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Big One

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,277
She has an actual character arc and Sakura doesn't. It's probably that simple.
Sakura has one too but it's very shoddily written like most Naruto character arcs. And by shoddily I mean it makes absolutely no sense. To be fair to Hinata her's is simple enough and focused on entirely one thing so her's makes sense.
 

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,375
I gotta give it to Izumi she's one of the few characters in anime/manga that are better because of their marriage with a male character, lol. IF she wasn't married her dynamic just wouldn't be the same.
TIL there's also a naruto character named Izumi...yet another character who's characterization revolves around a male character..:
znSpGaL.png
 

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
On Break
Oct 25, 2017
32,776
Sakura has one too but it's very shoddily written like most Naruto character arcs. And by shoddily I mean it makes absolutely no sense. To be fair to Hinata her's is simple enough and focused on entirely one thing so her's makes sense.
Sakura's revolves entirely around the Sauce, at least Hinata has something else going on in her life. Neither one is super great though, but at least Hinata has some agency in that her actions have consequences on the larger story.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,560
Sakura's revolves entirely around the Sauce, at least Hinata has something else going on in her life. Neither one is super great though, but at least Hinata has some agency in that her actions have consequences on the larger story.
What's funny is how people credit her for the Kayuga fight even though she sat out most of it. That's like crediting Vegeta for Cell, something no one does.
 

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
On Break
Oct 25, 2017
32,776
What's funny is how people credit her for the Kayuga fight even though she sat out most of it. That's like crediting Vegeta for Cell, something no one does.
Man, she didn't do anything of any importance during that fight. Kakashi practically won that fight solo, in comparison.
 

Chamaeleonx

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,348
The only definitive exception that instantly comes to mind is this badass:

b876655631ae4e837acad797aeb7e0b4.jpg
Isn't that the series of a female Yakuza boss marrying a salary worker and now has to defend him while beating up many men stronger and bigger than her? =O

I don't think TenTen has any kids. Or even a husband.

That was meant more for Hinata being a mom. Generally being a mom isn't bad or in any form negative. Just would have wanted more than that.
Sidenote: Ten Ten was written out of the story so much she didn't even get a love interest. =,(
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,474
Ya'll can love Rock Lee even though he's a clown that can't win fights for the first...400 chapters or so. I can love Hinata for being brave enough to stand up to Neji.
 

Lotus

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
105,877

tekomandor

Member
Oct 27, 2017
522
I just really empathised with her as a kid, I guess. She's really quite awfully written, but I still have a soft spot for her.
 

yado

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
Sakura's revolves entirely around the Sauce, at least Hinata has something else going on in her life. Neither one is super great though, but at least Hinata has some agency in that her actions have consequences on the larger story.

To suggest that Hinata has "something else going on" in her life is laughable when she contributed absolutely nothing to the story but cheering on the MC, she got married to him, had his kids and now every time we see her she's knitting or cooking. That's her arc.

Even if Sasuke was omitted from the plot entiely Sakura would still have her achievements.
 

Chamaeleonx

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,348
I don't recall this...


Not sure, was some irregular manga format I read months back. Is pretty new and I thought this was a panel from it. Premise is kinda that the boss got smitten with this salaryman guy and now so many want to kill him and she has to balance housewife and Yakuza things while keeping him alive.

She's taking her sweet time. She already has Chun Li's buns, so let her develop the rest of the look. She could've been like Ino and settle for a poor man's Sasuke.
Doubt she ever gets anything, author will probably let her die alone or simply not mention her anymore. If we already have panels where she says business is bad then it goes kinda downwards.
Agree though, Ino and Sai is kinda weird. Never understood their obsession with Sasuke to begin with. Everybody was shitting on Naruto while Sasuke in the end harmed everybody and killed so many.
By the way, do you think something alone the lines of Hsien-Ko from Darkstalkers could work for Ten Ten, regarding the techniques and maybe an outfit change to a wider outfit to emphasize the hidden weapon style?
 

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
On Break
Oct 25, 2017
32,776
To suggest that Hinata has "something else going on" in her life is laughable when she contributed absolutely nothing to the story but cheering on the MC, she got married to him, had his kids and now every time we see her she's knitting or cooking. That's her arc.

Even if Sasuke was omitted from the plot entiely Sakura would still have her achievements.
Achievements aren't shit. Hinata did things that actually changed the direction of the story. When Pain beat Naruto, she stepped in, lost, and he went 8-tails. Without that moment the entire series takes a different path. Sakura doesn't have anything close to that. Even the stuff in the OP doesn't reach the level of actually affecting and changing the direction of the story, and the one moment that does (the Kaguya one) is definitely an exaggeration. Like 90% of that list is purely background tier shit. You could replace her with a sentient first aid kit or a radio for most of that and nothing would change.

Neither of them are great, but only one of them has actual agency in the larger story and it ain't Sakura.
 

Tace

Avenger
Nov 1, 2017
35,526
The Rapscallion
Seriously, ain't that some shit?





Hell yeah, we can hate everyone else, but damn, not Rock Lee and Maito Gai, so good and carried the underdog appeal of the original series that was betrayed in the sequel series.

Those two and Shikamaru made it out of Naruto still awesome, so that's something.


Glad someone did. That shit was dirty. Hard work really meant nothing in the end

His fight losses are still better than most of even shitty fights wins in the series.

You can lose and still be badass. Just look at Vegeta. Rock lee has swag like that
 

Deleted member 14377

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
13,520
Just chiming in to shit on Ten-Ten. Everyone had SOME gimmick, but her's was "I use weapons". She's lame AF, she's never had a "moment" in the entire series whatsoever. My friends and I back in middle-school/high school had an on going joke where we would point out when it was 10:10AM at school and just act useless for a minute.
 

yado

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
Achievements aren't shit. Hinata did things that actually changed the direction of the story. When Pain beat Naruto, she stepped in, lost, and he went 8-tails. Without that moment the entire series takes a different path. Sakura doesn't have anything close to that. Even the stuff in the OP doesn't reach the level of actually affecting and changing the direction of the story, and the one moment that does (the Kaguya one) is definitely an exaggeration. Like 90% of that list is purely background tier shit. You could replace her with a sentient first aid kit or a radio for most of that and nothing would change.

Neither of them are great, but only one of them has actual agency in the larger story and it ain't Sakura.

By that logic Kishi could have written in any other character as a crash dummy to get slapped around by pain. Any other medic could have cut him open and saved his life but somehow giving Naruto a pep talk is a totally rare skill that no one else could have done?
 

marimo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
612
I thought this was going to be about Hinata the very good boy from Haikyu!! and was about to be all "how dare you?!"
 

Ehoavash

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,238
No deLmao this is like the OP's 5th? Thread on Hinata bashing on gaf and here.

Anyway while I agree she didn't have enough screen time/development, and the movie was kinda shitty for the whole genjutsu thing. I still liked her character, especially in part 1 though, her awkward shy personality resonated with me a bit also she didn't shit on naruto all the time like sakura did in part 1.

Let it go op. I know how much you ship narusaku
 
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i-hate-u

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,374
Whooever said Rukia is the Sakura of Bleach...

StY36x0.gif


Hinata being so passive/cheerleder-y is because she didn't have enough screen time. Maybe an episode 1-2 per arc max. That's a lot more than the likes of Tenten and Shino. But let's not lie and say that she wasn't an impactful character on Naruto himself. Had they spent more time, these kinda threads wouldn't exist.

It's hard because the series is focused on Naruto/Sasuke, but everyone wishes they spent more time on characters like Neji, Hinata, Sai and Lee in the vein of Shikamaru.
 
Oct 27, 2017
42,700
Who likes her? People are largely indifferent to her because she's such a non-character and while she has little going for her, she has little going against her either
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,560
Just chiming in to shit on Ten-Ten. Everyone had SOME gimmick, but her's was "I use weapons". She's lame AF, she's never had a "moment" in the entire series whatsoever. My friends and I back in middle-school/high school had an on going joke where we would point out when it was 10:10AM at school and just act useless for a minute.
Yeah, I don't understand where Ten Ten had potential came from. She was introduced and put Temari over and then never did anything ever again besides be Neji's hypeman.

Who likes her? People are largely indifferent to her because she's such a non-character and while she has little going for her, she has little going against her either
Some people definitely like her, just no nearly to the degree the OP thinks based on his shipperwar experience.
 

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
On Break
Oct 25, 2017
32,776
By that logic Kishi could have written in any other character as a crash dummy to get slapped around by pain. Any other medic could have cut him open and saved his life but somehow giving Naruto a pep talk is a totally rare skill that no one else could have done?
You misunderstand, agency in a character works like this:
  • does this character have a want or a goal they want to achieve?
  • do they take action to achieve that goal?
  • does that action they take directly cause the story to take a change in direction?
In that moment Hinata takes action to achieve her goal (she likes Naruto but also wants to be more like him) and her action directly causes the story to take a change in direction that it would not have taken otherwise. All of the achievements the OP gives to Sakura have nothing to do with her wants/goals in the series, they're more general actions that could be taken by anyone else and have nothing to do with her specifically (as a character). Sakura, on the other hand, never really takes direct action to achieve her goal (bringing Sauske home).

Like, neither of them are good characters, but one clearly has agency while the other does not.
 
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Chamaeleonx

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,348
Just chiming in to shit on Ten-Ten. Everyone had SOME gimmick, but her's was "I use weapons". She's lame AF, she's never had a "moment" in the entire series whatsoever. My friends and I back in middle-school/high school had an on going joke where we would point out when it was 10:10AM at school and just act useless for a minute.
Honestly, more potential and interest than OP main character number xy. Never understood what people liked about Sasuke for example. Hidden weapons at least allows for cool, more grounded techniques. Personally I would have loved to see that. =/
Some powers in general seemed limited or not developed to potential.

By that logic Kishi could have written in any other character as a crash dummy to get slapped around by pain. Any other medic could have cut him open and saved his life but somehow giving Naruto a pep talk is a totally rare skill that no one else could have done?
Honestly, by that logic you could probably replace most of the cast with some kind of doll that does x or y. They both could have used more and/or better scenes and development.
 

Deleted member 14377

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
13,520
Honestly, more potential and interest than OP main character number xy. Never understood what people liked about Sasuke for example. Hidden weapons at least allows for cool, more grounded techniques. Personally I would have loved to see that. =/
Some powers in general seemed limited or not developed to potential.

Tenten had issues in the fact that in all honesty she is way more of an underdog character than Lee or Naruto were ever built up to be. She was the weapon's expert and was bested by Temari, who also mainly fought with a weapon. She was just an oddity. If you want to talk potential and interest but completely underused was Shino. Would have loved more than a Kankuro fight and a 2 page moment against Tobi, but I feel like Shino and his clan in general was more of a "I made something incredibly broken, how do I fix it? Just not do anything with it!" kinda character
 

Android Sophia

The Absolute Sword
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,110
Tenten had issues in the fact that in all honesty she is way more of an underdog character than Lee or Naruto were ever built up to be. She was the weapon's expert and was bested by Temari, who also mainly fought with a weapon. She was just an oddity. If you want to talk potential and interest but completely underused was Shino. Would have loved more than a Kankuro fight and a 2 page moment against Tobi, but I feel like Shino and his clan in general was more of a "I made something incredibly broken, how do I fix it? Just not do anything with it!" kinda character

It says a lot that the two times we explicitly see Shino fight in the Boruto anime, they have to come up with plot justifications to nerf him. Against most opponents, he'd be really broken.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,560
Tenten had issues in the fact that in all honesty she is way more of an underdog character than Lee or Naruto were ever built up to be. She was the weapon's expert and was bested by Temari, who also mainly fought with a weapon. She was just an oddity. If you want to talk potential and interest but completely underused was Shino. Would have loved more than a Kankuro fight and a 2 page moment against Tobi, but I feel like Shino and his clan in general was more of a "I made something incredibly broken, how do I fix it? Just not do anything with it!" kinda character
I like Shino, but buddy had bugs crawling all over him at all times, That's fucking disgusting. Less is more with him.
 

Chamaeleonx

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,348
Yeah, I don't understand where Ten Ten had potential came from. She was introduced and put Temari over and then never did anything ever again besides be Neji's hypeman.

Personally it was great to see another female character that had some ego to it that wasn't grounded in worshiping Sasuke. Sure she made a bad first impression on me but it seemed to have potential if you look at Sakura or Ino who simply worshiped the ground Sasuke walked on.
Mentioned Hsien-Ko early, would have loved to see something along those lines combined with some chakra techniques. She doesn't need to be top tier or anything, but some relatively grounded fighting that isn't based on some "super cheat power" would have been great. Just seemed like a waste. If you don't do something with a character why even create it? Just makes me sad for her/them. =(
Didn't help that Ten Ten got the worst fight possible against a wind user, which effectively removed her from the series. =(
There were a lot of cool characters where I imagined some cool powers later on but a lot never happened.

Tenten had issues in the fact that in all honesty she is way more of an underdog character than Lee or Naruto were ever built up to be. She was the weapon's expert and was bested by Temari, who also mainly fought with a weapon. She was just an oddity. If you want to talk potential and interest but completely underused was Shino. Would have loved more than a Kankuro fight and a 2 page moment against Tobi, but I feel like Shino and his clan in general was more of a "I made something incredibly broken, how do I fix it? Just not do anything with it!" kinda character

Can agree with Shino (though you can probably always come up with some kind of counter to their OP'ness). Generally a lot of the smaller characters just faded and never did anything. You could probably remove them, tighten the story and it would still work. =/

Still, the fight against Tenmari was kinda unfair for Ten Ten because she simply used wind to win... (Hell, her loosing could have been amazing for a redemption or training arc for her). After that Ten Ten just vanished from the series. As you said, she could have been a great underdog character along side Lee, but nothing happened. Now she just slowly goes out of business and probably dies alone. =(
 

yado

Member
Oct 25, 2017
477
You misunderstand, agency in a character works like this:
  • does this character have a want or a goal they want to achieve?
  • do they take action to achieve that goal?
  • does that action they take directly cause the story to take a change in direction?
In that moment Hinata takes action to achieve her goal (she likes Naruto but also wants to be more like him) and her action directly causes the story to take a change in direction that it would not have taken otherwise. All of the achievements the OP gives to Sakura have nothing to do with her wants/goals in the series, they're more general actions that could be taken by anyone else and have nothing to do with her specifically (as a character). Sakura, on the other hand, never really takes direct action to achieve her goal (bringing Sauske home).

Like, neither of them are good characters, but one clearly has agency while the other does not.

I'd say wanting to become stronger, training with Tsunade and the things she did as a result of that training affect the story. I don't really see bringing Sasuke back as a goal anyone really set out to achieve, it was something some of the konoha 11 wanted to do but they didn't aggressively pursue it. Even though Naruto was obsessed with Sasuke and wanted to make him return he didn't set aside his responsibilities to chase him. There's nothing Hinata does in relation to Naruto that couldn't have been done by almost anyone else.
 

Chamaeleonx

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,348
It says a lot that the two times we explicitly see Shino fight in the Boruto anime, they have to come up with plot justifications to nerf him. Against most opponents, he'd be really broken.
Should have just written some kind of drawback into the symbiotic insects to make it less OP. Though I am not sure how his entire powers are currently.
Just brainstorming, but let Ten Ten have a fight with him, she uses no chakra, slashes all insects down and counters most of his abilities. Could maybe be interesting... . =x

I like Shino, but buddy had bugs crawling all over him at all times, That's fucking disgusting. Less is more with him.
You don't like it, I found it cool that he has insects living in his body in some kind of symbiotic connection. The potential is great but it can be so op with shutting down chakra, etc. .
 

Bor Gullet

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,399
Hinata stanks. Such a one note character.

Temari is easily the best female in Naruto (until she became a housewife in Boruto, but I don't count any of that as canon).
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,560
Should have just written some kind of drawback into the symbiotic insects to make it less OP. Though I am not sure how his entire powers are currently.
Just brainstorming, but let Ten Ten have a fight with him, she uses no chakra, slashes all insects down and counters most of his abilities. Could maybe be interesting... . =x


You don't like it, I found it cool that he has insects living in his body in some kind of symbiotic connection. The potential is great but it can be so op with shutting down chakra, etc. .
Would you let him in your house tho? Would you let him hold your dog?

I'm just saying, there's a reason no one ever invites Shino's clan to the cookouts
And imagine how bad Kiba smells.
 

B-Dubs

That's some catch, that catch-22
On Break
Oct 25, 2017
32,776
I'd say wanting to become stronger, training with Tsunade and the things she did as a result of that training affect the story. I don't really see bringing Sasuke back as a goal anyone really set out to achieve, it was something some of the konoha 11 wanted to do but they didn't aggressively pursue it. Even though Naruto was obsessed with Sasuke and wanted to make him return he didn't set aside his responsibilities to chase him. There's nothing Hinata does in relation to Naruto that couldn't have been done by almost anyone else.
Again, done by anyone else doesn't matter. It matters that she did it and things changed as a result. She had a goal, took action to achieve that goal, and that action directly affected the direction of the story. Sakura never did, even getting stronger (which everyone did) only indirectly affects the story.