Marvel's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. S5 |OT| Six Seasons and a Seventh

mreddie said:

Good finale but yeah, I think IW kinda lessened the impact of this. After all this, it's likely for nothing and the hope spot will be for nothing. But I wonder how S6 will do things with the short run.

Spoiler

I now think everyone but Coulson, May and Daisy survive the snap.

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I mean, if it premieres after A4 for sure, they can just write around it. And that's likely what is happening, unfortunately.

I think a huge opportunity was missed here though. To allow AoS S6 to take place in a world after the events of Infinity War. Really disappoints me that it's not happening now.

ZeoVGM said:

I mean, if it premieres after A4 for sure, they can just write around it. And that's likely what is happening, unfortunately.

I think a huge opportunity was missed here though. To allow AoS S6 to take place in a world after the events of Infinity War. Really disappoints me that it's not happening now.

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Oh well, at least we avoid potential annoyances this time around.

Tathanen said:

Yeah but why didn't Coulson take the serum this time? We've been led to believe that "Coulson being saved," is what leads to the destruction of the world, presumably future Yo Yo was referring to the exchange where they had to choose between saving Coulson and killing Graviton. And in her timeline, they save him, and then he and Daisy encounter Talbot together or whatever and one way or another they lose and he blows everyone up. The fine details there aren't super important. All we know is that Yo Yo watches the world end, and thinks "if we had used the serum to kill Graviton this wouldn't have happened."

So what's the actual thing that changed? Is it really just "Coulson chose not to take it?" If so, why? We've been led to believe that this shit has been looping a few times already, right? What did Yo Yo do differently this time that she didn't do previous times? What was the chain reaction that resulted in Coulson making that choice, when he didn't up until now?

I just wish they had been more explicit about the predicating event, since "how do we break the loop" was such a fundamentally huge question all season long.

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It's the usual problem with plot like this, they have a goal in mind but they almost always fail to deliver a satisfactory or even coherent way to get there.
Also I agree with another poster earlier, I'd have liked an episode showing us the actual events happening when they failed to break the loop, there was a fucklot of things more interesting there than spending so much time on Ruby or Talbot

manchego obfuscator said:

lol. if you and other folks are free to argue that the show "had to" or would "obviously" incorporate the IW ending

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They absolutely would have if they knew they were renewed. It's very clear by the fact that they were setting it up a bit. They didn't have to mention Thanos at all.

I'm free to argue the opposite

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Of course you can argue whether or not they would have incorporated the IW ending. (They would have, as I mentioned above.) But you can't argue whether or not it's in the same universe. That's a statement of fact that isn't up for debate.

and you're free to not like my posts in return. nice backseat modding, though.

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It's not backseat modding. It's one person talking to another person. That's all you do in the thread. All you do is try to argue with people over this stuff. It's tiring.

Great episode. The swerve with thinking they were mourning Fitz but it was Coulson's retirement party was great.

Was really hoping for a end credit stinger. They have always had great ones before to get that early hype going for the next season.

Daisy should definitely be an Avenger at this point.

Now the long wait til a season 6.....

Tathanen said:

Yeah but why didn't Coulson take the serum this time? We've been led to believe that "Coulson being saved," is what leads to the destruction of the world, presumably future Yo Yo was referring to the exchange where they had to choose between saving Coulson and killing Graviton. And in her timeline, they save him, and then he and Daisy encounter Talbot together or whatever and one way or another they lose and he blows everyone up. The fine details there aren't super important. All we know is that Yo Yo watches the world end, and thinks "if we had used the serum to kill Graviton this wouldn't have happened."

So what's the actual thing that changed? Is it really just "Coulson chose not to take it?" If so, why? We've been led to believe that this shit has been looping a few times already, right? What did Yo Yo do differently this time that she didn't do previous times? What was the chain reaction that resulted in Coulson making that choice, when he didn't up until now?

I just wish they had been more explicit about the predicating event, since "how do we break the loop" was such a fundamentally huge question all season long.

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Maybe time just kept looping until YoYo could give herself the right advice. "Don't do this" "That didn't work, so don't do this" "That didn't work either, don't do this now". Maybe this was the first time that YoYo was so insistent, so that it changed Coulson's decision.

BorganXI said:

Was really hoping for a end credit stinger. They have always had great ones before to get that early hype going for the next season.

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They said they didn't want to do one because it wouldn't feel right to have something after the Tahiti scene.

Daddy Kasius was super disappointing. They talked about him like some fearsome tyrant and he's litterally just some guy.

Shahadan said:

Daddy Kasius was super disappointing. They talked about him like some fearsome tyrant and it's litterally just some guy.

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Did you expect him to the big bad for this 2nd half or something?

Tathanen said:

Yeah but why didn't Coulson take the serum this time? We've been led to believe that "Coulson being saved," is what leads to the destruction of the world, presumably future Yo Yo was referring to the exchange where they had to choose between saving Coulson and killing Graviton. And in her timeline, they save him, and then he and Daisy encounter Talbot together or whatever and one way or another they lose and he blows everyone up. The fine details there aren't super important. All we know is that Yo Yo watches the world end, and thinks "if we had used the serum to kill Graviton this wouldn't have happened."

So what's the actual thing that changed? Is it really just "Coulson chose not to take it?" If so, why? We've been led to believe that this shit has been looping a few times already, right? What did Yo Yo do differently this time that she didn't do previous times? What was the chain reaction that resulted in Coulson making that choice, when he didn't up until now?

I just wish they had been more explicit about the predicating event, since "how do we break the loop" was such a fundamentally huge question all season long.

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Daisy having the power to blast Talbot into space is what changed.

Lotus said:

Did you expect him to the big bad for this 2nd half or something?

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No I expected him to fit the description. Even the actor looked a wimp.
That said him being the big bad would have probably been more interesting than boring too-fat-for-his-ugly-costume Talbot

Shahadan said:

That said him being the big bad would have probably been more interesting than boring too-fat-for-his-ugly-costume Talbot

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Yea I doubt that.

Also, this means IW takes place in the fixed timeline.

Wondering, if in the looped timeline, the Earth gets cracked, it would have happened around the time Thanos is in Wakanda or on Titan? How the events would have played out.

BorganXI said:

Also, this means IW takes place in the fixed timeline.

Wondering, if in the looped timeline, the Earth gets cracked, it would have happened around the time Thanos is in Wakanda or on Titan? How the events would have played out.

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I'd love to see a comic book or something that shows that. Everything is happening pretty continuously in AoS so the very ending of this episode is likely just before the ending of IW.

Tathanen said:

Yeah but why didn't Coulson take the serum this time? We've been led to believe that "Coulson being saved," is what leads to the destruction of the world, presumably future Yo Yo was referring to the exchange where they had to choose between saving Coulson and killing Graviton. And in her timeline, they save him, and then he and Daisy encounter Talbot together or whatever and one way or another they lose and he blows everyone up. The fine details there aren't super important. All we know is that Yo Yo watches the world end, and thinks "if we had used the serum to kill Graviton this wouldn't have happened."

So what's the actual thing that changed? Is it really just "Coulson chose not to take it?" If so, why? We've been led to believe that this shit has been looping a few times already, right? What did Yo Yo do differently this time that she didn't do previous times? What was the chain reaction that resulted in Coulson making that choice, when he didn't up until now?

I just wish they had been more explicit about the predicating event, since "how do we break the loop" was such a fundamentally huge question all season long.

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Yoyo didn't break the loop, Coulson did. "You have to let Coulson die" didn't mean that the serum was needed to kill Graviton, it meant don't use it on Coulson. Now we (and Yoyo) are led to believe that the serum will stop Graviton but the writers were pretty smart by leaving that line open - Coulson slips the serum to Daisy and she uses it not on Graviton but herself to get him off-world. They had to let him die after all.

Now I couldn't possibly tell you why the loop broke this time. Time travel and the likes always gets weird and theoretical in plots like this. But Simmon's little speech toward the end of the episode about time being fluid instead of fixed was a big hint for me. They believed they were stuck doing the same thing over and over again, failing to save the Earth each time, but if time is fluid then that's only partially true, and maybe small things were changing here and there with each loop, just not enough to save the planet. The loop we witness is the one where all the pieces finally fall into place. Robin said she saw a future where they succeeded and Coulson was the key, and that makes sense if time is fluid and not set in stone. That's just my theory anyway.

How crappy for the SHIELD team. Save the Earth and timeloop against Graviton.

Coulson and May on the beach.

Team in space looking for Fitz.

Then.... Well you know...

BorganXI said:

How crappy for the SHIELD team. Save the Earth and timeloop agianst Graviton.

Coulson and May on the beach.

Team in space looking for Fitz.

Then.... Well you know...

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Hey man, ya never know.

Shahadan said:

No I expected him to fit the description. Even the actor looked a wimp.
That said him being the big bad would have probably been more interesting than boring too-fat-for-his-ugly-costume Talbot

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wot

wow, I tweeted some pretty angry things when I thought Fitz was dead. They actually got me

Agents of SHIELD S17: 36 Tablots on Mars

Well, I guess I can catch up on the Netflix shows during the wait for S6. Gotta watch Punisher, JJ S2, Cage S2 soon, and probably DD S3 and IF S2 before SHIELD gets back on the air.

At least we'll get some Coulson in Captain Marvel.

ZeoVGM said:

They absolutely would have if they knew they were renewed. It's very clear by the fact that they were setting it up a bit. They didn't have to mention Thanos at all.



Of course you can argue whether or not they would have incorporated the IW ending. (They would have, as I mentioned above.) But you can't argue whether or not it's in the same universe. That's a statement of fact that isn't up for debate.



It's not backseat modding. It's one person talking to another person. That's all you do in the thread. All you do is try to argue with people over this stuff. It's tiring.

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Gregg and the showrunners had said for some time that the S5 finale would be written as a potential series finale. That wasn't news.

As for the separate universes thing, you're misinterpreting my post. That's just how a couple folks here have chosen to strawman my views on the Marvel Studios/Marvel Television relationship, not something I actually literally believe.

manchego obfuscator said:

Gregg and the showrunners had said for some time that the S5 finale would be written as a potential series finale. That wasn't news.

As for the separate universes thing, you're misinterpreting my post. That's just how a couple folks here have chosen to strawman my views on the Marvel Studios/Marvel Television relationship, not something I actually literally believe.

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Of course.

Damn, my co-workers theory for Avengers 4 looks like it can't happen now...

Man tho Daisy in a crater in a big city getting liquid-metal absorbed by the big bad. I wonder how much of that was actually a purposeful Matrix finale reference.

I like Shield a lot and I'm glad it's coming back but man it's cuts some of the impact knowing nothing they do impacts the movies and vice versa, especially with something as big as IW.

I hope they can mend whatever gap exists between TV and Film because it just seems weird as events get bigger and bigger for there to be nothing more than passing references.

Watched the episode hours ago (when it aired), but it's taken me a considerable amount of time to read all the posts in this thread from today.

On mobile so I'll keep this relatively short. I was disappointed about the lack of tie-in to a certain moment from IW and I was expecting a surprise guest due to the earlier reports about Chloe filming a scene after the season ended.

But if I take those two issues out and look at this episode the same way I look at most episodes of this show, this season finale would probably be in my top 5 episodes of Shield. And even though this season wasn't near as good as season 4, it's nice to know that it's still top tier.

I remember watching this show when it originally premiered. It's amazing how for we've come.

It is an absolute crime that Quake is not included in the Infinity War movies. Damn.

thatother said:

I like Shield a lot and I'm glad it's coming back but man it's cuts some of the impact knowing nothing they do impacts the movies and vice versa, especially with something as big as IW.

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For IW sure (unfortunate about the week move up, sounds like it would have tied in if that didn't happen), but the movies/show have impacted each other directly so not entirely nothing. The Winter Soldier made the show turn into a fantastic show, and the show is the backstory behind how the Avengers assault Strucker's base at the start of Age of Ultron and how Nick Fury gets the air vehicle at the end of Age of Ultron. It's not much, but it's also more than the Netflix shows have ever done.

99% of this stuff is passable to me in general though - the Marvel movies themselves also very rarely impact one another as is, they just occasionally come together into really big events where stuff matters more.

The only thing on the show that has ever bugged me is the inhumans part of it. The event was simply too big that it's extremely weird it's never come up in any other MCU property (other than the Inhumans), and even though the event was huge in scale the world has seemed to move on with it barely being a blip. I guess the Sokovia Accords were just THAT effective at managing the Inhuman threat?? There were fish oil pills turning tons of people into Inhumans and we haven't seen/heard of what happened to all of that since. There were no new Inhumans on Earth introduced this season at all, not even just one heard on the news or casually mentioned by Hale in lockup or anything.

Just finished the episode why the fuck am I crying so much

Great episode.. Would have been a fine finale. Missed having a tie in, but I can see how it wouldn't be easily worked in. Hope season 6 gives us some links.

What a fantastic episode on all fronts.

Would have been a great sendoff, but I'm so so happy we're getting more, even if it migh lessen the impact of this episode in the long run.
If anyone from the AoS team reads Era: You guys are (and did) great.

I have a feeling Coulson's death will be permanent.

It was a good farewell for the character and I'm not sure how they would decide to bring him back besides more magic.

Is that what they meant about Coulson being alive gets resolved? That he dies again so the Avengers don't need to find out he's alive?

Cuburger said:

I have a feeling Coulson's death will be permanent.

It was a good farewell for the character and I'm not sure how they would decide to bring him back besides more magic.

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The show is coming back so it ain't permanent. I'm sure if they planned on legitimately killing Coulson, they would have just allowed the show to end.

Is that what they meant about Coulson being alive gets resolved? That he dies again so the Avengers don't need to find out he's alive?

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Nope, that's not resolution at all.

Cuburger said:

I have a feeling Coulson's death will be permanent.

It was a good farewell for the character and I'm not sure how they would decide to bring him back besides more magic.

Is that what they meant about Coulson being alive gets resolved? That he dies again so the Avengers don't need to find out he's alive?

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Wait Coulson died? Did I miss something?

CryptiK said:

Wait Coulson died? Did I miss something?

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He didn't die, but he's going to... in a few days or weeks.

Any gif of that extra in Chicago who doesn't know if his going to run or not lol

Entire budget of the season went here.

Not a bad finale

I want the Leftovers style marvel show in the year until avengers 4 and I just don't think I'm going to get it :(

Can't believe anyone actually thinks Coulson is coming back. That send-off was perfect and any attempt at bringing him back completely undermines it. I'm sure he'll pop up as a vision or hologram or something in the series finale, but otherwise he's gone.

manchego obfuscator said:

I'll try to keep this to one post: I haven't had a chance to actually watch the finale yet, but I gather I can say "I told you so."

Hopefully now everyone can acknowledge the Marvel Television/Marvel Studios relationship for what it is, and certain occasional insiders can drop their asinine strawmen.

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Do you even give a shit about the show?

Just started this episode. These dumb mother fuckers. Listen to Yo-yo. What the fuck.

Shugga said:

Coulson and May taking a break in Tahiti

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Gotem

Good finale

Great final.

A little sad there wasn't a dusting scene during the last toast, but May and the Son of Coul in Tahiti made it worth it.

Guess the next time we see him will be in or in a flashback unless they somehow resurrect him for the final season.

Safe to watch? still havent seen IW.

Strafer said:

Safe to watch? still havent seen IW.

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Yes

Nothing IW related lol. Didn't Quake say she filmed a super secret scene with somebody after the show had already stopped filming? Where was that? Just a troll to get our hopes up or something?

Agents of SHIELD S6: The Search for Fitz

I'm down for that. I actually hope Coulson is not back next season, to give this finale more meaning. It hit hard...

speaking of which, who has gifs of Quake-boosting Talbot into the dirt.

I love Coulson but I could totally see the show going on without him.

That said, again, I love him and secretly wish he'd be back for the fun.

Absolutely fan fucking tastic. Not sure how I would've felt with that being the series finale, but I was satisfied nonetheless.

JustinBB7 said:

Nothing IW related lol. Didn't Quake say she filmed a super secret scene with somebody after the show had already stopped filming? Where was that? Just a troll to get our hopes up or something?

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Nah, that must've been the scene with Candyman.

manchego obfuscator said:

I'll try to keep this to one post: I haven't had a chance to actually watch the finale yet, but I gather I can say "I told you so."

Hopefully now everyone can acknowledge the Marvel Television/Marvel Studios relationship for what it is, and certain occasional insiders can drop their asinine strawmen.

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Christ dude.