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QuantumZebra

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,304
Got into a minor argument with the wife. We're expecting a baby girl in about 4 weeks time. She is very keen on the Irish name Caoimhe. It's actually a lovely name, but for an English speaker it's a bit of a mindfuck, as it's pronounced Qweeva or Kweeva. And I don't really want to give her a lifetime of having to spell it out to absolutely everyone. She seems to think I'm being ridiculous. We're in Scotland and the rules of the Irish language and Gaelic are somewhat similar so there's a bit more familiarity with gaelic names but you'd still have to explain/spell to most folk.

The other issue is as her mum is from Donegal, she wants to pronounce it Keeva which is more common the further north you get in Ireland, but it just strikes me as taking a name which you'll already have to spell and explain to English speakers and you've got the 'wrong' pronouncation for most Irish/Gaelic speakers.

Am I over-reacting?

I mean my name is Beau and people butcher it 24/7, but on legal documents forms etc, I use my other name (I have two first names) or my middle name.

Just give her a middle name that's a good failover. That's what we did with our girls, and I'm glad my mom did with me (as I prefer Beau but it's so much easier to not use it in legal formats).
 

RetroMG

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
6,732
We're in Scotland and the rules of the Irish language and Gaelic are somewhat similar so there's a bit more familiarity with gaelic names but you'd still have to explain/spell to most folk.

This makes it a little bit better than if you were, say, in the United States, but in general, no, I don't think you're being ridiculous.
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 31104

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 5, 2017
2,572
Without being disrespectful, how is Caoimhe pronounced as Kweeva... I genuinely want to know. I can understand the C having a K sound, the AO maaaybe a W sound, the I is likely just EE, but one does one pronounce MHE as VA? Unless the letters themselves aren't pronounced the same way of course.

Like most people from the North of Ireland (where the wife is from) we'd be pronouncing it Keeva.

C = plain old hard K sound
aoi = EE (as in Aoife (eefah) and Saoirse (Seer-sha)
mh = V sound
e = sort of an "uh"

Kweeva is the 'correct' pronunciation in terms of traditional rules of the language, but that's really only used in the South of Ireland (and gets more common the further west you get) and she's from the Donegal where it's normally Keeva. The pronunciation as Keeva is more common now as it's the slightly anglised version. A bit like Kevin, the root of Kevin in Irish is Caoimhín is pronounced KwEE-VEEN but the w caused by initial broad consonant C (pronounced like Cappacino) into a medial slender consonant ( the mh pronounced as a V), is mostly ignored in some Irish dialects and has been dropped completely in the anglised version. Irish and Gaelic is difficult because of the interplay between slender and broad vowels and consonants depends so much on what surrounds them, and don't get me started on modifiers.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,696
I'm not trying to imply that you got bullied "for nothing," I'm sorry that happened to you. I wish kids were nice and there were no bullies, but I also don't think all parents should choose names on the basis of whether or not some kids will be little closeminded bigots. I would (and still do) occasionally get made fun of for my name, but I'm still glad I have a name that's meaningful to myself and my parents. I'm sorry if you don't feel that way, and I think it's important for many people in this thread to remember that what counts as an "unusual" name is different depending on where you are, so your perspective is valuable and appreciated. I certainly didn't mean to devalue your experience.

Its ok, it was a long time ago, and I've learned to come to terms with it as part of my lived experience.

I go agree, though, a parent choosing a name for their child shouldn't have to extraploate whether that name will cause the child to be a target for bullies, but this is the shitty world we live in.
 

Tbm24

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,329
Little Timmy in Kindergarten and Sarah in 3rd grade won't know or care that we live in a globalized world and different languages and dialects have very different names. They'll hear a funny name, they see that spelling and pronunciation are completely different than what they know and make fun of the kid. That's just the way kids are. Stop thinking with your adult perspective and think of the years the kid will have to spend in school with other children before she will reach the point in life that you're at now. Kids won't think the way you do, they won't have the experience with other cultures that you have. If the spelling of the name were different it wouldn't be that much of a deal tbh, but as it is she will have to explain to everyone not familiar with that particular variety of English how to pronounce it or have people mispronounce her name in all kinds of ways. Teacher reads name wrong, it sounds funny, kids laugh. Common scenario she could face.
I mean, you quoted me and ignored that I specifically said regardless of my basic ass first name I was addressed and called by my last name throughout my school life because it was easier for teachers to single me out this way. That in effect led to my classmates knowing me as such to the point I graduated high school and THEN some people realized I had a first name.

I was also made fun of for it because everyone couldn't pronounce it. I do not look back on that and wish I had a different last name. Far fucking from it. This is the kind of thing you want children to learn and instead not call them "common" names in the english language just because it's easy.

The name the OP is conflicted about is a great name with a great spelling.
 

MoogleWizard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,692
Another example of the amazingly insular thinking in this thread. I assume you left out "in America" from your facts there.
Children very much DO call each other by their surnames and nicknames based on the surnames in Ireland and Britain.

I didn't know that about Britain, sorry. And I'm also not from America ;-)

1. Kids will make fun of your kid for 100000 reasons. Kids are very capable of making fun of very ordinary names.
2. I don't go through life bending to the whims of bullies.
3. I'm sure she will be able to grow through the trauma of having the teacher misspell her name, as hard as that is.
4. What you're suggesting and defending here is cultural assimilation. Your take might sit on being a "realist" but the end result is just the same - Give in to the dominant culture, erase your cultural heritage.
5. As the world becomes more global, experiences will change. These kids will grow up to a world connected through the internet, and they will come across all sort of names as they play online games, or interact with international people in general. They'll hopefully grow up to be much more understanding and welcoming than you are.


Yeah, it's not like Michael ("Mai-kel") or George ("Djordj") make much more sense unless you know the pronunciation rules of English.

I'm not defending cultural assimilation. I'm just talking about reality, name bullying that turned into more bullying is something I have seen myself with kids. Children are cruel, that's reality. You can also give your child two or three first names (I have three, one of them very antiquated but because it wasn't my first name I never had problems with it), or Middle Name or whatever it's called where you're from. That way you can still include your cultural background and not make it easier for your child to get bullied. Generally, I'd say unusual names that are written the way or close to how they are pronounced are much easier to deal with. In OP's case it seems that not the case. That's the main problem IMO, that she will live a life of explaining to people how to pronounce her name because of the orthography.

And yeah sure, kids will bully anyway, so let's give them reasons for it since it will happen anyway. Smh. And good for you that you don't give into bullies, I'm sure we can extrapolate from that to OP's daughter, who hasn't even been born yet.
 

dude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,641
Tel Aviv
I'm not defending cultural assimilation. I'm just talking about reality, name bullying that turned into more bullying is something I have seen myself with kids. Children are cruel, that's reality. You can also give your child two or three first names (I have three, one of them very antiquated but because it wasn't my first name I never had problems with it), or Middle Name or whatever it's called where you're from. That way you can still include your cultural background and not make it easier for your child to get bullied. Generally, I'd say unusual names that are written the way or close to how they are pronounced are much easier to deal with. In OP's case it seems that not the case. That's the main problem IMO, that she will live a life of explaining to people how to pronounce her name because of the orthography.

And yeah sure, kids will bully anyway, so let's give them reasons for it since it will happen anyway. Smh. And good for you that you don't give into bullies, I'm sure we can extrapolate from that to OP's daughter, who hasn't even been born yet.
Regardless of whether it's your intention or not, you are actually arguing for cultural assimilation, just on the grounds of being a "realist". I wouldn't want to give my kid a name that has no cultural meaning to me just because it's common where I live. Part of a kid's identity is their family, which will include their parents cultural heritage, tastes, weirdness and whatnot - and all of that should be reflected in their name. Not what's common.
Explaining your name to people is not actually such an immense hardship you must endure, it's an annoyance - That is more aimed at the people who have their head so far up their ass they can't deal with a name they don't recognise, than towards the parents who lovingly raised you and given you a name that is meaningful and beautiful to them.
 

Tickling

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
961
A normal and very common name and because your wife comes from these waters I think you are overreacting.
 

Lentic

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,836
Little Timmy in Kindergarten and Sarah in 3rd grade won't know or care that we live in a globalized world and different languages and dialects have very different names. They'll hear a funny name, they see that spelling and pronunciation are completely different than what they know and make fun of the kid. That's just the way kids are. Stop thinking with your adult perspective and think of the years the kid will have to spend in school with other children before she will reach the point in life that you're at now. Kids won't think the way you do, they won't have the experience with other cultures that you have. If the spelling of the name were different it wouldn't be that much of a deal tbh, but as it is she will have to explain to everyone not familiar with that particular variety of English how to pronounce it or have people mispronounce her name in all kinds of ways. Teacher reads name wrong, it sounds funny, kids laugh. Common scenario she could face.
Hmm....maybe we should be teaching kids not to make fun of things they aren't familiar with? It's possible that the kids will find it interesting or surprising, but making fun or bullying won't happen unless it's in an environment where it's unchecked or encouraged.

I had a "weird" name and there were tons of kids that were cool about it and wanted to learn more. Kids go to school to learn, do they not? It seems like the perfect environment to expose them to people of different backgrounds.

Also, from my experience, whenever a substitute teacher mispronounced my name, even though I didn't really mind, the other kids were the first to correct them. It was nice.

It's the people assuming kids will bully that are projecting their own biases onto the kids. Kids are generally open minded. At a young age, they barely have a concept of what's a "normal" name. Hell, they are watching so many cartoons and movies with such bizarre names already.
 
Last edited:
Apr 27, 2019
52
C = plain old hard CK sound in the North (depending on where you are in Ireland: C is a really broad sound in Irish and can be a Qw or K sound )
aoi = EEE (as in Aoife (eevah) and Saoirse (Seer-sha)
mh = V sound
Thaanks man this really helps me visualize where the pronounciation comes from. "yeah it's like the consonant sound from *tosses boggle set down the stairs*" after reading your posts in this thread you clearly have huge hangups about the Irish language for some reason, and honestly you need to just talk to your wife about this. She had a similarly Irish name, talk to her about how it impacted her life instead of just making all these weird assumptions on your own.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,669
Actually, I just had a thought. Why is it that you can see names from all over the globe written in the Modern English Alphabet, and they're usually pronounced how you would think, but Irish names just take letters and go "Fuck it, the letter 'B' is pronounced 'X' now!"
As has been pointed out, the names are consistent with Irish pronunciation. Irish as a language is quite complex and challenging to learn, but it's highly phonetic and things sound how they're spelt. The rules that govern the pronunciation can be challenging to learn, but any familiarity with Irish makes it very clear how to spell and pronounce the names correctly.
 

MoogleWizard

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,692
Regardless of whether it's your intention or not, you are actually arguing for cultural assimilation, just on the grounds of being a "realist". I wouldn't want to give my kid a name that has no cultural meaning to me just because it's common where I live. Part of a kid's identity is their family, which will include their parents cultural heritage, tastes, weirdness and whatnot - and all of that should be reflected in their name. Not what's common.
Explaining your name to people is not actually such an immense hardship you must endure, it's an annoyance - That is more aimed at the people who have their head so far up their ass they can't deal with a name they don't recognise, than towards the parents who lovingly raised you and given you a name that is meaningful and beautiful to them.

My first priority would always be the daily life experience of my child, nothing else. Life is full of compromises. OP is worried about his daughter having difficulties because of the name. This might be a case where a compromise should be made. For me, giving her the "difficult" name as a second name would be that compromise. Or choosing a name with cultural heritage that is easier to pronounce and read. And I frankly wouldn't give a shit if someone thought that was cultural assimilation. I'd only care about my child. I have a cousin that lives in the Philippines, her mother is German. She has a first name that is not local but easy to say for locals and a German second name. At home she's called by her second name and in school by her first, it works perfectly for her. Just an example for a compromise. Names don't hold that much meaning to me that choosing a different one would count as a betrayal of my heritage or culture to me. My first name is a biblical name and I'm an atheist, I don't care. I'm sure there are other names for OP's daughter with cultural meaning that would be easier. Or they could talk to people and find that it's not as difficult as he thought. In the end, it should require some thorough thinking. It's a very individual thing and we can only speculate and give our thoughts/experiences, since we don't know the environment she would be growing up in.

Hmm....maybe we should be teaching kids not to make fun of things they aren't familiar with? It's possible that the kids will find it interesting or surprising, but making fun or bullying won't happen unless it's in an environment where it's unchecked or encouraged.

I had a "weird" name and there were tons of kids that were cool about it and wanted to learn more. Kids go to school to learn, do they not? It seems like the perfect environment to expose them to people of different backgrounds.

Also, from my experience, whenever a substitute teacher mispronounced my name, even though I didn't really mind, the other kids were the first to correct them. It was nice.
That's good for you and the way it should be ideally. But we have several people in this thread saying that was not their experience. I'm just being realistic. You'd be surprised how much goes unseen in schools. One teachers can't notice everything in a class of 30+ students. Victims often don't speak out etc. Avoiding bullying in a school environment is not an easy task.
 

Lentic

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,836
That's good for you and the way it should be ideally. But we have several people in this thread saying that was not their experience. I'm just being realistic. You'd be surprised how much goes unseen in schools. One teachers can't notice everything in a class of 30+ students. Victims often don't speak out etc. Avoiding bullying in a school environment is not an easy task.
But bullies will find a target regardless. I've seen even the most average of average people get picked on. I honestly doubt that the people who make fun of other people's names honestly give a shit what the name is. They're just looking for an excuse to start shit. If it isn't a name, it will be something else, which is why I think it's futile to try and avoid it.
 

dude

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,641
Tel Aviv
People also get bullied for having different religions, beliefs, hobbies, skin color, sexual orientation, perceived sexual orientation, hair color, taste in clothes, the size of their house, the occupation of their parents... I mean, I could go on, but it would just be a list of every possible parameter. What else should people change in their kids, themselves or their family to avoid bullying? Where does the line stops for you?
Yeah, you might say it's "just a nam"e - But that also goes the other way around. His, and anyone else's, kid is probably going to be bullied for something much more central to their identity than their name. You're not actually benefitting the kid in any way, since you're not actually stopping or even lessening any bullying.

My first priority is also the well being of my hypothetical child - That they'll grow with their own unique identity, that they know their cultural and family heritage. That they can take pride in their name and its meaning.
So I can take one tiny pebble away from the bullies who also have an arsenal of machine guns, or I can give my kid something I think is of value. I know which way those scales tip for me.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,669
My first priority would always be the daily life experience of my child, nothing else. Life is full of compromises. OP is worried about his daughter having difficulties because of the name. This might be a case where a compromise should be made. For me, giving her the "difficult" name as a second name would be that compromise. Or choosing a name with cultural heritage that is easier to pronounce and read. And I frankly wouldn't give a shit if someone thought that was cultural assimilation. I'd only care about my child. I have a cousin that lives in the Philippines, her mother is German. She has a first name that is not local but easy to say for locals and a German second name. At home she's called by her second name and in school by her first, it works perfectly for her. Just an example for a compromise. Names don't hold that much meaning to me that choosing a different one would count as a betrayal of my heritage or culture to me. My first name is a biblical name and I'm an atheist, I don't care. I'm sure there are other names for OP's daughter with cultural meaning that would be easier. Or they could talk to people and find that it's not as difficult as he thought. In the end, it should require some thorough thinking. It's a very individual thing and we can only speculate and give our thoughts/experiences.


That's good for you and the way it should be ideally. But we have several people in this thread saying that was not their experience. I'm just being realistic. You'd be surprised how much goes unseen in schools. One teachers can't notice everything in a class of 30+ students. Victims often don't speak out etc. Avoiding bullying in a school environment is not an easy task.
The bolded is true, but in giving those suggestions it's important to consider how it feeds into hibernophobia and the continued oppression of Irish culture. Irish traditions and the usage of the Irish language were heavily suppressed during the United Kingdom's occupation of Ireland.

The suggestions some people are making, driven by their own thoughts and experience (many I would suspect coming from a privileged background where their culture and language wasn't purposely decimated via occupation and left a shell of its former self), are resulting in them suggesting that traditional Irish names should be Anglicised or outright dismissed as choices (because they're 'weird' or 'unique' even though not only are they not but the spelling is consistent with the Irish language) for the benefit of native English speakers, despite the names being perfectly normal, acceptable, and common names in the area the OP is talking about, is incredibly xenaphobic.

Many people's suggestions and 'wisdom' in this thread are centred around the idea of 'whitewashing' the child's name in order to try and avoid harassment. Things about how a common Irish name (both in Ireland and where the OP is discussing) is 'difficult to spell for English speakers', it's 'weird/reminds them of some slang phrase', and 'challenging to say' are incredibly English-centric reasons to dismiss the name rather than something routed solely out of 'personal experience' and absolutely routed in a xenophobia which shouldn't be appeased. I don't think the OP should choose the name out of fear of other's racist reactions anymore than the OP should choose the child's religion or encourage/discourage exploration of gender and sexuality based on whether the child will be bullied for it.
 
Apr 27, 2019
52
Little Timmy in Kindergarten and Sarah in 3rd grade won't know or care that we live in a globalized world and different languages and dialects have very different names. They'll hear a funny name, they see that spelling and pronunciation are completely different than what they know and make fun of the kid.
Put into consideration that Little Timmy and Sarah live less than 50 miles from Ireland in a region that also historically spoke a Gaelic language with similar pronunciations, will grow up seeing Gaelic names on roadsigns and maps, and will take classes in Gaelic throughout their school career. Put into consideration that the OP has asked about this on British football communities where people had so much familiarity with the various Gaelic languages that they would passionately fight about regional pronunciation variations. We're not talking about a Korean guy wanting to name his son Αναστασιος here.
 

xEik

The Fallen
Nov 17, 2017
4,422
Principality of Catalonia
The bolded is true, but in giving those suggestions it's important to consider how it feeds into hibernophobia and the continued oppression of Irish culture. Irish traditions and the usage of the Irish language were heavily suppressed during the United Kingdom's occupation of Ireland.

The suggestions some people are making, driven by their own thoughts and experience (many I would suspect coming from a privileged background where their culture and language wasn't purposely decimated via occupation and left a shell of its former self), are resulting in them suggesting that traditional Irish names should be Anglicised or outright dismissed as choices (because they're 'weird' or 'unique' even though not only are they not but the spelling is consistent with the Irish language) for the benefit of native English speakers, despite the names being perfectly normal, acceptable, and common names in the area the OP is talking about, is incredibly xenaphobic.

Many people's suggestions and 'wisdom' in this thread are centred around the idea of 'whitewashing' the child's name in order to try and avoid harassment. Things about how a common Irish name (both in Ireland and where the OP is discussing) is 'difficult to spell for English speakers', it's 'weird/reminds them of some slang phrase', and 'challenging to say' are incredibly English-centric reasons to dismiss the name rather than something routed solely out of 'personal experience' and absolutely routed in a xenophobia which shouldn't be appeased. I don't think the OP should choose the name out of fear of other's racist reactions anymore than the OP should choose the child's religion or encourage/discourage exploration of gender and sexuality based on whether the child will be bullied for it.
There's nothing that predominant cultures like more than minority cultures self-erasing themselves. It gives the same result as when they used imposition but without the need to dirty their hands.
 

butzopower

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,861
London
I think this thread does illustrate the pros and cons of the name.

Loads of people are going to be ignorant to the spelling/pronunciation, and lots of people love to get upset from their ignorance. It's just the way people seem to be, for whatever reason. So can understand your view, because it puts a lot of pressure on a kid.

Some people have genuinely been curious and OP has pretty much started copy-pasting an explanation and educating people. More people now have a better understanding of the Irish language than they did before. Only through people's ignorance being challenged, did they grow and learn. Can totally understand your wife's point of view on that, burying the culture effectively kills it, because noones ignorance is challenged, and nobody learns.

There's a lot to unpack, especially given the history of Ireland. Not exactly a coincidence there aren't as many people with Irish names as there might have been.
 

Deleted member 44129

User requested account closure
Banned
May 29, 2018
7,690
Just an aside, our kids name is Eric James. We went through every possible combination of ways the name could be used against him, and decided it was squeaky clean.

The first time we introduced our kid to my best mate he yelled "I'm Eric James, BITCH !"
 

Stop It

Bad Cat
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,352
I think this thread does illustrate the pros and cons of the name.

Loads of people are going to be ignorant to the spelling/pronunciation, and lots of people love to get upset from their ignorance. It's just the way people seem to be, for whatever reason. So can understand your view, because it puts a lot of pressure on a kid.

Some people have genuinely been curious and OP has pretty much started copy-pasting an explanation and educating people. More people now have a better understanding of the Irish language than they did before. Only through people's ignorance being challenged, did they grow and learn. Can totally understand your wife's point of view on that, burying the culture effectively kills it, because noones ignorance is challenged, and nobody learns.

There's a lot to unpack, especially given the history of Ireland. Not exactly a coincidence there aren't as many people with Irish names as there might have been.
Exactly.

If people are bullied for non common names, making the names even less common is surely counterproductive.

Preserving that cultural identity via things like this keeps it alive and as Gaelic is a family of language that is also native to Scotland, using the Irish language for naming isn't out of the ordinary and really should be encouraged.

Edit: For dull disclosure my partner mum was Irish and an immigrant to the UK. So a little bit invested in the subject indirectly.
 

Metalix

Member
Oct 28, 2017
883
She is very keen on the Irish name Caoimhe. It's actually a lovely name, but for an English speaker it's a bit of a mindfuck, as it's pronounced Qweeva or Kweeva.

As a fellow Scot who supported a predominately Irish clientbase that pronunciation was still lost on me, haha. Irish is a riot: "How come you don't spell Steve, Stiamh?"
 

NekoNeko

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
18,447
My name is Basque and most people elsewhere in Spain have trouble with it at the beginning. I shudder at the notion of not wanting to have a name related to someone's culture because other people elsewhere in the country couldn't pronounce it.

Basque is hard though, throwing random X's everywhere.
 

Catdaddy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,963
TN
I'm sure it's been mentioned, but give her a decent/common name to fall back on. I've always been of the opinion that people that get weird with names without thinking things through are selfish and not thinking of their child and consequences down the line.. We went a common name for my daughter and a middle name that is somewhat unique.
 

purpleturtle

Member
Jan 27, 2019
27
I don't know if "queef" is used often where you're from, but if it is I would choose a different nane. Based on my childhood experience people will make all sorts of rude nicknames leveraging the similarity in pronunciation.

Nevermind - just saw how it would likely be pronounced "Keeva." I have no strong feelings then I guess.
 

DJ_Lae

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,870
Edmonton
I don't really see an issue with the name, to be honest - maybe go with a more 'typical' middle name she could use as a nickname, but you'd be surprised how weird some people go (or maybe you wouldn't).

One of the more normal names in our midwife parent group was Wynter Storm.
 

deepFlaw

Knights of Favonius World Tour '21
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,496
Just pick a middle name that's also important to you that she can fall back on if ever needed, I guess? Obviously she can always come up with something herself at that point, but a name that also means something to you and your wife would be preferred, no? I know people are suggesting just making this her middle name, but unless your school systems etc. very strict about using the first name, I don't think you'd need to go that far.

Cause I only skimmed the thread, but it sounds like the name isn't that uncommon in context even if it's unusual for us Americans. And I think trying to minimize easy bullying targets and such isn't a bad idea, but it shouldn't keep you from picking a name that your wife likes and reflects where she's from.
 

Deleted member 2761

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,620
You have more options than just "Caoimhe" versus "not Caoimhe". You could just straight up Anglicize its spelling to Kiva or Keeva. Alternatively, you can do as my parents did and essentially give their children two names, one regularly used and given out to people people who speak the language, and the other essentially used in official documents and given to people who aren't as familiar with the language.
 

aisback

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,745
From someone who has a strange name for a guy I think you are being pretty reasonable.

A more easy name as a middle name appears to be the perfect solution.

Amber
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,669
You have more options than just "Caoimhe" versus "not Caoimhe". You could just straight up Anglicize its spelling to Kiva or Keeva. Alternatively, you can do as my parents did and essentially give their children two names, one regularly used and given out to people people who speak the language, and the other essentially used in official documents and given to people who aren't as familiar with the language.
Yeah, the bolded isn't really a compromise as much as it's quite insulting.

People should think about the poor person that has to live with the name before naming their child.
Think of the poor child living with the twenty fifth most common girls name in Ireland.
 

Deleted member 984

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,203
Just go with it. It's interesting, has cultural significance, will stand out on a CV. It will also give her an intolerance detector so she doesn't have to waste time on dick heads.
 

butzopower

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,861
London
Yea this. I wouldn't name your daughter that either.

Like most people from the North of Ireland (where the wife is from) we'd be pronouncing it Keeva.

C = plain old hard K sound
aoi = EE (as in Aoife (eefah) and Saoirse (Seer-sha)
mh = V sound
e = sort of an "uh"

Kweeva is the 'correct' pronunciation in terms of traditional rules of the language, but that's really only used in the South of Ireland (and gets more common the further west you get) and she's from the Donegal where it's normally Keeva. The pronunciation as Keeva is more common now as it's the slightly anglised version. A bit like Kevin, the root of Kevin in Irish is Caoimhín is pronounced KwEE-VEEN but the w caused by initial broad consonant C (pronounced like Cappacino) into a medial slender consonant ( the mh pronounced as a V), is mostly ignored in some Irish dialects and has been dropped completely in the anglised version. Irish and Gaelic is difficult because of the interplay between slender and broad vowels and consonants depends so much on what surrounds them, and don't get me started on modifiers.
 

CampFreddie

A King's Landing
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,957
I expect it's fine, since gaelic names are common enough in Scotland. It'd be trickier if you lived in Kent.

There are enough Niamhs, Siobhans and Eilidhs in the UK that gaelic names won't seem too unusual.

If you're worried then the garlic middle name is a good option.
 

Miles X

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
710
Forget pronounciation, it's an ugly sounding name to begin with. I'd put your foot down, just pull on the heartstrings and claim she'd be bullied.
 

Herne

Member
Dec 10, 2017
5,319
Forget pronounciation, it's an ugly sounding name to begin with. I'd put your foot down, just pull on the heartstrings and claim she'd be bullied.

The OP says he likes the name, that's not what the issue is. So why do people have to come in here and shit all over it? He didn't ask what mean thought you had about a potential name for his child.

Kids are unbelievably cruel. Don't give them anything to use against your daughter.

If there's anything this thread proves, it's that many adults are, too.
 

LL_Decitrig

User-Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
10,334
Sunderland
When considering a name you have to consider "will this get my kid bullied in school"'

Oh come on. You're doing the bullies' work for them. When you say crap like this, I hear you openly and unashamedly declaring that you intend to capitulate to the presence of bullying in your child's education. It's your job as a parent to ensure that the bullies will not gain a foothold in yet another generation.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,731
I'm Irish,

My daughters name is Sadhbh. Most people in Ireland can't spell that either,.

Deal with it man, Caoimhe is a gorgeous name, and very common over here.

Anglesing the spelling is a fucking insult, use the Irish spelling.

EDIT:
Sadhbh constantly gets her name mispelled and mispronounced, she thinks its hilarious. Even family get it wrong on birthday/Christmas cards, its a running joke. I say let this one go. Embrace it.
 
Last edited:

shotopunx

Member
Nov 21, 2017
1,588
Dublin, Ireland
I'm Irish,

My daughters name is Sadhbh. Most people in Ireland can't spell that either,.

Deal with it man, Caoimhe is a gorgeous name, and very common over here.

Anglesing the spelling is a fucking insult, use the Irish spelling.

EDIT:
Sadhbh constantly gets her name mispelled and mispronounced, she thinks its hilarious. Even family get it wrong on birthday/Christmas cards, its a running joke. I say let this one go. Embrace it.


Before anyone asks it's pronounced "Sive".
 
Oct 27, 2017
7,486
Oh come on. You're doing the bullies' work for them. When you say crap like this, I hear you openly and unashamedly declaring that you intend to capitulate to the presence of bullying in your child's education. It's your job as a parent to ensure that the bullies will not gain a foothold in yet another generation.

It's just common sense, surely. Children are occasionally unpleasant to other children, you're never going to eradicate bullying and that's not an admission of failure, that's just realism. You attempt to give every advantage to your kids and that includes not saddling them with a name that might cause difficulties throughout their lives.

I'm going to call my kid Tosspot and then we'll just parent away the bullying.