All Elite Wrestling announced; bankrolled by Tony Khan, son of Jacksonville Jaguars and Fullham FC owner Shahid Khan

Audi

Sekai Project
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
90
Los Angeles
While I do love the bubbly, my wife keeps laughing still about Le Champion since she's a Quebecker and just dies everytime she hears Jericho say it in the pool video.

Also, AEW made my wife like wrestling. She keeps asking me when Jungle Boy and Luchasaurus will have a match again.
 

Rivenblade

Member
Nov 1, 2017
5,352
Jericho said on his pod that he personally requested Aubrey Edwards to referee the main event because he thinks she’s the best ref in the company.
 

RBH

Official ERA expert on Third Party Football
Member
Nov 2, 2017
11,918
LAX vs. Pentagon and Fenix confirmed for the AAA show in NYC on 9/15:



 

BoboBrazil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,251
I'm assuming Velasquez is coming into AEW at some point? He would be a big draw for them, especially if built up right.
 

Rivenblade

Member
Nov 1, 2017
5,352
Near the end of the Jericho All Out post-show episode, he talks about doing some stuff backstage after the show, and specifically mentions that he “did some stuff with Santana and Ortiz,” so maybe those guys are gonna be his partners on October 2nd. Would make sense with their attack against the Bucks, and with Kenny losing to Jericho at Double or Nothing.
 

Henry Hank

Member
Jul 25, 2019
152
The whole storytelling workrate false dichotomy is super weird. Workrate matches are full of so much storytelling laid on so thick I can’t help but assume ‘no storytelling’ is some bizarre wrestling version of no true scotsman. Storytelling is by definition a form of workrate in the context of wrestling. You can’t really have one without the other in any situation. I’m not going to pretend that the arbitrary separation doesn’t have some utility but the frequency and generality in which it’s typically applied doesn’t do that utility any favors.
I think a few different aspects of in-ring work get lumped together. There's work rate/moves, there's the match story, and then there's, I guess ring psychology is the right word? Regardless if the Young Bucks or whatever other flippy team can portray some kind of story, I think the logic/psychology of the wrestling is lacking. The selling of big moves, realistically selling injuries, limiting/building up to one big spot rather than going from one to another to another, etc. To me the latter is really a lost art in wrestling. I think the Bucks, Omega, Page all from what I have seen don't really have, or care, about that part of the art. It takes you out of this trying to be a simulation of a real sport.

It reminds me more of the 'Cena can't wrestle' crowd, if they're any different. Perhaps just because its more recent
IMO, Cena really CAN'T wrestle, and it goes to some of what I talked about above. His execution of moves is sloppy, his work looks fake, his move set doesn't make sense for his abilities and style (eg trying to do flippy shit), his selling sucks. I think he can tell a story in the ring, and he's always been a good talker, but his work sucks. Cody in comparison is a well-executed worker in the ring, if a little bland. But he's got the ring psychology part down pat. I think that's why Cody deserves more credit than people give him, and frankly he seems to have hit on and understands that he can make a certain style of match work. Which is great, it's part of the variety of the AEW product. I don't want every match being flippy shit high spots without selling.
 

steveovig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
613
Who gives a shit about Cena's execution of moves and his moveset? What year is this that people are bringing up this stuff in defining how good a wrestler is? Wrestling is about telling a story, and if you can do that, you're a good wrestler. It's not about moves and dumb stuff.
 

night814

Member
Oct 29, 2017
6,548
Pennsylvania
I'm not done giving Cody the benefit of the doubt until he loses it. Something tells me it's not the last time I'll be calling out his doubters. Cody vs Jericho is going to get a much bigger response from the audience than Page vs Jericho did, that's for sure.
No doubt about that, I always looked at Page and Jericho as a weak matchup personally. And the final results matched what I expected.
 

RBH

Official ERA expert on Third Party Football
Member
Nov 2, 2017
11,918
AEW tickets for Charlotte on 11/6 and the PPV in Baltimore on 11/9 went on sale this morning. Baltimore is well ahead of the pace of WWE's show Monday there, but is not close to being sold out, and it looks to be a pretty loaded lineup. We're at reality levels now, just like WWE doesn't sell anything out immediately, doesn't look like AEW will either except for special circumstances, unless TV creates a new buzz, and that goes for both companies. Charlotte is behind the pace of WWE's show on 9/15 in the same city.
 

LiquidSolid

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,748
The "Cody is Trash" crowd is so reminsicent of the mid-2000's "Triple H is trash" crowd.

Neither of them are going to be candidates for the Mount Rushmore of Wrestling, but they are both decent workers, good-to-excellent "in-ring storytellers" and incredibly ambitious outside the ring.

Cody clearly seems to be aware of this parallel with the whole throne breaker gimmick, it's not just a dig at WWE. His AEW matches have all been Triple H-style matches.
Nah, fuck that. The problem with mid-2000's Triple H wasn't really his matches, they were okay, it was everything that surrounded them. His character, the boring as fuck 30 minute promos every week and burying the shit out of everyone except the guys Vince was pushing heavily. He was trash.

I have some concerns about Cody, particularly the way he's made his own storylines one of the main focuses in the Road To series, instead of other far more important matches, but he's a million times more entertaining than Triple H's reign of terror.

I wouldn't say Cody is trash, but Cody is 100% made by his opponent. He'll never elevate anyone else, its always his opponent, and he can make them look good, but rarely is it great.
Yeah, I'd agree with that. The match against Ibushi was the one big highlight from his NJPW run and that was mostly Ibushi.

I think a few different aspects of in-ring work get lumped together. There's work rate/moves, there's the match story, and then there's, I guess ring psychology is the right word? Regardless if the Young Bucks or whatever other flippy team can portray some kind of story, I think the logic/psychology of the wrestling is lacking. The selling of big moves, realistically selling injuries, limiting/building up to one big spot rather than going from one to another to another, etc. To me the latter is really a lost art in wrestling. I think the Bucks, Omega, Page all from what I have seen don't really have, or care, about that part of the art. It takes you out of this trying to be a simulation of a real sport.
I'm just going to assume you didn't watch much of them in NJPW because this is laughable.
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,049
I think a few different aspects of in-ring work get lumped together. There's work rate/moves, there's the match story, and then there's, I guess ring psychology is the right word? Regardless if the Young Bucks or whatever other flippy team can portray some kind of story, I think the logic/psychology of the wrestling is lacking. The selling of big moves, realistically selling injuries, limiting/building up to one big spot rather than going from one to another to another, etc. To me the latter is really a lost art in wrestling. I think the Bucks, Omega, Page all from what I have seen don't really have, or care, about that part of the art. It takes you out of this trying to be a simulation of a real sport.

Yo this shit is boring. Wrestling isn't real. Real fighting is dull as shit. If it's not real then let them be superheroes and villains and kick the crap out of each other.
 

Henry Hank

Member
Jul 25, 2019
152
Who gives a shit about Cena's execution of moves and his moveset? What year is this that people are bringing up this stuff in defining how good a wrestler is? Wrestling is about telling a story, and if you can do that, you're a good wrestler. It's not about moves and dumb stuff.
Yo this shit is boring. Wrestling isn't real. Real fighting is dull as shit. If it's not real then let them be superheroes and villains and kick the crap out of each other.
There's obviously some suspension of disbelief watching wrestling, but it's like any other fake media. It still should try to look real and make sense. If a movie has bad acting, bad stunts, huge plot holes, etc it's going to be a bad movie unless it's intentionally trying to be bad. And I mean that in execution. Orange Cassidy, for instance, is obviously silly and over-the-top, but he performs the character well. I don't have a problem with silly in doses. Wrestling should be over-the-top to some extent and do things that a real sport doesn't, because otherwise you can just watch MMA. Bad performance of wrestling is no different than bad acting. IMO, probably the major reason that modern WWE sucks is that they fully embraced the idea that "it's fake so it doesn't need to make sense." Which leads to a product that completely loses people because there's no logic to anything and no reason to care about anything.

So yeah, I would say if a wrestler can't execute moves in a way that makes them look like they could be real, they aren't good. If they don't know how to time moves in the ring, sell injuries, etc, they aren't a good worker. There are other parts of being a good wrestler (character, promo, etc) but I don't see how anyone can argue against that the ability to actually execute moves is important.
 

DeathyBoy

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,468
Under my Hela Hela
There's obviously some suspension of disbelief watching wrestling, but it's like any other fake media. It still should try to look real and make sense. If a movie has bad acting, bad stunts, huge plot holes, etc it's going to be a bad movie unless it's intentionally trying to be bad. And I mean that in execution. Orange Cassidy, for instance, is obviously silly and over-the-top, but he performs the character well. I don't have a problem with silly in doses. Wrestling should be over-the-top to some extent and do things that a real sport doesn't, because otherwise you can just watch MMA. Bad performance of wrestling is no different than bad acting. IMO, probably the major reason that modern WWE sucks is that they fully embraced the idea that "it's fake so it doesn't need to make sense." Which leads to a product that completely loses people because there's no logic to anything and no reason to care about anything.

So yeah, I would say if a wrestler can't execute moves in a way that makes them look like they could be real, they aren't good. If they don't know how to time moves in the ring, sell injuries, etc, they aren't a good worker. There are other parts of being a good wrestler (character, promo, etc) but I don't see how anyone can argue against that the ability to actually execute moves is important.
Cena is a far, far better wrestler than Cody. And I say that as someone who highly rated Cody vs Dustin.
 

RBH

Official ERA expert on Third Party Football
Member
Nov 2, 2017
11,918
*waits patiently for AEW to announce an Atlanta show*
 

MoonScented

Member
Oct 28, 2017
499
Who gives a shit about Cena's execution of moves and his moveset? What year is this that people are bringing up this stuff in defining how good a wrestler is? Wrestling is about telling a story, and if you can do that, you're a good wrestler. It's not about moves and dumb stuff.

Uhh.. I care if wrestlers are having bad matches that bore me to sleep.
 

lucebuce

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,961
Pakistan
Quote: " we're considering..." "there are no plans for it at the moment"

Twitter caption: "TV TITLE CONFIRMED"
 

SageShinigami

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,049
There's obviously some suspension of disbelief watching wrestling, but it's like any other fake media. It still should try to look real and make sense. If a movie has bad acting, bad stunts, huge plot holes, etc it's going to be a bad movie unless it's intentionally trying to be bad. And I mean that in execution. Orange Cassidy, for instance, is obviously silly and over-the-top, but he performs the character well. I don't have a problem with silly in doses. Wrestling should be over-the-top to some extent and do things that a real sport doesn't, because otherwise you can just watch MMA. Bad performance of wrestling is no different than bad acting. IMO, probably the major reason that modern WWE sucks is that they fully embraced the idea that "it's fake so it doesn't need to make sense." Which leads to a product that completely loses people because there's no logic to anything and no reason to care about anything.

So yeah, I would say if a wrestler can't execute moves in a way that makes them look like they could be real, they aren't good. If they don't know how to time moves in the ring, sell injuries, etc, they aren't a good worker. There are other parts of being a good wrestler (character, promo, etc) but I don't see how anyone can argue against that the ability to actually execute moves is important.
Man I'm not trying to watch these WWE ass matches where someone gets punched and sells it for five minutes. Action films have all these perfectly timed and blocked punches and kicks that are insane and simply could not work, but we all let it go because it looks cool. But for some reason, wrestling can't do shit because it looks cool. It's gotta feel real. It ain't real, so why are we trying to fake it.

But I mean. Everything can't be for everyone. The Bucks offer one style of wrestling. AEW tries to be for everyone.
 

Henry Hank

Member
Jul 25, 2019
152
Man I'm not trying to watch these WWE ass matches where someone gets punched and sells it for five minutes. Action films have all these perfectly timed and blocked punches and kicks that are insane and simply could not work, but we all let it go because it looks cool. But for some reason, wrestling can't do shit because it looks cool. It's gotta feel real. It ain't real, so why are we trying to fake it.

But I mean. Everything can't be for everyone. The Bucks offer one style of wrestling. AEW tries to be for everyone.
I don't think wrestling can't do things that just look cool, just because they are over the top or unbelievable. But there's got to be some semblance of logic to it. Like, in a movie, if a guy gets his arm broken, I'm not going to believe he's going to be able to lift something real heavy like he normally would be. For an example of something in AEW that I hated that took me out of a match, Page vs Sabian. Page is supposed to be selling a serious knee injury, yet does a moonsault off the top rope to the outside and is then writhing in pain. OK, i guess I can buy that he's foolhardy and did a risky move that caused him more injury. Yet within a minute of that, he's back on his feet, hops up onto the top rope and does a big slam off the top. That makes no sense to be able to pull that off if his knee was that bad off just a moment ago. I don't think it's too much to ask that wrestlers at least make sure what they are doing in the ring makes some sense.

The Bucks in general aren't for me but I can appreciate their abilities and enjoy their kind of work in small doses. The ladder match at All Out was fun. I get that some people are really into that style. But I don't want a whole card of that and I'm glad that's not what they're going for as a promotion.
 

Buckle

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,680
He added, "We want to provide bell-to-bell sports-centric pro-wrestling. That's going to mean longer matches. That's going to mean stories being told between the ropes. That means no invisible camera backstage.
You mean when someone tries to murder somebody with a forklift backstage that there won't be a conveniently timed and placed camera?

Thats weird.
 

Henry Hank

Member
Jul 25, 2019
152
I've always liked the concept of the TV title and am not surprised that's a direction they plan to go. I think it definitely makes sense to wait a while as they establish their other major titles. That would be a good belt for guys like Page, MJF, and Allin to go after to help build them up more.
 

Asakim

Member
Oct 27, 2017
587
Even if it's not a regular thing I hope at least the first AEW TNT show starts off with Tony Schiavone loudly and beautifully welcoming us.
 

Lazybob

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,430
Spears/Moxley confirmed for the 2nd TNT show
Yes I believe that was already announced. Unless you mean confirmed because of the infection which in that case thank good Mox is recovering well.

This match feels weird now though since Spears lost to Cody. He NEEDS some wins early on to be taken seriously. I get why Cody won now the the Full Gear main event was announced but it'd be surprising for Spears to win this and if they do give him the upset win that also feels wrong since Mox is so hot.
 

RBH

Official ERA expert on Third Party Football
Member
Nov 2, 2017
11,918
Despite running for two hours each week, not everyone on the roster is going to be featured on each episode. "We're going to try and present quality over quantity," Rhodes said. "Which means that some guys are going to have some time off. Which for the life and the well-being of a wrestler is a great thing to hear; that they're not going to be, every week, putting themselves in a high-profile singles match. That, every week, they're not going to be in a barn-burner tag. It's going to be a very different show each week. We're not going to try and cram everybody on the two-hour show. There's no participation award here."

That being said, Rhodes and others behind AEW are considering an extra hour of content, which more than likely won't be televised. "It will probably live for people to stream on B/R Live," he shared. "We have a lot of resources and we want to make sure that people can plug into the wrestlers who we signed who they're fans of. We're going to try and keep everybody busy."