Wow that's one boss I absolutely dominated in my play through. I believe I had the fire paper by that point and just went to town getting behind her a lot and if I remember right I beat her on my second attempt :)
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A Bloodborne Frustration Thread
- Thread starter Pirate Bae
- Start date
Wow that's one boss I absolutely dominated in my play through. I believe I had the fire paper by that point and just went to town getting behind her a lot and if I remember right I beat her on my second attempt :)
Yeah, read the last part. I'm joking about the guy not being able to kill that boss but I was doing (I'm guessing far more) horribly against the Blood Beast or whatever it's name is and my replay of the game didn't last long because I haven't been able to defeat it again. Sorry if I wasn't clear.
Oh and he's definitely NOT the "hardest boss in the game", lol.
Well, probably if you just go beeline the main story only without doing optional stuff.
Well, probably if you just go beeline the main story only without doing optional stuff.
Hey OP, I know you've got a lot of great advice so far already, but here's my take on how to learn him. First off, if you're getting him down to beast phase regularly, that's pretty good. I always try - when stuck with a boss in these games - to spend a couple of goes just dodging and watching the boss intently (you can even video it using the share feature and watch it back) until you can work out his tells. Don't worry about losing - accept you might lose but plan to work out what he does before each move. Also, whilst doing this don't use blood vials. Grinding for them is useful but it feels annoying after losing them in a boss fight. The one thing I would change in this game is make the vials like Estus.
Then, work out what you can do during each tell to make the move either parryable or dodgeable. Basically with Papa G I parry his first form and then dodge his second - with the first his parry windows are quite big and with the second, you should be aiming to dodge into him, through his attacks and then punish him. Don't get greedy, just do a couple of hits and then reset.
Finally, when I want to beat him (and this might sound odd but it works for me) is commentate yourself through the battle. Talk through his tells. For example, I would say things like 'right, he's switched his axe to two handed form, so when he spins there will be two spins. There it is, now I can attack for one swing before I need to dodge out," out loud and it would calm me down, remind me of the tells and make sure I was approaching it logically instead of panicking. Weird, but it might help!
Then, work out what you can do during each tell to make the move either parryable or dodgeable. Basically with Papa G I parry his first form and then dodge his second - with the first his parry windows are quite big and with the second, you should be aiming to dodge into him, through his attacks and then punish him. Don't get greedy, just do a couple of hits and then reset.
Finally, when I want to beat him (and this might sound odd but it works for me) is commentate yourself through the battle. Talk through his tells. For example, I would say things like 'right, he's switched his axe to two handed form, so when he spins there will be two spins. There it is, now I can attack for one swing before I need to dodge out," out loud and it would calm me down, remind me of the tells and make sure I was approaching it logically instead of panicking. Weird, but it might help!
Aside from the last boss Of the game which I never beat the father took me the most attempts to beat.
OP
OP
Taking the rest of the night to chill and cuddle with the fur babies
It is and hard fight, probably the hardest also because its quite early in the game, but beating it will make you clear HOW to beat the game basically.
Oh and advice -> I never used the music box, it was actually harder for me to use that thing...
Here how I did it... there are 2 phases. The first when he is human, here you can learn to parry (I never did, and I platinumed the game and the dlc), here you can take your time and hit him without much hurry... when he transform then its all about avoid but NEVER and I say, never try to run away, he is much faster than you. For me it worked to avoid but going forward and being quite aggressive, he is super scary in this form, but is actually way easier to beat than in the previous one...
Also if you start to get nervous, just stop playing and go back later, dont get stressed because it doesnt help and always try to understand what went wrong and why you lose... if it was just bad luck or an error you did.
Really, after this fight the game looks much less intimidating, you will always think "I beat Father Gascoigne, I can do anything"
Oh and advice -> I never used the music box, it was actually harder for me to use that thing...
Here how I did it... there are 2 phases. The first when he is human, here you can learn to parry (I never did, and I platinumed the game and the dlc), here you can take your time and hit him without much hurry... when he transform then its all about avoid but NEVER and I say, never try to run away, he is much faster than you. For me it worked to avoid but going forward and being quite aggressive, he is super scary in this form, but is actually way easier to beat than in the previous one...
Also if you start to get nervous, just stop playing and go back later, dont get stressed because it doesnt help and always try to understand what went wrong and why you lose... if it was just bad luck or an error you did.
Really, after this fight the game looks much less intimidating, you will always think "I beat Father Gascoigne, I can do anything"
Aight, in a far more serious manner because this place can turn me into a cynical asshole who doesn't know how to joke anymore, the Bell Gargoyle's were my pain in the ass in Dark Souls 1. I swear those were the hardest bosses for me and while the rest wasn't a cakewalk, I didn't do as badly with the rest of them.
OP
OP
This is some very good insight. Thank you very much for the advice :)
*Every* humanoid enemy in this game can be parried, including bosses. If you can do parries properly, it will make the fight against them much, much easier.
Also some weapons are stronger against particular type of enemies. For example, Serrated weapons (weapons with "teeth"), will do extra 20% damage to beasts, and since plenty of bosses in this game are beasts, you'd do well to familiarize yourself with one of them (the short version of Saw Cleaver, both versions of Saw Spear, the whip version of Threaded Cane, are some of the examples of serrated weapons)
OP
OP
I really like the Threaded Cane, but I'm not too jazzed about the Saw Cleaver. Haven't bought the Spear yet, but I will try that as my next purchase.
I'll post my stats tomorrow too.
Hehe... insight... You're going to like the rest of this game, OP. You're in for some good times.
Threaded Cane is, as you say, bae, hahaha. I platinumed the whole game plus completing the DLC all the way through by using it. YMMV, but I really adore it.
If you are already using the Cane, then I assume your build is skewing more towards the Skill side of things, then Saw Spear is a superior choice than Saw Cleaver since it is more skill-oriented. In fact, Saw Spear in general is a much better choice than Saw Cleaver, to be honest, as both its short and extended form is Serrated (while the Cleaver is only serrated on its short form), their speed are similar, and Spear can do Thrust Damage while the Cleaver cannot. True, Cleaver offers a tiny bit more damage than Spear, but the difference is really negligible.
I really should go back and learn to parry. My first playthrough was pretty much completely w/o parry and maybe because I never learned the technique I got my ass handed to me on NG+ and never really bothered with it.
I tried, but never really felt I "got" it and besides occasional tries (and failures) I just stuck with dodging the shit out of things.
I tried, but never really felt I "got" it and besides occasional tries (and failures) I just stuck with dodging the shit out of things.
No worries - let us know how you get on. One of the oddest things about these type of games is the vicarious thrill you get from watching/hearing about other people getting through the difficult bits. It's the only series I know off where I will gladly watch somebody play through just to see their reactions when they beat their most difficult boss.
OP
OP
Uh my highest stat other than vitality is strength, actually
If you want to cheese it, there's one particular tree in the graveyard that you can use to keep him at bay and just kite around for most of the fight. That was how I ended up beating him.
If all else fails and the fight is still kicking your butt, I believe you can summon help. No shame in that.
Good luck OP
Good luck OP
You should put points into skill if you want to stick with the cane. Have you tried the Hunter's Axe? That's a strength weapon and super fun!
....wat? Every boss from the DLC is ten times harder than Gascoyne -at the very least- (well, except the Emisaries).
Gascoyne is definitely a tutorial boss, nothing more than that.
Ow, hahaha. Since you said you really like Threaded Cane and how you're really not into Saw Cleaver, I thought you're going Skill.
Well hmmm, well Strength weapons are alright. The Hunter Axe is cool, and it's strong against mobs, but since it can only do blunt damage there would be plenty of times when the damage it offers just simply not that good. One of the absolute best melee weapon in this game is Strength tho, although it's only DLC (although it also worth noting that a weapon that many also consider as one of the best is an exclusively Skill weapon, haha)
Just so you know, riposte damage scales off from Skill only, so a riposte from Strength-builds will be much weaker than a riposte from Skill-builds.
Didn't read any of my follow-up posts?
Also, what is with people pointing out the DLC bosses when I'm talking about Bloodborne, not Old Hunters, anyway?
If you look at the weapon menu, you can see the attributes of each. The attribute Bonus (red circle) is how much the weapon damage scales with each parametre. Muscle is Strenght and Arm is skill, and it goes from A to E, with A being the biggest gains per level. So we can see this weapon scales evently when you level up Strenght and Skill, but there's weapon that scales better with one or other, or other skills like Bloodtinge. In your case the Threated Cane is a Skill weapon.
Btw, Strenght and Skill has 2 softcaps, where gainings per level is reduced. one is at 25 and the second is at 50 (you should never level up that skill after 50). That means that for some weapons, for example a Strenght B/Skill C scaling, leveling Skill till 25 will net you more gains that leveling Strenght from 25 to 50.
Old Hunters is so essential that no one thinks of it as separate from the main game. :)
OP
OP
Plenty of bosses in the Chalice is much harder than Gascoigne. It's not DLC :P
Also yeah, I would also consider one or two bosses in the main game as harder than Gascoigne.
OP
OP
Hmm, ok. Looks like I should grind a bit
If you look at the weapon menu, you can see the attributes of each. The attribute Bonus (red circle) is how much the weapon damage scales with each parametre. Muscle is Strenght and Arm is skill, and it goes from A to D, with A being the biggest gains per level. So we can see this weapon scales evently when you level up Strenght and Skill, but there's weapon that scales better with one or other, or other skills like Bloodtinge. In your case the Threated Cane is a Skill weapon.
I was wondering what those meant...thanks a bunch
Yeah that took me so damn long. Struggled. Toggling off lock on changed the game for me and made dealing with the two so much easier.
I think it's designed to be a "mental hurdle" for some, hard enough to make you doubt yourself but very rewarding once you get through it. Sets the tone for the rest of the boss fights.
Yeah just mess around, you'll get comfy with it after awhile. It can get messy and you'll miscalculate it every once in awhile if you're like me though. Lol
Uh oh, you've raised the wrong stat, if you're going to use a skill weapon like the Cane. Luckily, you're still in the beginning, so it's not a gamebreaker for you. The upside with skill-based build is, that it also increases visceral damage which goes well with parrying.
Yes, for optimal play, you should basically build your stats based on what weapon you are going to use.
General rule: Strength is for staggering, but your Riposte/visceral will suffer. Skill is for fast, fluid combos, but generally weapon in this category cannot stagger. Strong at riposte/visceral.
To get the most damage out of your melee weapons, raising Strength and Skill is a viable build, though your range options will be limited.
Blood vials scale off Vitality, so raising it is important.
There is also the concept of soft-cap and hard cap on stats. I can explain further if you wish, hahaha.
My son when he was 12 went from barely being able to kill a single enemy to demanding that I bought the dlc, within the space of a few weeks. Bosses that had him in tears were crushed by his mastery of the parry and dodge. I had a ride watching him play.
Don't worry about it. Just put points into skill until it's balanced with strength, then you have a nice versatile build that can equip lots of different weapons. Then if you do stick with the cane just keep pumping up skill.
Parry, music box, charged axe to the face, fight near ther stairs, git gud...
The ways to beat him are numerous, don't lose faith, try to stick to a single weapon to get a good fell of it (none of the starters are better, all have pros and cons, but the cane sword is the most classy : o) and persevere.
The ways to beat him are numerous, don't lose faith, try to stick to a single weapon to get a good fell of it (none of the starters are better, all have pros and cons, but the cane sword is the most classy : o) and persevere.
Just cheese him. Bait him to follow you onto the stairs and hop off yourself. Then you can attack him through the stairs from a safe distance.
I never properly learned to parry, and beat the game (pre-dlc)
I never properly learned to parry, and beat the game (pre-dlc)
Maybe so, but that is a pretty imprecise reading of "Hardest in [X game]" at best, and at worst is actually being purposefully obtuse to score "You're wrong" points -- even when I have like 2 follow-up posts in this thread, on the same page I think, detailing what is meant by "Hard", since everyone seems to have their own interpretation here.
I actually have no issue with the statement: "X boss from Old Hunters is harder" -- hell, pick whichever one you find the hardest, make the case for it, and that's fine, but anyone who has actually sat around the campfires of old and discussed the pain and suffering of learning BB shouldn't find the "Father Gascoigne git gud" moment even slightly controversial. People who are able to get past the intro of BB, on average, probably make it through the entire game with far less difficulty -- at least such that you tend not to see threads whining about, frankly, any other bosses (though I am sure they exist). When I see a thread like this, I almost always assume it's FG, and it almost always is, and there is a reason for that regardless of whatever boss you or your friends struggled on.
Again, my follow-up posts are essential reading for understanding what I mean by this. Nobody has any issue with the statement: "Your hardest From game is your first" -- though I am sure someone is now drafting something in contrast with that. My statement of Gasgoine being hardest is in line with that: when you have so much game in front of you, and you are struggling, there's execution (what you guys describe as "Hard") and there is the mental warfare of "gitting gud", which is what I am trying to underscore with the original sentiment.
OP
OP
I like to raise Endurance early. That extra stamina can save your life, or allow you to get an extra hit in.
Also OP, don't let people who post "beat him on second try" or something like this irritate you since this doesn't mean much in Bloodborne (or souls games). You can farm one spot for days before moving on and have a way higher level and thus more health, defense, and damage compared to someone else who is always advancing. Add weapon upgrades and you can't really compare it.
I remember someone in the fresh "Old Hunters OT" thread on GAF (or was it already Era?) who was constantly posting how he beat that boss easily with first try and rolled through this and that area in the DLC, without breaking a sweat, till i asked for his level and he was way overleveled and entered the DLC in his first BB playthrough (Old Hunters gets a signifcant difficulty boost boost in NG+).
Father G is a roadblock but he prepares you for the following stuff. I came right from Demon's Souls and Dark Souls platinum trophy to BB and still struggled with the Father. Nothing unusual.
I remember someone in the fresh "Old Hunters OT" thread on GAF (or was it already Era?) who was constantly posting how he beat that boss easily with first try and rolled through this and that area in the DLC, without breaking a sweat, till i asked for his level and he was way overleveled and entered the DLC in his first BB playthrough (Old Hunters gets a signifcant difficulty boost boost in NG+).
Father G is a roadblock but he prepares you for the following stuff. I came right from Demon's Souls and Dark Souls platinum trophy to BB and still struggled with the Father. Nothing unusual.
Even as a Souls veteran, I found him to be damn hard. I always played Souls with a shield so it took me a while to git gud at Bloodborne. Father G is a real roadblock and forces you to learn the games mechanics. I needed a ton of tries. But after that, it was mostly smooth sailing.
Use blunderbus for parries in this fight.
Offers more room for execution than the pistol.
The Axe is also your friend in this fight.
Spin attack works great when you're not trying to parry.
When father G reaches hsi final phase it's best to run up the stairs and fight there.
When he lunges at you dodge INTO his attack NOT away.
If you're lucky this will happen. lol
Offers more room for execution than the pistol.
The Axe is also your friend in this fight.
Spin attack works great when you're not trying to parry.
When father G reaches hsi final phase it's best to run up the stairs and fight there.
When he lunges at you dodge INTO his attack NOT away.
If you're lucky this will happen. lol
Well alright :)
Generally speaking, as far as "important stat" goes:
- Vitality = Increase your health, obviously, but also your defense and how much blood vials heals you.
- Stamina = Increase your stamina, people generally just put 20 in here. 15 is also viable, depending on your preference.
- Strength = Increase damage from Strength based weapons, obviously.
- Skill = Increase damage from Skill based weapons, also increase visceral damage.
- Bloodtinge = Increase damage from your guns, and your arrows for a particular DLC weapon. There are several hard boss fights where having high bloodtinge will benefit you greatly. Two guns, in particular, will give you great damage potential if you raise this up.
- Arcane = As far as weapon damage goes, not many weapon benefits from this. In fact, in some weapons if you have say D scaling in strength and C/B scaling in Arcane, you will still benefit more from increasing Strength instead of Arcane. It's required to use some of the more exotic buff/ranged options.
The soft cap is 25 for Vitality, Strength, Skill, Bloodtinge, and Stamina while the hard caps is 50, excepting Stamina that hard caps at 40. Arcane doesn't have soft or hard-caps, all items (not weapon though) benefiting from it will continue to scale up well up to 99. Soft caps means your stat will increase less than they did before hitting it, while hard caps means that the gains you get from raising it will be extremely negligible it's not worth doing.
Generally speaking, melee weapons fall into Strength, Skill, or Strength/Skill, otherwise known as Quality builds. Example of Quality build are: Ludwig Holyblade, and, well, actually Saw Cleaver and Saw Spear is more of a Quality build weapon than Strength/Skill weapons respectively. Skill also pairs up well with Bloodtinge if you have more range options, and there is a specific DLC weapon that benefits greatly from this combination.
People that use Strength/Bloodtinge or Strength/Arcane do so mostly with the intention of using two specific DLC weapons, since only these two melee weapons are designed specifically to benefit from these two builds. There is also a melee weapon that is Arcane only, but again, it's DLC only and it's something that you can only get by beating the last boss of the DLC (and fulfilling a specific side quest to unlock its full potential), so yeah.
That's all for now, hahaha. Feel free to ask anything if you wish.
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