Yeah, the somniums there were awful (ShovelForge eugh), alongside the conspiracy stuff being relatively weak.
I think I'm on the very final bit now. Still having a ton of fun, but not too jazzed with the last few reveals.
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I think I'm on the very final bit now. Still having a ton of fun, but not too jazzed with the last few reveals.
So. Uh. I have one major issue. Regarding Date's status at the end of the game...
Everyone's just gonna let Falco's murders slide, huh? And why is Boss okay with this, as he was still doing killings after becoming a cop? Turning over a new leaf and trying to become a family man isn't an accepted legal defense, even if you do look extremely badass in the process. This would be an extremely shady coverup, too, since it wouldn't need to discuss any of the program's secrets. It's the original dude in the original body that committed the crimes. Is pretending they didn't happen because there might not be any evidence or witnesses left really make this okay to shrug off?
Got my first ending, Mizuki's route.
That was great, makes me wish I got that one last because I'm not sure how the rest of them are gonna top that.
That was great, makes me wish I got that one last because I'm not sure how the rest of them are gonna top that.
Still so much left unanswered but that's what the other routes are for I guess. Is So really the cyclops killer? Never even got his motive here..
Is the knife in Sota's somnium a red herring? It's never brought up at all.. I know it could just be because that's a knife Sota recognizes rather than it actually being his mother's knife, but still makes me wonder.
Anyway, Mizuki and Date are great. Got teary-eyed at the end of this. Even if the rest of the routes aren't as good, this is already in my top games of the year.
Is the knife in Sota's somnium a red herring? It's never brought up at all.. I know it could just be because that's a knife Sota recognizes rather than it actually being his mother's knife, but still makes me wonder.
Anyway, Mizuki and Date are great. Got teary-eyed at the end of this. Even if the rest of the routes aren't as good, this is already in my top games of the year.
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Ok, so im trying not to read too much about this game because of spoilers, but i have noticed a few people are very critical of the Somniums. Whats the deal here? Can someone briefly indicate why they are so divisive?
I'm 90% sure i want to pick this up (loved The Zero Escape games, Phoenix Wright, Hotel Dusk, Danganronpa, Steins Gate). This game is likely to appeal right? There is no unique mechanic that makes it completely love or hate when compared to all the others i have listed?
I'm 90% sure i want to pick this up (loved The Zero Escape games, Phoenix Wright, Hotel Dusk, Danganronpa, Steins Gate). This game is likely to appeal right? There is no unique mechanic that makes it completely love or hate when compared to all the others i have listed?
The Somniums are puzzle sections which can take a while and are both quite abstract and possible to screw up to the point that you have to restart. Honestly they're less stressful than Danganronpa's trials due to the way the time limit works, but they can be a touch fiddly.
There are also a few action scenes which are relatively simple and basically just involve locking on to a target for a few seconds.
For the most part it's the typical Visual novel mixed with point and click investigation that those other games use. You'll probably enjoy it.
They're very good when they're dealing with deep-rooted insecurities and the like. Some of the later ones are just lame trial and error puzzles that feel relatively uninspired. Either way, they're a relatively minor part of the experience in terms of overall playtime.
If you liked Zero Escape and Phoenix Wright, I can basically guarantee you'll like this a lot too, since it's Uchikoshi doing his own version of a Phoenix Wright style game.
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People were really underselling the amount of shitty lewd comments in this. Holy hell is it off putting.
I skimmed a bit of the thread since I am very early on (day 3), I have no idea how to know if I'm on a "purple" route or whatever, I definitely went the left route on the flow chart though.
I'm really annoyed by the game gratuitously dishing out boobies, women constantly crossing their legs in front of me in mini skirts (sitting on their desk, for better viewability), innuendos I didn't ask for (I made a thing out of NOT talking to the receptionist at one part, panning the camera away to focus on the other character and the camera KEPT PANNING BACK TOWARDS HER) and me constantly driving underage girls around and having my peepy eye stare at them while I'm supposed to be driving.
JEEEZ.
I skimmed a bit of the thread since I am very early on (day 3), I have no idea how to know if I'm on a "purple" route or whatever, I definitely went the left route on the flow chart though.
I'm really annoyed by the game gratuitously dishing out boobies, women constantly crossing their legs in front of me in mini skirts (sitting on their desk, for better viewability), innuendos I didn't ask for (I made a thing out of NOT talking to the receptionist at one part, panning the camera away to focus on the other character and the camera KEPT PANNING BACK TOWARDS HER) and me constantly driving underage girls around and having my peepy eye stare at them while I'm supposed to be driving.
JEEEZ.
The game made a big tutorial message about the extras you can find in the Somniums, then the first thing it lets you find after the message is a concept art of Bizarro-Date with a right eye constriction. Huh. It's really piling on the suspicions against him, culminating in the image of him in the mirror in Tesa's somnium. I'm curious to see where this goes, but if he ends up having an evil twin or split personality, that's pretty lame. However, if it was him, and current Date is just sedated and brainwashed, that's pretty sad too. That's basically pulling the same thing another game pulled, which I can't name, because that would be spoilers, hah. Guess I'll press on for now to see where the wild ride leads to see if this holds!
It's also worth mentioning that there's a speed up button and also a retry system that let's you restart at specific checkpoints inside the Somnium, so failing a sequence is not really a big deal.
Great, thanks. Have ordered it and look forward to starting it at the weekend!
Missed the launch discount since I couldn't buy it until now, but people are really liking this? I'm about to drop 70 dollary-doos on this.
I also know ahead of time to do the English dub, but that's what I did when I had the option in Dang Grandpa and 999 series.
I also know ahead of time to do the English dub, but that's what I did when I had the option in Dang Grandpa and 999 series.
Finished + 100%ed. The final scene really was lovely.
Overall I wasn't as hot on the right side of the flowchart and some of the ending revelations as I was on the rest, but it was still a great time.
VLR -> 999 = E17 -> R11 -> Ai -> N7 -> 12R -> Punch Line might be my overall played Uchikoshi game rankings? Keeping in mind I enjoyed all of them.
Overall I wasn't as hot on the right side of the flowchart and some of the ending revelations as I was on the rest, but it was still a great time.
VLR -> 999 = E17 -> R11 -> Ai -> N7 -> 12R -> Punch Line might be my overall played Uchikoshi game rankings? Keeping in mind I enjoyed all of them.
Finished the game. Definitely enjoyed it and I'm glad I went in completely blind, but to be frank, it doesn't really touch 999, VLR, E17 or R11 for me. The pace could've been considerably snappier, there was a surprisingly high amount of completely avoidable repetition, most of the sex humor and general lewdness fell very flat for me, the dreams boiled down to boring trial and error and worst of all, it was surprisingly predictable. I was hoping for at least one or two weird metanarrative twists (and was actually expecting one potentially related to the strange heartbeat effects you got every now and then).
But overall, it was good. I more or less enjoyed all of the characters (aside from Ota and Moma), most of the story was interesting and there was a fair amount of non-sexual humor that did work for me. Solid 8, I'd say.
But overall, it was good. I more or less enjoyed all of the characters (aside from Ota and Moma), most of the story was interesting and there was a fair amount of non-sexual humor that did work for me. Solid 8, I'd say.
Hey everyone,
I'm going to raffle a couple of copies of this game off at an LGBTQ+ gamer Facebook group I'm in.
I've only played a couple of hours, but been hearing great things about it, so I wanted to share the visual novel love.
I bought the copies but I just remembered there was some controversy with LGBTQ+ depiction in the game or something.
For those of you that have finished (or substantially played) the game, is there anything to worry about?
I've only played a couple of hours, but been hearing great things about it, so I wanted to share the visual novel love.
I'm going to raffle a couple of copies of this game off at an LGBTQ+ gamer Facebook group I'm in.
I've only played a couple of hours, but been hearing great things about it, so I wanted to share the visual novel love.
I bought the copies but I just remembered there was some controversy with LGBTQ+ depiction in the game or something.
For those of you that have finished (or substantially played) the game, is there anything to worry about?
I've only played a couple of hours, but been hearing great things about it, so I wanted to share the visual novel love.
Two characters are implied to have had a romantic relationship but I didn't personally pick up on it during my playthrough.
Mama is a large male-bodied non-binary person who uses female pronounces, wears a glitzy dress and boa, and makeup. She's very heavy handed with her flirting which occasionally prompts mild discomfort from Date. Date pokes back with size jokes so it feels more like two good friends making light jabs at each other and knowing the other isn't serious.
Otherwise she is a super helpful character throughout the game even if her biggest moments are comedic ones.
Mizuki is initially a little uncomfortable around Mama but when asked she says some really lovely things about the LGBT community.
As a gay man I was pretty happy with the representation and lack of the usual outright homophobia.
That's awesome! Thank you very much for your response!
There is this:
Uchikoshi is a good dude, if there's anything people find problems with I'm sure it wasn't intentional.
here is what mizuki says about LGBT, it was pretty great :
should i spoiler that?
here is what mizuki says about LGBT, it was pretty great :
should i spoiler that?
I don't know about everyone else, but I had already scene that part on Twitter. I believe it was from that post that some people were discussing some problematic content in other parts of the game, but Dandy Crocodile explained the situation.
There is this:
Uchikoshi is a good dude, if there's anything people find problems with I'm sure it wasn't intentional.
He really does seem pretty cool.
As a straight + cis male I don't know if my opinion counts for much, but: I saw some at-all problematic bits (some of Mama's flirting + characterization), yet I felt like the good good outweighed the bad. Mizuki is frequently the adult in the room (despite, y'know, being 12) and I appreciated her take on the subject as captured above.
Date's perpetual horniness was a bigger stumbling block to me, and is what I'd probably warn folks about if they are going in to the game.
Date's perpetual horniness was a bigger stumbling block to me, and is what I'd probably warn folks about if they are going in to the game.
I'm a bi trans guy (not that we're a monolith or anything but just putting my two cents in here) and this, exactly. I also agree with Dandy Crocodile's assessment.
Mama is not the best for a few reasons but you can tell her portrayal isn't meant to be malicious, so it doesn't bother me too much. I'd rather have people write trans characters imperfectly from a place of respect rather than not at all, myself.
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AWWWW YEAHHHH! Got my Agent Edition in the mail today! This thing is quite a lot bigger than I thought. O_o
Now that I've slept on it, I think the biggest weakness of the overall story for me is
The true ending was quite weak, too.
The left side of the flowchart was definitely much stronger than the right side. I loved how bleak it could get and even though more or less all the reveals or twists there were undercut by later reveals, the mysteries were super intriguing at the time.
I'll drop my yesterday's 8 to a 7.5, I think. It's in that range, anyway. A solid 7.5 to 8 sounds right for an ultimately surprisingly simple murder mystery with a neat scifi twist and some very fun characters.
e: A tiny disclaimer on comparing it to the other games, though: It's been YEARS since I played Ever17, Remember11, 999 and VLR. I'm not sure how I'd like them if I played them now.
that the whole thing happened just because a criminally insane (and criminally underdeveloped) murderer wanted their body back. Considering the length of the game and the amount of reveals (almost all of which turned out to be non-reveals after all since the later actual reveals sort of nullify them all), it's all just too simple for me. The story never felt very grand at all compared to the other Uchikoshi games. I'm of course not saying that more intimate stories are worse by default, but I feel like Uchikoshi's strengths lie more in piling on the insanity rather than surprisingly straightforward mysteries like AI.
Also, let's at the very least drop the absurd sexual humor from the more serious sequences. Distracting professional mercenaries with panties and inexplicably powering Date up with porno mags was dreadfully stupid.
Also, let's at the very least drop the absurd sexual humor from the more serious sequences. Distracting professional mercenaries with panties and inexplicably powering Date up with porno mags was dreadfully stupid.
The true ending was quite weak, too.
It was way too clean and perfect. And I already felt like that before they asspulled Aiba back to life for no reason whatsoever and ended on that absurdly strange and deflating dance number credits sequence. I half expected a stinger with Aiba going "HEY DATE, I FIGURED OUT A CURE FOR DEMENTIA, NOW WE CAN SAVE OTA'S MOM TOO" lol.
The left side of the flowchart was definitely much stronger than the right side. I loved how bleak it could get and even though more or less all the reveals or twists there were undercut by later reveals, the mysteries were super intriguing at the time.
I'll drop my yesterday's 8 to a 7.5, I think. It's in that range, anyway. A solid 7.5 to 8 sounds right for an ultimately surprisingly simple murder mystery with a neat scifi twist and some very fun characters.
e: A tiny disclaimer on comparing it to the other games, though: It's been YEARS since I played Ever17, Remember11, 999 and VLR. I'm not sure how I'd like them if I played them now.
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The LGBT content in this game is actually pretty good (especially by "anime game standards"). Mama is handled well in regards to the cast acting like it's a normal thing and interacting with her in a friendly manner for the most part. My feeling was that Date's banter with her was playful and welcomed by both sides as endearing. Date was never particularly put off by it and always took it in stride. And yeah there's that scene with Mizuki.
I got the impression that Date's seemingly infinite thirst spun itself up over time from interacting with Aiba 24/7 as her being an unobtainable person no matter their emotional relationship. That, and as someone starting with largely blank slate of personality with his amnesia, it'd be more likely for that to develop as a natural instinct... possibly exacerbated by Boss' apparent BDSM fantacies involving him that may or may not have happened. In a more normal work setting that would be straight sexual harassment that would never be tolerated. It's also... uh... fairly creepy to me that she'd want to flirt with Date, given later events revealed about him in the story.
It didn't feel like it was anything malicious with Aiba mind you, but talking with someone with no physical form that's effectively forced to hear you has to be hard. That's one complicated-as-hell relationship, and it had to be even stranger once she took a projected physical human appearance for him to watch and her projecting herself via AR. She became even closer to real which would further suspend disbelief for him of her being someone he could have a physical relationship with, yet it would still be impossible. She even went out of her way to make herself look like his preference in physical appearance, perhaps to tease him, but actual rationale unknown.
The idea of affection or romance between a person and an AI is a fascinating subject to me, and it will no doubt be a complex issue in the future. This was an interesting display of what something like that might look like.
I got the impression that Date's seemingly infinite thirst spun itself up over time from interacting with Aiba 24/7 as her being an unobtainable person no matter their emotional relationship. That, and as someone starting with largely blank slate of personality with his amnesia, it'd be more likely for that to develop as a natural instinct... possibly exacerbated by Boss' apparent BDSM fantacies involving him that may or may not have happened. In a more normal work setting that would be straight sexual harassment that would never be tolerated. It's also... uh... fairly creepy to me that she'd want to flirt with Date, given later events revealed about him in the story.
It didn't feel like it was anything malicious with Aiba mind you, but talking with someone with no physical form that's effectively forced to hear you has to be hard. That's one complicated-as-hell relationship, and it had to be even stranger once she took a projected physical human appearance for him to watch and her projecting herself via AR. She became even closer to real which would further suspend disbelief for him of her being someone he could have a physical relationship with, yet it would still be impossible. She even went out of her way to make herself look like his preference in physical appearance, perhaps to tease him, but actual rationale unknown.
The idea of affection or romance between a person and an AI is a fascinating subject to me, and it will no doubt be a complex issue in the future. This was an interesting display of what something like that might look like.
Check out the film Her with Joaquin Phoenix, if you haven't yet. Been a while since I saw it, but I remember really enjoying the way they depicted this in it.
Finished the game yesterday, and felt underwhelmed.
But now that I've slept on it, I think Uchikoshi just wanted to do something different from the Zero Escape series. I feel that the twists weren't as huge as in, say, VLR or 999, but in AI the story is more about characters and their development. It's more "human", in that the main element is the characters, their motives, their traumas, their feelings rather than hard sci fi and time paradoxes. It's a story where relationships take the center stage, love in the widest sense possible is the main point, imho.
I don't even know if I'd rank it higher or lower than the ZE series, it's just different. The gameplay is different and the focus is different, it's a more intimistic story that I'm very glad I experienced.
But now that I've slept on it, I think Uchikoshi just wanted to do something different from the Zero Escape series. I feel that the twists weren't as huge as in, say, VLR or 999, but in AI the story is more about characters and their development. It's more "human", in that the main element is the characters, their motives, their traumas, their feelings rather than hard sci fi and time paradoxes. It's a story where relationships take the center stage, love in the widest sense possible is the main point, imho.
I don't even know if I'd rank it higher or lower than the ZE series, it's just different. The gameplay is different and the focus is different, it's a more intimistic story that I'm very glad I experienced.
I want the low down on Punch Line. lol.
Is it just creepy as the synopsis sounds? Is it worth a playthrough?
The game ups the creepiness factor by having you, the player, take a voyeuristic role.
If you want to experience the story, watch the show instead. It's quicker, cheaper (should still be on Crunchyroll), the game has a lot of cutscenes that are just clips from the show anyway, and the ending theme is a banger.
The story is definitely wild in that Uchikoshi way, with plenty of twists that you may or may not see coming based on your experience with his prior works. I watched it without knowing he was involved but when I looked up who the writer was I was not shocked in the slightest.
It also has a whole thing about gender essentialism which I'm not fond of on the surface, but have slightly more complex feelings about considering what is revealed about the characters involved. I won't go into depth on it here, though.
Edit: One extra thing. The game does add an epilogue scene not in the anime, but that should be easily available on Youtube.
It actually has key elements in common with the plot of Ai lol (which I can't get into without horrifically spoiling it, though I imagine anyone who has finished both immediately knows what I'm talking about). Underneath the cringe-y stuff, there is a legitimately good story there.
... I'd probably recommend the anime over the VN though, just because it goes through almost all of the same story beats, but faster (which adds to the insanity).
EDIT: I don't quite know how they swung it, but Tetsuya Komura did the OST of Punch Line too, and it's pretty rad.
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They increased his dose after all :p
I assume the new Date is the old Hayato + the Date Boss created right?
Just hit the fuckery with saving Iris in So's Somnium, and then she's suddenly alive IRL. I was surprised nothing like that happened when I went down the left side of the flowchart, but maybe that happens after that one lock on that side. I'm still curious to see how this plays out because So is still extremely suspicious, and has been implicated on both sides of the flowchart. However there was that time where he was dismembered in the vase, so I'm not sure what the deal with that was.
Out of context I don't really think it's much of a spoiler, other than the fact that it might be a nice surprise for people to discover.here is what mizuki says about LGBT, it was pretty great :
should i spoiler that?
Also Atlus needs to take notes from this.
Yeah the lewd comments get pretty obnoxious. I mean at least he doesn't make them toward any underage characters (Mizuki mainly), but that's a very low low bar to clear and not really something to be lauded. Hell they even made a "joke" ending about Date's thirst.
Also does internet porn just not exist in Ai's universe or something?
That QTE segment where you're about to go to Marble with Iris and get attacked, and the strategy is....shooting the porno mag vending machine and all the guys are suddenly like "HOLY SHIT PORN MAGAZINES, ALL MORE IMPORTANT THAN THE GUY WITH A GUN WE ARE FIGHTING AGAINST!"
Just got to that bit, I was thinking that was possibly a homage to Metal Gear Solid 2? Otherwise I don't get it at all.
Is the game sold out everywhere?
I went to two GameStops (only had their silly opened but still "new" copies), Best Buy (website claimed they had copies, but nope), and then an indie shop (World 8) who only had the special edition.
I think I spend 50 bucks traveling from shop to shop trying to find a physical copy.
I was going to raffle out two copies of the game, but screw it, only raffling off the special edition.
I went to two GameStops (only had their silly opened but still "new" copies), Best Buy (website claimed they had copies, but nope), and then an indie shop (World 8) who only had the special edition.
I think I spend 50 bucks traveling from shop to shop trying to find a physical copy.
I was going to raffle out two copies of the game, but screw it, only raffling off the special edition.
I dont think Date is straight either because one of the male policemen are described as "really cute" in the character files (I havn't finished it so please no spoilers)
Also can we discuss what an absolute fucking BANGER this is.
I totally missed it on my playthrough because I always skipped the credits and thought the start sounded generic. I finally listened to it all on my night bike ride home today from work and it was a hell of a experience. 11/10 song.
Yeah, I was actually wondering about this, since Mama's bar seems to be themed around male hookups (or just hookups in general)? I'm not sure where you're at, so you probably shouldn't read the following spoiler:
Renju and Pewter are in a relationship (Someone very special got Renju the watch (Pewter)), and Date constantly tries to throw Mizuki and Iris off from what the club is about.
PS: I'm 99.9% sure the files are written from the point of Uchikoshi, since he does mention things in relation to his team, bosses, etc.
I was refreshingly pleased to see it pretty much be avoided entirely. There's a good variety of intra-personal relationships, too.
I was absolutely convinced for awhile that he was interested in Renju. I mean... drinking buddies. At that particular bar? Yeah. The idea of amnesia blanking some subconscious societal norms one develops over time on gender is interesting at least.
Good lord the fact that the porno mag thing worked again with the gunmen was absurd. I definitely didn't suspect Pewter though, I thought Boss was a suspect given that one ending on the right side of the chart that turns into a lock when Boss reveals herself on the camera. I think I can see where this is going though, given the foreshadowing I know Uchikoshi for in Zero Escape. I doubt there is just one killer and it's all part of a grand conspiracy, the only thing I don't know is why. I got to the second Somnium for Iris that was the ShovelForge version of the shrine and stopped there. I am guessing we will learn about the factory incident very soon.