A watermark can be briefly seen in Kingdom Hearts 3’s Let it Go cutscene

Oct 25, 2017
3,188
Haven't played the game yet, so there's pre-rendered cutscenes? Man, that sucks not only due to disc size but also increasing the resolution of the in-game down the road not affecting them. Any idea what resolution they're rendered in?
 

MP!

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,711
Las Vegas
Either someone brought a cracked copy to work or The Terminators joining SD&G in KHIV.
a cracked copy likely wouldn't display the watermark... that's why someone would crack it..

It's likely that a computer on the render farm didn't have an updated license... I don't think this indicates anything illegal
 
Nov 16, 2017
174
I want to know how much the license costs so I can laugh harder at SE.
It's not a cost issue, it's a network shitting the bed issue.

I have had a ton of issues with arnold and i'm not really comfortable using it in production because of things like this. Most render engines have a separate trial and full version so that if they drop the licenses, they wont render - and you'll get a notification that there's an issue.
Rendering everything as normal and slapping watermarks all over it because the internal network was under a lot of strain is beyond useless and a huge problem.

For massive studios with hundreds of employees and internal render farms they have the IT staff and support to make sure this kind of thing doesnt happen, but smaller studios can get fucked by it. (and the re-render with english lip sync will have been outsourced to a small studio)
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,363
Yeah had a brain fart and updated the post. Still weird to me that in a Disney product they wouldn't opt to use the actual Pixar rendering suite to render ... you know uhh Pixar scenes.
Use Disney or Pixars render tech to achieve things that Arnold or Redshift could do for half the price/work/computing power?

Disney and Pixars renderers are very expensive and require a team of trained monkeys to actually get the results that Pix and Disney achieve.....Arnold, Redshift
To put things into perspective, talking about scenes in Frozen:
Fifty effects artists and lighting artists worked together on the technology to create "one single shot" in which Elsa builds her ice palace. Its complexity required 30 hours to render each frame, with 4,000 computers rendering one frame at a time.
30 Hours x 4000 computers.
Thats 120,000 hours of computing power per frame.....get serious friend.
Current renderers can achieve production quality at a lower price point, and dont require hiring highly specialized artists from Disney/Pixar to do relatively simple scenes.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,916
I’m so glad I played through this sequence yesterday. I would’ve HATED to get spoiled that there was going to be a Let it go scene before I played it. The title is definitey a spoiler and is unnecessary. Please remove it.
 
Feb 1, 2018
625
why are they using third party software ?

Don't SE have Visualworks (and a fairly huge R&D dep) dedicated entirely for in house pre-rendered movies ?
 
Feb 8, 2019
43
Watching the KH3 version next to the original... Any chance Disney actually gave them the source to work with? That sound more likely than them putting in the effort to recreate everything as close as they did!
Nomura confirmed that Disney gave them the models and motion data
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,910
Yeah this is such a minor thing that is understandably skipped over, especially if it wasn't even in the Japanese version. It's not really cheap or lazy. If anything I find it kinda humbling.

For what its worth the KH version also apparently "fixes" the weird Elsa hair clip from the movie



I believe they cut the scene differently?
 

Pal

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
Yeah this is such a minor thing that is understandably skipped over, especially if it wasn't even in the Japanese version. It's not really cheap or lazy. If anything I find it kinda humbling.

For what its worth the KH version also apparently "fixes" the weird Elsa hair clip from the movie



I believe they cut the scene differently?

I swear I simply cannot see the clipping people are talking about. When does it happen exactly? Where should I look at?
 
Oct 27, 2017
11,877
I swear I simply cannot see the clipping people are talking about. When does it happen exactly? Where should I look at?
Her braid just kinda phases through her arm.

You can tell by the way the hair moves. It’s not falling down like it’d been moved on top her arm.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,910
I swear I simply cannot see the clipping people are talking about. When does it happen exactly? Where should I look at?
It is a bit tricky to tell, but the tip of the braid is already on the other side of her arm after it passes by her back. Just keep an eye on her left armpit/shoulder area
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,569
I swear I simply cannot see the clipping people are talking about. When does it happen exactly? Where should I look at?
Not alone, even when it's segmented out like that, I still can't see whatever it is. I believe people when they say it's there, but whatever it is I have no clue what it is and where exactly I'm supposed to be looking.
 

Pal

Member
Oct 25, 2017
596
It is a bit tricky to tell, but the tip of the braid is already on the other side of her arm after it passes by her back. Just keep an eye on her left armpit/shoulder area
Ah....I do see it now. Well.......lol.....Cannot unsee it now :(



Not alone, even when it's segmented out like that, I still can't see whatever it is. I believe people when they say it's there, but whatever it is I have no clue what it is and where exactly I'm supposed to be looking.
Look exactly where the poster above you tells you to look for. The braid pass through her arm/shoulder as she makes it move with her left hand.
 
Jan 18, 2018
3,067
Yeah this is such a minor thing that is understandably skipped over, especially if it wasn't even in the Japanese version. It's not really cheap or lazy. If anything I find it kinda humbling.

For what its worth the KH version also apparently "fixes" the weird Elsa hair clip from the movie



I believe they cut the scene differently?
They angle it so that you can't see the clipping.
 
Dec 10, 2018
670
When I was in Uni doing a 3d course and batch rendering, there would be a person on duty looking through every frame because this happened even on legit copies of Arnold Renderer.
 
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Nov 16, 2017
174
30 Hours x 4000 computers.
Thats 120,000 hours of computing power per frame.....get serious friend.
uhh thats not right. it's 30 hours per frame. in order to render out the thousands of frames, they had 4k machines available to use.

30 hours per frame is already a shitload even for pixar / ILM, 120k is ludicrous.
 
Nov 16, 2017
174
When I was in Uni doing a 3d course and batch rendering, there would be a person on duty looking through every frame because this happened even on legit copoes of Arnold Renderer.
Arnold is famously shit for this. I guarantee they had to re-render thousands of individual frames to replace ones with watermarks and this is the only one that slipped through the cracks.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,419
If this only shows up in some scenes but not others, I wonder what happened?

Different computers? License expired somewhere along the way? A dropped connection to a licensing server? If they just didn't have a license this would be in everything, right?
If you look at the credits, the cutscenes were assisted by over a dozen different animation companies. One of them will have slipped slightly, and the QC person missed it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,790
Yeah. Just sounds like a bad machine in a render farm since its just a few frames or so

And its only in the English version of the clip
 
Dec 8, 2017
1,264
But..
I have seen comparison videos pop up on YouTube in the past few days so I thought most cutscenes in the game were realtime ?
Why even rerender them, especially since most I've seen are almost a 1:1 match for the originals in terms of camera angles and cuts ?
 
Oct 25, 2017
611
But..
I have seen comparison videos pop up on YouTube in the past few days so I thought most cutscenes in the game were realtime ?
Why even rerender them, especially since most I've seen are almost a 1:1 match for the originals in terms of camera angles and cuts ?
The game struggles when there a few particles effect on screen lol can't imagine how low it'd go if these videos were realtime.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,372
I wonder if the Arnold render developers now. Have ground to sue.... It's an unlicensed software uses for a Multi million retail product
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,170
But..
I have seen comparison videos pop up on YouTube in the past few days so I thought most cutscenes in the game were realtime ?
Why even rerender them, especially since most I've seen are almost a 1:1 match for the originals in terms of camera angles and cuts ?
For when they need bigger effects, particles and such; like when (mild spoiler) Aqua turns Castle Oblivion into Land of Departure

And I think there are two kinds of pre-rendered cutscenes, ones that try to look like gameplay but with an added touches, and the full-blown Visual Works cutscenes, like the secret movie.