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Ventilation Stick

Alt account
Banned
Apr 2, 2018
283
I was thinking PS4 but oddly enough I've seen a great lack of sea of Theives in multiple stores.

At the same time Microsoft has not posted any sales milestones directly.

This is a tough one for this month.
 

Kill3r7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,441
So long as Sony are happy which I think they will be, all should be good in terms of getting future games from SSM so I will be very happy! It remains to be seen what happens with GOW sales wise, at worst though it is probably going to beat Horizon with some ease at least in NA, what remains to be seen is how this game resonates with people that were not interested in previous GOW titles. For one, this is a lengthy experience with RPG elements so it could open the fanbase up and lead to greater sales.

Service games are top dog now but for GOW, the mainline games have always been 90+ but did not exactly light the charts on fire. 7.5 million for Horizon already makes it way bigger than any GOW game, so if this new GOW can reach those heights I would think Sony would be elated. Unless it's Nintendo, first party games do not seem to sell mammoth numbers and with Nintendo, they do that by having a userbase that basically buy the console for the first party support, Sony don't have that.

Fortnite just smells like a fart in the wind, it will blow over. PUBG was the hottest shit even end of last year but Fornite blew past them, it just seems like a matter of time until something else takes its place.

Hard to beat a F2P game that tens of millions are playing regularly. No game has knocked it off PSN's top games since December nor XBL most played list.
 

Andri

Member
Mar 20, 2018
6,017
Switzerland
Call me crazy but I'm thinking 1.6 Million for Dad of War. I think if you look at it with perspective, God of War is a franchise that does extremely well in the US compared to Europe which i expect franchise records to be broken.

What's the biggest exclusive openings for this gen?
My own guess is:
1: Mario Odyssey
2: Halo 5
3: Horizon Zero Dawn
4: Uncharted 4
5: Breath of the Wild(just Switch)

I could see Smash Bros and God of War having close to 2 Million in debut NPDs.

How do any of these compare to Pokemon though ?
 

rahzel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
452
So long as Sony are happy which I think they will be, all should be good in terms of getting future games from SSM so I will be very happy! It remains to be seen what happens with GOW sales wise, at worst though it is probably going to beat Horizon with some ease at least in NA, what remains to be seen is how this game resonates with people that were not interested in previous GOW titles. For one, this is a lengthy experience with RPG elements so it could open the fanbase up and lead to greater sales.

Service games are top dog now but for GOW, the mainline games have always been 90+ but did not exactly light the charts on fire. 7.5 million for Horizon already makes it way bigger than any GOW game, so if this new GOW can reach those heights I would think Sony would be elated. Unless it's Nintendo, first party games do not seem to sell mammoth numbers and with Nintendo, they do that by having a userbase that basically buy the console for the first party support, Sony don't have that.

Fortnite just smells like a fart in the wind, it will blow over. PUBG was the hottest shit even end of last year but Fornite blew past them, it just seems like a matter of time until something else takes its place.
GoW games have sold well in the US, but traditionally haven't sold well elsewhere, which is why HZD sold more. HZD has more international appeal I suppose.

I'm pretty confident in saying that GoW will sell more than HZD in the US. I also think it's going to be the best selling title in the series. It just seems like the reboot has given the IP more mass appeal, being more story driven. Game is getting a lot of high praise.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
6,942
Hard to beat a F2P game that tens of millions are playing regularly. No game has knocked it off PSN's top games since December nor XBL most played list.
At least on the cbox, I think PUBG should have a good chance next week. It's at #2 now and it's a free weekend next week followed by a possible sale. Usually after those there's a sales jump as well as a played jump from new people buying into the game
 

Thorrgal

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,330
Last edited:

Deleted member 5727

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826
Wow, so a single low review can really impact sales .

Well, not necessarily. This would be correlational research, so it's not establishing a casual relationship between metacritic averages and game sales. It may be that metacritic averages are associated with factors that are the primary driver of sales (e.g., acclaim, positive publicity, quality, etc.). One low review score would not have an effect on that.

Interesting data, Mat, thanks. Interesting that the effect seems to increase at 90+.
 

Sedated

Member
Apr 13, 2018
2,598

slavesnyder

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,127
SlaveSnyder Media Corp.
Just curious about that statement, your telling me these same different rules applied to Wii/Wii U 1st Party titles?

Or are you just saying 3DS and Switch at the moment?
nitendo is different with a different focus, portfolio and strategy. so it's fair to keep them out of the discussion for some themes. they have no focus on gaas, don't rely on third party and are quite cautious on dlc, microtransactions, discounts and stuff. online play is there but not such a vital part of the overall experience. same goes for the e-shop.
whoever sais that's bad and they should be more like sony and microsoft, analyst or not, mentally took the easy road but understood nothing.
 

Thorrgal

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,330
When u guys talk UC 4 total sales (10M+) are talking NPD or WW?

Because the 850k first week is NPD, right?
 

Deleted member 2785

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Oct 25, 2017
2,119
Just curious about that statement, your telling me these same different rules applied to Wii/Wii U 1st Party titles?

Or are you just saying 3DS and Switch at the moment?

Nintendo games have different decay curves, pricing and upside potential, among many other things. They are, to a large extent, consistent outliers. Outliers, if not accounted for in a data set, throw off whatever findings may be had and increase ranges of error. It's not my opinion, it's just how the math works.

Well, not necessarily. This would be correlational research, so it's not establishing a casual relationship between metacritic averages and game sales. It may be that metacritic averages are associated with factors that are the primary driver of sales (e.g., acclaim, positive publicity, quality, etc.). One low review score would not have an effect on that.

Interesting data, Mat, thanks. Interesting that the effect seems to increase at 90+.

Exactly. The metacritic score is a certainly imperfect quantitative surrogate for the actual unquantifiable factors that help a game sell. Like Andy says, the game doesn't sell because of the MC, it sells because of the reasons the MC is what it is.

In genres that have GOOD correlations between MC and sales you really only get to an r-squared of like .35, meaning that one can explain 35% of the variability in sales between like titles by difference in MC. Unfortunately, that leaves 65% that must be explained by differences in marketing, distribution, etc etc.

But really, best case, using all available quantifiable attributes, I've yet to see a genre where we can explain more than half of the variability of sales between titles.

So what does that mean? Huge ranges of error in forecasting based on unquantifiable factors.

It's why multivariate regression modeling breaks down in games and why if you get within +/- 10% on any forecast you threw a bullseye and more likely got lucky with the forecast than actually knew what was going to happen.

Anyways, long story short, pinpointing forecasts on the sales on a group of games on a consistent basis is extremely difficult.
 
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Sangetsu-II

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,503
Nintendo games have different decay curves, pricing and upside potential, among many other things. They are, to a large extent, consistent outliers. Outliers, if not accounted for in a data set, throw off whatever findings may be had and increase ranges of error. It's not my opinion, it's just how the math works.

Interesting, but does that data show consistency based on historic data on all Nintendo platforms incluiding legacy systems? or is it just something that has been discovered recently with Nintendo success this generation?
 

Deleted member 2785

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Oct 25, 2017
2,119
Interesting, but does that data show consistency based on historic data on all Nintendo platforms incluiding legacy systems? or is it just something that has been discovered recently with Nintendo success this generation?

Always been the case as far as I've seen. A cart racer from Nintendo, for example, behaves quite differently than cart racers from other publishers. Just go down the list of genres and tell me Nintendo games don't operate on a different level than other publisher games in those same genres.
 

JesusBuiltMyHotRod

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Apr 13, 2018
203
A 95 rated game should break out and sell much better than "other major exclusives" looking at historical data. But in 2018, after the service game revolution and with things like Fortnite out there, will this still be the case? Or will the market be limited to the traditional exclusive base?

EDIT misread

Don't take this the wrong way, you clearly are a smart guy, but I don;t understand why very smart people in the industry cannot seem to grasp the difference between the folks who play critical mass games ala fortnite, and smart phones then traditional gaming....They are two different market segments imo.

EX: My 18 year old daughter has had a PS4 for 3 years she has played 1 game GTA...until recently she came to me and asked about FortNite....The folks who plays these games go beyond traditional gamers, they reach critical mass. It will have zero effect on GOW or any other game imo. This really seems like a "Smart Phones will hurt Consoles" line of thought that was always off base. One is not going to effect the other...at all.

On a totally unreleated note, people who don;t even normally game outside of NHL, COD every year have asked me about GOW...it's going to be huge, not Fortnite huge obviously, but big.
 

Deleted member 2785

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Smart people always question the assumptions and do not project to total market the thoughts of a small sample.

And if you've ever read my comments or thoughts, I've always been an advocate of mobile and other gaming activities growing the overall pie.

It's been 5 years since we've had a game like this in terms of MC score. And it's the first game in a longer time that has been a single player only, non service game.

Given what's happened in that market, the data suggest that multiple forecast scenarios should exist because the comparable sample is small and old.
 

Astandahl

Member
Oct 28, 2017
9,011
Nintendo games have different decay curves, pricing and upside potential, among many other things. They are, to a large extent, consistent outliers. Outliers, if not accounted for in a data set, throw off whatever findings may be had and increase ranges of error. It's not my opinion, it's just how the math works.



Exactly. The metacritic score is a certainly imperfect quantitative surrogate for the actual unquantifiable factors that help a game sell. Like Andy says, the game doesn't sell because of the MC, it sells because of the reasons the MC is what it is.

In genres that have GOOD correlations between MC and sales you really only get to an r-squared of like .35, meaning that one can explain 35% of the variability in sales between like titles by difference in MC. Unfortunately, that leaves 65% that must be explained by differences in marketing, distribution, etc etc.

But really, best case, using all available quantifiable attributes, I've yet to see a genre where we can explain more than half of the variability of sales between titles.

So what does that mean? Huge ranges of error in forecasting based on unquantifiable factors.

It's why multivariate regression modeling breaks down in games and why if you get within +/- 10% on any forecast you threw a bullseye and more likely got lucky with the forecast than actually knew what was going to happen.

Anyways, long story short, pinpointing forecasts on the sales on a group of games on a consistent basis is extremely difficult.

I wanted to ask you more insight about the correlation between MC Score and sales but you've already answered. Thanks again from your inputs Matt , they are always appreciated here.
 

JesusBuiltMyHotRod

Banned for alt account
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Apr 13, 2018
203
Smart people always question the assumptions and do not project to total market the thoughts of a small sample.

And if you've ever read my comments or thoughts, I've always been an advocate of mobile and other gaming activities growing the overall pie.

It's been 5 years since we've had a game like this in terms of MC score. And it's the first game in a longer time that has been a single player only, non service game.

Given what's happened in that market, the data suggest that multiple forecast scenarios should exist because the comparable sample is small and old.
Fair enough, you make good points here.
 

slavesnyder

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,127
SlaveSnyder Media Corp.
Will take a safe risk here (...)
noone and nothing is a safe risk this month.

oh, by the way: with god of war being such a graphical boastfulness, do we expect a significantly higher percentage of Pros sold next month?
i would not be surprised if the game could convince a lot of people to opt for the Royal PS* or, if there's still the feeble 4 in da house, invest into a hardware update.

*missed opportunity
 
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Soony Xbone Uhh

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
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Oct 27, 2017
3,156
Thanks, wasn't sure on the specifics

March to september or april to october?
April to October. October 2017 for Xbox One was extremely low.

Just go down the list of genres and tell me Nintendo games don't operate on a different level than other publisher games in those same genres.
Smash Brows is a great example for this.
Probably even a better one than Mario Kart. Just because there're not many Cart Racers out there anyway.
 
Oct 30, 2017
636
Canada
noone and nothing is a safe risk this month.

oh, by the way: with god of war being such a graphical boastfulness, do we expect a significantly higher percentage of Pros sold next month?
i would not be surprised if the game could convince a lot of people to opt for the Royal PS* or, if there's still the feeble 4 in da house, invest into a hardware update.

*missed opportunity

I caved and bought one, and the bundle keeps going out of stock on Amazon like an hour after they have stock. Completely anecdotal, but I think they will sell a lot of Pros next month.
 

Ventilation Stick

Alt account
Banned
Apr 2, 2018
283
Always been the case as far as I've seen. A cart racer from Nintendo, for example, behaves quite differently than cart racers from other publishers. Just go down the list of genres and tell me Nintendo games don't operate on a different level than other publisher games in those same genres.

This is because kart racers outside Mario kart almost all died in the early 2000's sans nitro kart which Mari kart 8 took ideas from.

S
April to October. October 2017 for Xbox One was extremely low.


Smash Brows is a great example for this.
Probably even a better one than Mario Kart. Just because there're not many Cart Racers out there anyway.

Smash Bros is not a fighter it's a party game and that's what it's originally designed to be.

The chat if smash being a fighter happened when melee became competitive which only happened due to breaking the game and exploiting glitches.

Other wise games like Zelda (combat system aside), f-zeri, golden sun etc aren't really that "different "
 

v_iHuGi

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
5,155
God of War should eclipse Uncharted 4 easily WW based on the hype I'm seeing across REAL LIFE people not internet.

Based on Internet it will crush Uncharted 4 lol.

With that said, Spider-Man should wipe out both and Last of Us 2 aswell.

Original TLOU has sold probably over 15M by now, I've little to zero doubts about that.
 

JesusBuiltMyHotRod

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Apr 13, 2018
203
I love how Sony is basically exposing those companies like EA and MS who keep trying to convince us SP games do not have a big impact. What that really means is they don't have the talent or want to try and push the medium forward, far easier to follow standard trends, throw in some MP, and monetize it, takes less talent. This game is gonna sell a tonne.

Make a well crafted SP game people will buy it. Yes 6-10 hour linear Sp games are a harder sell no doubt, but Sp epics like this will always be in demand.
 
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RexNovis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,184
Good lord.....what an odd and silly way to react when you disagree with someones view point.

Nah he just wisely recognizes there is no sense trying to argue with you about how skewed your POV is on the subject. Saying that the games made by third party publishers don't take talent to make is just so asinine its clear you have no frame of reference whatsoever for context of games development or the industry at large. I get that folks are excited about the impending release of such a highly rated game but that doesn't excuse brazen ignorance or outright dismissal of other studios' hard work. Some of y'all are getting way too wrapped up in this stuff.

Word to the wise if you are going to comment on trends in the industry and the costs, profits and talents involved you would do well to educate yourself about said subjects first.
 

JesusBuiltMyHotRod

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Apr 13, 2018
203
Well, your viewpoint is a bit ridiculous, so I don't really blame him.
Ok, I disagree, being salty or agitated by that is...sad. I don;t see it as ridiculous at all. I mean imagine being like that every time something you really disagreed with made you angry, be a harsh life.

Nah he just wisely recognizes there is no sense trying to argue with you about how skewed your POV is on the subject. Saying that the games made by third party publishers don't take talent to make is just so asinine its clear you have no frame of reference whatsoever for context of games development or the industry at large. I get that folks are excited about the impending release of such a highly rated game but that doesn't excuse brazen ignorance or outright dismissal of other studios' hard work. Some of y'all are getting way too wrapped up in this stuff.

Word to the wise if you are going to comment on trends in the industry and the costs, profits and talents involved you would do well to educate yourself about said subjects first.
Then assuming is wrong...I can tell you this. Some are getting way too wrapped up and it isn;t me lol. My job requires to take in all view points, you have t really skewed.

Someone finding something "Ridiculous" does not make them right...
 

Deleted member 3017

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Ok, I disagree, being salty or agitated by that is...sad. I don;t see it as ridiculous at all. I mean imagine being like that every time something you really disagreed with made you angry, be a harsh life.

Mat is interested in reasonable discussion. Claiming essentially everyone outside of Sony lacks the talent to create great single player software is the type of thing someone with little interest in a true discussion in this area would say.