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StuBurns

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Nov 12, 2017
7,273
I don't know about SH4 being originally intended to be a SH or not. I know I've read people say it wasn't a lot, but I do remember hearing a podcast with Blaustein about MGS1 in which they mention SH4 as an aside, and he said it was meant to be a Silent Hill game, just that they very deliberately wanted to make something that went against the series so far.

To me, it's just a trilogy. In fact, I'm ready for a Silent Hill 4 right about now.

Sony need to put Japan Studio on Siren 3 and get as many of the Team Silent dudes as possible in-house.
 

Cipher Peon

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,829
I didn't play Silent Hill 2 when it came out. Far from it. I played it for the first time about 6 years ago.

All I know that my initial reaction after I beat it was "Wow, that game was incredible...but I'm too terrified to touch it ever again."
Several months later it had hit me that it had been my favorite game of all time, which it is to this day.
 

evilways811

Banned
Jan 12, 2018
148
St. Cloud, FL
A visually and psychologically fucked up game, with a stunning soundtrack. It's my favorite of the series, but yeah, my brain was fried after finishing it and wrapping my mind around the twist and all the symbolism.
 

Polioliolio

Member
Nov 6, 2017
5,399
I really got into Silent Hill on Playstation. For me, when Silent Hill 2 came out, I was blown away. Still unmatched. Silent Hill 3 was great too, but not on 2's level. Seems like since 3, they had to keep going back to the cult story and lore, though I'm one of those guys who can't stomach any silent hill game after 4. 4 wasn't very good, but it still had the feel of the series baked in. Recognizable. Everything since then has been shameless silent hill worship hitting all the big references, blood, rust, cult, pyramid head, and without any of spirit of the team silent games. I remember feeling bad about silent hill 5 previews and everyone on silent heaven just seeing the rust and flashy transformation and I guess that's all they needed to be sold on it.
 

Patitoloco

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
23,714
I don't know about SH4 being originally intended to be a SH or not. I know I've read people say it wasn't a lot, but I do remember hearing a podcast with Blaustein about MGS1 in which they mention SH4 as an aside, and he said it was meant to be a Silent Hill game, just that they very deliberately wanted to make something that went against the series so far.

To me, it's just a trilogy. In fact, I'm ready for a Silent Hill 4 right about now.

Sony need to put Japan Studio on Siren 3 and get as many of the Team Silent dudes as possible in-house.
According to Wikipedia, the Siren team was composed by a fair deal of Team Silent ex-workers, including SH1 director. But yeah, I agree 100% with you.
 

XaviConcept

Art Director for Videogames
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,914
At the time I remember magazine impressions praising the graphics and little else. It took abour 2/3 years for people to catch on.
 

supernormal

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
3,147
I actually remember skipping Silent Hill 2 at the time because of it getting fairly mixed reviews (the game hovered around a 7). It was only years later that the game was elevated to the GOAT status it has now.
 

StuBurns

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Nov 12, 2017
7,273
According to Wikipedia, the Siren team was composed by a fair deal of Team Silent ex-workers, including SH1 director. But yeah, I agree 100% with you.
Ito, art director and monster designer, is freelance. Owaku, writer of 2 and 3 is producing an anime cell phone project for Konami.

Do it Sony, we deserve it.
 

Dusk Golem

Local Horror Enthusiast
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,807
Silent Hill 2 on release had some mixed response, some loved it immediately but both from professional critics at the time and quite a few users there was middling response due to several aspects, such as it being too easy, the game lacking the dark scary atmosphere of the first game, the slower drawn out pace, and other things which some felt were downgrades from the first game (such as the thread mentioned, some wanted to see a connected storyline like the RE series had, which SH2 was almost completely separate from SH1's story, which disappointed many people). plus some just thought the story was confusing (complex game stories weren't common back then), I don't think SH2 was what a lot of people were expecting out of a sequel to SH1. I also think it should be noted the time frame it released it, it was releasing after 9/11, right before Halo 1, etc. It was kind of at the wrong place at the wrong time.

It also is a pretty good showing for how people shouldn't put too much stock into an initial critical response to a game. Silent Hill 2's reception bettered over time, I think SH2 was a bit ahead of its time so people weren't fully ready for it back in 2001. Also shows how expectations can be one of the worst things for artistic vision, because of people's expectations of what Silent Hill 2 could or should be after SH1 many in that moment didn't like SH2 as it wasn't what they were expecting, so they critiqued it for what it wasn't rather than for what it was.

This will be a controversial opinion, but while I love looking at the critical response to things, I think in a lot of ways the consensus immediately upon release is near useless due to several blinding factors, ranging from hype, to expectations, to sometimes the drive to be done by release tampering with the experience, to the mindset someone is in when experiencing a work. Some elements also age well while others age worse, but I think it's understandable why SH2 got mixed reception on release, and what that can tell us about video game critique and consumerism reviews as a whole. They have value for the consumer in the moment, yes, but they aren't necessarily reflective of the actual quality of a game for a number of factors.
 

Treasure Silvergun

Self-requested ban
Banned
Dec 4, 2017
2,206
Just out of curiosity, do you prefer SH2 or 3?
Haven't played 3.


Just by thinking there's a "twist" you're already misinterpreting the game. Its not about what happened to Mary but what happens to James, and the several different endings you could get are anything but predictable

Also, its not like SH was any sort of unpredictable masterpiece either. Or you're going to tell me that you <gasp> totally trusted Dahlia ?!?!
Of course not, but come on, there's no similarity between the two situations.

Harry wants to find his little girl. She was alive when he last saw her. And the game twists and turns so many times, the fact that Dahlia is not a "good" person is pretty much the only given in the whole plot until the end. Dahlia and Kaufman were modeled and voiced explicitly to raise suspicion at first glance.

James wants to meet again with his wife, knowing full well that she's dead and he was the one who killed her. The scene with the tape in the hotel room is anticipated and framed as your goal and a pivotal scene, and yet it's completely predictable. I'm comfortable in saying it at least wants to be a twist, and as such, it failed for me.
But you're right, SH2 isn't really about what happened to Mary. SH2 is about Silent Hill itself, and what it represents for all the characters we see in the game. James just happens to have more screen time.
 

StuBurns

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Nov 12, 2017
7,273
SH2 isn't 'about Silent Hill', it's about processing trauma.

That's the real genius of that game. It used the trappings of being a sequel to this cult horror game to trojan horse style force this painful reconstruction of a man's psyche on the audience.

It's crazy that it landed the same year Kojima used consciously retreading MGS1 to speak to the futility of game iteration and the hype and marketing managent of a product release.

Konami went HAM, just letting their creatives push the industry way further than anyone dares today.
 

astroturfing

Member
Nov 1, 2017
6,459
Suomi Finland
i just remember a bunch of average, not very enthusiastic reviews.. so i skipped it and only played it a year or two after release.

oh well, at least i played it! one of the best gaming experiences ever for me, it was so.. otherworldly. and that OST... words cannot describe. i've listened to it ever since then, and i'll never get bored it.
 

11redder

Member
Oct 27, 2017
135
My memory is vague at best, but I recall Silent Hill 2 being pretty damn acclaimed when it came out. One of the magazines I bought at the time, maybe Official UK PlayStation or something like that, gave it an 89 or 92. That review alone convinced me to get it even though I found the first one too scary lol. The response back then wasn't really all that different to how the game is treated now.

Plus I always found 2's story far more compelling than the cult stuff of 1 and 3.
Yup. Official UK PS magazine definitely gave it a very positive reception and Edge scored it very highly as well, either an 8 or a 9. In the UK and Ireland, it was met with near universal acclaim.

The only complaint I remember hearing was that the melee combat wasn't reliable, but whoever wrote that obviously didn't realise the mechanic made use of the DS2's analog face buttons.
 

HeWhoWalks

Member
Jan 17, 2018
2,522
SH2 isn't 'about Silent Hill', it's about processing trauma.

That's the real genius of that game. It used the trappings of being a sequel to this cult horror game to trojan horse style force this painful reconstruction of a man's psyche on the audience.

It's crazy that it landed the same year Kojima used consciously retreading MGS1 to speak to the futility of game iteration and the hype and marketing managent of a product release.

Konami went HAM, just letting their creatives push the industry way further than anyone dares today.

100% agree. SH2 does not focus on the town specifically, unlike 1 and 3. That said, while 2 isn't my favorite of the bunch, it is a highly enjoyable and replayable experience (one that I'm having on PC right now and just happened to coincidentally stumble on this thread).
 
Nov 13, 2017
9,537
I may be a simpleton and a heathen, but I'm of the opinon that, exactly like it happened for MGS2, the initial critical reaction to SH2 and the scores the game got reflected the game's actual worth accurately. Both games have since gathered a cult following and have been reappraised, grossly exaggerating their actual value in their respective series and in the gaming landscape in general. Both are now widely held as untouchable GOATs, mainly because of their non-ludic qualities.

I played Silent Hill 2 as an adult. The game didn't remotely make me feel like the first SH did, and I could see the game's "twist" coming from a mile away. Sure, it's very well constructed, but just like MGS2, I feel that what the story strives to convey isn't best conveyed through the video game medium - which, ironically, is probably the main reason why they're both so well remembered and so highly praised. Both come from a very experimental phase in gaming history and both are part of that famous "fall of 2001" PS2 catalogue, which also contibutes to enhance their mythical aura. It's easy to see why the game gets such mad praise today. Yet, as a game and as an experience, it falls short of the first SH for me.

I agree.
 

Dreamboum

Member
Oct 28, 2017
22,868
Small bump but I've been thinking about it and has done some research and it does seem that the game has kinda received the MGS2 treatment, though MGS2 was still widely well reviewed just for being a hype machine. SH2 breaking expectations and going for a slower paced psychological experience was something that didn't seem to strike the western audience.

This is ironic to me, because I think this way of handling horror is something the japanese audience is more attuned to (Moonlight Syndrome being an iconic example of psychological horror), but SH2 was clearly designed for a western audience, even more so than 1. I just think that the discourse around video games wasn't ready for a game like Silent Hill 2. Not like it was a game from another dimension, but just because they way to treat this game seems to go beyond a bullet point of pros and cons and more of a deep dive into how the game is constructed. Especially as people had to figure out how mechanics like ending requirements were used as storytelling devices.
 

Dreamboum

Member
Oct 28, 2017
22,868
I've done well to search Masahiro Ito's twitter, he had something to say about it. Sales were also a factor

 

thepenguin55

Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,823
Weird. I always assumed that it had a super positive reaction because it reviewed super well and sold really well (or at least well enough to get both the Greatest Hits and Platinum Hits labels).
 

More_Badass

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,623
Silent Hill 2 on release had some mixed response, some loved it immediately but both from professional critics at the time and quite a few users there was middling response due to several aspects, such as it being too easy, the game lacking the dark scary atmosphere of the first game, the slower drawn out pace, and other things which some felt were downgrades from the first game (such as the thread mentioned, some wanted to see a connected storyline like the RE series had, which SH2 was almost completely separate from SH1's story, which disappointed many people). plus some just thought the story was confusing (complex game stories weren't common back then), I don't think SH2 was what a lot of people were expecting out of a sequel to SH1. I also think it should be noted the time frame it released it, it was releasing after 9/11, right before Halo 1, etc. It was kind of at the wrong place at the wrong time.

It also is a pretty good showing for how people shouldn't put too much stock into an initial critical response to a game. Silent Hill 2's reception bettered over time, I think SH2 was a bit ahead of its time so people weren't fully ready for it back in 2001. Also shows how expectations can be one of the worst things for artistic vision, because of people's expectations of what Silent Hill 2 could or should be after SH1 many in that moment didn't like SH2 as it wasn't what they were expecting, so they critiqued it for what it wasn't rather than for what it was.

This will be a controversial opinion, but while I love looking at the critical response to things, I think in a lot of ways the consensus immediately upon release is near useless due to several blinding factors, ranging from hype, to expectations, to sometimes the drive to be done by release tampering with the experience, to the mindset someone is in when experiencing a work. Some elements also age well while others age worse, but I think it's understandable why SH2 got mixed reception on release, and what that can tell us about video game critique and consumerism reviews as a whole. They have value for the consumer in the moment, yes, but they aren't necessarily reflective of the actual quality of a game for a number of factors.
1) I mean, this isnt a video game thing. Look at the initial reviews for The Thing or The Shining
2) Reviews are never about the "actual quality of a game/movie/etc". Never have been, never will be. Reviews merely reflect what that person feels about something at that moment in time; the same person can review the same work years apart and have completely different reactions to it. Quality doesnt matter; you could dislike something that is excellent (again look at the reviews of The Thing) and love something that is a b-movie guilty pleasure because it appeals to your quirky likes and dislikes (cult classics exist for a reason). The notion that a review of entertainment is measuring the quality of something is a flawed one IMO.