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badcrumble

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,734
I'm in Sunnyside, right in her district, and some of the salt in here from a few people who find it more important for the left to be harshly disciplined by the center than for political progress to happen is pretty funny.

Like, at least admit that you're hostile on specific policy items and stop deflecting with the 'electability' argument when these people are clearly winning elections.
 

Terraj_RSL

Member
Feb 8, 2018
866
"Did-Hard progressive"

"Called for dismantling ICE"

I like the sound of that
I love her entire platform:
dgqwsjswaau7nio97smk.jpeg
 

Deleted member 14459

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,874
A couple of things stand out in this thread, which mirrors society at large:

1. AOC's intersectionality focus in surgically separated from her socialist ideology, she is denied the latter for various reasons - all of them mimicking a historical tendency to deny or digtate POC women and other minorities their identities - wholly or partially. Those most eager to perform this separation are the self-described pragmatic progressives.

2. Her ideology, socialism, is equated with Bernie and thus rejected by those pushing the issues on the social platform w/o the economic platform, as if the latter is an ideology earmarked and owned by Bernie Sanders representing priviliged white (old) males. One might ask who 'owns' the proposed pragmatic of alternative financialized capitalist orthodoxy building on accumulation of disposession? Do people actually know what ideology MLK and Malcom X espoused?

3. POCs role is to be 'radical' on social issues but are not to step over the line in regards of economic ideology, instead tiptoing conservative 'pragmatic' ideals celebrating a more 'meritocratic' system of accumulation by disposession. This progressive pragmatic ideal sediments the line that radical economic ideas are politically only viable in the hands of old white males like Bernie. We 'let' him do it because he is white and old - but a black socialist, fuck no we ain't ready for that - or something. By this thinking we diminish the horizon of political imagination and again redtape POC's right to their ideological identities.

4. AOC should be an ideal candidate for the democratic party - but instead it backed Crowley, a guy who is the embodyment of crony capitalism and politics. If NYC 14 is such a safe blue space then why keep propping up this guy instead of standing up for someone who is clearly energizing the base and lifts up the three things that should matter for dems, class, race and gender? Because Crowley stands for what is the de facto ideological pillar of the democratic party today, corporate donors.

5. AOCs platform is populism but whatever the current bullshit jargong of centrist meritocratic down-tricklers is not.

What I have not learned from this thread:

1. AOC is not a product of Bernie but she is, in her own words, a product of Brand New Congress - look up their work and the candidates tied to them: http://brandnewcongress.org/ , they're great but they need your legwork.

2. Democratic socialists actually run great corporate ventures, such as Means of Production, the company behind AOCs media campaign, they works exclusively for the working class. They're great, check them out: https://means.media/
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
She's almost too good to be true.

Her looks and age will be a ridiculous distraction for a media that literally can't help itself.
 

Tracygill

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
1,853
The Left
Calling Ocasio-Cortez a socialist or communist when she's a centre-left social democrat really shows how far to the right the U.S. is compared to the rest of the world. She doesn't even call for social ownership of the means of production. But still it's a good step in the right direction.
 

Deleted member 1041

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,725
The problem with small campaigns is that they don't have the luxury to really turn away anyone who shows up at the door offering help but it would be a shame if they didn't at least renounce this clown.



well this is fucking problematic.

If it gets out that she employs this person, in conjunction with her views of Israel/Palestine, they could probably paint her as an 'anti-semite socialist'.
 

Deleted member 14459

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,874
Calling Ocasio-Cortez a socialist or communist when she's a centre-left social democrat really shows how far to the right the U.S. is compared to the rest of the world. She doesn't even call for social ownership of the means of production. But still it's a good step in the right direction.

She is a member of DSA, an organization that actually calls for the abolishment of capitalism as end goal and call for democratization of private business
 

Deleted member 22490

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
9,237
Calling Ocasio-Cortez a socialist or communist when she's a centre-left social democrat really shows how far to the right the U.S. is compared to the rest of the world. She doesn't even call for social ownership of the means of production. But still it's a good step in the right direction.
She is quite literally a socialist in the getting rid of capitalism sense
 

badcrumble

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,734
Guilt by association is enough in the public eye. She'd do well to denounce publicly his views and that he is not representative of the campaign she ran or will continue to run in November.
If it turns into a real issue, sure. I think she's better off not interrupting her messaging unless and until that becomes the case, though. Preemptively concern trolling yourself over the views of unpaid volunteers is a good recipe for strategic paralysis.
 

Jersey_Tom

Banned
Dec 2, 2017
4,764


rPNCqww.jpg


If it turns into a real issue, sure. I think she's better off not interrupting her messaging unless and until that becomes the case, though. Preemptively concern trolling yourself over the views of unpaid volunteers is a good recipe for strategic paralysis.

Doesn't hurt to do so when the guy was prominently shown around her celebrating. Best to nip that particular issue in the bud, especially given he's apparently known for crashing political events to inject himself into the conversation. It's a layup for her.
 

badcrumble

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,734
Doesn't hurt to do so when the guy was prominently shown around her celebrating. Best to nip that particular issue in the bud, especially given he's apparently known for crashing political events to inject himself into the conversation. It's a layup for her.
Nicely done - I think it's important not to give ground to the narrative that it's a big deal that this guy volunteered for her, and she denounced him without giving any credence to the assumption that it was a moral stain on her campaign to have him photobomb their events a few times.
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
Knowing when to just abandon/disavow trash people like that is a very good show of her political instincts.
 
Nov 14, 2017
2,335
Knowing when to just abandon/disavow trash people like that is a very good show of her political instincts.
It's not exactly hard to do when the person in question is an opportunistic volunteer that you have no real connection to, even Trump has done it. Although this case is even easier because Ocasio-Cortez is renouncing an actual unpaid volunteer, not a campaign figure embroiled in a criminal conspiracy.
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
It's not exactly hard to do when the person in question is an opportunistic volunteer that you have no real connection to, even Trump has done it. Although this case is even easier because Ocasio-Cortez is renouncing an actual unpaid volunteer, not a campaign figure embroiled in a criminal conspiracy.
You would be surprised just how badly other politicians have handled similar situations.
 

sphagnum

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,058
A couple of things stand out in this thread, which mirrors society at large:

1. AOC's intersectionality focus in surgically separated from her socialist ideology, she is denied the latter for various reasons - all of them mimicking a historical tendency to deny or digtate POC women and other minorities their identities - wholly or partially. Those most eager to perform this separation are the self-described pragmatic progressives.

2. Her ideology, socialism, is equated with Bernie and thus rejected by those pushing the issues on the social platform w/o the economic platform, as if the latter is an ideology earmarked and owned by Bernie Sanders representing priviliged white (old) males. One might ask who 'owns' the proposed pragmatic of alternative financialized capitalist orthodoxy building on accumulation of disposession? Do people actually know what ideology MLK and Malcom X espoused?

3. POCs role is to be 'radical' on social issues but are not to step over the line in regards of economic ideology, instead tiptoing conservative 'pragmatic' ideals celebrating a more 'meritocratic' system of accumulation by disposession. This progressive pragmatic ideal sediments the line that radical economic ideas are politically only viable in the hands of old white males like Bernie. We 'let' him do it because he is white and old - but a black socialist, fuck no we ain't ready for that - or something. By this thinking we diminish the horizon of political imagination and again redtape POC's right to their ideological identities.

4. AOC should be an ideal candidate for the democratic party - but instead it backed Crowley, a guy who is the embodyment of crony capitalism and politics. If NYC 14 is such a safe blue space then why keep propping up this guy instead of standing up for someone who is clearly energizing the base and lifts up the three things that should matter for dems, class, race and gender? Because Crowley stands for what is the de facto ideological pillar of the democratic party today, corporate donors.

5. AOCs platform is populism but whatever the current bullshit jargong of centrist meritocratic down-tricklers is not.

What I have not learned from this thread:

1. AOC is not a product of Bernie but she is, in her own words, a product of Brand New Congress - look up their work and the candidates tied to them: http://brandnewcongress.org/ , they're great but they need your legwork.

2. Democratic socialists actually run great corporate ventures, such as Means of Production, the company behind AOCs media campaign, they works exclusively for the working class. They're great, check them out: https://means.media/

This is a fantastic post.
 

Arkeband

Banned
Nov 8, 2017
7,663
Colbert announced Ocasio-Cortez will be on his show tomorrow. Pretty swift get, he really pounced on that.
 

thefit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,243
LMAO



Edit: good to know she denounced that's shit head. Had no doubt she would lol.


It's bad as Trumpism? So it's the hard left of their hard right? I'm trying to figure out how that's a bad thing and coming up empty.

Hear me out. The right wing is going to go hard on the New Democrats that come in swinging from a hard left like Cortez especially the pundits who while denouncing Trumpism will never accept the polar apposite version on the left because although they hate the nationalist idiocy of Trump they are deadly afraid of a democratic version of it because it would actually work and get things done by decree like Trump. They want the same old guard back and milk toast Democrats to win because they know they would have a familiar punching bag back in power to neuter with obstruction and rules and decor the very things they have given up. They know that by not standing up to Trump breaking rules and norms and they themselves helping they have opened up Pandora's box to a new generation of democrats that are not coming to Washington to reach across the ile and shake hands.
 

Icolin

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,235
Midgar


dude pulling the "this is the future liberals want" thing and...well yeah this future sounds pretty rad fym sean lmao
 

SolidSnakex

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,421
yup

if Trump wins again, I feel it'll be because of that, because he's constantly out there rallying. It's disgusting. Constant 24/7 thinking about him.

I guess it's notable that other networks aren't covering him anymore. In a previous rally Fox News actually had a banner stating that they were covering it while other networks weren't. I know MSNBC didn't cover the rally today. So to some degree it seems like the networks are finally learning. Stop giving him free press with all these bullshit rallies.
 
Nov 4, 2017
2,203
I guess it's notable that other networks aren't covering him anymore. In a previous rally Fox News actually had a banner stating that they were covering it while other networks weren't. I know MSNBC didn't cover the rally today. So to some degree it seems like the networks are finally learning. Stop giving him free press with all these bullshit rallies.
I wouldn't hold my breath. They're going to follow the ratings and the money. They're part of the problem. Once the election season picks up, I'm sure they'll be back.