"8 Cores, 16 Thread CPU, Zen/Ryzen" etc mean nothing to me. What kind of graphics can we expect next gen?

SeriousGoku

Member
Jun 20, 2019
295
And from glancing over some of these next gen threads here on Era, I know I'm not only speaking for myself here. A lot of gamers here aren't blessed with the technical knowledge and have no clue what any of those confusing spec numbers actually mean.

So. Break it down for me (feel free to use dragonball terminology, I've watched the entire series so ill understand any metaphor 😉)

How much of an improvement can we expect? Compared to PS3 -> PS4? PS2 -> PS3?

Too much text, not enough tech demos/ target renders/ "you can expect games to look something like this" in any of those Next Gen threads. lol.


Post some bullshots we can expect to be reality.
 

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,695
Look at Ryzen performance (Probably clocked a bit lower) with a 2 yr old graphics card and you'll know.
 

ADS

Member
Oct 27, 2017
224
It's not just the graphics. Part of the reason levels/worlds this gen have been so small/claustrophobic is the underpowered jaguar CPU both consoles shared (and the slow hdd strangling asset streaming).

Honestly, I'm more excited for larger, fully realized worlds than I am the graphical improvement.
 

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
20,201
It's not just the graphics. Part of the reason levels/worlds this gen have been so small/claustrophobic
??????????????????

Open world games more so than anything have benefitted from the technology that was allowed this gen. Devs legit made country sized open world games instead of more linear claustrophobic games. When I think claustrophobic I think games like the Order. Which is an outlier this gen.
 

kirbyfan407

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,731
I don't know Dragon Ball, and I unfortunately don't know how it will compare to previous generations. However, I can try to explain some of the stuff based on what I've picked up. But also note that we don't have all of the specs yet.

- Ryzen/Zen2: This is AMD's newest CPU architecture. It's commonly understood that the CPUs were the weak point of the previous gen. Between 2013 and now, AMD has made a major comeback in the CPU space with their Ryzen line, and the new consoles will feature their latest (as of 2019). This will likely make a big gen-on-gen difference.

- Navi GPU: This is AMD's latest GPU architecture as of 2019. It's not as much of a leap as the CPUs have had but it still represents an improvement, so I'm guessing we can expect a pretty standard gen-on-gen improvement. It also seems likely that these GPUs will feature tech planned for the 2020 Navis, such as raytracing, so these GPUs will probably be fairly modern. The raytracing implementation will likely be minimal compared to what we are probably going to see hit the PC market over the next few years, but I've learned to never underestimate what developers manage to do with the limited tech of the closed-box systems.

One thing to note is that due to console size/thermals/power and cost limitations, a console will never feature the full, top-of-the-line tech you can get with a PC. PC chips simply have the option to be bigger and more power hungry when consoles do not. However, these consoles will benefit from sharing the same core architecture advances AMD has made since 2013.

- SSD drive: This is going to make a big difference for load times and how games load as you play them. It's hard to say how developers will use the speed, but I'm sure many developers are happy to have access to it.
 
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Edgar

Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,186
Imagine more and bigger knacks and you will have your answer when it comes to next gen visuals
 
OP
OP
SeriousGoku

SeriousGoku

Member
Jun 20, 2019
295
I remember going into this generation, we had a game like Crysis 3 as a benchmark for what we could expect. That game still looks incredible and arguably it's still the best looking thing this gen.

But from what Im reading, the next consoles aren't as underpowered as these ones were right out the gate, so a 7 year old game shouldn't still be in the running for best game ever nearly a decade later.
 

Earthed

Member
Sep 26, 2019
74
We'll see. Looking at environments like what Death Stranding's giving us, I really don't see how that video is all that outlandish, given that we're talking about the kind of hardware that's running on now, compared to what we're bound to get. And of course, some healthy concessions.
 

Stygr

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,944
- Ryzen/Zen2: This is AMD's newest CPU architecture. It's commonly understood that the CPUs were the weak point of the previous gen. Between 2013 and now, AMD has made a major comeback in the CPU space with their Ryzen line, and the new consoles will feature their latest. This will likely make a big gen-on-gen difference.
Not actually the latest by the time PS5 and Scarlett are out, AMD will have a new architecture for sure; PS5 and Scarlett are based on 2019 hardware and they are releasing in Late 2020.
 
OP
OP
SeriousGoku

SeriousGoku

Member
Jun 20, 2019
295
I don't know Dragon Ball, and I unfortunately don't know how it will compare to previous generations. However, I can try to explain some of the stuff based on what I've picked up. But also note that we don't have all of the specs yet.

- Ryzen/Zen2: This is AMD's newest CPU architecture. It's commonly understood that the CPUs were the weak point of the previous gen. Between 2013 and now, AMD has made a major comeback in the CPU space with their Ryzen line, and the new consoles will feature their latest. This will likely make a big gen-on-gen difference.

- Navi GPU: This is AMD's latest GPU architecture. It's not as much of a leap as the CPUs have had but it still represents an improvement, so I'm guessing we can expect a pretty standard gen-on-gen improvement. The raytracing implementation will likely be minimal compared to what we are probably going to see hit the PC market over the next few years, but I've learned to never underestimate what developers manage to do with the limited tech of the closed-box systems.

- SSD drive: This is going to make a big difference for load times and how games load as you play them. It's hard to say how developers will use the speed, but I'm sure many developers are happy to have access to it.
Thank you.

And you should definitely watch DragonBall
 

Keyouta

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,915
Canada
The CPU bump in these consoles will be the star, especially paired with the SSD. While the GPU with hardware accelerated ray tracing will be amazing, the bump from the jaguar netbook cpu is more exciting.

The new CPUs will enable devs to increase complexity in their game worlds, more NPCs having a schedule, enemies with more advanced pathing and ai. Being able to do more with weather and more advanced simulations in general. The SSD will allow fast streaming of assets and since they're the base that all devs can expect the consoles to have, games can build to that as a minimum spec.
 

Earthed

Member
Sep 26, 2019
74
Lol, no. That short was made more for the film industry more so than the game industry atm.
I mean, they're literally showing a charcter running around in part of that environment, and showing interactability. I get that it's a visual tech demo first and foremost, and that those don't really show visual fidelity in a realistic like, but you should know that going in, and adjust your expectation accordingly. We all saw that "wizard" PS4 tech demo, and what that translated into (Detroit), so if you translate that to this tech demo, I think it could give you a pretty good idea.

It's pretty much the best we've got right now anyway, except for maybe those unity tech demos.
 

ReginaldXIV

Member
Nov 4, 2017
798
Minnesota
On consoles it'll be the same ol but now mostly at true 4K but still capped at 30fps since it's clear AAA game development on consoles do not care about frame rates.

PCs will see the bigger boost since minimum specs will increase somewhat.
 

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
20,201
to be fair it was running on a 1080ti
The issue is the part where it has to be an actual game.

mean, they're literally showing a charcter running around in part of that environment, and showing interactability. I get that it's a visual tech demo first and foremost, and that those don't really show visual fidelity in a realistic like, but you should know that going in, and adjust your expectation accordingly. We all saw that "wizard" PS4 tech demo, and what that translated into (Detroit), so if you translate that to this tech demo, I think it could give you a pretty good idea
The Wizard demo looked better than Detroit and that photorealism tech demo was running on PC. Not a console.
 

Xyber

Member
Oct 27, 2017
353
Not actually the latest by the time PS5 and Scarlett are out, AMD will have a new architecture for sure; PS5 and Scarlett are based on 2019 hardware and they are releasing in Late 2020.
Zen3 will mostly be the same, but more energy efficient thanks to 7+nm or whatever the process was called for making them.

But just the step from the Jaguar CPU's, that were pretty bad even back at launch, up to Zen2 will be massive on its own and will definitely allow devs to do a lot more.
 
Mar 23, 2018
1,596

LOL

Actually, probably something close to the CGI trailer from Cyberpunk 2077 at E3 2019 for most, well... some of the AAA+ games. Seems achievable to me.


I think the graphical aspect is not going to be the most surprising thing come next-gen footage, though.
 

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
20,201
Actually, probably something close to the CGI trailer from Cyberpunk 2077 at E3 2019 for most, well... some of the AAA+ games. Seems achievable to me.


I think the graphical aspect is not going to be the most surprising thing come next-gen footage, though.
There are....A LOT of things in that cinematic that currently aren't possible in real time.
 

GroovySnake

Member
Jun 10, 2018
519
USA
Performance is the big thing, being able to handle more stuff (effects, complex stuff happening, detail etc) with a great framerate. Like upgrading your PC.

A PS4 from 2013 can have incredibly detailed scenes and gameplay, but as we see sometimes they tax the system. And the framerate falls to 15 or 20 FPS in some recent games, etc. So at this stage in game history, having more power just means your system can handle things better, not necessarily that it'll need to have notably better graphics in general.

So I'm excited for those reasons, even though they're not flashy necessarily. Some innovation here and there to lighting or whatnot is always cool, but being able to make these complex games run smoothly is the biggest thing this gives us here.
 

Oticon

Member
Oct 30, 2017
588
Not actually the latest by the time PS5 and Scarlett are out, AMD will have a new architecture for sure; PS5 and Scarlett are based on 2019 hardware and they are releasing in Late 2020.
No they won't. Zen 3 is due for 2021. They will have Ryzen 4000 SKUs out but that's just going to be Zen 2 refined and maybe a minor clock boost.
 

Mikey Jr.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,981
I get it OP.

It's hard to imagine the future. I can't really help you in that regard.

We're just going to have to wait and see.
 

iksenpets

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,682
Dallas, TX
Wouldn’t the Halo Infinite trailer from E3 be the closest thing we have to a developer saying this is what they expect out of their current Scarlett target? Granted, that had nothing resembling gameplay.
 

Kamisori

Member
Oct 26, 2017
86
France
The graphism themselves won't increased so much, on the other side you may expect bigger and more complex/richer open-world games (more elements displayed on the screens, with more effects, more interactions). You may also expect better lightning systems in next-gen games at some point.
 

Stygr

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,944
No they won't. Zen 3 is due for 2021. They will have Ryzen 4000 SKUs out but that's just going to be Zen 2 refined and maybe a minor clock boost.
Here they are saying that Zen3 is coming next year
 

RivalGT

Member
Dec 13, 2017
1,345
Control at times looks like a nextgen game, from its physics to its overall graphics, even with out RTX the game looks very impressive. Its character models leave a lot to be desired though. Also expecting 60 FPS on everything is dumb, but you will a lot more 60 FPS games nextgen. The CPU in current gen systems would have been outdated in 2007, thats how bad we have had it this gen, we are lucky some games even hit 60 fps.
 
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Kamisori

Member
Oct 26, 2017
86
France
Ryzen 3 will be released next year, but it's way too late into be integrated to the consoles. The best scenario is that the consoles will feature a Ryzen 2 APU (Gen3), the most probable scenario is that they'll feature a custom Ryzen+ APU (Gen2).
 

Metalingus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,008
It's not just the graphics. Part of the reason levels/worlds this gen have been so small/claustrophobic is the underpowered jaguar CPU both consoles shared (and the slow hdd strangling asset streaming).

Honestly, I'm more excited for larger, fully realized worlds than I am the graphical improvement.
Did games really feel small and claustrophobic to you this gen?
 

ADS

Member
Oct 27, 2017
224
Did games really feel small and claustrophobic to you this gen?
Absolutely. You had stuff like the Witcher 3, which was big, but the world was largely empty/static outside the major cities. The actually interesting parts of Witcher 3 (dungeons, cities, etc) were very claustrophobic. RDR2 was the same, claustrophobic feeling points of interest dotted in a big empty world. I don't want big empty worlds, I want big living worlds.
 

Earthed

Member
Sep 26, 2019
74
Absolutely. You had stuff like the Witcher 3, which was big, but the world was largely empty/static outside the major cities. The actually interesting parts of Witcher 3 (dungeons, cities, etc) were very claustrophobic. RDR2 was the same, points of interest dotted in a big empty world. I don't want big empty worlds, I want big living worlds.
I'm sure stuff like that will end up being better implemented next gen. But in the case of stuff like RDR2 and even The Witcher 3, a lot of it is also simply the amount of content creation needed to make something feel even more contiguous and lived in than it already is.
 

Inuhanyou

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,255
New Jersey
It'll allow developers to do a lot more than they can currently on consoles. I'm not sure what else you expect people to talk about OP? Graphics on their own are just one aspect of what developers are capable of improving on