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Canada PoliERA |OT| Two Years of Sunny Days? That’s Scheer Madness!

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Sean C.

Sean C.

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Oct 27, 2017
7,738
Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island
killerrin said:
We can even break it down ever further. Keep in mind, the Election is next year.

His entire term, Justin Trudeau spent a lot, no a ton of political capital fighting BC on the Pipeline issue. He can't count on those votes come Election Time. Those votes come from the progressive camp meaning they'll split back to their root parties and give the NDP/Conservative and a small Liberal faction the win.
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The pipeline issue is absolutely going to hurt the Liberals in BC to some extent, but any pipeline protest vote would go to the NDP, the party that is militantly anti-pipeline. The result of that would be more New Democratic MPs, which doesn't elect the Conservatives, it just means Trudeau would have to cut a deal with Singh.

Next, Justin Trudeau is fighting Saskatchewan on the Carbon Tax bill, not that they really vote Liberal to begin with, but since its a tax that increases costs to consumers, he will have lost votes. Next, he will also soon be fighting Ontario as early as next week. When Ontario kills its cap and trade program, The liberals will have to swoop in in order to keep their promise of fighting Climate Change and prevent his seats out west from being 100% decimated. This change from Cap and Trade to Carbon Tax will increase the load Ontario will have to pay, and increase Hydro Costs even further because the Carbon Tax is higher than the Cap and Trade Bill. Doug Ford and Andrew Scheer are going to absolutely nail him on that and the Ontario Electorate is going to respond in kind by not voting Liberal.

In Quebec, with the collapse of the Bloc, the Conservatives are really hitting up Rural Quebec and former Bloc Strongholds and positioning themselves as the successor of the Bloc as a party. They will succeed at this.

In Alberta, it was a miracle they got the seats they did. But they aren't safe seats. If the wind blows the wrong way, they will be gone just as fast as they were earned. In general though, Alberta is not a safe haven for them and never will be in the near-immediate future

That is the outlook in four of the most important regions in Canadian Elections.
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The Liberals have a grand total of three seats in Alberta and Saskatchewan right now. They could lose them all and it wouldn't meaningfully affect their numbers.

The Conservatives are definitely going to gain in Quebec, though I think the Liberals will too (in the aggregate). You're likely to see them carving up the NDP and Bloc's seats.

What happens with the Ford government is a big question mark, but you could as easily say that the Ford government will turn into a giant gong show that makes the federal Liberals lookg good by comparison.

Pedrito said:
The GOP did exactly that and politically, Canada is usually a few years behind, so yeah, it's probably coming. Though I've been surprised by their vocal support for supply management. But I suspect it's because they expect Trudeau to make a few concessions on that front in the NAFTA negociations and they want to use it against him in 2019, especially in Quebec.
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Scheer owes his leadership win to the Quebec dairy vote, so he's not going to abandon them.
 
Tiktaalik

Tiktaalik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,428
Given that the NDP is probably dead in Quebec they should burn it all down and become the CHEAP FUCKING CHEESE party, advocating no cheese tariffs.
 

Deleted member 12950

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SRG01 said:
Did the Harper story fall off a cliff? I'm not hearing anything about it anymore...
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It was a nothing story.

Chretien met with Putin without informing the government after Russia annexed the Crimea and the narrative then wasn't that the Harper government was "blindsided", you just had Kenney saying it was "curious" and they hope the Chretien had the same (impotent) message about getting out of Ukraine as the government did.
 
Mr.Mike

Mr.Mike

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Oct 25, 2017
1,677
In happier news, this is the logo for Quebec's weed stores:

sqdc-logo.png


It's uh, something. Still better than Ontario's though.

logo-1.png
 

Pedrito

Member
Nov 4, 2017
2,369
Mr.Mike said:
In happier news, this is the logo for Quebec's weed stores:

sqdc-logo.png


It's uh, something. Still better than Ontario's though.

logo-1.png
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Should be SQC. The "du" doesn't deserve a letter. It's the not the SADQ afterall. Is it really too much to ask for a little consistency? We can only hope the CAQ will undo this travesty.
 
Gabbo

Gabbo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,567
Caz said:
Thought this was an interesting read on the Trudeau groping allegations...even if the title could have been chosen more wisely: https://nationalpost.com/news/polit...-against-justin-trudeau-is-not-a-metoo-moment

That is the most boring logo i've seen in a while.
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Assuming Ford sticks with the LCBO model (and when the money roles in he'll shut his fat yap about corner stores), it was likely the government's intention of downplaying the sale of weed.
 
djkimothy

djkimothy

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Oct 27, 2017
5,456
Ontario's cannabis marketing could change though i doubt it. Ford still hasn't taken an official position. Last i checked.
 
Unknown Unknown

Unknown Unknown

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Oct 31, 2017
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Trudeau has been a very good leader and getting more skilled as he gets experience. He's been a positive representative of the Liberal party and Canada. However, he is not the Liberal party or Canada; Trudeau is simply a Canadian among Canadians.
He's worked well with all political parties and has done and continues to do a good job balancing and advancing various business, environmental, educational, security and social interests. He's been open to the press and the citizens of the nation with town hall meetings. Internationally he's recognizable as trustworthy and viewed favourably by many government officials and citizens of other countries. He's advanced the representation, importance and voice of scientists.
The issues addressed under his leadership have been generally carefully considered and reviewed and not rushed for expedient political gain. Often he's taken a route on policies that may be difficult in the short term that have a longer term vision. He's organized a great team of national advisors and international ambassadors from all political parties.
He's done a lot to try to get the government to address various problems that don't get a lot of attention. This hasn't always succeeded yet it has shone light on where there are problems hampering the process.
Overall, if Canadians consider their vote honestly and with a clear head over a wide range of topics and not become emotionally entrenched in single issue voting or by Conservative and foreign dishonesty there is a good chance to Trudeau will get re-elected.
 
Vamphuntr

Vamphuntr

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Oct 25, 2017
3,301
Pedrito said:
Should be SQC. The "du" doesn't deserve a letter. It's the not the SADQ afterall. Is it really too much to ask for a little consistency? We can only hope the CAQ will undo this travesty.
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If CAQ is really the party of "smart management" like they keep saying they shouldn't spend a single cent on something pointless like this imo. In QC it seems the government really didn't want to get into the Cannabis selling business. They kind of have too now since Canada has legalized it and since the province controls the sale of alcohol they kind of have to with pot. The law project for the creation of the SQDC also prohibited advertising cannabis as a lifestyle, preventing celebrities from pushing its products and also goes on and on wtih an elaborate list of details about how store will need to be sober with little style or deco. QC has also been fighting actively to prevent citizens from having and growing plants. The message is that they have to sell it because they have too but they will not push the product at all. Spending money on a high class attractive logo is really pointless under that logic.

[
 
killerrin

killerrin

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Oct 25, 2017
9,238
Toronto
I FUCKING CALLED IT! Time to go rub this in the face of all my Conservative voting friends

Edit: Eh, it's not that bad. Theyll still cover drugs, just not if you already have coverage elsewhere. So we're going a hybrid system. The only question is if they are keeping the age restrictions
 
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Fuzzy

Fuzzy

Completely non-threatening
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,133
Toronto
It's not that bad though. If you have private insurance then that pays first and OHIP+ covers the balance. The problem is actually knowing who already has private insurance from either their own work or their parents.
 
OP
OP
Caz

Caz

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
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13,055
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Well...they wasted no time in showing how terrible their government will be for Ontario in record time.
 

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I think the main bad thing about this is it will be a little more work for people making claims. But if you keep the status quo you're letting private insurance profit on the premiums they're collecting for drug coverage for U-25s without actually paying the cost of coverage because OHIP is doing it for them.
 
killerrin

killerrin

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Oct 25, 2017
9,238
Toronto
Roke said:
I think the main bad thing about this is it will be a little more work for people making claims. But if you keep the status quo you're letting private insurance profit on the premiums they're collecting for drug coverage for U-25s without actually paying the cost of coverage because OHIP is doing it for them.
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That's the main problem I see. It will cost Hospitals and Pharmacy's a lot more time and money to process claims, which will increase costs of service and ultimately serve as an inefficiency
 

SRG01

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Oct 25, 2017
7,020
Wait, I don't see the problem with this. Alberta Health doesn't even cover the cost of medication for minors/dependents past private insurance, and I don't think other provinces do either...?

I mean, it doesn't make it right, but this has been the status quo for other provinces for a very long time now. What other things do Ontarians have that other provinces don't in terms of health care?
 

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SRG01 said:
Wait, I don't see the problem with this. Alberta Health doesn't even cover the cost of medication for minors/dependents past private insurance, and I don't think other provinces do either...?

I mean, it doesn't make it right, but this has been the status quo for other provinces for a very long time now. What other things do Ontarians have that other provinces don't in terms of health care?
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Ontarians have the privilege of paying a lot for out-of-hospital cancer drugs that are covered in Québec and Western Canada.

While Quebec and the western provinces do pay for all cancer medications, Ontario and the Atlantic provinces have less or non-existent coverage for take-at-home medicines, whose costs typically run to thousands of dollars a month.

For Ontario patients under age 65 with no workplace drug plan, or who cannot afford the plan's co-pay — usually 20 per cent — the province's catastrophic drug coverage kicks in. But it requires patients to contribute a deductible of four per cent of their gross income — $2,600 a year for a family making $65,000 – and funding is only available after waiting several weeks.

Coverage in the Atlantic provinces is less generous.
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Kernel

Kernel

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Oct 25, 2017
19,889
Roke said:
I think the main bad thing about this is it will be a little more work for people making claims. But if you keep the status quo you're letting private insurance profit on the premiums they're collecting for drug coverage for U-25s without actually paying the cost of coverage because OHIP is doing it for them.
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Yeah I never got any reduced premiums even though OHIP would have covered anything for my kids.
 
Kernel

Kernel

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Oct 25, 2017
19,889
Fuzzy said:
Most workplace health plans are multi year deals which is why you didn't see a change so the OLP plan was just giving insurance companies free money.
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Yeah I remembered that right after I posted it. I'm sure it helped people who don't have benefits.

How nice that my work implements a $10K annual maximum on drug costs a week after my doctor suspects my wife has cancer :(

I may be royally fucked. I thought the Trillium Drug Program covered such things.
 

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Kernel said:
Yeah I remembered that right after I posted it. I'm sure it helped people who don't have benefits.

How nice that my work implements a $10K annual maximum on drug costs a week after my doctor suspects my wife has cancer :(

I may be royally fucked. I thought the Trillium Drug Program covered such things.
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This is just non-Ontarian me googling shit but the 4% of net household income deductible thing the article mentions appears to be Trillium for cancer drugs (and that's paid in quarterly installments) so I think you shouldn't end up with USA-size bills. Hoping for the best for you and your wife Kernel .
 
Tiktaalik

Tiktaalik

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Oct 25, 2017
3,428
killerrin said:
In other news, the battle over the BC PR referendum is heating up with lines being drawn by all parties

Former B.C. NDP premier campaigns against proportional representation
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Former British Columbia premier Ujjal Dosanjh is urging voters to say No to a referendum on proportional representation because he believes it would usher in extremist parties like those in some European countries...
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I can totally understand why Dosanjh is particularly concerned about extremists, given that extremists beat him with an iron bar for speaking out against them, but on the other hand, holy shit how on earth can you think FPTP is not well capable of electing extremists given what has happened in the USA and Ontario??
 

SRG01

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Oct 25, 2017
7,020
Tiktaalik said:
I can totally understand why Dosanjh is particularly concerned about extremists, given that extremists beat him with an iron bar for speaking out against them, but on the other hand, holy shit how on earth can you think FPTP is not well capable of electing extremists given what has happened in the USA and Ontario??
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FPTP isn't responsible for extremist parties, but rather whichever leadership system is in place for those parties. For the US, a good portion of the people voted Republican regardless of the leader -- it was the extremist rust belt voters that brought Trump over the top. For Ontario, it was a change election, so it was going to be the OPC regardless of who the leader was.

At it's core, yes PR does give a slightly higher chance to fringe elements to gain power, but that's easily stopped by a minimum vote threshold or something equivalent.
 
djkimothy

djkimothy

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Oct 27, 2017
5,456
I'm just waiting for the shit show of leaving the cap and trade market outright. Either they pay back the billions they owe the companies, or they get sued. Fun times.
 
Tiktaalik

Tiktaalik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,428
SRG01 said:
FPTP isn't responsible for extremist parties, but rather whichever leadership system is in place for those parties. For the US, a good portion of the people voted Republican regardless of the leader -- it was the extremist rust belt voters that brought Trump over the top. For Ontario, it was a change election, so it was going to be the OPC regardless of who the leader was.

At it's core, yes PR does give a slightly higher chance to fringe elements to gain power, but that's easily stopped by a minimum vote threshold or something equivalent.
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Right the core issue here is that with FPTP you can get huge majorities and 100% of the power with very little support (eg. 39% support for the Federal Liberals). This is obviously extremely problematic if a radical leader gains control of one of the major parties due to a few hundred party member votes.

In contrast with a PR system it is MUCH more likely that you're going to need the support of other parties and need to rely on consensus to govern. I'm not so concerned that the Terrible Racist Party gets seats in parliament because they'd require moderate parties to govern. The example we have this year is how a few BC NDP promises quietly dropped off the radar because the BC Greens didn't support those ideas. In a PR system everything is moderated and it's less likely that extreme ideas move forward. As well the most extreme Green ideas weren't supported by the NDP because that party didn't have enough leverage.
 
mo60

mo60

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Oct 25, 2017
1,198
Edmonton, Alberta
Man. The UCP has been struggling with stuff like this since their AGM in May.


Maybe the idea of a united party needed more time in the oven because I really do not see how the UCP lasts long especially as long as kenney is leading them
 
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bremon

bremon

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Oct 27, 2017
7,876
Fuzzy said:
Looks like an anus with a spliff in it.
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Laughed out loud, thanks for that.

mo60 said:
Man. The UCP has been struggling with stuff like this since their AGM in May.


Maybe the idea of a united party needed more time in the oven because I really do not see how the UCP lasts long especially as long as kenney is leading them
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I'm fine with the UCP opening the oven too quickly and having their cake collapse lol. Party brass; "Members; please don't vote yes for this narrow-minded resolution that will cut us off from potential voters". Members; "but we're narrow-minded!" *members vote yes*.
 
mo60

mo60

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,198
Edmonton, Alberta
bremon said:
Laughed out loud, thanks for that.


I'm fine with the UCP opening the oven too quickly and having their cake collapse lol. Party brass; "Members; please don't vote yes for this narrow-minded resolution that will cut us off from potential voters". Members; "but we're narrow-minded!" *members vote yes*.
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The smart thing would have been for the two right wing parties to lose in 2019 and then unite after that election. It would have given them more time for them to figure out the direction they would have taken a merged party and a strategy that can appeal to albertans. Now you have a party who's sole purpose of being created was to beat the ABNDP no matter the cost, whose divisions are still really visible with a mediocre person leading them that is slowly pissing Albertans off. Like I don't see how the UCP lasts for more than a decade or two as a political party at this point if the infighting continues or the other issues plauging the UCP currently continues even if they win the next election.
 
OP
OP
Caz

Caz

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,055
Canada
Welp.

Premier Doug Ford has quietly fired Ontario's chief investment officer, chief scientist, and removed Ed Clark as the premier's business advisor in a post-election purge.

Sources told the Star that Ford's newly elected Progressive Conservative government ended Allan O'Dette's brief tenure as the province's first chief investment officer at cabinet on Friday...

Also gone is chief scientist Molly Shoichet, a prominent University of Toronto professor named to her post last November by Wynne.
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Source: https://www.thestar.com/news/queens...chief-investment-officer-chief-scientist.html
 
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