Lol.Alright, that's a fair point. Still, I'd argue that despite having a much lower budget, there's actually a lot of REALLY good character work in Lost Planet 3 that went completely ignored.
But I actually have a whole thing about last-gen games that weren't treated right. Like Kane & Lynch 2, might actually be the best video game I played in 2018? Fucking love that game? I think when it released for $60... like, yeah, that shouldn't be a $60 game, it's too short. But devoid of that context, just as a Creative Work, holy shit, people slept on Kane & Lynch 2, you know?
I wrote it in one draft and it's my blog so I don't have an editor because I can't afford to pay anyone for th at, lol. I just paid the doctor $225, ain't got the cash for an editor. My Kotaku/IGN/USgamer stuff has editors, obviously.
My article was never going "every game has to be wholly original." It was going "man, a lot of people kinda just copy other people's homework without getting why it works."
When I play Resident Evil 2 Remake, it's like, wow, those guys get horror. They get survival mechanics. Their level design is on. fuckin. point. Resident Evil 2 is a near perfect video game. Every single element of that game comes together to form this perfect whole of a thing, just an absolute, juicy delight of a game.
When I play a game like God of War, I have the Generic Loot System, the Generic Crafting System, the Generic Skill Tree System. The consideration for its design just isn't there; it's just cribbing from other games with no real understanding as to why those mechanics needed to be in its game.
Neither game is 'original,' but one game knows why it's doing what it does. The other just throws in what's popular. RE2 has the 'it factor.'
I didn't agree with this initially, but once the controls were patched and I replayed the game on PS4, I felt the same way. It's absolutely wonderful.This is offtopic but I think you're on point. UC3 was everything I loved about U2 taken to the next level and expanded upon.
The worst part of that mess is that even if the moment to moment gameplay loop was competent (it really isn't), it's made entirely pointless because everything in the game push the player to ignore itYeah, kinda. The level design is certainly the worst its ever been in a Metroid game, the moment to moment gameplay is competent as far as action goes but too simple to have much depth.
The 1st cutscene of BBS is everything about showing the friendship in the group and it's more genuine than anything in that god forsaken mess.
Once again man, I like you, I think your opinions are a little archaic, and find the dismissive nature of "if it isn't challenging then it's a walking simulator" pretentious and no longer relevant to the medium.
But to get a whole thread seems a bit masturbatory.
Maybe he shouldn't have written a whole long-ass article that boils down to "my opinion is more correct than yours" then.
It makes more sense when you replace "prestige" with "it's overrated" he's just smart enough to know how saying "it's overrated" would go. Anyone who uses it's overrated as a criticism is usually not worth paying attention too.Lol.
Re2 isn't perfect. Maybe for you, but its design isn't what everybody is willing to find in a videogame. They did know what they were doing, sure. Dead Space is way better for me for example as an horror game.
And same for God of war. It isn't generic at all. You dislike its skill tree and that? The game isn't for you as RE2 wasn't for me. But man, of course they knew what they were doing when designed skill tree, loot....
Also a big lol for Nintendo games not being 'prestige'. You just pick the games you like and and ones you dislike and label like that them without any sense.
Deal with it, not every game is for everyone and no need to understand why a developer did something you would have done differently.
He was the impetuous. He isn't above criticism for it
It makes more sense when you replace "prestige" with "it's overrated" he's just smart enough to know how saying "it's overrated" would go. Anyone who uses it's overrated as a criticism is usually not worth paying attention too.
Originally I was going to call them Sad Dad Games because of John Marsden, Max Payne, Kratos, Bioshock Guy, and so on, but I felt like the new Tomb Raider games were going that route too, especially Shadow of the Tomb Raider, and that's a game where the dad is dead and the daughter is sad, so I couldn't call them sad dad games.
Yes, but did the OP know it was Doc's thread?You said "but to get a whole thread seems masturbatory"...are you even paying attention to what you're saying? A blog post is not this thread and again Doc didn't make this one in case you're confused by the order of events of what came first.
free burger king tacos every thursday
they call it taco thursday
What does that matter?
How is that Doc's fault anyway?
Right, sure. That's what that is. It's not a game current that the author doesn't like, one that they describe in the blog post. And it's not like the author released, in the same blog, an article singing the praises to Days Gone. Obviously, it's console warring.
A dead dad is a sad dad.Originally I was going to call them Sad Dad Games because of John Marsden, Max Payne, Kratos, Bioshock Guy, and so on, but I felt like the new Tomb Raider games were going that route too, especially Shadow of the Tomb Raider, and that's a game where the dad is dead and the daughter is sad, so I couldn't call them sad dad games.
... what?
A game developer friend of mine told me that games were often constructed at Naughty Dog by finding bits and pieces of movies and television shows, screening them, and going "okay, we're going to make this."
Taking inspiration from media is not a new thing.A game developer friend of mine told me that games were often constructed at Naughty Dog by finding bits and pieces of movies and television shows, screening them, and going "okay, we're going to make this."
This can't be true, can it? God, I hope not. Hmm
That's not what this is describing. This is describing stealing from other media and turning it into a video game.
Probably true. Overrated or that he just doesn't like and needs to 'downplay' those games by writing something that sounds cool and may make done sense here and there, so he can have some followers basically those that don't like those same games , that will prefer that opinion and even expand the 'arguments'.It makes more sense when you replace "prestige" with "it's overrated" he's just smart enough to know how saying "it's overrated" would go. Anyone who uses it's overrated as a criticism is usually not worth paying attention too.
If they are stealing... How come the haven't been sued yet?That's not what this is describing. This is describing stealing from other media and turning it into a video game.
Really fun to watch people go through ancient interviews or do selective quoting (yeah, I see your "look, he hates on sony games!!!" post where you ignored me saying I disliked bioshock, bioshock infinite, red dead redemption, grand theft auto iv, max payne 3, and so on).
So.
Let me shut this down real quick.
If I hated Sony games, why did I write a whole lot more praising one single Sony exclusive this year?
Could it possibly be that
1) you don't appreciate sony games that much; you just like one specific kind of sony game and associate t hat with the brand
2) i actually fucking love a lot of sony games, I just don't like the Naughty Dog approach?
I think it would be more apt to characterize me as someone who doesn't like Neil Druckmann's games than someone who dislikes Sony.
Sure, I have issues with The Corporation of Sony, but... really? You're just gonna pretend I don't actually love Sony games, when I have like 12,000 words of me praising the shit out of Days Gone just months ago? When I talked about a certain STYLE of game, without singling out any one specific publisher or developer?
Hell, when you read the article, did you see the part where I said that I thought the PlayStation exclusive game Shadow of the Colossus deserved the praise it got?
Nah, the people whining "doc just hates sony" are either malicious or stupid.
EDIT: really fun that resetera can't handle medium links lol
'I hate cinematic games but love Gears 5 which is a cinematic game. Maybe because it's not from Sony. I think Shadow of the Colossus is probably a masterpiece, dunno i haven't played it. Crackdown 3 is the best thing ever despite having game design that was stale 10 years ago. I also loathe Christopher Nolan because i went to film school. Or something.'
That's some next level praise, never played the game but think is masterpiece.
Probably true. Overrated or that he just doesn't like and needs to 'downplay' those games by writing something that sounds cool and may make done sense here and there, so he can have some followers basically those that don't like those same games , that will prefer that opinion and even expand the 'arguments'.
It is a bit sad that there's so much negativity in gaming community these days, as easy as it is to choose another game when you dislike one.
And also one thing it surprises me, I've always known what games i enjoy and which ones won't, so just skip those. And if i doubt, i buy when cheap enough to try and not feel bad in case i was right. Why do these gamers that write such long articles or posts about the Gabe's they dislike keep playing them? I have no fucking clue.
If they are stealing... How come the haven't been sued yet?
People are so dramatic in this (and other) forum...
Huh?That's not what this is describing. This is describing stealing from other media and turning it into a video game.
But you only label some with it, so your Prestige tag isn't really for prestige games. Gears 5 is just as much a prestige game as TLoU is. BoTW is also a prestige game, as is something like Minecraft. Prestige is just a recognition for extremely high quality or achievement. You like prestige games, you also dislike some, as it's a incredibly wide reaching definition (to the point of being kinda meaningless honestly). You just don't like that some are actually considered prestige or not, because you personally do/don't like them, or put differently you think they are overrated/underrated.I think prestige is a specific game format though. There are plenty of highly rated, even overrated games out there. Like I wrote an article about Breath of the Wild and some issues I had with its open world structure (I revisited those when telling everyone how much I loved Days Gone). I think Breath of the Wild is overrated. I wouldn't call it a prestige game.
Originally I was going to call them Sad Dad Games because of John Marsden, Max Payne, Kratos, Bioshock Guy, and so on, but I felt like the new Tomb Raider games were going that route too, especially Shadow of the Tomb Raider, and that's a game where the dad is dead and the daughter is sad, so I couldn't call them sad dad games.
then criticize me instead of posting really weird shit about the old place being an echo chamber (as if I wrote this with any idea it would show up on era at all) or insisting that I'm some sort of gameplay primacy advocate
I'd argue that Minecraft is kinda of badly placed here.But you only label some with it, so your Prestige tag isn't really for prestige games. Gears 5 is just as much a prestige game as TLoU is. BoTW is also a prestige game, as is something like Minecraft. Prestige is just a recognition for extremely high quality or achievement. You like prestige games, you also dislike some, as it's a incredibly wide reaching definition (to the point of being kinda meaningless honestly). You just don't like that some are actually considered prestige or not, because you personally do/don't like them, or put differently you think they are overrated/underrated.
I'm not a fan of the informal tone of the writing. I get it's a piece about emotion, but it does read more as a long era post than it does any sort of argument or clear articulation of why the author doesn't like certain things. Bioshock is stupid, because it's a poorly written video game that doesn't think it's poorly written - Okay, and? There's nothing of substance to really reinforce the author's feelings here, or to sway a reader's mind on something. It's barely analytical, and feels more like the author is just talking down to me.
It's a shame, because the premise of the article could be an interesting discussion - Is there a games equivalent of "Oscar bait"? Does that push the medium of games or hold them back? Why are games not considered art unless they imitate another medium? - and some parts of it I may even agree with, but the writing here just seems all over the place and unfocused, like someone turning their rant on discord into a script for an amateurish YouTube video essay with an illustrated persona in rotating poses.
I think a lot of this thread is kind of a mess, with accusations of fanboyism and whatnot (and honestly some of that feels like projection) but you've got to expect some major blowback when you're nearly insulting the intelligence of the reader and conclude the article with a vague shrug.
Doc I see where you're coming from. We all have preferences I suppose. Some people won't eat beef unless it's grass fed. Some folks will shit on any mainstream pizza chain. I personally enjoy most things for what they are and my world is better for it.
I loved TLOU and Uncharted 4. I love Gears 5 and really enjoy jumping around collecting orbs in Crackdown 3. I love Rambo as much as I love Clockwork Orange. I will always be sad for folks who limit their enjoyment based on rule sets they created.
Gears 5 isn't really a cinematic game, it's a bombastic third person shooter where Cole screams "now's the fun part, bitch," and punches a brumak in the head
it's informal 'cause it's my blog and that's what i do, i be informal there
If you want Formal Doc, you should check out the work I do for pay with actual editors and I'm not just trying to work out The Weird Shit.
A lot of what's on my blog is intentionally exploratory and questioning; it's not meant to be something everyone should consume. Think of it a bit like a game design theory sketchbook. It's quite rough. It's a place to try to work out creative problems.
I don't do what I'm doing because of a ruleset, I looked at games I didn't like and tried to find the commonalities and see if that was a specific kind of game.
I really have no idea.Ok. Someone explain to me what are the fundamental differences between the Gears of War series and the Uncharted series that make one a 'prestige' series and the other not. Seriously.
'I hate cinematic games but love Gears 5 which is a cinematic game. Maybe because it's not from Sony. I think Shadow of the Colossus is probably a masterpiece, dunno i haven't played it. Crackdown 3 is the best thing ever despite having game design that was stale 10 years ago. I also loathe Christopher Nolan because i went to film school. Or something.'
That's some next level praise, never played the game but think is masterpiece.
I actually like that line.[I cut out a paragraph here which seemed too self-aggrandizing. Here are two new ones.]
I think that's fair, but I'd definitely consider it prestige, just the insane scale and freedom to pretty much cover damn near any genre Minecraft offers is just mind blowing imo, definitely didn't start as a prestige game though, just a great concept.I'd argue that Minecraft is kinda of badly placed here.
It's not really a prestige game at least it didn't start as one.
It's really an indie game that went out of control.
But yeah BotW is the biggest most prestige game Nintendo ever released.
That's not a direct quote. It's my interpretation of the text.
Just sayin'
Gears 5 is very much a cinematic games at times. But sure, stick with the one line in the trailer.
But you only label some with it, so your Prestige tag isn't really for prestige games. Gears 5 is just as much a prestige game as TLoU is. BoTW is also a prestige game, as is something like Minecraft. Prestige is just a recognition for extremely high quality or achievement. You like prestige games, you also dislike some, as it's a incredibly wide reaching definition (to the point of being kinda meaningless honestly). You just don't like that some are actually considered prestige or not, because you personally do/don't like them, or put differently you think they are overrated/underrated.
Ok. Someone explain to me what are the fundamental differences between the Gears of War series and the Uncharted series that make one a 'prestige' series and the other not. Seriously.
And in what world does that apply to something like Uncharted, but not Gears or BoTW? They take themselves all as seriously as they can, all very high quality, all have a story. Uncharted just has way better written characters (not played Gears 5 yet) and different level design to BoTW. You are just selectively labelling stuff prestige.I don't want to spoil some of the better jokes in the game.
I feel there's a distinct difference between Big Campaign Game With Cinematics (Halo, Resistance, God of War 3 or 4) and Prestige Game (Killzone wants to be one really bad, God of War 2017, all Naughty Dog games). There's a self-seriousness to it, a desire to be Like A Movie. I don't think Gears of War is Like a Movie, I think Gears of War is someone asking the question "what if resident evil 4 met halo?"
To me these are distinct flavors of games
No, you're confusing prestigious as an adjective with 'prestige game' as a concept similar to 'prestige tv.' The Simpsons is a prestigious television show, but it's not The Sopranos, which is considered Prestige Television.
Gears of War is like "every level is a combat space," and Uncharted is like "woosh, as you're playing, watch the camera swing around to show nathan in a precarious situation!" Naughty Dog really loves their crane shots. Gears of War is a very clear third person shooter.
Depends if you're talking about gameplay or setting/setpieces.
I feel there's a distinct difference between Big Campaign Game With Cinematics (Halo, Resistance, God of War 3 or 4) and Prestige Game (Killzone wants to be one really bad, God of War 2017, all Naughty Dog games). There's a self-seriousness to it, a desire to be Like A Movie. I don't think Gears of War is Like a Movie, I think Gears of War is someone asking the question "what if resident evil 4 met halo?"