Gonna be honest, it really rubs me in the wrong way that in addition to massively voting for this wannabe dictator, Dutch Turks also vote for this pro-erdogan party here.
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Turkish General And Presidental Elections, 24th of June |OT| Once More Unto The Breach
- Thread starter Mórríoghain
- Start date
Yeah. I do hope people get out if possible before the possible collapse happens. Also, technically what I mentioned was not a collpase but a severe economic downturn were I lived that led to the governing party there to be kicked out of office in 2015.As this election has shown Erdogan is not invincible and he can be beaten. I expect the next election will be worse for him unless he magically fixes the economy and makes people living standards better. I highly doubt he and the AKP party will be in power for 40 years because he's going to have to step down eventually and the AKP is going to accumulate a ton of baggage in the next 5-10 years.
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Erdogan has been rescinding democratic processes for years, did you not see what he did with the judiciary? It's not independent any more (there's so many other things too) and this general election was called in so that he could gain even more power, and this is all for building a stronger theocracy and very hostile conservatism, with the backbone of a dictatorship, there is no democracy here.
I am at least not aware that he has attacked education in a way that Erdogan did and considering the treatment by western states I am glad he appears to be quite calm / level headed in terms of outside violence. That being said, being preferrable over Erdogan (which I think Putin is) is not exactly a high bar to pass. Not at all.
No, it is not a joke. I would expect Erdogan in Putin's position (over a country like Russia) to exert more physical violence and to be a higher risk for war when compared to Putin.
In no country should a president be in power for more than 2 terms. I always prefer there to be a new individual elected. A law like this can prevent dictatorships. Trump will try to do the same as Erdogan
User Warned: Inflammatory Generalizations + Community Whining
It is funny how detached from reality ResetEra and Neogaf are/were
Few past claims
Trump won't ever win
Brexit will never happen
Italy
Turkey
The list probably goes on and on, this is of coursed caused by a dogging of anyone with different views until they get banned, but whatever ResetEra thinks will happen, the opposite does!
Few past claims
Trump won't ever win
Brexit will never happen
Italy
Turkey
The list probably goes on and on, this is of coursed caused by a dogging of anyone with different views until they get banned, but whatever ResetEra thinks will happen, the opposite does!
Then it's really just sad. Calling things like the war in Ukraine and the brutal attacks in Syria "level headed" is just sad.
If a person and his party comes into enough power, term limits do nothing, consider Erdogan and Turkey's existing term limits.
Very, very few people on here(bar a few optimists) expected Erdogan to lose lol.
Level headed in terms of not causing WW3, yes. Level headed in the sense of furthering the own interests at all other people's cost without risking a full-on war on a global scale, yes. Level headed in the sense of acting peaceful, no, certainly not.
In Canada people can lead a province or a country as long as they want. Were I live in Canada some now defunct socially conservative party had one of their leaders leading a province for over 25 years. He left office a few years before his party got kicked out of office by a centre right leaning party who went on to govern that province for like 43 years.
Same.
I still believe in democracy tho. My favourite club in Turkey finally got rid of the wannabe dictator chairman after 20 years.
my dude Erdoğan didn't authorize LGBT purges
that is not what level headed means
Italy what? Most people expected the electoral results. Do a bit of research before tying things to some grand narrative that shows your dumb ass
Wasn't the opposition front runner extremely xenophobic and anti-refugee, willing to send back 4 million Syrian refugees back to Syria to die? You can fault Erdogan for a lot, but his stance on refugees is to be praised.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...l-both-vow-to-send-syrians-home-idUSKBN1JI175
Basically, both want the refugees to be sent back but one wants them to be sent back to Assad, someone who they're escaping from.
on point!
It's sad to see that the "turks" in Germany are voting for this idiots in masses. They don't have to live with him.
Just saying, every single opposition proponent in Turkey had the highest hopes for this election out of all in the last decade.
This community wasn't so detached from reality, rather, it was quite in touch with the realistic expectation in this election.
Even Trump and Russia both thought Clinton would win. Seek help, bro.
I have no idea about Putin's or Erdogan's position on LGBT issues (I'd assume Erdogan, as a leader of an Islamist party, not to be in favour of it thogh and I heard that the situation for LGBT people in Russia is not nice), but I do know this of Erdogan:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...stop-schools-curriculum-erdogan-a7955596.html
(Erdogan drops theory of evolution from school curricula because it is "too complex") which accompanies the de-secularisation of state and education in general. It's hard to beat for me, personally.
What does level headed mean to you? I used it to mean rational and non-impulsive, without any valuation of ethics.
Are you actually going to say something meaningful or are you okay with Ince's stance on Syrian refugees and his views on establishing ties with Assad? Erdogan may be corrupt, nepotistic, backwards, whatever but Ince is a giant xenophobic racist.
It's funny that if Ince was running in Europe, he'd probably be leading a far right nationalistic party like the AfD in Germany or UKIP in the UK. It's unfortunate that Erdogan is corrupt and running Turkey's economy into the ground that is causing people to overlook such glaring negatives if not outright scapegoating refugees.
https://twitter.com/DanaNawzar/status/1007941415329042433
Not surprising, Turkish nationalism is extremely toxic and Erdogan supporters are moreso, his party has persecuted academics and lynched soldiers and yet they're the most popular.
Well enjoy your descent into darkness Turkey, you the US, UK and Italy to keep you company.
Yeah so Erdogan wants to send Syrian refugees to settle inside the Kurdish territories he conquered with his AlQuaeda proxies so he can have his demographic displacement he covets so much and get rid of the Kurdish problem on his border once and for all.
We've seen his Jihadi militias in Afrin.
Well enjoy your descent into darkness Turkey, you the US, UK and Italy to keep you company.
Yeah so Erdogan wants to send Syrian refugees to settle inside the Kurdish territories he conquered with his AlQuaeda proxies so he can have his demographic displacement he covets so much and get rid of the Kurdish problem on his border once and for all.
We've seen his Jihadi militias in Afrin.
Yeah, Turkey is totally a beacon for LGBT rights, or human rights in general.
That's correct, but you yourself said you used the term in this way:
This simply isn't what level headedness is. If you interpret "furthering the own interests at all other people's cost without risking a full-on war on a global scale" as a rational move, you should've made that clear imo
I meant that painting Putin as benign compared to Erdoğan is an outlandish proposition. We don't need to contest their shitheadness.
You must've missed the part where Erdoğan literally threatened the EU with allowing refugees passage through its borders unless they gave Turkish citizens visa exemptions.
They're regarded here as a bartering chip at best and a national issue at worst (there's a lot of stigma going around related to how Syrian refugees have an easier time getting into Turkish universities and finding work or something), and Erdoğan's stance is no different.
Don't fool yourself.
I'd say it is rational from an egoistic perspective - which is an assumed perspective for a dictator. It is rational because it is the best (read: most efficient) way of increasing his power without putting his position seriously at risk (by causing a war that could lessen his standing in his country in the mid-term and may even cost him his life).
The original posting I replied to was saying Turkey was heading to Russia's misery, in this context I feel it is adequate to compare the leaders. I would definitely prefer living under Putin over Erdogan, which is not to mean I'd want to live under Putin.
Shameful votes for european turks again.
Belgium : 74.9%
Netherlands : 73%
Germany : 64.8%
France : 63.7%
Heard all the honks next to my neighbourhood last night. They do my head in.
Belgium : 74.9%
Netherlands : 73%
Germany : 64.8%
France : 63.7%
Heard all the honks next to my neighbourhood last night. They do my head in.
I see this everywhere.
So you guys are cool with Turks, as long as they are not religious. You are cool with Turkey as long as the country abandons their Islamic religion.
No fucking wonder people voted for Erdogan.
You know there's a middle ground between supporting Erdogan and abandoning your religion, right ?
If you look at Erdoğan and see something other than an Islamist despot, you understand nothing.
E: And I think you missed the part where I AM A FUCKING TURK WHO'S LIVED UNDER ERDOĞAN'S RULE FOR ALL BUT THREE YEARS OF MY LIFE
They sure showed us with Erdogan. They mostly screwed their own country over.
No. We're cool with Turks as long as they don't support a dictator who hates everything we believe in. These Erdogan voters live in a free, democratic country yet have no issue supporting a dictator who's hostile to the very country they live in. Fuck 'em.
Erdogan's stance on refugees is to be praised statement is laughable if you actually care about them.
Erdogan is a clever man, he knows very well how powerful tool refugees are. Every time he is under pressure or in bad spot, he threatens he'll drop the EU deal and unleash them to the Aegean sea.
You're ill-informed, I am afraid.
One of Russia's last universities with pro-European faculty got its license revoked just a few days ago.
Putin and his clique had destroyed most institutions in society that don't further his reactionary agenda and co-opted others. Adopting a facade of 'reason' on the international stage, in a stark contrast to Erdogan, doesn't make him any less dangerous.
My condolences to the Turkish people. I would advise not to expect your fellow citizens to turn on him as the economical situation sours and international pressure intensifies. God knows, they will double down. Resistance at every turn is the only way.