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uncelestial

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,060
San Francisco, CA, USA
Oh ok, definitely let the 9 year old girl know this! Of course we should have math problems in the form of comparing girls' weights. Because NASA. Who cares what an actual girl thinks.
"It isn't polite to ask someone's weight, or to shame someone for their weight, or to compare two people's weight to their face, or make fun of people's weight behind their back. That's private, and people can have strong feelings about that. But we're not doing that here, are we?" -> Pivot into times when people who worry about numbers have to work with weight data, and that's okay -> Congratulate for being so thoughtful -> The end

It isn't hard. I say this as a father of two girls.
 

uncelestial

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,060
San Francisco, CA, USA
who is advocating for that?

"Maybe it shouldn't be a word problem for kids" != talking about weight is taboo and we should never do that
If mentioning weight in a completely hypothetical and impassively written math problem *is* a taboo, then what actually isn't? Keep in mind that for the reasons I mentioned -- let's throw in actuarial work! -- people *actually do math on people's weight in their actual jobs in real life*.
 

Deepwater

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,349
If mentioning weight in a completely hypothetical and impassively written math problem *is* a taboo, then what actually isn't?

but that wasn't the offense though, it's about introducing the scenario of comparing the weight of children to 4th graders being inappropriate. Respond to that, not the straw man of "how can we ever compare weight Without offending"
 

Midramble

Force of Habit
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
10,451
San Francisco
If mentioning weight in a completely hypothetical and impassively written math problem *is* a taboo, then what actually isn't? Keep in mind that for the reasons I mentioned -- let's throw in actuarial work! -- people *actually do math on people's weight in their actual jobs in real life*.
but that wasn't the offense though, it's about introducing the scenario of comparing the weight of children to 4th graders being inappropriate. Respond to that, not the straw man of "how can we ever compare weight Without offending"

For reference, this is the point the mother specifically mentioned.

"Her teacher was so responsive and spoke to her about it and supported her decision," Naomi said. "This isn't about the teacher, the school, or anything — we love our school and our community. What it's about is children being taught this everywhere, that it's okay to make direct comparisons with weight."
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
So much focus is put in weight for young girls. That's why the math problem is not the best. It's just more of the same societal issues.

Like is it surprising the weight math question was about girls comparing weight? Of course not because it's all part of the beauty myth
 

Baji Boxer

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,374
Yeah, sometimes I see why some people say libs get offende by everything. People have different weights, nothing bad about it.
Of course how many people that say that are offended by a football player kneeling, or a computer game being exclusive to a particular online store?

Anyway, she seems like a smart kid, but I'd question the wisdom of going to Twitter about this, and making it a news story. I wouldn't want to make a 4th grader a target of online bullies over such a minor thing. Look at the nasty comment here:

I'm sorry numbers offend you. I hope your family can cope through this tragic, traumatizing event.

This is probably among the milder reactions I'd expect on social media.
 

Cat Party

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,392
"It isn't polite to ask someone's weight, or to shame someone for their weight, or to compare two people's weight to their face, or make fun of people's weight behind their back. That's private, and people can have strong feelings about that. But we're not doing that here, are we?" -> Pivot into times when people who worry about numbers have to work with weight data, and that's okay -> Congratulate for being so thoughtful -> The end

It isn't hard. I say this as a father of two girls.

I'm the father of two girls, also, and your little example here is condescending garbage.
 

uncelestial

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,060
San Francisco, CA, USA
but that wasn't the offense though, it's about introducing the scenario of comparing the weight of children to 4th graders being inappropriate. Respond to that, not the straw man of "how can we ever compare weight Without offending"
There is nothing that being in 4th grade introduces into the situation that would preclude having a normal-ass discussion about this in which you try to describe the real world for a couple minutes.

I'm the father of two girls, also, and your little example here is condescending garbage.
Nah. "Your little example here" is though. Hopefully, you are normally able to behave more according to your ideals.
 
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Parthenios

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
13,589
Avoiding a math question/wider discussions involving weight is perhaps paradoxically worse for body image than the actual question. Avoiding it stigmatizes something pretty mundane and wraps all the way back around to the weight-negativity of "it isn't polite to ask a woman her weight."
 

Tezz

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,269
How is this even news worthy?
While I believe the subject matter of the word problem should've been about something different, the main thing I'm seeing is a Fox affiliate with a headline framed as though this is a Common Core problem.
To me it feels like that article about some annoying neighbor who, although inconsequential to the story, was identified as a vegan in the headline.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
Avoiding a math question/wider discussions involving weight is perhaps paradoxically worse for body image than the actual question. Avoiding it stigmatizes something pretty mundane and wraps all the way back around to the weight-negativity of "it isn't polite to ask a woman her weight."

Nope.

The question plays into our ridiculous beauty culture that pressures young girls to become obsessed with weight and toxic dieting
 

Parthenios

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
13,589
Nope.

The question plays into our ridiculous beauty culture that pressures young girls to become obsessed with weight and toxic dieting
It doesn't though. It doesn't assign "value" to any of the weights through context (aka saying the lightest weight is preferable or something like that) and is merely statistical. It doesn't "play into" anything, but making weight taboo certainly does.
 

MIMIC

Member
Dec 18, 2017
8,313
I saw this story on Facebook yesterday. I "get" the issue, but like they said, there is no value or judgment being placed on the different weights. Just comparisons.
 

Deleted member 41502

User requested account closure
Banned
Mar 28, 2018
1,177
I saw this story on Facebook yesterday. I "get" the issue, but like they said, there is no value or judgment being placed on the different weights. Just comparisons.
The "point" is that they wrote "common core" in the headline and they're hoping to bring in clicks from angry right wingers. I mean, the story is basically "kid reports offensive math problem. teacher agrees and removes problem without penalizing kid".
 

Deleted member 11413

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
22,961
The framing of this article is incredibly disingenuous. Has nothing to do with common core.

As for the concerns of the kid...I mean they seem valid. I don't think the question is inherently offensive, but I could see it making people uncomfortable. Could just change it to compare the weights of, say, livestock, or backpacks, or books, or literally anything else. The stakes are really low in terms of harm from the question, but changing it is also incredibly easy to do so...yeah, makes sense.
 

uncelestial

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,060
San Francisco, CA, USA
It isn't polite to condescend. That's private, and people can have strong feelings about that. But we're not doing that here, are we?

But congratulations on being so thoughtful.
lol okay. That word salad was sorta fun, but generally, pithiness and snark works better when you are making a modicum of sense when you talk. Honestly not even sure what you're trying to do/say here. :shruggie:
 

luffie

Member
Dec 20, 2017
798
Indonesia
So we can't do weight statistics anymore? I suppose comparing heights, eye colours, etc is offfensive now too.
yeah man, this is kinda dumb imo. Weird that anything you feel offended by can just be justified these days. "Black" friday is offensive, "Great White" shark is offensive... but the real working world don't work this way man.
 

Tigress

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,134
Washington
Is this one of those outrage against outrage culture articles? There's a long history of tying a woman's value to her weight, with constant reminders of pretty much everywhere. We don't math problems contributing to that. Good for the kid for knowing what's up, and the teacher for being supportive. It would have been very easy to pretend it's a thing that exists in a vacuum, and that she's just imagining things.

I'm surprised it took this long for some one to see the problem on this forum. These responses I've seen so far are something I'd expect from more conservative forums I go on.

(I'm also curious how many people dismissing the girl's complaints are male and maybe speaking from male privledge of not having to worry so much about weight being important to how people judge you. Yes guys get judged but it's not near as emphasized that their looks are important. Look at how many fat guy actors there are compared to fat or even chubby woman actors).
 
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faceless

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,198
with the way bullying is now on a global scale thru social media 24/7, questions like this ain't it chief.
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,450
It's pretty common for a number of benign reasons. People's weights are literally listed on baseball cards.

Again, weight in professional adult sports where it has an impact on performance is not the issue. Weight in young girls is and given the endless options for comparing weight in literally any other object, why use girls? It's tone deaf.

Honestly, I'm surprised at the response from the majority of Era on this one. No one should be 'outraged' by this, but it's interesting how many of you apparently have a really hard time even seeing why this might be an issue for a young girl and her mum.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
It doesn't though. It doesn't assign "value" to any of the weights through context (aka saying the lightest weight is preferable or something like that) and is merely statistical. It doesn't "play into" anything, but making weight taboo certainly does.

Look I'm saying it's telling in unconscious social bias way that it's girls whose weight is being used.
 

SapientWolf

Member
Nov 6, 2017
6,565
Is this one of those outrage against outrage culture articles? There's a long history of tying a woman's value to her weight, with constant reminders of pretty much everywhere. We don't math problems contributing to that. Good for the kid for knowing what's up, and the teacher for being supportive. It would have been very easy to pretend it's a thing that exists in a vacuum, and that she's just imagining things.
Thing is, no one is that concerned about weight. Tyra Banks weighed 160 in her heyday. People care about fat.
 

Parthenios

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
13,589
Look I'm saying it's telling in unconscious social bias way that it's girls whose weight is being used.
No. There's a 50% chance the question uses girls or boys. I just googled "math word problem boys weight" and quickly found:

"The average weight of a 5-year old boy is 45 lb. Jack's weight is 4 lb. heavier
than average. What is Jack's weight?"

"The total weight of three boys is 159 kilograms. If two boys weight 67 kg and 45 kg respectively, what is the weight of the third boy?"

I did find this question too, which I would consider problematic:

"Sonia's weight is 78 kilograms. She started exercise and lost 12 kilograms in 3 months. How much does she weigh now?"

This question implies a value (that 78 kg is too much for a girl to weigh and she needed to lose weight) and even worse doesn't include context like her height (which obviously wouldn't be relevant to the math problem at hand but is important info for healthy weight, etc).