil things just to do them. But when you start seeing him vulnerable and as a more genuine person (i.e. grief over Carl, Lucille, angry at Simon, etc...) it gets much easier to accept him. This is a world filled with murderous psychos, you can't compare your morality scale in real life to a world that doesn't even have one. Negan does have a bit of a code that he lives by and is justified in his head, and he has definitely corrupted himself somewhere along the way, just as Rick has. They both just live by different shades when it comes to how to survive in the post apocalypse world.
I like to think the only thing stopping Rick from becoming a full baddy is #teamFamily. They've kept him grounded. If Negan had one or the governor had one they probably wouldn't have completely broken "bad" but they keep people at arms length because they see everyone as a resource since losing their immediately loved ones i.e. Lucille and whoever the governor was grieving over, his daughter I think. So now Rick is at a similar decision point after losing almost all of his loved ones. He even used Morgan as a tool. That's what the episode was getting at me thinks.
I think that was exactly the point of it. He was clearly insane and doing insane shit (using Morgan's craziness to help him get some murder revenge going) because of the loss of Carl. Him reading the letter at the end and crying was him probably reading Carl telling him that everything he's been doing since Carl died is completely wrong and not how he should live. And he probably knew the letter would say that which is why he didn't want to read it.
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Rewatched the first season over the last couple of days. easily my favourite season. This show was so much better back then!
My GF has been watching Fear the Walking Dead this past week, and even though I'm multitasking when she's watching, it seems to be miles ahead of the Walking Dead proper, in terms of storylines, characters, and writing. It doesn't seem like it's spinning its wheels or has any hilariously contrived moments (or ones that I've noticed, at least).
I'll have to eventually catch up on Fear, the trailer for this upcoming season was pretty interesting.
I've personally tried fear a few times but can't get into it. Not a hater though just not my thing for whatever reason.
I just started and caught up to the second half of this season over the last few days, when I had nothing else to do. I'd been putting it off because the first half was so bad, and had considered not watching at all, but I'm a completionist.
This second half has been better than the first. It didn't start off that way, but there's been more depth and less fighting between mostly nameless extras. This show is at its best when it has depth and isn't continuous fighting that makes it hard to keep track of who's where and even who's who at times, with the extras.
It's still not anything too good or great, and it needs to end the Negan arc as soon as possible. But it's improved some.
I wish there was a break in-between this ending and FTWD, but not this year. Fear got better as its last season went on, after being pretty mediocre and forgettable for a while. Hopefully this season will be better.
This second half has been better than the first. It didn't start off that way, but there's been more depth and less fighting between mostly nameless extras. This show is at its best when it has depth and isn't continuous fighting that makes it hard to keep track of who's where and even who's who at times, with the extras.
It's still not anything too good or great, and it needs to end the Negan arc as soon as possible. But it's improved some.
I wish there was a break in-between this ending and FTWD, but not this year. Fear got better as its last season went on, after being pretty mediocre and forgettable for a while. Hopefully this season will be better.
I don't think they're trying to paint him as a good guy.. Just that the zombie apocalypse can make monsters of everyone.
Well, Carol only went to keep an eye on Morgan with the kid being a lucky bonus. What's your issue with that anyway?
Should've died a long time ago, but it felt good to see him go the way he did. Fuck that dude.
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Morgan is really annoying. Which pisses me off since I loved his character before. I prefered when he was the peaceful guy, trying to save people. Instead he he became a fuckin crybaby "Everyone dies except me :""(" "I am supposed to :""(".
It's the fuckin apocalypse. Everyone around him survived while losing family. Heck, Rick just lost his son a few days ago. Why would he act like some cursed man.
Eugene needs to die today. Gruesomely.
We already know that there are other technologically minded people out there now. Die. He sucks. Hearing him speak is painful.
We already know that there are other technologically minded people out there now. Die. He sucks. Hearing him speak is painful.
Who knows if they'll even end the all out war arc this season
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I don't know if I can take another season of this, though. Most of this season was just different shots of fights between nameless extras.
I like Negan's actor, but am also getting sick of him.
They did well with the casting but they've had a tough time writing him in a satisfying way. He's got his moments, definitely, and I'm glad they're trying new stuff with him lately, but it's all still a huge mess.
They need to, I don't know if I can handle another season with the Saviors as the main antagonists.
Well he seems to legitimately have a mental illness, and has struggled with that the entire show.
But yeah the "character goes from pacifist to psycho killer and back again" thing has happened with like half the characters on the show.
Rick is a good guy. He's just doubting himself because Carl is gone. He's in No Mercy mode.
I gotta admit... it would be interesting to see Negan join Rick... really interesting but that can't happen because Negan has done so much to Rick that it's near impossible. It's really confusing why Carl would even ask Rick to show forgiveness to Negan considering how Carl was literally one of the first people to show absolute HATE for Negan after killing Abraham and Glenn. Carl made several death threats to Negan AGAIN. Anybody remember when Carl boldly said to Negan that if he was smart he would kill him? OR when Carl infiltrated the Saviors with a gun?! Do the writers think that people just forget the actual better episodes?! LMAO
The show is at a very weird point now where it prolly doesn't even know where it wants to go anymore.
That's what character development is to these writers; people are either psycho killers or enlightned pacifists and they flip back and forth between those 2 modes. Only Michonne and Maggie of the major characters has really been consistently more even keeled.
Cosigned. They ruined this character. He wasn't nearly as irritating in the comics. It seems like the show still wants the viewers to like him despite him consistently being a cowardly traitor though, so I'm sure they won't kill him.
Yeah, it'd be nice to see Eugene go. His character doesn't make much sense anymore. He's turned into a piece of shit.
I'm kind of looking forward to tonight's episode, but it's partly because there are only two left and I'm caught up and don't have several episodes sitting on my PVR, weighing on my shoulders. It has gotten a bit better, though.
I'm kind of looking forward to tonight's episode, but it's partly because there are only two left and I'm caught up and don't have several episodes sitting on my PVR, weighing on my shoulders. It has gotten a bit better, though.