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All first-party PS1 games included in the new PS Plus in Taiwan (an NTSC region) appear to be based on the PAL 50hz/25fps versions

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Gradon

Gradon

Saw the truth behind the copied door
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Oct 25, 2017
7,464
UK
So this is a discussion ongoing in the PS1 features thread but I thought it deserved it's own thread.

Sadly we're finding out that some of the PS1 games on the Asian PSN stores that went up today are PAL versions, unfortunately it looks like little has been done to mitigate them from running at 25fps.

Gradon said:
Hmmmmm.

This person in this tweet is very unhappy playing side by side with the Japanese version on PS1… :(

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andshrew said:
Here's Ape Escape with a frame time graph over it (full disclaimer I have no idea what I'm doing and could have mis-configured the tool, so wait for Digital Foundry for definitive analysis).

www.youtube.com

[Fixed as of Dec 2022] Ape Escape PS1 on PS5 Framerate (It's the PAL version...)

Update 5th December 2022Sony have now released patch version 1.000.002 and the European release now includes a PAL/NTSC version toggle (accessed via pressing...
www.youtube.com www.youtube.com
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Thank you andshrew for collecting the footage and graphing it.


brokenswiftie said:
PAL
Ape Escape SCES01564
Hot Shots Golf SCES00983
I.Q: Intelligent Qube SCES00866
Jumping Flash! SCES00003
Wild Arms SCES00321
Worms Armageddon SLES02217
Worms World Party SLES03804

NTSC
Disney·PIXAR Toy Story 2: Buzz Lightyear to the Rescue
Syphon Filter SCUS9424
Tekken 2
Oddworld: Abe's Oddysee

Mr Driller not sure
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Hopefully Sony fix this because this is extremely disappointing. :(
 
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AuthenticM

AuthenticM

Son Altesse Sérénissime
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,023
how does this happen in the year of our lord 2022. This issue should have died with the Wii back in fucking 2009.
 
Diogo Arez

Diogo Arez

One Winged Slayer
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Absolutely inexcusable if this keeps up, I usually don't support public complaints on Social Media but we should try to get heard by Sony to offer us the choice between PAL and NTSC
 
Fisty

Fisty

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Oct 25, 2017
20,209
It's probably best to wait for confirmation on this and whether it applies to other regions.
 
Big Yoshi

Big Yoshi

Member
Nov 25, 2018
1,806
How the fuck are the third party devs getting the versions right when sony fucks it up? Especially after the psone classic???
 
zombiejames

zombiejames

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Oct 25, 2017
11,918
Hm, I wonder if this could be a legal thing? Like, they can't release the NTSC versions in PAL regions because they're missing language support?
 
Lant_War

Lant_War

Classic Anus Game
The Fallen
Jul 14, 2018
23,543
How are they still fucking up with this? Been an issue with every Sony retro initiative
 
El Toporo

El Toporo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,121
Finally you will all suffer like we did...again, after the Playstation Classic. Hey, re...remember that one?
 
Kindekuma

Kindekuma

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,729
All those unsold PS Classic Mini units are haunting us now. Sony made us all spend $500 for one now.
shaq-shaquill-oneal.gif
 
kadotsu

kadotsu

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,504
If only those nasty US voice actors had signed a modern "screw you" contract and not one of those old ones with rights.
 
AuthenticM

AuthenticM

Son Altesse Sérénissime
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,023
someone tell me how this decision gets made. I do not understand. I seriously do not understand. Is there some accountant somewhere in the chain of command who's never played video games before?
 
purseowner

purseowner

From the mirror universe
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Oct 25, 2017
9,444
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Relieved to hear it's not the case with all of them, but Ape Escape deserves better.

Same thing happened with most of the PS2 Classics on PS4, Ape Escape 2 included (although that one had a different dub, and a different publisher).
 
Psamtik

Psamtik

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Oct 27, 2017
6,845
Wouldn't be surprised at all if this is due to some asinine internal policy about using only the latest versions of these games, which was frequently the European release. It's the only thing that makes even a little sense.
 
Praedyth

Praedyth

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Feb 25, 2020
6,519
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I'm not expert in classics or emulation, but if I have a VRR display will it be better? Is it a issue of 50Hz on a 60Hz display or something else?
 
Eoin

Eoin

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Oct 27, 2017
7,103
Big Yoshi said:
How the fuck are the third party devs getting the versions right when sony fucks it up? Especially after the psone classic???
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I don't think there was ever any indication that any relevant decision-maker at Sony heard the feedback about the PAL games on the PlayStation Classic.

zombiejames said:
Hm, I wonder if this could be a legal thing? Like, they can't release the NTSC versions in PAL regions because they're missing language support?
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No, Nintendo offer only the NTSC versions of NES and SNES games. For N64 games they offer a choice of PAL or NTSC versions. Sony have in the past offered NTSC versions of PlayStation games in PAL regions. Most retro collections (and the retro mini consoles) nowadays are purely NTSC versions with their original language options. Additionally, for decades, many games have been released in Europe with only basic localisation options missing most or all European languages. Many were English-only and that's still not uncommon today for some small-to-moderate scale releases.

To add the final note to that, the games on this service themselves appear to be about 50/50 split between NTSC and PAL versions, so obviously NTSC is a possibility.

This isn't a legal restriction, it's a Sony choice.
 
shadowman16

shadowman16

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Oct 25, 2017
31,868
PAL releases should be shot into the sun. In terms of performance, they should not be used in any of these collections/re-releases. Why charge people extra to play inferior versions? What they should have done is taken the different extra languages included in PAL releases and spliced them together with the NTSC versions. But I guess that's too hard so shitty versions for all! Im glad that not all games are the 50Hz PAL versions, but still... even one game is too many.
 
apocat

apocat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,046
This is so weird. I legitimately thought the pal games on the Playstation Mini was a mistake or something, but apparently not.
 
0xe0x

0xe0x

Banned
Dec 23, 2021
286
Unfortunately, all Japan Studio games, and Worms are PAL. Probably licensing issues.
 
TheWooniestWoona

TheWooniestWoona

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Oct 27, 2017
5,777
Stuff like this is why I gave up and went with an X-Station for my PS1.
Not everyone can do that though, so these kind of mistakes suck.
 
Eoin

Eoin

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Oct 27, 2017
7,103
Fisty said:
I mean, has the service even been live for 24 hours? It's bullshit to have PAL as the only option sure, but it's a bit early to spin up the outrage machine imo
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The louder people are about this now the more likely it is that Sony fix this idiocy quickly. It's probably too late to fix it for other launches of the service but it's worth a try.

Praedyth said:
I'm not expert in classics or emulation, but if I have a VRR display will it be better? Is it a issue of 50Hz on a 60Hz display or something else?
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andshrew has also posted that VRR is blocked for these games.

However even if it was enabled, the games are running at 50Hz internally but still being output to the TV at 60Hz (which is what causes the frame pacing problems). From the TV's perspective it would be receiving a constant 60Hz signal so wouldn't activate VRR.
 
Diogo Arez

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Fisty said:
I mean, has the service even been live for 24 hours? It's bullshit to have PAL as the only option sure, but it's a bit early to spin up the outrage machine imo
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Nah, rather start complaining now if it means more chances of it being fixed, this is not a minor problem
 
Lowblood

Lowblood

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Oct 30, 2017
5,177
Big Yoshi said:
How the fuck are the third party devs getting the versions right when sony fucks it up? Especially after the psone classic???
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If this applies in the NA version as well, then it's clearly intentional on Sony's part. Someone there thinks the PAL releases are the way to go, for whatever reason.

zombiejames said:
Hm, I wonder if this could be a legal thing? Like, they can't release the NTSC versions in PAL regions because they're missing language support?
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Unlikely. Wild Arms was on the PS Classic as the NA release, but it's PAL here. I doubt anything would have changed between now and then.
 
Jazzem

Jazzem

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Feb 2, 2018
2,680
It's weird that Wild Arms and Intelligent Qube(/Kurushi) are PAL here, apparently they were NTSC on the PlayStation Classic
 
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