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4X Strategy |OT| eXplore, eXpand, eXploit, eXterminate

Oct 26, 2017
316
Random story about Sword of the Stars 2. I have a mate who was a mad fan of SotS (I was always more of a GalCiv2 man myself) and was mega looking forward the 2nd game. At the time his computer couldn't run it so he actually brought me it as a gift (at full price) so he could play it round my house. He played it for a bit and got on with it okay, fast forward 2 weeks and he gets a computer upgrade and now buys himself SotS2 (again at full price). He plays it a bit more, realises he completely hates it and vents his frustration that he brought this game twice that he despises. He's now far smarter with his money, probably better then me, but I still rib him occasionally at the double burn that game gave him. Moral of the story is you should always invest in GalCiv2, that game will never ever burn you will a bad sequel.......
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,489
Speaking of GalCiv — I have the complete edition of 2 (maybe 1 as well?)

I only ended up playing a game or two of GalCiv 2 though — getting it to work at the time which was several years ago at least was kind of a pain.

And GalCiv3 is coming out with some new expansion soon. I never bought the last one, but had the base complete edition before that which I picked up on the cheap.
 

Poodlestrike

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,491
I loved Gal Civ 2, but I remember being extremely unimpressed with 3 at launch. Not sure if that's a question of changing tastes (never went back to 2 to do a real comparison) or if they legit screwed the pooch.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,489
I loved Gal Civ 2, but I remember being extremely unimpressed with 3 at launch. Not sure if that's a question of changing tastes (never went back to 2 to do a real comparison) or if they legit screwed the pooch.
Yeah I'm not sure how 3 plays at all. I don't think I ever booted it up myself, but I know initially people weren't really liking it that much, both user reviews and critic reviews.
 
Dec 12, 2017
263
USA
I loved the shit out of GalCiv 1 and was kind of disappointed in GalCiv2. I own GalCiv3 but never played it. How is it now?

Also, how do you guys like other city builders? There's a lot of mobile games out that are "city builders" but are all on cooldown timers. Basically looking for something like Age of Empires minus the combat. Should I look into the Anno series?
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,489
I loved the shit out of GalCiv 1 and was kind of disappointed in GalCiv2. I own GalCiv3 but never played it. How is it now?

Also, how do you guys like other city builders? There's a lot of mobile games out that are "city builders" but are all on cooldown timers. Basically looking for something like Age of Empires minus the combat. Should I look into the Anno series?
You might like some of the Anno stuff, Banished for me was kind of a revitalization of this specific sub-genre -- saw a lot more (at least in the indie space) start to release after that was fairly successful. Look for stuff like that.

Frostpunk is kind of another high-profile recent game with a big city-builder focus as well.

Others might have more to add. I know Industries of Titan is one that's supposed to come out this year that I've been watching, there might be another one or two coming up, but I forget specifically.
 

Anno

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,014
Columbus, Ohio
I loved the shit out of GalCiv 1 and was kind of disappointed in GalCiv2. I own GalCiv3 but never played it. How is it now?

Also, how do you guys like other city builders? There's a lot of mobile games out that are "city builders" but are all on cooldown timers. Basically looking for something like Age of Empires minus the combat. Should I look into the Anno series?
You should definitely look at the Anno games. For my money they’re the best games out there for their combination of aesthetic city building and resource management/supply chains. They have combat which is bad but you can mostly turn off. Dawn of Discovery Gold is like $6 on Steam right now and still looks great for a 10 year old game.
 
OP
OP
Hella
Oct 27, 2017
9,888
I've been dying to play a Settlers game for a while now. Hoping to scoop up Ubisoft's settlers collection some time down the road. I also have Rise to Ruins but haven't really played it yet--it's very cool but I keep finding other things to play.

For GalCiv, I can't really get too invested in it when Stardock is such a trashfire of a company. They're way past what I feel comfortable supporting as a consumer, and more than that, Brad Wardell himself is just horrible.
You should definitely look at the Anno games. For my money they’re the best games out there for their combination of aesthetic city building and resource management/supply chains. They have combat which is bad but you can mostly turn off. Dawn of Discovery Gold is like $6 on Steam right now and still looks great for a 10 year old game.
Wait, Anno has combat? Mind blown. I always assumed it was a pacifistic Sim City-style game.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,489
Yeah the Stardock controversy stuff has me hesitant at best to buy anything they put out now. I’m still on some mailing list for them though that I needed to sign up for to make Gal Civ 2 work or something.

Their stuff is still worth keeping in mind and watching though since relatively few companies make PC strategy titles compared to say, shooters.
 

Anno

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,014
Columbus, Ohio
Wait, Anno has combat? Mind blown. I always assumed it was a pacifistic Sim City-style game.
It’d probably be better if it was. I kind of like the part in historical Anno games where you had to run warships as protection for your trade routes, but any part where you are fighting against your AI opponents more actively is just bad.

I haven’t really looked into what combat amounts to in Anno 1800, but I’m heartened that I haven’t seen anything about ground troops yet. If it’s just all boats and defensive turrets it’s tolerable.
 
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Dec 12, 2017
263
USA
On the topic of the Settlers 7, I have the gold edition, and apparently I just found out it doesn't work on WIN10, but hey, they have a re-re-re-release of it, which supposedly works on WIN10, but the reviews on steam are mostly negative. So, that's cool.

More on tangent, how are the new Endless DLCs? Considering picking them up.
 
Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
I bought Endless Space 2, tried to understand the game for 1h. I have no idea how to make ships or send they to solar systems. The tutorial is inexistent or I'm really bad. I'm going to request a refund and go back to Stellaris, which is a shame because the game seems interesting but it just dont care to teach me how to play
 
Dec 12, 2017
263
USA
I bought Endless Space 2, tried to understand the game for 1h. I have no idea how to make ships or send they to solar systems. The tutorial is inexistent or I'm really bad. I'm going to request a refund and go back to Stellaris, which is a shame because the game seems interesting but it just dont care to teach me how to play
I'm not sure what you're missing so I made a few screenshots on what you mentioned:

Click one of your planets and/or zoom in on it so you end up here:


See the arrow for the ships? that's what you click to create


Then, either wait, or spend the resources to buy out the ship for the next turn.


This is what a fleet looks like when it's orbiting a system. If you have ships in the hangar but no fleet has been created, then it will just have that little "U" you can see here.


Here you can see what I was mentioning, stuff will show up in the hangar section, and fleets orbiting will show up below the hangar. This is where you create a fleet. Once you have created a fleet, then select it on the map, then just right click where you want it to go. The game will figure out for itself the shortest path.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,489
I bought Endless Space 2, tried to understand the game for 1h. I have no idea how to make ships or send they to solar systems. The tutorial is inexistent or I'm really bad. I'm going to request a refund and go back to Stellaris, which is a shame because the game seems interesting but it just dont care to teach me how to play
I’m sure there’s plenty of YouTube tutorials and videos of players that are good at explaining. I wouldn’t let that hold you back if you were convinced to buy it in the first place and are into strategy games, as there’s plenty of much much worse games with decent or good tutorials.

For some games and genres it’s really not worth the time and cost for devs to implement extensive tutorials beyond the basics because of how many mechanics there are. Some games with “good” tutorials are extremely misleading if the high level play required skills or meta differ significantly from a dev-tutorial that was probably never updated after launch.


Honestly I think Stellaris might be worse in some ways than Endless Space 2, but you’re probably just more familiar. The other Paradox grand strategy games are definitely way worse in total complexity.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,041
I agree that the first few steps of Endless games are always a bit rough, though it becomes much smoother once you've conquered them. If you haven't refunded the game yet, I'd say you should keep trying, if only because once you're used to the UI and basic loop, it will be much easier to play Endless Legends, or whatever next title they make (except if they're making Dungeon2).

I'd really like to know what the main Amplitude team is doing now. They're supporting their last game which is good, but also Legends which mean they're probably not working on a sequel to that... Maybe another experiment like Dungeon ?
 
Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
I'm not sure what you're missing so I made a few screenshots on what you mentioned:

Click one of your planets and/or zoom in on it so you end up here:


See the arrow for the ships? that's what you click to create


Then, either wait, or spend the resources to buy out the ship for the next turn.


This is what a fleet looks like when it's orbiting a system. If you have ships in the hangar but no fleet has been created, then it will just have that little "U" you can see here.


Here you can see what I was mentioning, stuff will show up in the hangar section, and fleets orbiting will show up below the hangar. This is where you create a fleet. Once you have created a fleet, then select it on the map, then just right click where you want it to go. The game will figure out for itself the shortest path.
Thank you very much !
May I ask you again if I have new problems with the interface ?

Like, well, I don't know how do I make money :S
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,041
Like, well, I don't know how do I make money :S
Who are you playing as?
One of the particularities of EL2 is that the factions are extremely different, and favour one or two out of the FIDSI resources, and some totally ignore some of them. For example, you can ignore any food-related technology with the Riftborns. The Lumeris however focus on money (Dust) to the point that a successful Lumeris empire can disregard most of the other technologies and buy almost everything with Dust.
At the beginning, you should have a building that gives you 10 Dust if that's what you need, or look on the right side of the research tree. But even more important during the first turns: you need to be able to resist and ideally eradicate the pirate hideout that will spawn near your empire (and all other empires that will spawn next to you) at turn 11. Some empires can do that with their starting fleet, the more pacifist ones need to do some efforts in the military department to pull through. It's an interesting conendrum because pacifist empires tend to function better with a pacifist government, and these few turns have the risk to develop a bit more of military ideology in your empire if you're going overboard (also, you don't want to lose focus on science and colonization).
 
Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
Who are you playing as?
One of the particularities of EL2 is that the factions are extremely different, and favour one or two out of the FIDSI resources, and some totally ignore some of them. For example, you can ignore any food-related technology with the Riftborns. The Lumeris however focus on money (Dust) to the point that a successful Lumeris empire can disregard most of the other technologies and buy almost everything with Dust.
At the beginning, you should have a building that gives you 10 Dust if that's what you need, or look on the right side of the research tree. But even more important during the first turns: you need to be able to resist and ideally eradicate the pirate hideout that will spawn near your empire (and all other empires that will spawn next to you) at turn 11. Some empires can do that with their starting fleet, the more pacifist ones need to do some efforts in the military department to pull through. It's an interesting conendrum because pacifist empires tend to function better with a pacifist government, and these few turns have the risk to develop a bit more of military ideology in your empire if you're going overboard (also, you don't want to lose focus on science and colonization).
I'm playing as human


Question:

What determines this score of 146?




How do I use these resources?




Is it possible to choose buildings for each planet independently or does the game do for everyone at once?



I completed this mission but it was by accident.

 
Oct 25, 2017
2,416
I'm playing as human


Question:

What determines this score of 146?




How do I use these resources?




Is it possible to choose buildings for each planet independently or does the game do for everyone at once?



I completed this mission but it was by accident.

Ok lets start:

1. Scores, like in other 4x games, are a combination of technology, total population and army. It is not really important (until you have set a number of turns to end the game) and just gives you guidance of how advanced other civs are.

2. Some components of fleets might require them to be built. Same with some buildings. Think of them as "oil" or other important resources.

3. Buildings are system based on ES. You can choose to specialice planets.

4. Missions in ES2 have a clear goal. In the case of this one, it is a cooperative mission, which means all civs in the game share it and every time one unlocks a military tech, the number will go up. Once it reaches 26, all civs will be ranked about how many military techs they "contributed"to that 26 and the top 2 get an extra bonus.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,041
Is it the.... Imperial federation or something?
Never played with them, but I think they focus on Influence (the purple star). Don't know what they do with it.

What determines this score of 146?
An average of everything (population, FIDSI, military, wonders...).
I generally wouldn't focus on the score too much, especially at the beginning since the AI has special bonuses at the start to help it cope with the game. Midway-through, it becomes a good indicator to see if you're behind. It's also useful when picking on a neighbor: since all the AI have the same starting point, you can infer the ones or top are doing better than the ones at the bottom.

How do I use these resources?
Right now, you can't. However, you will once you will be able to develop your system (something that happens when you develop the Economy segment).
You will see it in the (currently) big empty space below the highlighted square.
It's something that is not really well explained and I often miss it, but basically... The science tree is divided in 4 sections, themselves divided in rings. When you reach a different ring of a section, you get a few free stuff, on top of the possibility of researching the technologies of the following ring. You often need to decide whether to keep going forward into the tree for the more expensive but potentially powerful technologies that will allow you to advance further, or stop and get the technologies from the previous ring because you need that specific thing now (also, each technology you unlock raises the cost of the following ones by a few percents, regardless of which ring they're from).
And one of the benefits from the right quarter of research is "Empire modification". It's super badly signified and I often forget about it for several turns, and then suddenly I open the economy screen and I discover I have 2 empire upgrades to decide upon.
What it does is that you can select to use one (and then two, and then three) luxuries to upgrade a system. The bonus you get depends on the luxury you've used. Once you've decided that, you'll be able to build in each system an upgrade that costs Industry and the luxury(ies) you've selected, and it will give quite a few bonuses to your system, on top of the bonus the specific luxury gives. You probably won't have enough luxuries to upgrade all your empire, so you need to focus on your better systems and upgrade them (especially since you can't upgrade a system to level 3 if it's not at level 2, so you need enough resources for level 2 at the very least).
In general, I'd say it's not necessary to hunt for specific resources and just upgrade with whatever you have at hand now (because it becomes quickly expensive, and you want to do it with whatever resources you generate naturally). However, if you have resources that don't align with your needs (+ food resources on an empire that doesn't eat) or you're really focusing on something right now (you play the science empire and you really only want science), then it can be a good idea to wait until you get a few systems that give that resource. Remember that whatever you select there will only be active quite far down the line (once you've built it on enough systems to make a difference) so you need to think about it long term. Don't pick Dust generation because you need money now, because it won't give you money now and will only start to give money back in several turns with some possible expensive improvement.

Is it possible to choose buildings for each planet independently or does the game do for everyone at once?
Every improvement is system-wide, not planet-wide. At some point, something will appear below "colonized": that will be the "specialization" of each planet (this planet will produce one more science if it's cold, this planet produces 2 more food if it's fertile, etc). That's the limit at which planets can be differentiated from others in the same system.
(You still need to individually colonize them when you unlock the technology for them).

I completed this mission but it was by accident.
It happens often! Some missions give good enough results or are easy enough that you may want to change course and complete them; some others give shit you don't care about or require far too much investment/micro-management and you're better off focusing on building better military/science/industry buildings.
If you want to follow the scenario, you may want to try to focus on the scenario missions (as finishing the scenario of a faction leads to victory), but it's often easier to win in the traditional way of genociding most of the galaxy/owning so much money that nothing else matters.
 
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Dec 12, 2017
263
USA
Yeah feel free to ask any questions, I've played endless space 2 like 124 hours (lol) but I can't view the forums at work so it can take a while before I see the post.

Oh btw of those AI, if you find one called Vodyani you can either blow them out of the sky, or ignore them completely. The AI has no idea how to play them at all. I don't even include them in my games anymore because they don't do anything.
 

Poodlestrike

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,491
Yeah feel free to ask any questions, I've played endless space 2 like 124 hours (lol) but I can't view the forums at work so it can take a while before I see the post.

Oh btw of those AI, if you find one called Vodyani you can either blow them out of the sky, or ignore them completely. The AI has no idea how to play them at all. I don't even include them in my games anymore because they don't do anything.
I've found that the only way to get the AI to work with Vodyani is to punch them up a bit in the custom race generator. I've found that giving them the Cravers' species trait does the trick pretty well.

For added hilarity, ecologist starting gov so they do their trick on every planet in the system from the word jump. Kind of risky though - too many low happiness worlds can just kill you.
 
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Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
Yeah feel free to ask any questions, I've played endless space 2 like 124 hours (lol) but I can't view the forums at work so it can take a while before I see the post.

Oh btw of those AI, if you find one called Vodyani you can either blow them out of the sky, or ignore them completely. The AI has no idea how to play them at all. I don't even include them in my games anymore because they don't do anything.
Well, in my game now there is an empire with 1,700 points and mine has 1,200. Any suggestions on what kind of ships I create to win?
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,041
For the military side, there are two non self-evident things to pay attention to: one are the new ship designs, which are surprisingly not in the military side, but on the left side of the tech tree. No need to push for the absolute top-end, the middle ones (the ones that have a clearly definite "offensive" and "defensive" archetype) are sufficient for most of the mid-game. They can be improved with extra slots, but only research these improvements if you have the resources needed to use these improvement slots (and then don't forget to customise the ships!).

The other element are the Combat Points. They are all (almost all?) in the military side of the research tree, and have an icon like a radar. They represent the maximum number you can have in one fleet (1 point = 1 small ship, and bigger ships take more points). If you see the opponent has much bigger fleets than you even though the game tells you you cannot add more ships to a fleet, that's because you don't have enough CP. Since snowballing is a thing, it's quite an important aspect to raise. Put a good mixture of your strongest ship designs together and let them raid the galaxy since the AI is generally lost once the main fleet has been destroyed.

Depending on the DLC you have bought, you may have Behemoth active too? They are ultra-massive ships that become available a bit too soon in my opinion, and completely wreck empires who don't have them. There is a quest to unlock them for everyone, and then special technologies to customize them and make them even more massive (don't let them alone though, they are very expensive to replace).

The point gap might be that you haven't extended as much as the others, and they have many more systems than you. If that's the case, bump up your military, look at your weakest neighbor, and just blob them (obviously, taking into consideration the geography of the galaxy. You'd rather invade systems that either give you resources you want, or systems that reinforce your strategic positions. Don't go for systems that would leave you exposed in the middle of 3 other empires).
The approval system is the thing that slows down blobbing. The more systems you colonize and conquer, the less people will be happy. Be prepared to research a few approval buildings (or the technology that give you one extra system colonizable before raising happiness) if you haven't. It might be necessary to bankroll these buildings on newly conquered planets, or to move governors around to manage them.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,041
All this talk about ES2 made me finally try the new faction... and they are WEIRD!
I expected the "spy" faction to be similar to the EL one, some sort of stealth assassins. But the Umbral Choir goes far beyond that: they are as super-pacifists! If I understand correctly, you could theoretically win the game while being cloaked for the whole game. No one would even know where you are, and they would just scout the galaxy looking for you without interacting with you directly, while you plant dozens of double agents (dreamers) in their population...
I suppose their main role will be the masters of back-stabbing (since their fleet that can appear out of nowhere), but I wonder/hope whether they could be the absolute pacifist nutjobs, and win while disregarding the entire military part of the science screen... There's obviously the risk of being identified and then annihilated in seconds at any point, so you'd have to prepare your backup plans and backup plans to your backup plans, but... wow. I'll probably try that in a lower difficulty setting first to see how it goes. Since they have penalties in Dust collection, I guess their main strategy would be to focus on winning their personal scenario?
I love how different they play from the rest of the factions. They can disregard the pirates, they don't have any area of control so the influence game is totally different, their population doesn't overlap with the normal population (being literal ghosts)... It seems their interaction with the minor factions is bugged, though, or at least not functioning as it should: the one I absorbed just vanished. Strange.

I'm afraid the hacking elements might be bothersome for the other factions (like in Civ when you are far ahead so no one declares war to you, but you have a bunch of "a spy has tried to sabotage your city" warnings every turn from civilizations from around the globe, and you have to micro-manage all this and it's just a slog that slows down everything). But a faction so dedicated to this concept it can potentially only do that? Amplitude, you crazy people.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,096
Apparently their design is a bit flawed right now. Amplitude posted they are working on some fairly big changes to them and the hacking mechanic.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,041
Flawed as in "too powerful" or "too weak"? From my little time with them, they could go either way.

I hope the changes won't make them less unique at least.
 
Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
All this talk about ES2 made me finally try the new faction... and they are WEIRD!
I expected the "spy" faction to be similar to the EL one, some sort of stealth assassins. But the Umbral Choir goes far beyond that: they are as super-pacifists! If I understand correctly, you could theoretically win the game while being cloaked for the whole game. No one would even know where you are, and they would just scout the galaxy looking for you without interacting with you directly, while you plant dozens of double agents (dreamers) in their population...
I suppose their main role will be the masters of back-stabbing (since their fleet that can appear out of nowhere), but I wonder/hope whether they could be the absolute pacifist nutjobs, and win while disregarding the entire military part of the science screen... There's obviously the risk of being identified and then annihilated in seconds at any point, so you'd have to prepare your backup plans and backup plans to your backup plans, but... wow. I'll probably try that in a lower difficulty setting first to see how it goes. Since they have penalties in Dust collection, I guess their main strategy would be to focus on winning their personal scenario?
I love how different they play from the rest of the factions. They can disregard the pirates, they don't have any area of control so the influence game is totally different, their population doesn't overlap with the normal population (being literal ghosts)... It seems their interaction with the minor factions is bugged, though, or at least not functioning as it should: the one I absorbed just vanished. Strange.

I'm afraid the hacking elements might be bothersome for the other factions (like in Civ when you are far ahead so no one declares war to you, but you have a bunch of "a spy has tried to sabotage your city" warnings every turn from civilizations from around the globe, and you have to micro-manage all this and it's just a slog that slows down everything). But a faction so dedicated to this concept it can potentially only do that? Amplitude, you crazy people.
I made a custam human empire but now I cant use influence to buy things. I had more than 80,000 influence points just for diplomacy :\
 
Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
New game, now with influence, on easy I have to admit, and finally I'm the player with higher score
Sad news: I spent 40 turn attacking a system to get their defenses down.
When I finally got their numbers to 0 I was completely unable to win against their ground forces. Every round I lost half of my soldiers.
I decided to load an old save (It was turn 120, my save was 80), used diplomacy and they were eager to accept peace and give me 5 systems ¬¬
 
Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
This new game started with a civilization in the same star system. I was quickly enough to invest in ships and attacked.
I must admit, I'm terrible with the "exterminating" part of the game. I feel guilty every time they suggest peace or ask me to stop. I feel a little bad haha
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,489
This new game started with a civilization in the same star system. I was quickly enough to invest in ships and attacked.
I must admit, I'm terrible with the "exterminating" part of the game. I feel guilty every time they suggest peace or ask me to stop. I feel a little bad haha
Well at least you're having fun now. I will say that using a custom created Civ in the Endless games can often result in something much more OP than the standard races (or under-powered I guess if you gimp yourself). It isn't the most balanced by default, unless you get some mod that's more strict on the point values assigned and available.
 
Dec 4, 2017
3,765
Brazil
i'm still playing the same session, now on turn 250. It is much more enjoyable now that I paid attention to what technologies I should research and preparing myself to the events.
I think Endless space does a poor job in the diplomacy aspect and a terrible job showing that you are under attack.