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A Reminder That Deplatforming Works

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Crossing Eden

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,374
As with any instance where a cesspool of hate is finally being dealt with there are the usual people who react this way:
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A reminder. Deplatforming actually works.

Whether it's Alex Jones who's now being faced with several lawsuits, Milo who's now $4 million in debt , Richard Spencer who only was brought up because CNN gave him a platform, a hate filled subreddit, etc. deplatforming opens the door to a ton of issues for those causes
https://apnews.com/579ed24d02c5449594e40925447ce833

Dealing with the problem directly, like an infestation of cockroaches in your home, is effective.

"BUT THEY'LL JUST GO SOMEWHERE ELSE" is always said time and again


No, because typically the users aren't that radicalized and dedicated to the cause, the ease of access was one of the main contributors to radicalization:



Doing nothing has never been the solution.



And for the NUCLEAR TAKES

"Ok these people were deplatformed but the shootings and things keep happening."


A reminder about who our president is, and what kind of crowd he attracts with his rhetoric:



"Ok but none of this is a perfect solution"



It's not supposed to be.
EBO7eRtUYAAt2So.png
 
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mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,190
You could present the argument without the condescending tone, but I understand it probably gets more views so I guess there's that. In any case I agree with the premise.
 
CopperPuppy

CopperPuppy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,636
Immediately post-2016, it felt like I was hearing about Alex Jones everywhere. Since losing his soapbox I literally almost forgot he existed. I couldn't tell you if he still has a show or what. Just complete irrelevance.
mrmoose said:
You could present the argument without the condescending tone, but I understand it probably gets more views so I guess there's that. In any case I agree with the premise.
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Lmao right in the title

freshwaterthumbnail_1506535882.jpg
 
Betty

Betty

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,604
It's true.

Milo feels like a non entity, Alex Jones isn't being talked about as much.

It just works.
 

Deleted member 43084

Banned
May 9, 2018
3,600
The real weird part of this whole thing is that the the platforms doubled down on not taking down 8chan, then reversed positions.
 
iareharSon

iareharSon

Member
Oct 30, 2017
8,940
Of course it works, and even if it didn't work the majority of the time - in what reality is inaction a potentially more fruitful alternative?
 
L Thammy

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,041
There was an article I read about far right groups in Canada which demonstrated something that I think is related. If there isn't an active effort to keep hate groups together and focused, or if those efforts are frustrated, they can break down on their own:

It's not just law enforcement right-wing extremists have to be watchful for; sometimes the enemy is their peers. Fighting in and between neo-Nazi groups is common as members jockey for power and status, the study said.

"They hate so much and so many that they start to hate one another," one officer said.

Some who have left the movement simply grew tired of constantly having to justify their racist, homophobic or anti-Semitic stances.

"Hating," it turned out, "was exhausting."
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Deleted member 46958

User requested account closure
Banned
Aug 22, 2018
2,574
OP thanks, but also fuck off with the condescension.

Not everyone is literate to these internet goings-on. This forum. smh.
 
OP
OP
Crossing Eden

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,374
Bran-dono said:
OP thanks, but also fuck off with the condescension.

Not everyone is literate to these internet goings-on. This forum. smh.
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If someone's not literate then how is anyone obligated to take their suggestions about a situation seriously? 🤔

Hell that makes it even worse.

"I'm not informed about this situation but here's my take about why deplatforming won't work."

I saw your posts in the other thread and the OP is absolutely not directed at you. Because you were genuinely asking a question, not pearl clutching, fearmongering, and suggesting that we do nothing about websites like 8chan or people like Alex Jones.
 

Deleted member 46958

User requested account closure
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Aug 22, 2018
2,574
Crossing Eden said:
If someone's not literate then how is anyone obligated to take their suggestions about a situation seriously? 🤔
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By schooling them in such a way that they come out INFORMED. Then maybe they can sit with it. More knowledge makes for less ignorance which is great if it's sought out. I posited this in another thread, and was met with "WELL HOW DOES NO ONE UNDERSTAND THIS?" With implications that they are lesser in intelligence for it. You're trying to be informative, but you're being a twat about it.

This forum is full of prudes with their noses in the air. Christ. Think I've head enough.
 
OP
OP
Crossing Eden

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,374
Bran-dono said:
By schooling them in such a way that they come out INFORMED. Then maybe they can sit with it. More knowledge makes for less ignorance which is great if it's sought out. I posited this in another thread, and was met with "WELL HOW DOES NO ONE UNDERSTAND THIS?" With implications that they are lesser in intelligence for it. You're trying to be informative, but you're being a twat about it.

This forum is full of prudes with their noses in the air. Christ. Think I've head enough.
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I'll repeat my edit

I saw your posts in the other thread and the OP is absolutely not directed at you. Because you were genuinely asking a question, not pearl clutching, fearmongering, and suggesting that we do nothing about websites like 8chan or people like Alex Jones.
 

Deleted member 46958

User requested account closure
Banned
Aug 22, 2018
2,574
Crossing Eden said:
I'll repeat my edit

I saw your posts in the other thread and the OP is absolutely not directed at you. Because you were genuinely asking a question, not pearl clutching, fearmongering, and suggesting that we do nothing about websites like 8chan or people like Alex Jones.
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Well I fucked up here. I thought it was directed at people just lacking information and were none the wiser, being flamed for simply asking. I apologize.
 
Christian

Christian

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,636
The cowardly responses to 8chan being taken down are really disturbing. "Now they'll really escalate!" Like, people are being murdered en masse by terrorists engendered on these websites. And your concern is that things will get worse? You're essentially saying that you're fine with casualties where they are now, because things might get worse? Even though evidence indicates that this is a misguided way of thinking, anyway? Or, you're okay with doing nothing as people die, because the websites will just pop up again elsewhere? What the fuck is wrong with people?
 
OP
OP
Crossing Eden

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,374
Bran-dono said:
Well I fucked up here. I thought it was directed at people just lacking information and were none the wiser, being flamed for simply asking. I apologize.
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There's a very explicit difference between

"Hey guys i'm genuinely curious about the end result can you point out how this is effective"

and

"dealing with cockroaches will literally spawn more cockroaches there's no way doing anything will work and I will outright ignore the other times that it did"

Paraphrasing things intentionally or unintentionally said in reaction to events like 8chan being taken down, there is a genuineness with the former that's absent in the latter. One of hte most frustrating aspects of online discussion is

"I don't know much about this thing BUT *insert nuclear take here*"
 
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Cuburger

Cuburger

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,975
Time and time again, deplatforming shown to be effective. Too bad it isn't a sentiment that it more universally accepted or recognized.

Now, to do some serious deplatforming in 2020.
 

softfocus

Member
Oct 30, 2017
903
The only things we hear from Alex Jones is that he's being sued up the ass by the parents of the victims of Sandy Hook, and that he had child pornography on his computer.
Tommy Robinson (or Stephen Yaxley-Lennon) has been deplatformed and is currently serving a prison sentence, with the only news that he got decked by a pensioner in the showers.

Next we need Katie Hopkins, Paul Joseph Watson, Steven Crowder, Mike Cernovich, Steven Bannon, and Nigel Farage taken off their platforms. And I'm sure I've forgotten many other names, the more hateful people lacking a platform to spout their hate filled rhetoric, the better.
 

ccbfan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,498
Did you even read the Georgia Tech study?

It's literally nothing about the effectiveness of deplatforming. It literally just says if Reddit start banning hate speech, people will either stop posting hate speech on reddit or leave reddit. Well no duh, if ERA starts banning people talking about steak, people will stop talking about steak on ERA or leave because they feel its being too restrictive. It doesn't mean people stop eating steak.
 
OP
OP
Crossing Eden

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,374
ccbfan said:
Did you even read the Georgia Tech study?

It's literally nothing about the effectiveness of deplatforming. It literally just says if Reddit start banning hate speech, people will either stop posting hate speech on reddit or leave reddit. Well no duh, if ERA starts banning people talking about steak, people will stop talking about steak on ERA or leave because they feel its being too restrictive. It doesn't mean people stop eating steak.
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What do you think happens after those people leave reddit? 🤔
 
L Thammy

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,041
I will say, though, that I still wonder if Milo is really the same thing as the others mechanically. The most important thing about seeing that deplatforming works is that it encourages us to try to push for it; to do things like pressuring the companies that support far right platforms and voices to shut them down. Milo's somewhat unique in that his own base hated him for being gay and Jewish, and so may have been waiting on an excuse to eat him alive.

Then again, I suppose Milo does serve as yet another demonstrator that conservative voices are completely interchangeable and disposable. They have no real perceived value as individuals, and even their bases won't care to see them fall if they can find another voice to spout the same rhetoric. If they find another self-hating gay person who is a big Nazi fan, he can just as easily do what Milo did.

Bran-dono said:
This forum is full of prudes with their noses in the air. Christ. Think I've head enough.
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I'm trying to figure out what a "prude" is in the context of his discussion. Someone who is really uppity about Nazis being bad?
 
faceless

faceless

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,198
they KNOW that deplatforming works, but they also KNOW that spreading lies can be effective sometimes.

so they parade around a bunch of lies about how "deplatforming doesn't work" because they're so used to their lies working sometimes so "it doesn't hurt to try" all the time.
 
OP
OP
Crossing Eden

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,374
ccbfan said:
No clue, we'll probably find out in a few months after another tragedy.

Just like most people didn't know about 8chan until new zealand shooting.
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Read my edit fam

L Thammy said:
I will say, though, that I still wonder if Milo is really the same thing as the others mechanically. The most important thing about seeing that deplatforming works is that it encourages us to try to push for it; to do things like pressuring the companies that support far right platforms and voices to shut them down. Milo's somewhat unique in that his own base hated him for being gay and Jewish, and so may have been waiting on an excuse to eat him alive.

Then again, I suppose Milo does serve as yet another demonstrator that conservative voices are completely interchangeable and disposable. They have no real perceived value as individuals, and even their bases won't care to see them fall if they can find another voice to spout the same rhetoric. If they find another self-hating gay person who is a big Nazi fan, he can just as easily do what Milo did.
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The thing about "but someone will just replace them" is that those replacements never really show up. People like Milo and Alex Jones spent years building their audience, and the issue was that the big tech companies, youtube, facebook, twitter, etc. all straight up signal boosted their rhetoric. And with that kind of identity specifically, one based on nothing but "owning the libs," there's a very very real lack of dedication amongst the majority.
 
L Thammy

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,041
If you're on a big site like Reddit or 4chan, there are plenty of reasons you could be there. 4chan was originally an anime board or something, it's ironic nerd shit, right? Maybe you're doing that. And Reddit's got all these specialty areas. Maybe that's why you're there and you just wander into bad places or something.

If you're on Stormfront, we know exactly why you're there. There's no other reason for you to be on that site.
 

ccbfan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,498
Crossing Eden said:
Ah yes, they go to a WAY smaller, less visible, and less easily accessible platform than reddit. Where do you think the users of 8chan are now? 🤔
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Smaller doesn't mean safer.

You're just concentrating the hate, strengthening the echo chamber. At least on reddit there was a large diverse varieity of people to fight against the hate. On an echo chamber like 8chan, you're just building it up.

We're have 3 mass shootings because of 8chan. How many came out of reddit with that many more users?
 
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