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Gaia Lanzer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,673
I don't see this changing in the US where every mention of it is immediately deemed body shaming
In the US, it's almost NEVER handled in a tactful, considerate and constructive way. I remember past threads on the other site where those who fat-shamed overweight people did so because they didn't want their hard-earned tax money going to treating the slew of medical problems fat people tend to deal with. In some ways, I see it similar to what Republicans ranting how they don't want their tax dollars paying for minority welfare mothers and bullshit like that. And given the current climate here in the US, people are as tribal as ever. I mean, it isn't wrong to believe there are a BUNCH of unapologetic assholes over here (look who we have as president). We need to humble ourselves CONSIDERABLY before we are capable of treading the balance between coddling and being callous.
 

GalacticToast

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,625
Losing weight is fucking hard and as it turns out, lots of people are lazy. As someone who used to weigh 268 pounds and dropped down to 170, I can't stand the "fat acceptance" thing. I am not saying that it should be open season on everyone or anyone just because they're body type doesn't align with the "ideals" put forward by lots of Western media. I just think it's backwards to try and suggest that being fat/overweight/obese isn't actively detrimental to your health.

I recognize that my opinion is definitely influenced by the fact that I used to be 100lbs heavier and I hated that about myself. I still struggle with my weight/body image now if I'm totally honest .
 

Carl2291

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,782
Nah. You should be scolded for being a hateful person though. Mind your own business.
There's nothing hateful about telling people the truth about health issues and giving advice on how they can (and should) improve their health.

I've been there. I took advice from an expert. I changed my lifestyle. I'm eager to see how my results compare when the NHS come back to my workplace.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,560
If someone smokes, society is okay denigrating them. Show them pictures of rotting lungs, overtax their cigarettes, ban them from restaurants, bars, etc, tell them their hobby is disgusting, tell them they smell, call them stupid for doing this in 2018 after everything we know.

Simply discussing the fact that fat people are unhealthy results in cries of intolerance.
Smoking is banned from SOME restaurants and bars, not smokers. Not to mention 2nd hand smoke literally kills people.

So do you really want to conflate those two things?
 

Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,670
I think a good solution would to show anti-junkfood ads that are similar to the anti-tabacco ads we've been seeing for decades. That way you don't shame unhealthy people while creating a stigma against eating unhealthy food.

Think about it. You don't shame someone for having lung cancer, you show people stuff that scares them away from smoking.

Imagine if this was replaced with a cheeseburger:
 

Bobson Dugnutt

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,052
Really now? If you are so worried, maybe stop shaming them since it clearly hasn't worked in the US (or anywhere else, for that matter). This is just hatred being disguised as concern and it is disgusting as fuck.

I'm ok with governments, medical professionals, health companies, charities, whoever being able to do things that are aimed at tackling what is an ever increasing public health issue spanning the globe without there being a diversion into false accusations/ a downplaying of the situation like there was in response to that advert and in this thread to this study.

Thank you for giving more credence to the study, if nothing else.
 
Oct 27, 2017
42,701
And it is. Why is it any of your business whether or not someone fulfils your criteria of being "healthy" to begin with?
Did you read anything in the OP or are you just randomly attacking people? The study literally points to some unintended side effects of this. That's what this whole thread is even about. Not to mention why are you quoting "healthy" when I didn't mention that at all?
 

Deleted member 19003

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,809
A lot of people don't realize how low the bar is for being 'overweight' and 'obese'. The photos being quoted have quite a few overweight and obese people in it. That doesn't mean that they're not attractive, but they're definitely not healthy.


bmi-chart.png
 

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
Losing weight is fucking hard and as it turns out, lots of people are lazy. As someone who used to weigh 268 pounds and dropped down to 170, I can't stand the "fat acceptance" thing. I am not saying that it should be open season on everyone or anyone just because they're body type doesn't align with the "ideals" put forward by lots of Western media. I just think it's backwards to try and suggest that being fat/overweight/obese isn't actively detrimental to your health.

I recognize that my opinion is definitely influenced by the fact that I used to be 100lbs heavier and I hated that about myself. I still struggle with my weight/body image now if I'm totally honest .
Loosing weight takes time and eating less. From a technical point of view, it is actually doing less...
 

Heisenberg726

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
1,071
lane-bryant_super-stretch-skinny.jpg


Brawny-Men-Male-Models.jpg



According to ERA, the above people are being considered obese, unhealthy and are being coddled for accepting their bodies.



Some of you posters in here are scum. What an ugly view of people you have.

Pisses me off to no end.

Most of those people look unhealthy in terms of their weight. I'm sorry that that may offend people. But if you're weight is that bad, you need help, because that can be a health problem and kill you.
 

Ukraine

Banned
Jun 1, 2018
2,182
If someone smokes, society is okay denigrating them. Show them pictures of rotting lungs, overtax their cigarettes, ban them from restaurants, bars, etc, tell them their hobby is disgusting, tell them they smell, call them stupid for doing this in 2018 after everything we know.

Simply discussing the fact that fat people are unhealthy results in cries of intolerance.
I literally haven't met a single person that was depressed because they smoked. That said I never look down on smokers. Sure it's stupid of poor people to smoke but I can see how they got there. I used to smoke and quit and I would never denigrate a smoker.
 

Deleted member 268

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,611
Probably a good idea to stop making fat people feel better about being fat and not trying to change that.

Weight loss is difficult. I don't believe there is a fat person alive that in their heart of hearts wouldn't prefer to be at a healthy weight. Telling them it's okay not to try by minimising the way we address a culture of obesity and unhealthy eating habits is not helping anyone. There are better ways to promote a healthier society in terms of exercise and diet that doesn't maliciously hurt people's feelings or stops them from wanting to make a change.
 

moeman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
864
Irrespective of anything, fat shaming or making people feel bad about their body weight is not effective and should never be used as any measurable tactic. The United States is a more sedentary society out of necessity. Changing the social determinants of health is a much more conducive argument than blaming the people who are forced to deal with a system that puts them in this position.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,293
There's nothing hateful about telling people the truth about health issues and giving advice on how they can (and should) improve their health.

I've been there. I took advice from an expert. I changed my lifestyle. I'm eager to see how my results compare when the NHS come back to my workplace.

Good for you and congratulations.

I'm not saying that all advice and information is hateful - I am specifically saying that many posters in this thread are actively disguising their incredibly transparent hatred as concern. As I've already posted several times, there are many things society can and should do in order to curb obesity. Making people depressed and suicidal is not one of them.

If you think body shaming is vicious in the US you should try some European or worse, Asian countries.

I live in Sweden and while there is some fat shaming around here as well, it's most likely less vicious than most other places, luckily. Coincidentally Sweden has pretty much no fat epidemic to speak of. How interesting.
 

Bernd Lauert

Banned
May 27, 2018
1,812
Shitty life pro tip: get really sick for 2 weeks and you will lose a lot of weight. A couple of years ago I had a really bad flu and lost almost 20 pounds because I barely ate anything.
 

siddx

Banned
Dec 25, 2017
1,807
I don't think a lot of Americans realize just how much unhealthy food is constantly around them. Every store you go into has a huge candy shelf sitting at every check out aisle regardless of what is sold in store. Fucking best buy has candy at their check outs. TJ max has this maze you have to navigate to the check out counters that is surrounded on all sides by candy and chocolate. It's in your face all the time and every summer when I visit I feel like I'm waging a war against my sweet tooth anytime I leave the house. You go to the grocery store and there are aisles and aisles of junk. The bakery section is 90% massive cakes and stacks of brownies and giant bags of cookies with all the less unhealthy less sugary options shoved into the back. They stack giant mounds of candy and junk food in front of the aisles with big for sale signs like a calorie bonfire. I don't blame people for struggling with restraint, this food is terrible for you but so delicious and it's in your fucking face all the time.
 

Zelenogorsk

Banned
Mar 1, 2018
1,567
I love the people that think that being an asshole will solve the obesity crisis. As a fat person trust me I've heard it all before. I know I'm fat, everyone that looks at me knows I'm fat, I've been called a fatass more times than I can even count, and if you think that you calling me a fatass will be the one thing to finally get me to lose weight than go ahead. Call me a fatass, call me a fat piece of shit, give me mean looks when I'm at the grocery store, if you want less fat people in the world then good job because the constant insults about my weight I've been enduring ever since I was a child have made me contemplate suicide too many times to count (with some self harm scars on my arms as a bonus).

The world never stops reminding a fat person that they are fat, and yet we still have plenty of fat people in the world. But go ahead, make sure to let every fat person know that they're disgusting fat pieces of shit, I'm sure you're gonna make a big difference in their lives.
 
Oct 27, 2017
42,701
What you think people stop being jerks after school age?
No, I think people being jerks at school doesn't necessarily correlate with people being jerks after, especially if they did it at a young age, unless being tall, having big boobs and liking ethnic foods are largely stigmatized in society nowadays. Of course some people who grow up being assholes stay assholes, don't get me wrong
 

DigitalOp

Member
Nov 16, 2017
9,292
Lol

I hope you didn't pay too much for your medical training

I payed the same as yours

no one should be demonized for behaviour that largely effects just themselves, but it's not even mostly genetics. it's partially genetics.

I agree. I was overzealous to say all. Its partial.

I'm built like the dude on the bottom right, just shorter. I am overweight, and am trying to diet because I want to be healthier. Am I scum for believing my body weight is unhealthy?

You have the right to feel however you want about your body. But people cant just dictate that youre grossly unhealthy simply because youve always been bigger. There is a scale and Im sure you're not on the dire side of it. But Im glad that youve taken action and I wish you success on your path.

This is a very wrong assumption. In fact, you even contradicted yourself in the next sentence. If it's all genetics, why change the food?!

Of course there are different body types and metabolisms and not everyone will or should look like a CW actor, but clinical obesity should not be praised as different or something positive like a personality trait when it is indeed a big health problem (and a huge public health problem). Obesity is directly linked to all major causes of death (outside of accidents/trauma). Of course we shouldn't demonize obese people and discriminate them, but okay, it is not and they should know that.
I know that this may seem unfair, specially since yes, for some people it is much harder to lose weight than to others, but it's just the way it is.

Its partial genetics. Simply being thicker isnt some immediate death sentence.

Its fucked to think people must be under some arbitrary weight to be considered healthy. There is a point where that shit becomes extremely dangerous and people who are plussize and fit are not on the same scale as someone who may have troubles moving around due to weight.
 

SugarNoodles

Member
Nov 3, 2017
8,625
Portland, OR
Anyone with a BMI > 30 is obese. It does not take much to get to that point and we've become skewed to where morbid obesity now represents obesity. I can't exactly quantify dad bods because they are a diverse body type but many of them have an obese BMI.
So basically this thread is about plus size models doing to women what male comedians have been doing to men for the last 5 decades?
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,293
I love the people that think that being an asshole will solve the obesity crisis. As a fat person trust me I've heard it all before. I know I'm fat, everyone that looks at me knows I'm fat, I've been called a fatass more times than I can even count, and if you think that you calling me a fatass will be the one thing to finally get me to lose weight than go ahead. Call me a fatass, call me a fat piece of shit, give me mean looks when I'm at the grocery store, if you want less fat people in the world then good job because the constant insults about my weight I've been enduring ever since I was a child have made me contemplate suicide too many times to count (with some self harm scars on my arms as a bonus).

The world never stops reminding a fat person that they are fat, and yet we still have plenty of fat people in the world. But go ahead, make sure to let every fat person know that they're disgusting fat pieces of shit, I'm sure you're gonna make a big difference in their lives.

Hey man, they're all just super concerned about you! /s

(Sorry to hear about your situation. Have many close friends who have struggled with similar problems.)
 

Principate

Member
Oct 31, 2017
11,186
Its both genetics, past history, and current behavior. I'm 177 at 5'4 but I don't look fat because its all muscles. I spend 6+ hours at the gym every week. There's no way I'll ever fit non-plus sizes due to have Serena William thighs and a Nicki Minaj butt. Would you prefer I go naked because I can't fit a size six?
I don't think when they was referring to that when talking about it not being genetics, especially not larger bottom sizes due to muscles. That's just the age old BMI problem, there's nothing health wise wrong with having large muscular legs. Thei contention that it's not all genetics is having thighs with high body fat percentage. That's not genetics. You may be predisposed to having it but that fat is not going to appear from nowhere. That fat comes from eating and exercise habits. How it's distributed is genetics. The fact it's there generally is not.

Yes some people have higher metabolisms than others but that's not the defining difference between being overweight and slim.
 

Prophaniti

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,028
Not everyone can afford healthy food and sometimes kids have to eat junk. The solution is making healthy foods cheaper.
I don't want to generalize. All I know is from my personal experience working at a grocery store in multiple states.

Everyday people would come in with government money and spend it on junk. Money specifically for healthy foods. Not once did someone plop a carrot down for purchase. Scraping change out of pockets and upturning purses for a few cents more so they can get a 36 pack of coke. Using EBT to buy potato chips.

I absolutely believe that a great number of people can't afford healthy food and so they buy what they can to survive. However just based on what I've seen I don't believe that's anywhere near the amount of people who just make shitty decisions about food.
 

Deleted member 6230

User-requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,118
Irrespective of anything, fat shaming or making people feel bad about their body weight is not effective and should never be used as any measurable tactic. The United States is a more sedentary society out of necessity. Changing the social determinants of health is a much more conducive argument than blaming the people who are forced to deal with a system that puts them in this position.
Agreed.
 

DigitalOp

Member
Nov 16, 2017
9,292
Its both genetics, past history, and current behavior. I'm 177 at 5'4 but I don't look fat because its all muscles. I spend 6+ hours at the gym every week. There's no way I'll ever fit non-plus sizes due to have Serena William thighs and a Nicki Minaj butt. Would you prefer I go naked because I can't fit a size six?

Its not even worth it. We have clearly found that if you dont fit these posters standards of skinny and healthy, you're doomed to heart attacks and strokes.

Really garbage mindsets and myopic world views
 

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
Irrespective of anything, fat shaming or making people feel bad about their body weight is not effective and should never be used as any measurable tactic. The United States is a more sedentary society out of necessity. Changing the social determinants of health is a much more conducive argument than blaming the people who are forced to deal with a system that puts them in this position.
The fact that the USA is more sedentary does not determine the quantity we eat.
 
Oct 27, 2017
42,701
Its both genetics, past history, and current behavior. I'm 177 at 5'4 but I don't look fat because its all muscles. I spend 6+ hours at the gym every week. There's no way I'll ever fit non-plus sizes due to have Serena William thighs and a Nicki Minaj butt. Would you prefer I go naked because I can't fit a size six?

How people come in here and think mentioning they're super muscular and workout hours a week somehow applies to more than a small percentage of people is beyond me. Like, how could you possibly think your, fairly unique situation, is generalizable? Or even close to the average? Like were you just trying to brag or did you think this study was talking about people like you?
 

Doc Kelso

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,166
NYC
A lot of people don't realize how low the bar is for being 'overweight' and 'obese'. The photos being quoted have quite a few overweight and obese people in it. That doesn't mean that they're not attractive, but they're definitely not healthy.


bmi-chart.png
I just want to comment on how incredibly difficult this chart is to read. I think I'm between 24 and 26 on the 5'6" scale?

I don't want to generalize. All I know is from my personal experience working at a grocery store in multiple states.

Everyday people would come in with government money and spend it on junk. Money specifically for healthy foods. Not once did someone plop a carrot down for purchase. Scraping change out of pockets and upturning purses for a few cents more so they can get a 36 pack of coke. Using EBT to buy potato chips.

I absolutely believe that a great number of people can't afford healthy food and so they buy what they can to survive. However just based on what I've seen I don't believe that's anywhere near the amount of people who just make shitty decisions about food.
Wrt to this: Most people don't actually understand nutrition in the slightest, or simply don't care about it. We're also taught that healthy stuff is bland unless you spend $5 on that little bottle of juice.
 

TheWickedSoul

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,156
Everyone here should spare us fat people your fake empathy for us. We already know we are unattractive and unhealthy.
 

Bucca

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,242
You can lose weight eating garbage and sitting on the couch all day. It's all about counting calories.

It's easier to lose weight eating healthy, but it's not impossible. It just takes some self control.

Just because you lose weight from counting calories doesn't mean that the makeup of what you eat isn't important.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,053
The number one reason fat people stay fat isn't over eating, it's the denial that they are over eating. Portion control is out of this world bad in America. Guzzling 80 ounces of soda every day? You do that because you are in denial about what it does to you.

Once you get past the denial stage and accept it is when it gets really, really dangerous health wise because if you decide you're okay with it, you're essentially serving yourself an early death sentence. People need to start taking their weight much more seriously or they are going to be in for a very rude awakening in their 30s and 40s.

Genetics has a play in everything but way way way too many people use it as an excuse when it's not true in their situation. The rest of your family isn't fat because of genetics, they're fat because they are generally unhealthy like you. Learned behaviors.
 

Kthulhu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,670
I don't want to generalize. All I know is from my personal experience working at a grocery store in multiple states.

Everyday people would come in with government money and spend it on junk. Money specifically for healthy foods. Not once did someone plop a carrot down for purchase. Scraping change out of pockets and upturning purses for a few cents more so they can get a 36 pack of coke. Using EBT to buy potato chips.

I absolutely believe that a great number of people can't afford healthy food and so they buy what they can to survive. However just based on what I've seen I don't believe that's anywhere near the amount of people who just make shitty decisions about food.

I mean there's also depressed people, people with eating disorders, people who live in food deserts, sugar addicts, and people who just don't have time to cook a healthy meal.

Not everyone eats unhealthy by choice, though many do.
 

Paquete_PT

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
5,335
I mean, really this is it. I'm fat, very fat in fact. Finding a doctor who isn't constantly trying to bully me into things I do not want (e.g., bariatric surgery) or lecturing about my weight when I go in to ask about a sinus infection like it has any relation at all is unbelievably frustrating. And it makes me not want to go to the doctor. I have several chronic illnesses; some are related to weight, others are not. And getting treated like a piece of shit every time I go see a doctor is awful.

I'm sorry that you ever felt that way leaving the house and you should definitely be able to use whatever the hell you want and makes you happy. We shouldn't focus so much about stuff other people do that doesn't have any impact whatsoever in our life.

Regarding that first paragraph and I don't mean to disrespect you, but as someone from the medical field I believe that every doctor that sees an obese person, no matter the problem, should indeed warn them of the risks of obesity and guide them towards weight lost and an healthier life-style. Now, it all comes down to how you approach the subject. If you feel "bullied", then they're doing it wrong and should be ashamed of themselves. No one should feel bullied or disrespected in an hospital setting.
You can be obese and have a normal blood pressure and all blood tests...for now...(I'm assuming that you're a young adult), but it will indeed come back to do you harm in the future. Doctors are dealing with the results of the obesity pandemic, I doubt that they have any other interest in mind that isn't your health and your best interest (and theirs, because prevention is the best medicine, and they want to help you before both of you have to deal with the consequences). In limit situations bariatric surgery is indeed a way that works out great for a lot of people (others not so much, it comes down to many variables).

The good thing is that it is never too late to try to make a difference and every kg counts in decreasing those mid to late-life risks (I can only imagine that being from an obese family makes it much harder, because you have to go against your family's "culture" and lifestyle)

Recently a family member lost his dad to heart attack at the age of 50. His dad ate a lot and in a badly fashion and was clearly overweight. My family member was never obese, but he was chubby, and tried to lose wait for years with no success. After his father's dad he started running (training by himself and then social runs/marathons) and he's now in the best shape of his life and in much better shape than I am.

Again, this is maybe not the place and I don't want to seem like I am criticizing you. You should never feel the way you described it, specially at the doctor's office and I wish you the best of luck if you indeed try to lose weight ;)
 

subpar spatula

Refuses to Wash his Ass
Member
Oct 26, 2017
22,159
Its not even worth it. We have clearly found that if you dont fit these posters standards of skinny and healthy, you're doomed to heart attacks and strokes.

Really garbage mindsets and myopic world views
It's just known the bigger you are the higher the risk. People should be aware of that and take steps to make themselves healthier. You're putting up an image no one who projecting.

You posted images of women and men who were clearly overweight and thought people were scum for thinking they are. It's quite obvious you're attacking a position very little people in this thread are holding and making it out that any criticism of overweight is of that position.
 

moeman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
864
So basically this thread is about plus size models doing to women what male comedians have been doing to men for the last 5 decades?


I don't even know what this means, but I'm not trying to vilify anyone in any way. I just made an off-handed remark about how heavy set men are also found attractive. Just be healthy and active. Body weight is thrown out of proportion and given too much importance. A heavier person who exercises and eats healthy will be in much better condition than a thin person who eats like junk. Weight in itself doesn't promote disease. It's the habits we form which do.
 

Spehornoob

Member
Nov 15, 2017
8,948
Got a kick in the ass in September of last year when I went to the doctor and weighed in at 300 lbs. Since then I'm down into the 240s, still a ways to go but I already feel far better than I did.

I don't think some thickness is inherently unattractive, and I don't hate fat people. Hell I still am a fat people. But the whole "health at any size" thing is a mistake. There are realities to being bigger and you have to be able to face those realities if you've made the choice to live that way.

With that said, just being a judgemental prick to fat people is shitty, too.