Okay, I beat DQVI again just now. I ended up job grinding after trying the boss for the first time and losing Milly and Nevan early in his final form (i.e. Kazing and Kerplunk dance). Getting Disruptive Wave on the hero was useful for getting rid of the oomph he cast in an earlier form, which was the primary contributor to losing my revivers. Lightning Storm was a bit over-powered feeling for clearing the additional monsters. I got access to other revives, but didn't really need them. Idk. I probably over-compensated. Heck, maybe I had a way to remove the oomph among my other abilities I hadn't realized. At least you don't gain many levels job-grinding, and it still was fun killing him.
In any case:
My feelings on the treatment of the characters haven't really changed since before I went to the endgame area. I wrote them out above but the biggest points are:
-I think the original Somnia arcs and the early and late Weaver's Peak events do a very good job with the main character (and his mom).
-I think Ashlynn has an intriguing premise but that it could've and should've been handled better. A vignette like at Graceskull later in the game or something for her town would've given more context and dramatic force. Especially given the end of the ending sequence, I think more should've been there. Her introduction is also particularly weak.
-I think Milly and Terry have good stories, of which the game for the most part subtly informs you, but there are loose ends surrounding things like the ocarina and the dragon (from the cover of the game), origins, and how Terry ended up in a certain place and why he ended up there in a certain way. I wanted more here. Especially with how these stories intersected with the hero's own story. It feels there should've been more of a focused vignette at a certain town, to add to the NPC story-telling. Still, it is pretty good stuff.
In general, I think VI handled more of its characters well than VII and I think that this is one of VII's core weaknesses outside of a certain character and a certain vignette. I always wanted more out of the characters that join you later, in particular. This also raises to me the question of how VI compares to VIII and to IV and V, which also are stronger than VII in this regard. I need to replay IV and V, but I played VIII again earlier this year when it came out on 3DS. I really like the hero's story and all its related parts in VIII as well as Angelo's and its related parts (I don't like the added Marcello content on the 3DS :P). I don't think Jessica or Yangus were poorly handled, but there isn't as much there, imo. I'm not sure how I'd rate them in a head to head but I think that the material surrounding the VI main character might be the strongest of these four core stories and there was a lot of potential to be more wrt Milly's and Ashlynn's. Idk.
As to scenario quality:
-VI has a very fluid structure compared to VII, which has a more concrete separation for story areas and a more focused place-by-place pacing (per its map-filling conceit). VII does have places of differing narrative sizes and VI does have focused narrative spaces, but there is generally this sort of difference. For example, you have the opening hours where you flow from town to town and don't even necessarily complete many of them at that time. And you have the more open-ended segments of the game. I made the comparison above to Metroid and Zelda, where the former has the puzzle-, combat-, traversal-problem-and-gadget gameplay strewn out irregularly throughout a labyrinthine map and the latter has this same sort of gameplay in discrete, predictable, focused 'temple' areas with a less focused and more varied overworld gameplay to complement it. Some of the irregular segments in the former resemble the 'temple' segments, like Maridia or Ridley in Super Metroid. I think this sort of difference is sort of what I'm describing between VI and VII here, only with respect to narrative rather than this gameplay type, if that is helpful.
-This does contribute to vignettes depending even more on "soft" story-telling, like that described for Milly in Felonia, for example, where the game doesn't give you the narrative, rather you construct it from what NPCs say. It also contributes to vignettes generally being very short and to the point and fairly uncomplicated. I think it is these qualities combined with a sporadic and extended in time playthrough that led the most to VI not leaving much of a mark on me the first time, but I do not think they are flaws, so much as the character of the piece. I do think VII has, over-all, a clearly better suite of tales.
-I think the game also has a really strong extended narrative in the original Somnia arc and it has various separate pieces and encompasses twin narratives in both worlds. I don't think the over-arcing narrative is as strong throughout the rest of the game, but that first part is a very nice expansion of a very DQI like story with more creative narrative techniques. I do wish there had been a similarly interesting narrative bent to the extended story. It would've made the last area and the characters introduced there more impactful, imo.
-I really like the dream world version of the dual world conceit, perhaps better than the way VII's world is locked up. I think it is used well with the invisibility segments earlier in the game and when it uses the dream world to reflect hopes and nightmares of the people in the real world. I don't think VI uses its dual worlds as consistently well as VII does, but there is plenty of interesting stuff here as I went into in the impressions in my older posts.
-I hadn't played III at the time but my first impression of VI could basically be summed up: it was a long, SFC edition of III, which just kept pushing its map beyond the point it should've calmed down and ended, and didn't do the interesting things that IV and V or Chrono Trigger did with structuring the narrative and how and when you visited the world. I think this is part of what VI is going for, namely, I think, as I said above, that it is trying to cap off both the Dragon Quest series up to its release and the Zenithia trilogy as well. I appreciated both of these things more this time, that is, I both appreciated the echoes of III's structure and came around to appreciating the interesting things VI did do with its narrative and the quality of the individual vignettes, as discussed above.
As to the gameplay:
-I think the skill and magic game pre-Alltrades is better in VI than in VII. I also think that if I had gone to the Abbey when I think it must have become available instead of when I did, then it was just about perfectly placed within the game. Also, Staff of Ghent is amazing, as always.
-Generally, I prefer DQ without the class system and with abilities just tied to character's preset class, level, and items. I don't hate the class systems, but I don't like the ability bloat and second realm of "leveling" involved overly much. Idk. I don't mean to overstate my feelings here because it isn't like I hate these systems. They just aren't my favorite tradition in DQ is all. I probably enjoyed it the most in DQIII where there wasn't as much bloat and you were creating the characters yourself.
-DQVI has a fairly high boss density up through Arkbolt, which severely tapers off after that point. On a related note, I do appreciate the tendency in DQ (generally speaking) to be a bit irregular about boss fights, e.g. have boss fights outside of dungeons or dungeons without bosses.
Overall, I really enjoyed the game this time around. I'm struggling with where I'd rank it tbh, particularly wrt VIII. VIII has a very special place in my DQ story and I think it has its virtues but my head is telling me VI is better :P. But that isn't overly important. Thanks to posters' who've encouraged my curiosity to try the game both directly and just from me reading your posts. I'm very glad I replayed it.
I want to replay IV and V before XI comes out west. But that is clearly just a month and a half away so I have no time at all :P (yes, I'm kidding and making the same dumb joke I made earlier. Still, fervent prayer!). IDK when I'll do that though. Those ones are shorter but I've got a lot of other games I want to play. I'll work them in somehow :).
In any case:
My feelings on the treatment of the characters haven't really changed since before I went to the endgame area. I wrote them out above but the biggest points are:
-I think the original Somnia arcs and the early and late Weaver's Peak events do a very good job with the main character (and his mom).
-I think Ashlynn has an intriguing premise but that it could've and should've been handled better. A vignette like at Graceskull later in the game or something for her town would've given more context and dramatic force. Especially given the end of the ending sequence, I think more should've been there. Her introduction is also particularly weak.
-I think Milly and Terry have good stories, of which the game for the most part subtly informs you, but there are loose ends surrounding things like the ocarina and the dragon (from the cover of the game), origins, and how Terry ended up in a certain place and why he ended up there in a certain way. I wanted more here. Especially with how these stories intersected with the hero's own story. It feels there should've been more of a focused vignette at a certain town, to add to the NPC story-telling. Still, it is pretty good stuff.
In general, I think VI handled more of its characters well than VII and I think that this is one of VII's core weaknesses outside of a certain character and a certain vignette. I always wanted more out of the characters that join you later, in particular. This also raises to me the question of how VI compares to VIII and to IV and V, which also are stronger than VII in this regard. I need to replay IV and V, but I played VIII again earlier this year when it came out on 3DS. I really like the hero's story and all its related parts in VIII as well as Angelo's and its related parts (I don't like the added Marcello content on the 3DS :P). I don't think Jessica or Yangus were poorly handled, but there isn't as much there, imo. I'm not sure how I'd rate them in a head to head but I think that the material surrounding the VI main character might be the strongest of these four core stories and there was a lot of potential to be more wrt Milly's and Ashlynn's. Idk.
As to scenario quality:
-VI has a very fluid structure compared to VII, which has a more concrete separation for story areas and a more focused place-by-place pacing (per its map-filling conceit). VII does have places of differing narrative sizes and VI does have focused narrative spaces, but there is generally this sort of difference. For example, you have the opening hours where you flow from town to town and don't even necessarily complete many of them at that time. And you have the more open-ended segments of the game. I made the comparison above to Metroid and Zelda, where the former has the puzzle-, combat-, traversal-problem-and-gadget gameplay strewn out irregularly throughout a labyrinthine map and the latter has this same sort of gameplay in discrete, predictable, focused 'temple' areas with a less focused and more varied overworld gameplay to complement it. Some of the irregular segments in the former resemble the 'temple' segments, like Maridia or Ridley in Super Metroid. I think this sort of difference is sort of what I'm describing between VI and VII here, only with respect to narrative rather than this gameplay type, if that is helpful.
-This does contribute to vignettes depending even more on "soft" story-telling, like that described for Milly in Felonia, for example, where the game doesn't give you the narrative, rather you construct it from what NPCs say. It also contributes to vignettes generally being very short and to the point and fairly uncomplicated. I think it is these qualities combined with a sporadic and extended in time playthrough that led the most to VI not leaving much of a mark on me the first time, but I do not think they are flaws, so much as the character of the piece. I do think VII has, over-all, a clearly better suite of tales.
-I think the game also has a really strong extended narrative in the original Somnia arc and it has various separate pieces and encompasses twin narratives in both worlds. I don't think the over-arcing narrative is as strong throughout the rest of the game, but that first part is a very nice expansion of a very DQI like story with more creative narrative techniques. I do wish there had been a similarly interesting narrative bent to the extended story. It would've made the last area and the characters introduced there more impactful, imo.
-I really like the dream world version of the dual world conceit, perhaps better than the way VII's world is locked up. I think it is used well with the invisibility segments earlier in the game and when it uses the dream world to reflect hopes and nightmares of the people in the real world. I don't think VI uses its dual worlds as consistently well as VII does, but there is plenty of interesting stuff here as I went into in the impressions in my older posts.
-I hadn't played III at the time but my first impression of VI could basically be summed up: it was a long, SFC edition of III, which just kept pushing its map beyond the point it should've calmed down and ended, and didn't do the interesting things that IV and V or Chrono Trigger did with structuring the narrative and how and when you visited the world. I think this is part of what VI is going for, namely, I think, as I said above, that it is trying to cap off both the Dragon Quest series up to its release and the Zenithia trilogy as well. I appreciated both of these things more this time, that is, I both appreciated the echoes of III's structure and came around to appreciating the interesting things VI did do with its narrative and the quality of the individual vignettes, as discussed above.
As to the gameplay:
-I think the skill and magic game pre-Alltrades is better in VI than in VII. I also think that if I had gone to the Abbey when I think it must have become available instead of when I did, then it was just about perfectly placed within the game. Also, Staff of Ghent is amazing, as always.
-Generally, I prefer DQ without the class system and with abilities just tied to character's preset class, level, and items. I don't hate the class systems, but I don't like the ability bloat and second realm of "leveling" involved overly much. Idk. I don't mean to overstate my feelings here because it isn't like I hate these systems. They just aren't my favorite tradition in DQ is all. I probably enjoyed it the most in DQIII where there wasn't as much bloat and you were creating the characters yourself.
-DQVI has a fairly high boss density up through Arkbolt, which severely tapers off after that point. On a related note, I do appreciate the tendency in DQ (generally speaking) to be a bit irregular about boss fights, e.g. have boss fights outside of dungeons or dungeons without bosses.
Overall, I really enjoyed the game this time around. I'm struggling with where I'd rank it tbh, particularly wrt VIII. VIII has a very special place in my DQ story and I think it has its virtues but my head is telling me VI is better :P. But that isn't overly important. Thanks to posters' who've encouraged my curiosity to try the game both directly and just from me reading your posts. I'm very glad I replayed it.
I want to replay IV and V before XI comes out west. But that is clearly just a month and a half away so I have no time at all :P (yes, I'm kidding and making the same dumb joke I made earlier. Still, fervent prayer!). IDK when I'll do that though. Those ones are shorter but I've got a lot of other games I want to play. I'll work them in somehow :).
