“YIIK: A Postmodern RPG” and its use of the Elisa Lam Case

[DatManOvaDer]

(I'm not very good at making threads so if there is anything you felt was important and left out, please let me know.)


Didn't see a thread about this and was curious as to what people thought.

In case you're not familiar with Elisa Lam

The body of Elisa Lam, a Canadian student at the University of British Columbia in Vancouver, was recovered from a water tank atop the Cecil Hotel in Downtown Los Angeles on February 19, 2013.She had been reported missing at the beginning of the month. Maintenance workers at the hotel discovered the body when investigating guest complaints of problems with the water supply.

...Her disappearance had been widely reported; interest had increased five days prior to her body's discovery when the Los Angeles Police Departmentreleased video of the last time she was known to have been seen, on the day of her disappearance, by an elevator security camera. In the footage, Lam is seen exiting and re-entering the elevator, talking and gesturing in the hallway outside, and sometimes seeming to hide within the elevator, which itself appears to be malfunctioning. The video went viral on the Internet, with many viewers reporting that they found it unsettling. Explanations ranged from claims of paranormal involvement to bipolar disorder from which Lam suffered; it has also been argued that the video was altered prior to release.

The circumstances of Lam's death, once she was found, also raised questions, especially in light of the Cecil's history in relation to other notable deaths and murders. Her body was naked with most of her clothes and personal effects floating in the water near her. It took the Los Angeles County Coroner's office four months, after repeated delays, to release the autopsy report, which reports no evidence of physical trauma and states that the manner of death was accidental

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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elisa_Lam

The recently released indie RPG, "YIIK: A Postmodern RPG", makes direct use of this case in regards to a specific scene and character which is shown in this imgur link that has been making rounds on twitter. https://imgur.com/a/wmYHCTx

Summary for those who can't read through the entire link:

- " This character, named Semi, is an Asian girl that you find in a weird separate dimension. She has you call her Sammy for short. When you left the dimension, she was violently taken away by a demonic/spiritual entity. "

- The depiction of her being taken away is a direct reference to Elisa Lam, who struggled with bipolar disorder, depression, and hallucinations of people stealing her away.

- Dev confirms its a direct reference by stating:

-Her getting taken becomes more bloody and gruesome.

What do you guys think of how the game references this case?

EDIT:

So there's one other element of this that the OP doesn't cover.

In Chapter 4

Spoiler

you're looking for a van with an Android inside, that the main character saw in his dreams. They give you a list of places the van was seen. One of these places you can investigate is the Water Tower in Wind Town, one of the cities in the game. When there, one of the main characters Rory tells the story about how residents of the town experienced discolored and bad tasting water. Police investigated the town's water tower and found the body of a girl locked inside. But there was no ladder to the tower, and it was locked from the outside so there was no way her body could have gotten into the water tower. In the game it's also mentioned that the police considered the incident an accident.

I just happened to reach that part of the game today so stumbling into this post was interesting since I had never heard about the event that it's based on.

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[ILikeFeet]

the iwata one wasn't really tasteless

but this, this is messed up

 

[DrArchon]

I feel like this game can't go one day without something really skeezy getting revealed about it.

This seems to be on another level of fucked up though.

 

[MrPhiliasfrog]

What a horrible thing to do.

 

[DGenerator]

Two questions;

Why, and how come?

 

[ForteanMan]

I couldn't think of the real-life case that the beginning of the game reminded me. So thank you for helping my solve that mystery. So much of this game has been bothering me, not just technical issues, but things like this which are more morally suspect. I don't think that the game handles the situation in a particularly thoughtful way, personally.

I'm certainly not suggesting that you can't use real-world scenarios in your games, but hopefully with a bit more respect to the situation.

I dunno, I know that this game was in development forever but perhaps it could have used a bit more time?

 

[dabs furiously]

i think theres a picture of said thing in the eshop page of the game, would they have to take it off?

 

[--R]

What is wrong with the devs?

 

[Comic Obsessed]

As usual with this game, everything is badly-handled.

 

[Tebunker]

Real world events are referenced and used in entertainment mediums all the time. Law and Order the tv show would have never existed otherwise, among other things.

However, those shows usually did a good job of just using it as referential material and not ham fisting it.

I haven't played the game, can anyone really comment on how it was/is handled? I am guessing poorly?

I have no issue using real world events as a reference for stories, but it has to be done well.

It seems like this game should have gotten some editorial passes, which is the trouble with some indie development, things like that are hard, take a while and can be expensive.

 

[Iva Demilcol]

This game is fucking awful.

 

[Comic Obsessed]

Holy sh*t, I was willing to give it a pass as something that didn't have ill-intentions per se but after seeing some of the pictures I can't help but wonder: Why the HELL would you include thoughts of porn with such a delicate topic like this?

Jesus, this game.

 

[Zero-ELEC]

I haven't played the game, can anyone really comment on how it was/is handled? I am guessing poorly?

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[Renteka-Bond]

Man, this game cannot catch a break.

The report is a bit wrong in regards to "You don't have enough time to read it". You can stay and read every single text on the board, not even just in that thread. As for the writing on the message board (and to a degree, the expression of Alex's thoughts on the matter), I think they do a good job of capturing the proper feelings for the way someone on these kinds of message boards would post and Alex's disaffection seems really realistic.

In regards to the case, like with the Iwata thing, I don't see what exactly is the issue here? I recognize that it's directly inspired by a real event but I fail to see why that's a problem.

In regards to my feelings on the game as a whole, I'm actually pretty fond of the way the story is told, personally. It's like playing a Visual novel, which is kind of ironic for me because I largely dislike VNs. There's the sections where the characters talk like normal and then we get Alex's thoughts; I actually think it's pretty cool.

 

[sibarraz]

YIIKES

 

[Hailinel]

Real world events are referenced and used in entertainment mediums all the time. Law and Order the tv show would have never existed otherwise, among other things.

However, those shows usually did a good job of just using it as referential material and not ham fisting it.

I haven't played the game, can anyone really comment on how it was/is handled? I am guessing poorly?

I have no issue using real world events as a reference for stories, but it has to be done well.

It seems like this game should have gotten some editorial passes, which is the trouble with some indie development, things like that are hard, take a while and can be expensive.

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The problem is multi-fold. First, there's a long-winded introduction to the video (in the game) where Alex blathers on about a friend that had previously sent him allegedly scary videos, that just turns out to be, like, elephants having sex, or some other weird porn. And then the video itself is aesthetically based on the video depicting the disappearance of the real-life Elisa, who was later found dead.

Basically, they used the story of Elisa Lam as a hamfisted way to incite all-around shithead Alex into action.

 

[Strings]

This sort of stuff is really complicated, and I'm not against media referencing interesting real life events (the way Mother does it is subversive and widely acclaimed). This particular case was a fascinating little mystery after it happened (mostly to do with how she ended up in the tank on the roof, and the disturbing elevator footage), but they probably should have abstracted it more / not gone with demons / had it play out in the background instead.

 

[Renteka-Bond]

The problem is multi-fold. First, there's a long-winded introduction to the video (in the game) where Alex blathers on about a friend that had previously sent him allegedly scary videos, that just turns out to be, like, elephants having sex, or some other weird porn. And then the video itself is aesthetically based on the video depicting the disappearance of the real-life Elisa, who was later found dead.

Basically, they used the story of Elisa Lam as a hamfisted way to incite all-around shithead Alex into action.

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But that isn't how it happens in the game though. Alex was there in the elevator with her when the event happens, he just isn't caught in the footage. The pictures in question take place after he's experienced the event. He interacts with Sammy of his own volition, abandons her in shock after she's kidnapped then, the next day, resolves to return to the factory due to his guilt at abandoning her.

Edit: I misread your statement as" Used the video to incite". I still disagree that it's any more hamfisted than many other 'calls to action'.

This sort of stuff is really complicated, and I'm not against media referencing it (the way Mother does it is widely acclaimed and subversive). This particular case was a fascinating little mystery after it happened (mostly to do with how she ended up in the tank on the roof, and the disturbing elevator footage), but they probably should have abstracted it more / not gone with demons.

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I'm a few hours in, but the 'demons' is part of a bigger whole to the story that, imo, really has me intrigued at this point more than I was a few hours earlier.

 

[Tebunker]

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The problem is multi-fold. First, there's a long-winded introduction to the video (in the game) where Alex blathers on about a friend that had previously sent him allegedly scary videos, that just turns out to be, like, elephants having sex, or some other weird porn. And then the video itself is aesthetically based on the video depicting the disappearance of the real-life Elisa, who was later found dead.

Basically, they used the story of Elisa Lam as a hamfisted way to incite all-around shithead Alex into action.

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Thanks, these Devs sound like they really screwed up here. No one thought to question this stuff?

 

[sredgrin]

The pop culture section about her death shows How to Get Away with Murder (they used the water tower drowning death as one of the central mysteries of the first season) and American Horror Story (didn't see, but Ryan Murphy credited it) both writing stories with clear references to it.

And that's just the famous examples.

It's not exactly uncommon, especially with "unsolved" mysteries.

 

[ASaiyan]

The more I hear about this game the worse it sounds.

EDIT: "Her suffering was influential to the development of the game"??? Good lord, how can you not hear how off that sounds dude?

 

[cainhxrst]

"her suffering was influential to the development in the game"

Man, I can't believe that's a real quote. Lacks any sort of subtlety and just totally rubs me the wrong way.

 

[Deleted member 19742]

YIIKES

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We've heard it a thousand times, man.

 

[Hailinel]

But that isn't how it happens in the game though. Alex was there in the elevator with her when the event happens, he just isn't caught in the footage. The pictures in question take place after he's experienced the event. He interacts with Sammy of his own volition, abandons her in shock after she's kidnapped then, the next day, resolves to return to the factory due to his guilt at abandoning her.

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Fair enough. But the fact that it's recounted in the way that it is, even though he was there when it happened, is really stupid.

 

[spam musubi]

There's just so much tasteless shit in this game that even the ham-fisted redemption arc and apologies by the dev don't cut it. You can only push so many times and apologize or make excuses for it until it becomes clear that you're just not understanding what you're talking about and the end message is shitty.

 

[LazyLain]

The problem is multi-fold. First, there's a long-winded introduction to the video (in the game) where Alex blathers on about a friend that had previously sent him allegedly scary videos, that just turns out to be, like, elephants having sex, or some other weird porn. And then the video itself is aesthetically based on the video depicting the disappearance of the real-life Elisa, who was later found dead.

Basically, they used the story of Elisa Lam as a hamfisted way to incite all-around shithead Alex into action.

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I agree that the creepy long-winded porn dialog is pretty bad, but fail to see why the rest is a problem. I don't personally take issue with works of fiction referencing real-world events, even in an overt manner.

 

[Mobu]

im pretty sure this case has been heavily referenced by tons of media

 

[Renteka-Bond]

Fair enough. But the fact that it's recounted in the way that it is, even though he was there when it happened, is really stupid.

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That's the point though. I agree that there probably should have been more reaction to the forum by Alex at that point, but I think the sense of what the scene was going for, the disaffectation of the forum goers and Alex, was handled well in showcasing the kind of people that we're dealing with. People are saying that the forum reactions and Alex's reactions paint him in a bad light as if that's a failure in the storytelling when it's exactly the point.

 

[werezompire]

im pretty sure this case has been heavily referenced by tons of media

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Yeah, a quick look on Wikipedia reveals that among other media, the TV shows, Castle, and How to Get Away With Murder, both had storylines that were heavily inspired by the case.

 

[Conkerkid11]

Does that make the movie Dark Water tasteless?

This gonna be the second thread now where this game referring to the death of an actual person is tasteless?

I have no interest in playing the game, but this is getting weird.

 

[BigJeffery]

Seems like making a quirky Earthbound-esque RPG that doesn't piss everyone off shouldn't be this hard.

 

[Courage]

I knew this game was gonna be trash when it unironically called itself 'postmodern'

 

[JayCB64]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Elisa_Lam#In_popular_culture

 

[Deleted member 39479]

Side note: how is Sammy short for Semi???

 

[LazyLain]

Seems like making a quirky Earthbound-esque RPG that doesn't piss everyone off shouldn't be this hard.

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It's hard quirk.

 

[aiswyda]

"Her suffering was influential in the development of this game" is probably the creepiest thing I've ever heard a dev say ever.

Does that make the movie Dark Water tasteless?

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Dark Water came out in 2005, this incident occurred in 2013. Use a better example if you're gonna argue this

I agree that the creepy long-winded porn dialog is pretty bad, but fail to see why the rest is a problem. I don't personally take issue with works of fiction referencing real-world events, even in an overt manner.

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You might feel differently if you knew/loved Elisa Lam.

 

[LazyLain]

You might feel differently if you knew/loved Elisa Lam.

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I mean, if you knew/loved Elisa Lam you'd probably be upset by news coverage of her story. Doesn't mean it's not okay for the news to cover it.

 

[Renteka-Bond]

Seems like making a quirky Earthbound-esque RPG that doesn't piss everyone off shouldn't be this hard.

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The thing is, I genuinely don't understand why people seem to hate this game so much. Most complaints I've seen seem to come from people not even playing the game looking at screenshots posted out of context and getting upset and, at times, indignant about it.

I'm about 6 hours in and, at its worst, I've thought it was mediocre. There are some clunky dialogue bits here and there, but nothing that stems far from 'awkward conversation', some of it even being intentional. I just hit a story point that only got me more interested in what's going on; it's very heady and presented in a somewhat pretentious manner, but I feel like the subject matter is super interesting.

Side note: how is Sammy short for Semi???

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It's not short so much as westernized for convenience. I think the dialogue even makes it a point to point out why she would use Sammy as shorthand for people who can't/won't pronounce her name correctly.

"Her suffering was influential in the development of this game" is probably the creepiest thing I've ever heard a dev say ever.

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It probably could've been worded better, but I don't see how it's creepy to say "her sad story inspired me". He's even said before that his own traumas heavily influenced the game as well, particularly after the dying and death of his mother.

 

[Claude Augario]

YIIKES

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Underrated

 

[JayCB64]

If we could bottle the hate boner people have for this game we could finally end erectile dysfunction.

 

[Deleted member 39479]

The thing is, I genuinely don't understand why people seem to hate this game so much. Most complaints I've seen seem to come from people not even playing the game looking at screenshots posted out of context and getting upset and, at times, indignant about it.

I'm about 6 hours in and, at its worst, I've thought it was mediocre. There are some clunky dialogue bits here and there, but nothing that stems far from 'awkward conversation', some of it even being intentional. I just hit a story point that only got me more interested in what's going on; it's very heady and presented in a somewhat pretentious manner, but I feel like the subject matter is super interesting.



It's not short so much as westernized for convenience. I think the dialogue even makes it a point to point out why she would use Sammy as shorthand for people who can't/won't pronounce her name correctly.

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Ahhh that makes more sense. Thank you!!

 

[ZeroX]

uh yeah like the Iwata thing, I don't really see what's bad here. It's just clumsy. It's a famous case that gets referenced constantly. The monologue that precedes it is stupid, but not really related and true of the internet at the time.

The most offensive thing about the game to me is still the art styles and character design.

 

[aiswyda]

I mean, if you knew/loved Elisa Lam you'd probably be upset by news coverage of her story. Doesn't mean it's not okay for the news to cover it.

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I personally feel a lot more comfortable with the news covering the death of a love one than a game dev using it for profit and saying their suffering impacted their game deeply.

One is an update on a current event--a tragic event, but a current event probably talked about by many. Another is a man using my love one's story for profit and 'creative inspiration' and telling a fantastical tale that sort of bastardizes this horrible thing that happened to them.

 

[JayCB64]

One is an update on a current event--a tragic event, but a current event probably talked about by many. Another is a man using my love one's story for profit and 'creative inspiration' and telling a fantastical tale that sort of bastardizes this horrible thing that happened to them.

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I have some shocking news for you about 90% of crime writers..

 

[LazyLain]

I personally feel a lot more comfortable with the news covering the death of a love one than a game dev using it for profit and saying their suffering impacted their game deeply.

One is an update on a current event--a tragic event, but a current event probably talked about by many. Another is a man using my love one's story for profit and 'creative inspiration' and telling a fantastical tale that sort of bastardizes this horrible thing that happened to them.

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I agree that news has a stronger claim to covering such stories, but I disagree about condemning art for covering them.

 

[Gloomz]

I'm not seeing the issue.

If we could bottle the hate boner people have for this game we could finally end erectile dysfunction.

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Pretty much - and I think the game was terrible.

 

[Excitemike]

I don't really see what the problem is. I mean, at least a dozen people have tried very patiently to explain it to me. They talked very slowly, using small words. There were plenty of illustrated examples. And still, I just don't get it.
If I was wrong about something, I would know it. I guess it's just a problem with everyone else.

 

[werezompire]

I hate how people have decided that this game and its developers are the cool thing to hate. I even saw someone talk about how they had ripped the script directly from the code & were searching it for offensive content. I've seen people furious that the YIIK developer was interviewed in a Gamasutra article about Western indie developers try to push the JRPG genre further with "super-controversial statements" like "when you make a JRPG today, you need to think about grinding" and "almost all classic JRPGs have a ton of filler." And I've seen people discussing how they should contact Nintendo/Sony/etc. and try to get the game delisted.

The Elisa Lam case has been used in media long before this. I don't remember anybody calling for a Nathan Fillion boycott when his very popular TV show did an episode based on the case.

Iwata was a famous & well-respected member of the game development community so mentioning him in a game as a little easter egg is understandable.

The main character says a lot of offensive stuff. Other party members call him out on it. In fact, the main character himself calls himself out.

From people who have actually played the game, opinions are very divisive, but the dogpiling by everybody else trying to create drama is getting absurd.

 

[Possum Armada]

im pretty sure this case has been heavily referenced by tons of media

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As have hundreds of other crimes, tragic events, etc.

 

[Renteka-Bond]

I hate how people have decided that this game and its developers are the cool thing to hate. I even saw someone talk about how they had ripped the script directly from the code & were searching it for offensive content. I've seen people furious that the YIIK developer was interviewed in a Gamasutra article about Western indie developers try to push the JRPG genre further. And I've seen people discussing how they should contact Nintendo/Sony/etc. and try to get the game delisted.

The Elisa Lam case has been used in media long before this. I don't remember anybody calling for a Nathan Fillion boycott when his very popular TV show did an episode based on the case.

Iwata was a famous & well-respected member of the game development community so mentioning him in a game as a little easter egg is understandable.

The main character says a lot of offensive stuff. Other party members call him out on it. In fact, the main character himself calls himself out.

From people who have actually played the game, opinions are very divisive, but the dogpiling by everybody else trying to create drama is getting absurd.

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Thank you for this. It's been incredibly frustrating to see it all transpire these past few days over a game that I feel, regardless of overall quality, really does not deserve it, especially with how the narrative around this game is being twisted so much by people who aren't even playing it.