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AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,162
How much is PS4 right now in US?

it hit 20m in september, so a safe guess should have it between 22 and 23 million. i think sales are something like this (feel free to correct me if you have better numbers):

ds: 53m
ps2: 45.6m
360: 43.1m
wii: 41.7m
gb/c: ~40m
gba: ~36m
psx: ~35m
nes: 33m
ps3: ~27m
atari 2600: 20-23m
ps4: 22-23m
3ds: 21m
snes: 20m
sega genesis: ~20m
xb1: 19m
n64: 18m
psp: 17m
xb: 14m
gc: 11m
wii u: 5.5m
nsw: 5m
dc: 4m
psv: 2.6m
tbgfx: 2.6m
saturn: 2m
master system: 2m
 

Deleted member 4021

Oct 25, 2017
1,707
The thing that made it so big was that it sold consistently, all over the world, for so long. There have been numerous consoles which have outpaced the PS2's early years, only to fall way behind at the end. It will be very difficult for any console to be that dominant again. The DS was the only one to come within spitting distance, but that's because it tapped into the mobile market pre-smartphones.
 

Titik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,490
it hit 20m in september, so a safe guess should have it between 22 and 23 million. i think sales are something like this (feel free to correct me if you have better numbers):

ds: 53m
ps2: 45.6m
360: 43.1m
wii: 41.7m
gb/c: ~40m
gba: ~36m
psx: ~35m
nes: 33m
ps3: ~27m
atari 2600: 20-23m
ps4: 22-23m
3ds: 21m
snes: 20m
sega genesis: ~20m
xb1: 19m
n64: 18m
psp: 17m
xb: 14m
gc: 11m
wii u: 5.5m
nsw: 5m
dc: 4m
psv: 2.6m
tbgfx: 2.6m
saturn: 2m
master system: 2m
I would say that the Switch has the potential to sell DS like levels especially when Pokemon and a third party break out comes out. Not sure if it will surpass it though because we have smartphones now.
 

Zedark

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,719
The Netherlands
Just a heads up on french sales on amazon.fr in 2018 so far. The 5 first console SKUs are all Switch:
https://www.amazon.fr/gp/bestsellers/2018/videogames/ref=zg_bs_tab_t_bsar#1

Basically, we are looking at Japan like success here.

First 2 SKU only on amazon.com in the US and UK.
I'be noticed that Bayonetta collection is ranking really high everywhere on amazon. Wonder if that's just amazon's niche bias or indicative of a rather good performance.
 

Bitch Pudding

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,202
Overall Sony had a very good year, and also a solid holiday season. But. The December results in the US indicate that this year's peak, especially the outstanding November performance, was clearly driven by discounts of the baseline SKU. I think going back to $299 for the first two weeks in December (after that $199 BF week discount) was not only a move to crossfinance that $199 discount but also some kind of experimental move to test the attractiveness of the Slim at $299 in a timeframe where people usually buy gaming consoles. And apparently the $249 a week before Christmas wasn't nearly good enough to make up for that two weeks.

If so, that experimental ballon surely was a true reality shock for Sony. I mean, it was clear from the beginning that there would be a major gap, but probably not like this. The truth is that PS4 needs severe discounts to move a serious amount of consoles in 2018 an ongoing. Neither MS nor Sony can "afford" selling their baseline consoles for $299 throughout the year. And I am talking MSRP here.

Thing is, the people you attract with those discounts are the (super) price sensitive ones. So they are the ones who also tend to buy used instead of new games (which also means they don't buy digital that much) and avoid costly online subscriptions (at least I expect that the PS+ attach rate is significantly lower compared to those who bought an OG PS4 or a Pro for $399).

My conclusion is that the results indicate that Sony needs to introduce a PS4 successor which attracts the price insensitive consumer segments rather sooner than later, as in 2019 or 2020 at the very, very latest.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,056
Time for time for a greatest hits line? Digital pricing on early PS4 titles can be very competitive and it'd be interesting to see a digital greatest hits line. Try and bring those price conscious buyers into the stickier world of digital too
 

Titik

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,490
I was a little worried that Nintendo not having big hitters in the first half of 2018 but there doesn't need to be a need for any at least for the momen. Odyssey, Kart and BOTW will continually sell throughout 2018 and the rest of the life of the console. They might need a heavy hitter boost in the later half of 2018 though and I think that it will be a Smash port if no other big thing comes out. Pokemon will carry whatever year it comes out in. Prime 4 is more of a prestige title so it's more like an icing but it's not cake. Unless they go all out and it's a breakout hit.
 

Zedark

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,719
The Netherlands
That statement confused me when it came out. It was never going to happen and ultimately did not happen.
I see. I take from this that 3DS was behind last year's tally before December and had a smaller December (that would be expected, since Pokemon Sun Moon are a bigger deal than their Utlra versions, of course). Ah well, it was hardly expected beforehand that this was possible for this year, so it makes sense that it didn't happen.

Edit: Although the bit about the smaller December does not necessarily follow from your words, so I shouldn't take that from your words.
Is it possible that Switchs shipment number has surpassed WiiU's as we speak now?
Nintendo France president already confirmed that Switch passed the 13.56 million shipped of the WiiU LTD at the end of 2017:
Les Numériques said:
La Switch aujourd'hui a battu les niveaux de ventes de la Wii U sur toute sa carrière (13,56 millions d'unités entre 2012 et 2017).
Translation:
The Switch today has beaten the sales level of the WiiU throughout its whole sales lifetime (13.56 million between 2012 and 2017).
Source: https://www.lesnumeriques.com/loisi...da-l-incroyable-come-back-nintendo-a3491.html
 
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ZhugeEX

Senior Analyst at Niko Partners
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
3,099
I see. I take from this that 3DS was behind last year's tally before December and had a smaller December (that would be expected, since Pokemon Sun Moon are a bigger deal than their Utlra versions, of course). Ah well, it was hardly expected beforehand that this was possible for this year, so it makes sense that it didn't happen.

Edit: Although the bit about the smaller December does not necessarily follow from your words, so I shouldn't take that from your words.

Yup. The numbers it sold this year aren't bad by any means. It actually had a strong holiday. But the main point is that it sold less in 2017 than it did in 2016.
 

Ikaruga

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,055
Austria
Switch is no new generation, it's cleaning up the failure the WiiU was, that's also the reason why it already passed the WiiU in Japan and probably world wide too by the end of its first year. It will be interesting to see the Switch pass the Xbox One by the time the next generation arrives.

Don't forget the Design of the Switch, Nintendo could easily enhance its lifetime like they did with the new 3DS in two or three years, with a successer that could be two to three times more powerful, probably matching the regular PS4.

So this New Switch might release alongside the PS5 and Xbox Two, things will get messy by then, will the new Switch be a Gen 9 then? Even though the sales will be counted as one for the old and new switch(like it is with the new 3DS and the old one). In this scenario the Switch might end up as the market leader of the next generation by a huge margin. Perhaps that will be the right time to cast generations aside?
 

Kriegshand

Member
Oct 28, 2017
516
The thing that made it so big was that it sold consistently, all over the world, for so long. There have been numerous consoles which have outpaced the PS2's early years, only to fall way behind at the end. It will be very difficult for any console to be that dominant again. The DS was the only one to come within spitting distance, but that's because it tapped into the mobile market pre-smartphones.

There was a PS2 game called Singstar which was very popular with the casuals to a similar extent Just Dance was. Even my sister had a PS2 only for this game. This helped to prolong the life of the PS2. There were bundles for 99$ with Singstar included in the late years.
 
Last edited:
Oct 28, 2017
1,972
I think it all depends on the software actually released as well as the price point tbh.
If anything, this holiday proved there is a massive pent up demand in the wings for a $199 PS4.
Sony still has to lower the MSRP to $249 btw, and we still have to see the result of an official price drop with a bundle sku that isn't BF2 (HZD making the most sense really).

The thing is, 1 month does not a trend make, and given the state of deals in December (NSW being then clearly the prefered item this year) it just shows that price/ perceived value can overcome a problem of lesser desirability (as seen across 2017 for the XB1), like back in 2014 with a $229 XB1 bundled with $100 worth of software.

Now will the PS4 sell less units in 2018? Maybe. Probably even. But there will be more at play than simple historical data and 1 month being behind due to prioritizing revenue...

1 month doesnt make a trend but a year in context does. The industry is cyclical. Once your device starts to decline after 4 years of fantastic performance its either staying flat or going down.
 
Dec 23, 2017
8,802
The thing that made it so big was that it sold consistently, all over the world, for so long. There have been numerous consoles which have outpaced the PS2's early years, only to fall way behind at the end. It will be very difficult for any console to be that dominant again. The DS was the only one to come within spitting distance, but that's because it tapped into the mobile market pre-smartphones.
DS was a monster. But any speculation on what the numbers might be for switch in December?
 

Fastidioso

Banned
Nov 3, 2017
3,101
Overall Sony had a very good year, and also a solid holiday season. But. The December results in the US indicate that this year's peak, especially the outstanding November performance, was clearly driven by discounts of the baseline SKU. I think going back to $299 for the first two weeks in December (after that $199 BF week discount) was not only a move to crossfinance that $199 discount but also some kind of experimental move to test the attractiveness of the Slim at $299 in a timeframe where people usually buy gaming consoles. And apparently the $249 a week before Christmas wasn't nearly good enough to make up for that two weeks.

If so, that experimental ballon surely was a true reality shock for Sony. I mean, it was clear from the beginning that there would be a major gap, but probably not like this. The truth is that PS4 needs severe discounts to move a serious amount of consoles in 2018 an ongoing. Neither MS nor Sony can "afford" selling their baseline consoles for $299 throughout the year. And I am talking MSRP here.

Thing is, the people you attract with those discounts are the (super) price sensitive ones. So they are the ones who also tend to buy used instead of new games (which also means they don't buy digital that much) and avoid costly online subscriptions (at least I expect that the PS+ attach rate is significantly lower compared to those who bought an OG PS4 or a Pro for $399).

My conclusion is that the results indicate that Sony needs to introduce a PS4 successor which attracts the price insensitive consumer segments rather sooner than later, as in 2019 or 2020 at the very, very latest.
Really you think Sony doesn't take in the count at 199 price drops in November would have influenced badly the NPD December sales? I can't believe it for a second. In all honesty such result was quite predictable.
However I continue to think 1000k not bad at all.
 
Last edited:

MONSTER

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,522
Switch is no new generation, it's cleaning up the failure the WiiU was, that's also the reason why it already passed the WiiU in Japan and probably world wide too by the end of its first year. It will be interesting to see the Switch pass the Xbox One by the time the next generation arrives.

Don't forget the Design of the Switch, Nintendo could easily enhance its lifetime like they did with the new 3DS in two or three years, with a successer that could be two to three times more powerful, probably matching the regular PS4.

So this New Switch might release alongside the PS5 and Xbox Two, things will get messy by then, will the new Switch be a Gen 9 then? Even though the sales will be counted as one for the old and new switch(like it is with the new 3DS and the old one). In this scenario the Switch might end up as the market leader of the next generation by a huge margin. Perhaps that will be the right time to cast generations aside?

its easy to not think of new generations and its kinda irrelevant.

its easier to think of it in terms of timeframes
 

Lord Brady

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
8,392
it hit 20m in september, so a safe guess should have it between 22 and 23 million. i think sales are something like this (feel free to correct me if you have better numbers):

ds: 53m
ps2: 45.6m
360: 43.1m
wii: 41.7m
gb/c: ~40m
gba: ~36m
psx: ~35m
nes: 33m
ps3: ~27m
atari 2600: 20-23m
ps4: 22-23m
3ds: 21m
snes: 20m
sega genesis: ~20m
xb1: 19m
n64: 18m
psp: 17m
xb: 14m
gc: 11m
wii u: 5.5m
nsw: 5m
dc: 4m
psv: 2.6m
tbgfx: 2.6m
saturn: 2m
master system: 2m

DS was such a beast. Best gaming device I think I've ever owned (DS Lite). I doubt the Switch will even approach its numbers. Didn't expect to see 360 so high or that 3DS has done so poorly in relation to the DS. Mobile devices and mobile game pricing really killed Nintendo there.
 

Celine

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,030
Didn't expect to see 360 so high or that 3DS has done so poorly in relation to the DS. Mobile devices and mobile game pricing really killed Nintendo there.
3DS sales in US were disappointing not in relation with the DS (which is the best selling console ever in US, Japan, UK, France and so on) but compared to previous Nintendo handheld consoles.
On the relatively positive side 3DS is enjoying some sort of prolonged constant sales year after year (it's basically 4 years that it has a YTD around 2.4M).
Also first-party software sales prominence is higher compared other Nintendo handheld consoles (which mean more profits for Nintendo but also highlight the difficulty in attracting third-party support for 3DS beyond the first wave).
 
Last edited:

slavesnyder

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,127
SlaveSnyder Media Corp.
If so, that experimental ballon surely was a true reality shock for Sony. I mean, it was clear from the beginning that there would be a major gap, but probably not like this. The truth is that PS4 needs severe discounts to move a serious amount of consoles in 2018 an ongoing. Neither MS nor Sony can "afford" selling their baseline consoles for $299 throughout the year. And I am talking MSRP here.
How is it a shock that people go apeshit and cut all strings of mental health and human dignity if you lower the price to a level you might still feel comfortable and profitable with and on which the competition is already riding along for a full year?
i think sony is quite pleased to see that whenever they feel like it they can just push the 199 button and all pain will be gone, just like a peridural anesthesia.
 

Bitch Pudding

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,202
i think sony is quite pleased to see that whenever they feel like it they can just push the 199 button and all pain will be gone, just like a peridural anesthesia.

Hey, that's exactly what I said in November. However, I believe going back to $299 for such a long time in such an important period was a liiittle bit too overconfident (only with regard to unit sales of course).

Besides, given the current MSRP pushing that $199 button actually DOES hurt Sony a lot (only with regard to revenues of course).