Why so much projection onto a kid's shirt? This isn't excusing horrible acts made by adults, but more like "Ethan's been running around in circles for an hour after eating some Oreos and stomping on his toys like if he was Godzilla"
This is also what I get from the phrase. Boys will be boys, as I heard it from my parents, is playing all day in dirt, no matter the weather and place and such. Never has it been linked to boys getting exused for bullying, sexism or other.Why so much projection onto a kid's shirt? This isn't excusing horrible acts made by adults, but more like "Ethan's been running around in circles for an hour after eating some Oreos and stomping on his toys like if he was Godzilla"
Why so much projection onto a kid's shirt? This isn't excusing horrible acts made by adults, but more like "Ethan's been running around in circles for an hour after eating some Oreos and stomping on his toys like if he was Godzilla"
This is also what I get from the phrase. Boys will be boys, as I heard it from my parents, is playing all day in dirt, no matter the weather and place and such. Never has it been linked to boys getting exused for bullying, sexism or other.
Good fucking riddance. My parents heard it from teachers and parents after I'd been verbally abused, kicked, punched, spat at and worse during school. Fuck people that use it to excuse violent/abusive behaviour and bullying in children/teens.
This here. I didn't hear it from parents in that particular case, but I definitely heard it form others with regard to me (and others) being abused and bullied by others throughout my childhood.
Never has it been linked to boys getting exused for bullying, sexism or other.
This is also what I get from the phrase. Boys will be boys, as I heard it from my parents, is playing all day in dirt, no matter the weather and place and such. Never has it been linked to boys getting exused for bullying, sexism or other.
I'm not really sure how you could possibly prove a negative for something like this but in any case we have anecdotal cases in this very thread.
it has several times in this thread.This is also what I get from the phrase. Boys will be boys, as I heard it from my parents, is playing all day in dirt, no matter the weather and place and such. Never has it been linked to boys getting exused for bullying, sexism or other.
This is also what I get from the phrase. Boys will be boys, as I heard it from my parents, is playing all day in dirt, no matter the weather and place and such. Never has it been linked to boys getting exused for bullying, sexism or other.
Read the page you replied on and you might get some sense of it.I guess I am too old and 'mediocre white' to understand why people get upset about stuff like this.
I guess I am too old and 'mediocre white' to understand why people get upset about stuff like this.
My thoughts exactly. When I see that shirt, I think about the dumb shit I used to do as a little boy, not an excuse for misogynist or abusive social behavior.
In the worst possible context, it is used to handwave problematic behavior.
I get the deplatforming argument for people who want to spew terrible hate.
But I generally don't care to see a piece of apparel go away that upsets some people. Not everything needs to be seen through the lens of trying to beat back on behaviors we don't like. Unless it's actually advocating violence or racism, I don't think a shirt that says that is so vile that it needs to be pulled from shelves.
I dunno. I always just associated it with boys, literally boys and not adults, doing things like getting muddy while playing soccer or making a mess in their room.
I am probably older than most people here so maybe the phrase has a new meaning these days.
This is wild. Boys will be boys was what people said when we were kids and smashed glass, or lit fires or did other dumb stuff. Who the fuck excuses rape and violence with boys will be boys??
The internet is melting your brains out here I swear.
I have never seen it used like this before. I live in The Netherlands and the only time I see it used in either English or Dutch is when young moms place it under a picture of their kid playing in the sand or something like that.
https://theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/apr/02/its-time-we-stop-using-the-boys-will-be-boys-line
There are more examples in this article but you really don't need anything more than the top one
I just wanted to highlight this post again for the people who think it always means "kids will be kids"When I was in middle school, "boys will be boys" was used by the school administration to excuse another student stabbing me during science class while the teacher was watching.
It's a busted phrase that only exists to excuse bad behavior.
Boys will be boys!Sorry but it chaps my ass when someone wants to dismiss a valid point by deflecting to "If you really cared you'd be doing/not doing X" which is just a terrible argument.
It would be if the quote wasn't referencing him and it being a bait post.
I'm not saying it isn't used in that way. I'm just saying that I personally have never seen it being used in that way. Maybe it's a US thing or maybe I just haven't been exposed to that usage of the term.Funny how everyone quote this post from the first page but nobody quotes the one with the article with examples and links to when it was used to excuse harassment, bad behavior and even the RAPE OF A CHILD.
It would be if the quote wasn't referencing him and it being a bait post.
My bad, didn't pick up on it. In which case yeh, I had the same sentiment upon reading it.
Did you have anything to offer to any of the points I made or are you content with just trolling? I've been having a discussion in good faith and you've been offering me one-line non-responses. It's fine if we disagree on stuff but I can't really work with what you're giving here.
I got it!
Because parents might think it's cuter for their son than just having "Kids Will Be Kids"??? This is not even close to the only gender-specific clothing for babies no???Jesus, how hard is it to get that the same should happen with Jane? No-one has a problem with kids will be kids. Why is it so hard for people to realize that changing one easy word can clarify what you "really mean"? Or do you really mean that only boys are allowed to get hopped up on Oreos and stomp on toys?
Because parents might think it's cuter for their son than just having "Kids Will Be Kids"??? This is not even close to the only gender-specific clothing for babies no???
You're purposefully removing the context. If you think this is about just the word "boy" then you don't understand the conversation.Because parents might think it's cuter for their son than just having "Kids Will Be Kids"??? This is not even close to the only gender-specific clothing for babies no???
I was merely responding to a post explaining why the shirt is not gender-neutral. Further proving my point, there are dozens of "Girls Will Be Girls" shirts online after doing a simple Google shirt. It's an overreaction IMO.You're purposefully removing the context. If you think this is about just the word "boy" then you don't understand the conversation.
I was merely responding to a post explaining why the shirt is not gender-neutral. Further proving my point, there are dozens of "Girls Will Be Girls" shirts online after doing a simple Google shirt. It's an overreaction IMO.
Google "Girls Will Be Girls" shirt and the 2nd link is from a shop called "Peek Kids"Interesting...your google must be better than mine. I only saw a couple, and they were for adults, not kids. And it's not really cuter seeing a boy stomp on his toys than a girl. As a dad of two boys I'm really done with hearing about how boys are just expected to be little shits and "oh well, boys will be boys". So cute!
Google "Girls Will Be Girls" shirt and the 2nd link is from a shop called "Peek Kids"
Since in my life and world, the phrase is still used for boys doing things like ruining their clothes with mud. I recognize the difference between a cute catch phrase on a shirt for little kids and the societal dismissal of toxic masculinity and misogyny so it's hard for me to be as outraged as you. I'll bow gracefully now out.
No phrase is needed, but we'll just have to agree to disagree.If a girl came home with her clothes ruined with mud, would you still say "boys will be boys!"? The catch phrase just isn't cute, and pretty much unneeded.
This is where I'm at. I understand both arguments and as a father of a young toddler, I hear the statement "boys will be boys" quite often. Especially on play dates and daycare and such.In the worst possible context, it is used to handwave problematic behavior.
I get the deplatforming argument for people who want to spew terrible hate.
But I generally don't care to see a piece of apparel go away that upsets some people. Not everything needs to be seen through the lens of trying to beat back on behaviors we don't like. Unless it's actually advocating violence or racism, I don't think a shirt that says that is so vile that it needs to be pulled from shelves.
I'm not saying it isn't used in that way. I'm just saying that I personally have never seen it being used in that way. Maybe it's a US thing or maybe I just haven't been exposed to that usage of the term.
No phrase is needed, but we'll just have to agree to disagree.
Context is key"Girls will be girls" has never been used as a defense for somebody's rape.
This is where I'm at. I understand both arguments and as a father of a young toddler, I hear the statement "boys will be boys" quite often. Especially on play dates and daycare and such.
I guess, like everything else, context and nuance is key.
But I don't see the shirt as being vile enough to pull either. Under the right context, the statement is true. Under the wrong context, the statement is sexist and dismissive. However, the phrase being on the shirt for toddlers doesn't seem like the wrong context to me.
Interesting...your google must be better than mine. I only saw a couple, and they were for adults, not kids. And it's not really cuter seeing a boy stomp on his toys than a girl. As a dad of two boys I'm really done with hearing about how boys are just expected to be little shits and "oh well, boys will be boys". So cute!
Never said I couldn't give it up. I just said I understand both arguments and they both have merit when in context. Your statement in bold is worth discussion and debate because the statement has different definitions depending on the context of which it's used. You have people in this very thread who have never heard it being used as a way to dismiss rape, harassment, etc.Even if you don't believe the phrase is toxic by default, then why can't you give up using a throwaway playful phrase that helps perpetuate a more toxic version that you acknowledge exists?
I don't think "kids will be kids" would be any better for the same reason, really.