r/msi_gaming lots of people report stuff like sometimes not POST and many other different issues
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AMD Ryzen 3000 and Radeon RX 5700 - Review Thread
- Thread starter vestan
- Start date
I really think this is dependent on the motherboard.
Do you know this list? AM4 Vcore VRM Ratings v1.2 (2019-07-10)
Maybe it can help to understand if those problem appear on motherboards with a too weak VRM ...
Edit
After visiting reddit, the problems I see there, are related to motherboards not upgraded with a BIOS that supports Ryzen 3000 or a BIOS outdated. For Tomahawk there is a working BIOS: 7C02v1A.
I also see that some of the issues are related to using FLASHBACK. That method is its own animal and I personally think the feature is broken as I for myself never got it working. I always use a command line flash tool to flash my BIOS. That way I can also rollback to older versions.
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Reposting from builders thread:
OMFG, I got my rig working!!!
I have 1 bad stick of RAM. I ran memtest overnight and it passed day 1, but when I built rigs at work I have seen 2 cases where memtest will catch a bit error once every 2 days and where RAM works at first but then quickly fails.
I'm 100% sure it's the RAM, despite not having memtest results (yet if I choose to RMA) because:
1. With both sticks in the system:
-The system would always post
-Games would load maybe 20% of the time at best.
-If witcher 3 loaded to the map, geralt would always kind of step forward a couple of times as he does but the fps would stutter heavy
-Once games loaded successfully, it would have the fps uptick and keep working for the long haul
-Once games started failing, it would keep failing until reboot
-Windows would mostly work. Every now and then things like task manager would stop responding...and when I noticed this earlier today I knew it had to be memory.
2. With 1 of the 2 sticks, everything ran super fast. I loaded and fucked around for about 1 minute the following games 5 times:
-Witcher 3 (loaded immediately into smooth fps)
-Deus Ex Mankind Divided
-Civilization 6 DX11 mode
3. Swapping back to the other stick to confirm it was the stick and not the motherboard RAM configuration, immediately I had problems:
-BIOS wouldn't post the 1st time, just hung at ASUS Republic of Gaming, MOBO code 0d which is a future error
-2nd time Windows BSOD with Video Scheduler error
4. Put back the other stick in, and repeated #2 testing and all passed.
As a DevOps software engineer in a different industry, my best hypothesis is that something is fucked up with 1 stick of RAM, whether it's bit errors or handling stuff with real world store/copy commands or stability with the entire system at load. Given the random behavior of stability, I'm leaning towards bad bit addresses, and that's why things sort of worked with both sticks in depending on where memory was allocated with chances being reduced with both sticks. Once allocated in a bad sector, windows will cache it and on reload use the same address and keep failing.
For those of you that have keen memory, I bitched on here before. I started with the ASUS Prime x570 Pro, and thought it was the motherboard and got this:
ASUS ROG Strix X570-E Gaming ATX Motherboard
Nvidia 1080 ti
32 GB Corsair Dominator Platinum RGB 32GB CMT32GX4M2C3200C16
ASUS xonar stx sound card
Windows 1903 Pro x64 with latest updates.
Latest AMD chipset driver
Unfortunately the older BIOS without the AGESA 1.0.0.3AB fix. Weird that the gaming model doesn't have it but the ASUS Prime Pro does.
And holy fuck the CPU transfer between motherboards was a nightmare. The thermal paste was like half dry paint, the stock cooler had excess, and a few pins got paste on them. I verrrryyyy carefully used a soft toothbrush (for gums, so very small) and dipped it in rubbing alcohol and gently brushed/dissolved it away. Once it dried, I was happy to just hit Windows.
I Immediately loaded the already installed windows and exact same errors. I felt like I was going insane. Then I went down a rabbit hole of more searches. Along the way I found out that XMP on these boards is DOCP and my memory was running vastly slower than it was speced for.
I'm going to sleep well tonight.
OMFG, I got my rig working!!!
I have 1 bad stick of RAM. I ran memtest overnight and it passed day 1, but when I built rigs at work I have seen 2 cases where memtest will catch a bit error once every 2 days and where RAM works at first but then quickly fails.
I'm 100% sure it's the RAM, despite not having memtest results (yet if I choose to RMA) because:
1. With both sticks in the system:
-The system would always post
-Games would load maybe 20% of the time at best.
-If witcher 3 loaded to the map, geralt would always kind of step forward a couple of times as he does but the fps would stutter heavy
-Once games loaded successfully, it would have the fps uptick and keep working for the long haul
-Once games started failing, it would keep failing until reboot
-Windows would mostly work. Every now and then things like task manager would stop responding...and when I noticed this earlier today I knew it had to be memory.
2. With 1 of the 2 sticks, everything ran super fast. I loaded and fucked around for about 1 minute the following games 5 times:
-Witcher 3 (loaded immediately into smooth fps)
-Deus Ex Mankind Divided
-Civilization 6 DX11 mode
3. Swapping back to the other stick to confirm it was the stick and not the motherboard RAM configuration, immediately I had problems:
-BIOS wouldn't post the 1st time, just hung at ASUS Republic of Gaming, MOBO code 0d which is a future error
-2nd time Windows BSOD with Video Scheduler error
4. Put back the other stick in, and repeated #2 testing and all passed.
As a DevOps software engineer in a different industry, my best hypothesis is that something is fucked up with 1 stick of RAM, whether it's bit errors or handling stuff with real world store/copy commands or stability with the entire system at load. Given the random behavior of stability, I'm leaning towards bad bit addresses, and that's why things sort of worked with both sticks in depending on where memory was allocated with chances being reduced with both sticks. Once allocated in a bad sector, windows will cache it and on reload use the same address and keep failing.
For those of you that have keen memory, I bitched on here before. I started with the ASUS Prime x570 Pro, and thought it was the motherboard and got this:
ASUS ROG Strix X570-E Gaming ATX Motherboard
Nvidia 1080 ti
32 GB Corsair Dominator Platinum RGB 32GB CMT32GX4M2C3200C16
ASUS xonar stx sound card
Windows 1903 Pro x64 with latest updates.
Latest AMD chipset driver
Unfortunately the older BIOS without the AGESA 1.0.0.3AB fix. Weird that the gaming model doesn't have it but the ASUS Prime Pro does.
And holy fuck the CPU transfer between motherboards was a nightmare. The thermal paste was like half dry paint, the stock cooler had excess, and a few pins got paste on them. I verrrryyyy carefully used a soft toothbrush (for gums, so very small) and dipped it in rubbing alcohol and gently brushed/dissolved it away. Once it dried, I was happy to just hit Windows.
I Immediately loaded the already installed windows and exact same errors. I felt like I was going insane. Then I went down a rabbit hole of more searches. Along the way I found out that XMP on these boards is DOCP and my memory was running vastly slower than it was speced for.
I'm going to sleep well tonight.
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I've tested and uploaded videos of Batman Arkham Knight and the Gladiator mode in Ryse Son Of Rome.
Watch Dogs 2 is another game I have tested but I haven't recorded any gameplay of it yet, I'll be sure to let you know when I do!
Unfortunately I realized after recording the gameplay that I was GPU bound in Ryse at 1440p 70% resolution, so I'll be doing another test of it at 720p or something close to it using the "rendering resolution" option in the game.
Batman Arkham Knight (Gameplay Benchmark) Ryzen 5 3600 CPU Test + GTX 1080 Ti
Ryse: Son Of Rome Gladiator Mode (Gameplay Benchmark) - Ryzen 5 3600 CPU Test + GTX 1080 Ti
I've seen a ton of complaints on Reddit regarding MSI boards. I myself have an MSI B450M Mortar and fortunately haven't had any issues after reinstalling Windows, I initially hadn't done it because I hadn't been able to properly prepare for a reinstall since the whole of my CX300 is dedicated to Windows 10 and hasn't been in another PC since my motherboard bit the dust. So I needed to move over a few files to my other drives to ensure a smooth reinstall.
I had a few problems with long post and boot times that was rectified by reinstalling Windows after a clean format of the drive and setting the OS boot mode to UEFI instead of UEFI+Legacy.
BIOS updating was smooth sailing through the use of the BIOS flash button. I'm worried about updating to the V19 bios though since I heard about the issues people are having with their boards. It seems the new V19 BIOS for my motherboard added the option to have overclock profiles which would be a nice addition but I'm not sure if I want to take the gamble lol.
For those that have a RX 5700 (XT). IgorsLAB introducing a tool that automates using SPPT and the editing of the parameters. Unfortunately the video is still entirely in german. English subtitles are in the works if I understood correctly.
Edit:
There is an english article describing the tool and its usage: https://www.igorslab.media/morepowe...x-5700-xt-tweaking-and-overclocking-software/
Edit:
There is an english article describing the tool and its usage: https://www.igorslab.media/morepowe...x-5700-xt-tweaking-and-overclocking-software/
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The Tomahawk and the Mortar (and the Gaming Pro Carbon) are the best B450 boards on the market imo. For my Tomahawk OC profiles were re-introduced with the 1A BIOS update (Lite BIOS).
I don't even know if I could understand that even if it were in English, lol.
My 5700XT is finally running smoothly. The trick for me was to only download the latest video driver through AMD and not the additional drivers. Apparently the Enhanced sync. feature is what's causing issues. My old RX 480 struggled a bit to play Dishonored 2 even at 1080p unless I turned down some of the settings. Now I can play Ultra at 1440p and get between 105fps and 120fps.
SPPT is a registry hack that allows for tuning your card beyond what WattMan currently allows. Means clock speeds and power limits. There is actually an english article about it in the video notes: https://www.igorslab.media/morepowe...x-5700-xt-tweaking-and-overclocking-software/
I think I've given up on the 3900x dream, just can't find one in stock and the extra cores/threads are probably wasted on me anyways. Guessing a 3700x will work well enough. A 9900k would probably be better as I mostly need single thread for iracing, but I like the idea of going all AMD right now (have a Vega 64 GPU).
I wouldn't worry too much. 1080ti or faster + 1440 + high refresh optimized situations are where the 9900k shows leads over 3700/3900. With a Vega64/1080/5700/2070 level GPU, the gap should be basically nil. Certainly so miniscule as to not be detectable by observation.
Appreciate the time and effort you put into this. Thanks :)
The average gap with a 2080 ti at 1080p was 5%, now it's gone down to 3.8% (going by Techpowerup) as the new chipset driver last week has improved performance by 1.2%!
Sounds like nothing but the margins here are tiny so nice to see how close it's getting to the fastest gaming chip.
After getting no performance improvements whatsoever with Precision Boost Overdrive or AutoOC, I've started tinkering around with a manual overclock in Ryzen Master for my 3800X.
If all cores were under load, PB/PBO/AutoOC all came out basically the same, and they would clock the eight cores somewhere between 4.125 and 4.2GHz. Even with a voltage set slightly lower than the one the system used automatically for 4.2GHz, I've managed to set a (seemingly stable) manual 4.4GHz clock speed.
My CPU-Z multi-thread benchmark score went way up, if nothing else. It was barely over 5700 points previously, and that was if I had a lucky run. Cinebench R20 went up too, from around 5000 to 5327.
The idle/load temperatures and power draw are still roughly the same too (as it is being reported by HWiNFO), so unless I'm overlooking something major, I feel like that's a pretty good deal.
If all cores were under load, PB/PBO/AutoOC all came out basically the same, and they would clock the eight cores somewhere between 4.125 and 4.2GHz. Even with a voltage set slightly lower than the one the system used automatically for 4.2GHz, I've managed to set a (seemingly stable) manual 4.4GHz clock speed.
My CPU-Z multi-thread benchmark score went way up, if nothing else. It was barely over 5700 points previously, and that was if I had a lucky run. Cinebench R20 went up too, from around 5000 to 5327.
The idle/load temperatures and power draw are still roughly the same too (as it is being reported by HWiNFO), so unless I'm overlooking something major, I feel like that's a pretty good deal.
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I really want this 5700 but I doubt it's coming to Europe and I haven't heard too many good things about Yeston
The first AIB 5700 XT is coming out the gates August 13th. No word on pricing yet.
Thank you!
I've got two videos of Watch Dogs 2 up now, a third will be going up later which will have over 25 minutes of gameplay.
Watch Dogs 2 - Ryzen 5 3600 CPU Test 1 + GTX 1080 Ti
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Running a 3700x on a Gigabyte x470 board, coming from a 6700k and I'm in love with this thing. Had to kinda ball out on the motherboard but it was so worth it; only game I've really tested is Destiny 2 since I'm hopelessly addicted but my framerate is so much more stable. Ryzen Master seems like an awesome tool that I have no idea how to navigate yet, I've dabbled a little bit into OC-ing my E-Die RAM but haven't gotten anywhere with it yet.
I had to upgrade my MSI B450 Gaming Pro Carbon AC yesterday to use my AMD 3600.
Have to say, it was a pain in the ass. I wish the process was more transparent, or that the bios upgrade would at least write some kind of log file / error code.
Overall the Flashback upgrade took me probably 2 hours, countless threads on reddit and youtube videos as well as multiple usb sticks. I also cannot say would really worked in the end.
Did you both use FAT32 usb sticks? I used one and had no issues flashing my bios on my MSI B450M Mortar.
If I get an X570 mobo will it avoid all this flashing the bios stuff? I really don't want to have to do that.
I upgraded only the MB without any hardware and confirmed that only the EZ led for the gpu was on (confirming cpu and ram were ok).
Then I installed everything into the case and suddenly the EZ cpu light was on again and nothing happened after multiple boots.
After that I tried multiple sticks (I used 4, 8, 16, 32GB sticks formatted as Fat32 and as MBR). Multiple reboots after flashes (it always seemed to flash correctly as it took multiple minutes for the procedure to finish). On my last try for the day it suddenly worked, no clue what the issue was.
You'll still have to flash a more mature bios eventually, but it'd be just a regular bios update through UEFI, not the flashback kind. Either way, some X470/B450 mobos are getting re-released with 3000 support out of the box (like the MSI MAX revisions) so you could get those as well, you're not forced to buy an X570.
Ok thanks. Any idea of the timeline on those X470/B450 models?
What issue with v19 BIOS? I'm using MSI B450M Mortar as well.
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I think the FAT32 stick I used was a USB 2.0 one.
Wow, that's really weird. I too used a 32GB FAT32 stick and it worked straight away.
I'm mainly just paranoid about upgrading because I've heard of people having so many issues with just bios updates in general, not necessarily the V19 bios.
I don't really feel like trying my luck any further while things are running smoothly for me. I might upgrade it on a day I feel like taking risks, but that day is not today lol.
Is Quad-Core Gaming Dead? - Ryzen 7 3700X vs. Core i5-3330 - 2019
An interesting comparison for those who are still on the older 4C/4T Ivy Bridge or Sandy Bridge platforms and on the fence whether to upgrade to the Zen 2 platform for gaming etc.
An interesting comparison for those who are still on the older 4C/4T Ivy Bridge or Sandy Bridge platforms and on the fence whether to upgrade to the Zen 2 platform for gaming etc.
Yeah mostly, you may need to update bios but thats easier than buying a x470 thats not compatible out of the box.
I've just upgraded from a 2500k to a 3700x without upgrading my gpu yet (RX 470) and it's night and day in certain games. I'm actually able to reach 60fps in games that previously wouldn't let me even on unacceptably low graphics settings.
Ah, I see, you're right. I've paired Ryzen 7 3700X with my B450M Mortar, and the most stable BIOSes out of the three (v17, v18, and v19). I found v17 to be the most stable. v18 never hits the stated max boost clock of my 3700X i.e. 4.4 GHz, while the v17 does. With v19 I've noticed the CPU voltage almost never goes below 1.46V even on idle with every task/program in the background closed/turned off, while the voltage can go as low as 0.31V during idle with BIOS v17.
Exactly. Crysis 3 and Watch Dogs 2 shows the biggest difference in that vid. Where the difference is like previously it was only possible to do 30fps vs. 60fps+ now with the 8-core Zen 2 chip.
Yes, AMD Cool n' Quiet is turned on.
This is relevant to my interests.
I have a very similar current setup, 2600k and RX480 currently. I'm almost certainly going to go for a 3700X. Glad to hear it makes a huge difference.
Need to pick a graphics card too and the value offered by the 5700xt looks hard to beat at the moment.
What motherboard do you have, if you don't mind?
In the UK some of the MSI MAX boards are already out.
You can get the MSI B450 Tomahawk max for the same price as the old one for example. I can't imagine it'd take that long to go elsewhere too.
What game wouldnt let you hit 60fps with a 2500K.
Cuz I can hit 60 in Odyssey on a 2500K.
Processors arent as important vs many many games.
With freesync a Sandybridge and Ivybridge are still actually totally totally viable for gaming.
Upgrading to a 3700X but thats just cuz im leaving GPU rendering behind and going towards CPU(and its just time) so I need dem cores but not willing to buy the 3900X
But so far NO game has actually beat my 2500K.
And its not even clocked that high.
FWIW, I couldn't hit 60fps in Odyssey on a OC'd 3570k(and I upgraded to a 1080ti last year, so it wasn't a gpu bottleneck - with my new CPU I'm getting 70-100). There was also other games I struggled with too, like Anthem and Fallout 76 were completely unplayable for reasons beyond them just not being that good, lol.
MSI B450 Gaming Pro Carbon AC. Since they've explicitly said they're not making a MAX version of that (because it's too good basically, they want you to buy an X570 Carbon if you're in that price range) they've had to drop the standard MSI bios interface for a more text-based one, the Click Bios lite (it looks like this) because of size limitations of the chip. You can still use the mouse if you want, it's just missing all the fancy pictures.
Yakuza Kiwami 2: absolute shitshow, couldn't keep 60 in Kamurocho even on 720p all low.
Shadow of the Tomb Raider (trial): Area-dependant, but it was a stuttery mess at times. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJvwmVXBA1w
FFXV (trial): When I'm not gpu-bound it's much, much more stable than before. Previously I had to stand still to keep a stable 60.
I didn't buy it yet but I'm pretty sure Dragon Quest XI can't hit 60 in cities or something like that.
Also, obviously Overwatch has no issues running on a 2500k, but since the upgrade I haven't had a single drop to the 40/50s which occasionally happened.
Coming from the same CPU, I was definitely seeing issues with bottlenecking, I was running it without an OC though. 3700x seems to have no problem with just about anything i throw at it, now I just need that new GPU to replace my old 290x and I should be golden for a good while.
Im guessing you already upgraded so this wont help much.
If you elevate the exe for most games that "give trouble" to Sandy and Ivy the games would consistently hit 60.
They are def long in tooth now and im not advocating NOT upgrading the 3700X and 3900X are too good a deal to not jump on as Sandy/Ivy users. Im jumping ship after being Intel since the dawn of time
But they are still more than capable of hitting 60fps at 1440p.
There arent that many games that need much more than 4 cores at 4.5 to hit 60fps.
Funny you mention Shadow of the Tomb Raider.
Im currently going through that right now, I was actually waiting to start it because of Zen 2 but my Zen 2 purchase is taking longer than anticipated and more games are coming that im getting so didnt want too huge a backlog........and I didnt even need to elevate the exe it just pulls 60 no problem. The town (where Jonah and chick chill) was the only section that caused any issues.
And Dragon Quest was no problem as well....and I was playing it with DSR from 4K.
Maybe I got a golden sample or something.
Not refuting this specifically, just stating that IPC is a major part of this. Core counts and clock speed are two pieces of three that are needed for fast chips, the missing one is IPC and this is where older chips fall down greatly. IPC is what affects games the most.
Hitting 60fps is okay, but can you stay above it? What are your lows? 1%? Bad IPC can greatly affect your overall experience even if you can hit the target FPS.
I actually did try elevating in some cases, but that can run into even more issues if the game is extremely cpu demanding. It can cause the game to be more important on the CPU than mouse and keyboard inputs for example(oddly enough gamepads don't seem to experience this issue as much, not sure why).
I agree for most games the CPU is still fine for 1440p/60hz. It's why I held out for so long, but there definitely has been a few games over the past year which are really stressing them. Another one I didn't mention in the previous post was the Division 2. During the time I was playing The Division 2 we had to swap to using discord for voice chat because our mumble server got abruptly shut down, and I just couldn't use it. Division 2 stressed the CPU so much that it just didn't allow discord to breath, and it seems discord uses a lot more CPU than mumble did. In the end we just had to ditch discord and get another server.
Sadly I think Sandy Bridge/Ivy Bridge are nearing the end of their time. But damn, they've had a good run. That CPU was solid as a rock in my system for basically 7 years.
This is very true also. Even at the same framerate it feels a lot smoother on the new CPU just because it isn't getting micro stuttering.
how noticeable would the difference be if i upgraded to a ryzen 5 3600 from an i7 4770k? i currently combo w/ a gtx 1070, 16gb of ram and a 1440p 144z gsync monitor
I had an i7 4790K (refreshed i7 4770K) and upgraded to the Ryzen 5 3600, the performance boost is profound in CPU-bound games!
Unfortunately I can't run any benchmarks with my i7 4790K as my motherboard bit the dust but games such as Assassin's Creed Origins and Watch Dogs 2 run much smoother on the Ryzen 5 3600 than on my i7 4790K.
FFXV is another game which I played which runs much smoother although I don't have any gameplay of it uploaded yet.
In Assassin's Creed Origins there were points on my i7 4790K where it would dip to around 40-50 fps in areas such as Alexandria and Memphis, so far with my Ryzen 5 3600 I haven't seen any dips lower than 80 fps.
I have 100s of gigabytes of gameplay recorded so hopefully I can find some older tests I did with my i7 4790K but I'm not sure if I do.
In this post I have included numerous videos of me testing games with my Ryzen 5 3600 and GTX 1080 Ti:
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Ah, so going from an i7-4790k to Ryzen 5 3600 was a massive improvement in performance? That's great considering the price of that cpu.
Yes it's really great, there's been a performance improvement in pretty much every game I've played!
I still need to do some more testing of more games though such as Battlefield 3, 4 and 1, as well as Forza Horizon 3.
Thank you for following up on this - I have that same i7 and GPU and have been debating whether it was time to upgrade. Do you happen to recall what your 4790k was clocked at?
