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2020 Democratic Presidential Primary | OT | Hickenlooper makes it to the debate
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Can we retitle to the thread to:
2020 Presidential Primary |OT| It's Not About Norms and Ethics In Hiring Practices
2020 Presidential Primary |OT| It's Not About Norms and Ethics In Hiring Practices
Democrats did the right thing by embracing civil rights and rejecting the status quo which was basically that both parties until the 60's were implicit white nationalist organizations. In return, though, a lopsided amount of white people shifted to Republicans and got them 20+ years of the presidency, with a brief reprieve from Carter that only happened thanks to Watergate, and was only wrestled away from them when the Democrats deliberately became Republican lite with Clinton.
We are only, just now, getting to a point where we can actually run campaigns the way we want to and not frame everything through a conservative lens thanks to shifting demographics. That's why Stacey Abrams can come within a point of the governorship in GA. Would have been unfathomable just 10 years ago.
So I think the trend you are referring to has way more to do with the multi-decade political blowback of supporting Civil Rights, and not much to do with the candidates we were running.
I notice a lot of people going no big deal at a canadidate not disclosing a hire so this hire could be his attack dog while he makes a pledge to not attack other candidates and trying to cover it up.....
Are the same ones who got angry at CNN for not disclosing questioners jobs.
I would throw Kamala and Beto in the trash over this level of lying, covering up, and corruption. No hesitation.
Are the same ones who got angry at CNN for not disclosing questioners jobs.
I would throw Kamala and Beto in the trash over this level of lying, covering up, and corruption. No hesitation.
The story of this page is "this, but unironically"
Yeah. Because politics as it's usually done in America cares more about business ethics than human lives. I reject all of that.
If you think Bernie hiring Sirota makes him less likely to help Palestine you are absolutely free to think that.
Me? It's not a blip on my radar, I'd have to see a lot worse to drop my support of him.
This is only March 2019. Man this primary is hot already. This thread, too. What is it going to be like next February when votes are being cast?
I feel like
2020 Presidential Primary |OT| It Actually Is About Norms and Ethics In Hiring Practices
would work better because of the swerve
except for when it's convenient for you
It's okay to attack Beto because of a dumb joke but calling out campaign corruption and lying to the press? Not a real issue apparently.
There's an opening here for Lincoln Chafee to run again and scream about ethics in politics once more.
Forget all these cramps, I want to get CHAFED.
Its perfectly fine to attack your opponents and this primary should be a bloodbath, imo. I dont think Ive ever expressed anything differently so at the very least my morals are quite firm and solid, the foundations just in a different place than where most people ITT have them.
I think people are just desensitized to your "the sky is falling" rhetoric. It's quite literally like disengaging from the boy who cried wolf.
There are conflicts of interest in literally every campaign this cycle (and every cycle). Was Sirota unethical at times? Sure. As a journalist, he was pretty shitty, imo, but that goes for most MSM journalists, and he's not the first journalist to favor a specific presidential candidate. The idea that most journalists are actually neutral in politics is quite laughable, and this corruption story is not going to get the traction that you think it deserves, I'll tell you that.
You don't have to go back too far into US Democratic primaries to counter this statement, lol.
Bernie stans will justify anything in furtherance of their cult of personality. His stans are the mirror image of Trump cultists, willingly twisting their already malleable ethical standards to whatever shape the moment demands.
But you are okay with a campaign lying to the press about this and covering it up?
Cant wait for this news to rot and die in the next few hours only to have you all be the only ones to bring it up ad nausea for the next year.
What the fuck does this have to do with all the sweet tea in Georgia?
You can't excuse any unethical behavior with, "Well, yeah, but this doesn't affect Bernard's policies on Palestine." That's a non-sequitur! The Israel-Palestine conflict is deeply important, but what the hell does it have to do with Bernard secretly hiring an "objective" journalist and having him write attack pieces while publicly claiming that we're going to ~~~unite~~~?
The campaign needs to show the scope of SIrota's work for the campaign, and why they didn't think it was important to the discourse.
The fun thing is this isn't a hypothetical. Bernie lied to the press! He broke a pledge and then tried to cover it up!
It actually happened!
Hopefully the things being discussed are more substantive and less inside the beltway.
honestly this is all I'm saying, that conflicts of interest are gonna pop up everywhere in campaigns but a lot of them don't rise to the level of "writing widely-read hit pieces against everyone else while the campaign's literally paying you under the table"
And? LOL we dont know how Bernie would do unless you have access to a multiverse where he actually did get the nod. Therefore to argue he'd win is simply as good as saying I'd have created Windows instead of Bill Gates if I was around at the same time he was. Its a fruitless game of whatif.
There's a bigger picture. He was writing articles attacking Bernie's rivals without disclosing he worked for Bernie. He framed himself as a neutral arbitrator when he wasn't and Bernie's campaign allowed him to do it. It shows that Bernie (or someone in his campaign) is willing to be less than ethical if they thinks it will benefit them and they won't get caught. How is that not a huge red flag?
And keep in mind, I thought all the bitching about Sirota was dumb until this came out.
No, this is worse than just having a slant. Everyone has a slant. Not everyone secretly works for a political campaign while covering the race.
I already said he never should have made that pledge and it was a stupid move on his part. Thankfully we can get things back on track to a bloodbath primary now.
That's not an argument I'm making. To defend someone as a wife and not a person first is a horrible take, especially in regard to dismissing sexual assault allegations.
You're traveling down a very dangerous road instead of just recognizing the very obvious takeaway here: that it's never ok to baselessly dismiss accusations of sexual assault.
This is not misogyny. It's supporting victims of sexual assault, period. Part of the reason they don't step forward is because they're afraid they won't be believed. Do you understand that?
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and look how much it did. harris and o'rourke are still polling just fine. You'll just take anything and everything to attack the campaign because you straight up don't like Sanders. I agree that what Sirota did was shady but it is no worse than Debbie Wasserman-Schultz ferverntly backing the Clinton campaign, I'd go so far as to say it's actually much less worse because Sirota isn't the DNC Chair.
It means I see through your lame selective application of your moral and ethical standards. You may as well just delete everything in that post and write, "For the greater good".
That's bernie in a nutshell. a Mistake and Bad politics.
Pretty much. It's insane to keep seeing.
I mean, not really. We're just a few dozen Extremely Online obsessives. In the real world, 12% of adults can not name the sitting vice president.
They really should have revealed the association. From an ethics standpoint and politics standpoint. I don't even understand how they think this arrangement was beneficial in the short term or long term. The type of people who are going to listen to Sirota were already pretty securely Sanders.
Bernie made a pledge to not attack the other candidates like this and stay positive and above board.
He then hired someone to do it for him and then covered it up and lied about it to the press.
I am not sure why you are tying to spin this.
I was mostly talking about how often you tout your own moral/ethical standards that are never actually tested
It's a convenient life so I can't really get mad at you for taking the imaginary bypass to the high road
Didn't you hear? He's "desensitized." Great excuse to handwave, eh?
It is for the "greater good". Some people think electing the incrementalist is "for the greater good" and some people think electing the radical is "for the greater good". People have different ideas of what "the greater good is", and make their moral decisions based on that.
People explicitly or implicitly challenged my support for Bernie and my "progressive values". I explained what moral system I used to arrive at my "who cares" attitude about this.
Then don't fluff it up. Say you don't apply your moral and ethical standards to Bernie and move on. Be honest. Don't waste our time.
People sure love to bring up Betos pledge about donations from executives. Which they even concede he likely didn't even realize he broke.
But I guess it's okay for Bernie to intentionally break this pledge and try to actually cover it up and hide it from the press.
But I guess it's okay for Bernie to intentionally break this pledge and try to actually cover it up and hide it from the press.
But if I'm following this new break correctly...Sirato has a preferential canadidate, and was doing hits on that candidate's competitors...while secretly being on his preferred candidate's payroll?
K. Why hide it and have your attack dog claim he's a journalist?
I'm not spinning anything. I just know not to take what you say literally as you've consistently had some of the most disingenuous posts I've ever seen on this forum and I've called you out on it many times. Where there is a hint of truth, you dial it up with hyperbole over 9000. It doesn't faze me whatsoever.
I know politicians are politicians but Damn disappointed at Bernie... I thought he was above this kinda shit
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