Anthem Review Thread

Oct 25, 2017
9,930
Miami, FL
I prefer switching loadout in-game, but I’m a filthy casual. I don’t need it to be realistic, I just find it more engaging when I can think about and use the best weapon I have for the job when situations change.
Yea that's totally respectable and most games offer instant switching. And for good reason, to be honest.

But I also understand why this game doesn't, and it's just a style choice. Personally I like it, but would like it a lot more if it didn't take 3-5 minutes to swap out weapons and do the loop of: Freeplay --> Tarsus --> change loadout --> Freeplay. The load times must change.

Streamerhouse got banned for farming in the most efficient way they knew how. Wow, looking for that reaction.
The Twitch channel? Can you tell us more about that? What were they doing? Bans don't get handed out for nothing, right?
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,930
Miami, FL


Imagine if Bungie banned people who were using loot cave or the omnegul checkpoint. Fucking lol
yikes.

But I just went to his stream and he’s playing it right now...?
They applied a new code. Apparently they didn't lose any progress? I don't really understand but they did get banned.

I want to know what they did.

edit:

"EagleEyeSm: no you werent abusing a checkpoint. you were disconnecting from the server and abusing their reconnect feature. "
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,930
Miami, FL
They kill a boss and restart at a checkpoint by dying or something. Loot cave of this game it seems. But you have to kill the boss.
I see.

I don't really understand, though. They have all of their gear? Did they start from scratch? It seems like they've lost no progress (based on their progress on goals in the menu system). Are saves done in the cloud or locally?
 
Oct 28, 2017
9,767
But I just went to his stream and he’s playing it right now...?
I imagine its a different origin account or something
They kill a boss and restart at a checkpoint by dying or something. Loot cave of this game it seems. But you have to kill the boss.
I can't even begin to imagine the logic of banning people for loot exploits in a PVE only game. What the fuck is even the point? And even if that were logical (it isnt), you dont offer a warning before a permaban? Bioware has no idea what theyre doing in this genre.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,131
I see.

I don't really understand, though. They have all of their gear? Did they start from scratch? It seems like they've lost no progress (based on their progress on goals in the menu system). Are saves done in the cloud or locally?
They are on another account or something.

Oh he mentioned activation key. Maybe they just took the game from them but their account and save stuff still works. The first one was the Legendary or EA Pass version, this one is apparently standard so it's a different activation license I suppose.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,930
Miami, FL
I can't even begin to imagine the logic of banning people for loot exploits in a PVE only game. What the fuck is even the point? And even if that were logical (it isnt), you dont offer a warning before a permaban? Bioware has no idea what theyre doing in this genre.
I agree.

Checkpoint farming in a loot game is like white and rice.

They are on another account or something.

Oh he mentioned activation key. Maybe they just took the game from them but their account and save stuff still works.
what a strange system.

I would expect a ban to mean you lose your character and progress related to it.
 
Oct 28, 2017
9,767
Ban someone that accounts for 10% of your games twitch numbers, for farming loot like literally every other loot game community does. Way to have your shit together bioware.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,131
Actually thinking about it, what loot game have I not farmed a boss without using a check point? Diablo 3? Check points. Path of Exile? Not boss but farm area check points.

Bioware, what are you doing cousin?

Ban someone that accounts for 10% of your games twitch numbers, for farming loot like literally every other loot game community does. Way to have your shit together bioware.
Exactly. Want to see them removing checkpoints. That will go over nicely.
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,930
Miami, FL
Actually thinking about it, what loot game have I not farmed a boss without using a check point? Diablo 3? Check points. Path of Exile? Not boss but farm area check points.

Bioware, what are you doing cousin?
Actually I think I've only done true "checkpoint farming" once: in Destiny 2 in a part of Forsaken's expansion when it came out. There was a chest you could farm in perpetuity if the party leader hadn't finished a given quest before. It felt gross, actually.
 
Oct 30, 2017
1,067
Yea that's totally respectable and most games offer instant switching. And for good reason, to be honest.

But I also understand why this game doesn't, and it's just a style choice. Personally I like it, but would like it a lot more if it didn't take 3-5 minutes to swap out weapons and do the loop of: Freeplay --> Tarsus --> change loadout --> Freeplay. The load times must change.
I doubt its style choice. Judging by the amount of loading screens and continual bugs around completing quests and going into cutscenes etc. I bet that it's a technical limitation just like everything else in this game.

I imagine its a different origin account or something

I can't even begin to imagine the logic of banning people for loot exploits in a PVE only game. What the fuck is even the point? And even if that were logical (it isnt), you dont offer a warning before a permaban? Bioware has no idea what theyre doing in this genre.
Banning is dumb for doing something within the confines of the game. Instead BW should just fix it so people can't do it.
 
Oct 26, 2017
530
They kill a boss and restart at a checkpoint by dying or something. Loot cave of this game it seems. But you have to kill the boss.
Sounds like the Escalation Protocol exploit in D2, where you'd kill the boss at the last second of the timer, get loot and then reset as the game registers a failure. Existed for weeks, no one was banned, shortly after fixing it Bungie patched in an official way to reset the boss.
 
Oct 30, 2017
1,067
All this depressing anthem talk made me wanna go back and play mass effect, can't believe all the dlc for ME3 is still full price lol.
Lol yeah I want to do that too.

Your best bet is subbing to origin if that's an option.

I want to add too that anthem is okay, it's got its issues but I'm enjoying this 4 out of 10 game.
 
Oct 28, 2017
2,643
Some were defending the banning pretty hard on the reddit. If you agree with a ban surely the length of it was way too extreme. I guess they got their chilling effect. A feelgood moment!
 
Feb 20, 2019
366
Australia
This is a bad look EA. Banning for abusing a loot farming chexploit in a purely PvE game? And reversing it like that makes it look even worse, either because it's special treatment to a streamer, a scare tactic or you falsely banned them in the first place. If the offence is bad enough for average Joe to be ***!!!!!***PERMANENTLY***!!!!!*** banned for then it's bad enough for slightly above average Joe with some Twitch followers to be banned for.

Though IMO this is not a bannable offence at all, even in Destiny which has PvP, Bungie knew it would be assinine and stupid to ban people farming the loot cave.
 
Oct 29, 2017
103
So the channel that made my favourite review of Anthem has made a video all about Inscriptions/Augments and why it's terrible. (As well as some other discussion.) Worth a watch. Actual length of the video is about 6 minutes, the rest is showing his various MW's and Legendaries and their rolls to illustrate the point.
People in the preview threads were lauding the game for its Diablo-style loot without realizing that unless you NAIL your itemization system, it can get wildly out of tune. The more controlled and streamlined Destiny loot model was right there for them to try and emulate.
 
Oct 28, 2017
501
How can you ban someone for...playing the game you released? It's not cheating unless it harms other players.

This confirms what I've been saying: EA simply does not have the inclination to build the community loyalty required for this kind of game. They'll think vindictively, not listen to feedback, and will cut support as soon as an immediate cash cow seems out of reach.

If we make it to 2020 with Anthem support ongoing, I'll be surprised.
 
Jan 14, 2019
701
My younger son was really enjoying Anthem - and got to the Tomb quest. Even with some of this done, he informed me he didn’t think he’d play anymore and that freeplay is boring. Sigh. I thought for sure he’s stick with it. It really does make a great first impression though.
 
My younger son was really enjoying Anthem - and got to the Tomb quest. Even with some of this done, he informed me he didn’t think he’d play anymore and that freeplay is boring. Sigh. I thought for sure he’s stick with it. It really does make a great first impression though.
I can totally relate my daughter loves Destiny so I got her going on Anthem she put in about 4 hours and tells me, this isn't fun at all and I think I am done.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,237
My younger son was really enjoying Anthem - and got to the Tomb quest. Even with some of this done, he informed me he didn’t think he’d play anymore and that freeplay is boring. Sigh. I thought for sure he’s stick with it. It really does make a great first impression though.
Part of why, even with the fix, you need to think about the design of things like the Tomb quest.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,534
Well, when they said Diablo-style loot, I guess they really meant it. Launch Diablo 3, that is.

Here is how loot worked on launch Diablo 3: Very few (read none) legendary drops before cap, making gearing and leveling uninteresting. Very few legendaries were actually worth anything or had interesting, build affecting affixes. Stormshield, some Natalya's pieces, a couple of belts and very few rings were useful due to high native stats. Anthem doesn't really have the benefit of set pieces, which Diablo 3 at least included. High variance in random stats while top rolls had underwhelming, samey effects. Straight up useless or bugged affixes that didn't provide any benefits (weapon elemental damage was bugged and it did nothing on any weapon it rolled on. You could roll main stats -dex, str, int- on class specific items that didn't benefit from those rolls -sounds familiar, doesn't it?). Whole weapon classes like two handed swords were completely useless to every single build beause they didn't provide a single unique stat that distinguished them from the rest. The only advantage swords had at some point was Attack Speed. Guess which was the first, only affix Blizzard nerfed before doing any single instance of balancing? LOL. The best ilvl items were behind Acts 3 and 4 on Inferno difficulty. Except, clearing that barrier required some of those items due to the difficulty curve. Beating bosses wouldn't actually yield any significantly better loot than random elite monsters either.

Blizzard actually made this worse by implementing a few changes, the 2 most notable ones were: they increased the penalties for dying/repairing damaged equipment and they added enrage timers that made long, hard fought battles impossible after certain point. They assumed this would discourage people from even trying that content, but the ilvl fence meant that there was an effective cap on the stats that drops could roll in acts 1 and 2, so it was a requirement to leap ahead to make any kind of gearing progress. Due to the lack of endgame specific content (because Blizzard in all their wisdom wanted to push people to run entire acts again instead of doing boss runs) the efficiency of running bosses or particular areas was largely diminished (the whole loot genre is basically time vs reward commitment. Bullet sponges only significantly delay people rushing to the best gear when the best gear can be acquired at a significant rate that doesn't make you feel you wasted your time) and because everyone was undergeared, the most efficient alternative became farming goblins: high hp enemies that dropped considerably more treasure and do no damage. Fun it was not.

People will take the path of least resistance every time if your balance is out of wack and the difficulty peaks and valleys are working against them. I mean, the Diablo team admited they only doubled the damage numbers they've been testing on Inferno because their userbase would find ways to outsmart them, but that lack of testing (plus the presence of the AH which became the single most efficient way to get gear) meant they never really understood the experience their playerbase would have. They patched a few things during the following months, but even adding paragon levels, removing the auction house and reworking a lot of loot affixes and legendaries to have more unique effects was just a band-aid. It took them a whole two years to get the game to a place where people were enjoying the treadmill and loot was actually decent across the board. And this is Blizzard, basically the kings of the genre at that point. (Path of Exile is the new king btw, where they actually learned lessons from Diablo 2 and innovated in other aspects like barter economy).
...

And here we are. Making the damn same mistakes Blizzard suffered through in 2012 and basically wrote the book on how to fix them in 2014. They did all the work for you already. How does this happen?
 
Last edited:
Feb 20, 2019
366
Australia
/snip
...

And here we are. Making the damn same mistakes Blizzard suffered through in 2012 and basically wrote the book on how to fix them in 2014. They did all the work for you already. How does this happen?
As I said a page back -
The game was obviously developed in a 1980's era Soviet ICBM silo guarded by T1000's, that's the only logical way I can see so little information having gotten to BioWare on the modern state of video games and their competitions advances. I've said it before but other than the gorgeous graphics this game FEELS like it was made in '12-'13, and even then there was Borderlands 2 to compete with.
It's sad that I was only 3/4th's joking. This game really feels developed in a pre-Diablo 3 vacuum. I honestly don't know how it happens, it has to either be complete incompetence or having literally no extra time to do more than build a Minimum Viable Product
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,534
As I said a page back -

It's sad that I was only 3/4th's joking. This game really feels developed in a pre-Diablo 3 vacuum. I honestly don't know how it happens, it has to either be complete incompetence or having literally no extra time to do more than build a Minimum Viable Product
You really have to try hard to be this incompetent tho. We know they looked at Diablo 3. They've namedropped it several times and the whole difficulty tiers feels modeled on the torment system. It's almost inconveivable. If you don't have time to develop and test on your own shit, the least you can do is copy the homework of the kid in class who went through this already, then add your spin later. They couldn't even do that.

One of the ex Diablo 3 leads was on reddit earlier outlining exactly how to fix the loot and endgame. Will they finally listen when basically the Diablo 3 team is reaching out to you, telling you how to fix the things that you shouldn't have done in the first place...?
 
Oct 25, 2017
9,930
Miami, FL
I doubt its style choice. Judging by the amount of loading screens and continual bugs around completing quests and going into cutscenes etc. I bet that it's a technical limitation just like everything else in this game.
I really do think it's style choice. I think they want your loadout choice to be consequential. A "choose wisely and deliberately" approach. We see it in other games too.
 
Feb 20, 2019
366
Australia
You really have to try hard to be this incompetent tho. We know they looked at Diablo 3. They've namedropped it several times and the whole difficulty tiers feels modeled on the torment system. It's almost inconveivable. If you don't have time to develop and test on your own shit, the least you can do is copy the homework of the kid in class who went through this already, then add your spin later. They couldn't even do that.

One of the ex Diablo 3 leads was on reddit earlier outlining exactly how to fix the loot and endgame. Will they finally listen when basically the Diablo 3 team is reaching out to you, telling you how to fix the things that you shouldn't have done in the first place...?
Travis Day is a treasure, I posted his GDC talk much earlier in the thread, it's well worth a watch if you've never seen it before, discusses both WoW and D3.
Luke Stephens also made a video discussing Anthem and BioWare from a more business perspective.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,131
Well, when they said Diablo-style loot, I guess they really meant it. Launch Diablo 3, that is.

Here is how loot worked on launch Diablo 3: Very few (read none) legendary drops before cap, making gearing and leveling uninteresting. Very few legendaries were actually worth anything or had interesting, build affecting affixes. Stormshield, some Natalya's pieces, a couple of belts and very few rings were useful due to high native stats. Anthem doesn't really have the benefit of set pieces, which Diablo 3 at least included. High variance in random stats while top rolls had underwhelming, samey effects. Straight up useless or bugged affixes that didn't provide any benefits (weapon elemental damage was bugged and it did nothing on any weapon it rolled on. You could roll main stats -dex, str, int- on class specific items that didn't benefit from those rolls -sounds familiar, doesn't it?). Whole weapon classes like two handed swords were completely useless to every single build beause they didn't provide a single unique stat that distinguished them from the rest. The only advantage swords had at some point was Attack Speed. Guess which was the first, only affix Blizzard nerfed before doing any single instance of balancing? LOL. The best ilvl items were behind Acts 3 and 4 on Inferno difficulty. Except, clearing that barrier required some of those items due to the difficulty curve. Beating bosses wouldn't actually yield any significantly better loot than random elite monsters either.

Blizzard actually made this worse by implementing a few changes, the 2 most notable ones were: they increased the penalties for dying/repairing damaged equipment and they added enrage timers that made long, hard fought battles impossible after certain point. They assumed this would discourage people from even trying that content, but the ilvl fence meant that there was an effective cap on the stats that drops could roll in acts 1 and 2, so it was a requirement to leap ahead to make any kind of gearing progress. Due to the lack of endgame specific content (because Blizzard in all their wisdom wanted to push people to run entire acts again instead of doing boss runs) the efficiency of running bosses or particular areas was largely diminished (the whole loot genre is basically time vs reward commitment. Bullet sponges only significantly delay people rushing to the best gear when the best gear can be acquired at a significant rate that doesn't make you feel you wasted your time) and because everyone was undergeared, the most efficient alternative became farming goblins: high hp enemies that dropped considerably more treasure and do no damage. Fun it was not.

People will take the path of least resistance every time if your balance is out of wack and the difficulty peaks and valleys are working against them. I mean, the Diablo team admited they only doubled the damage numbers they've been testing on Inferno because their userbase would find ways to outsmart them, but that lack of testing (plus the presence of the AH which became the single most efficient way to get gear) meant they never really understood the experience their playerbase would have. They patched a few things during the following months, but even adding paragon levels, removing the auction house and reworking a lot of loot affixes and legendaries to have more unique effects was just a band-aid. It took them a whole two years to get the game to a place where people were enjoying the treadmill and loot was actually decent across the board. And this is Blizzard, basically the kings of the genre at that point. (Path of Exile is the new king btw, where they actually learned lessons from Diablo 2 and innovated in other aspects like barter economy).
...

And here we are. Making the damn same mistakes Blizzard suffered through in 2012 and basically wrote the book on how to fix them in 2014. They did all the work for you already. How does this happen?
Yep, farming act 1 inferno for gear ilevel below your level and always crappy was so demoralizing with the untested Act2+ of inferno destroying you. Act 2 with it's annoying enemies and bullet hell was such a hard wall, and the thing was that there was rumors of act 3 giving loot good enough for act 2+. Act 1 seemed good enough since it was usually zombies, but remember those impossible champion pack affixes? Ice, mortar, arcane? Man the hax affixes combos annoyed me so much.

And for visuals on further explanation on what was so wrong with D3 vanilla loot itemization.

 
Oct 25, 2017
4,131
As I said a page back -

It's sad that I was only 3/4th's joking. This game really feels developed in a pre-Diablo 3 vacuum. I honestly don't know how it happens, it has to either be complete incompetence or having literally no extra time to do more than build a Minimum Viable Product
I don't know if it was posted here already but a Blizzard developer, Travis Day, who worked on D3 and the D3 rework actually gave feedback to EA/Bioware after playing a lot of Anthem.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AnthemTheGame/comments/ato54p/reward_structure_issues_and_ideas/

Long and insightful post. Short slice of the beginning.

"Reward structure issues and ideas
I've been playing Anthem for the last week and really enjoying myself. However the game seems to fall into a number of reward system related traps that I wanted to take a moment to point out and offer some possible solutions to in an effort to help make this game, which I'm enjoying, more compelling.​
"Dead" inscriptions -
By now I suspect many people have seen items roll with stats that they don't understand. TLDR Man icon means it effects everything you do, Cog icon means it only effects the item that it rolled on. Currently the game allows for items to roll inscriptions that literally can not effect the item they are on. Example, Venmous Blaze with item specific Physical damage, +% Weapon damage, or +% Cold damage.​
Having items roll affixes that are sub-optimal is standard practice for this kind of game but I think there should be a hard distinction made between "bad" and "literally doesn't work". Currently this causes a considerable amount of confusion for players learning the game as their initial assumption is to think anything an item rolled will work on the item it rolled on. Since that isn't true I assume the design intent was to create a larger spectrum of item power based on the rolls, I would argue it comes with too many drawbacks. Keeping the spectrum of item power large could easily be accomplished by simply changing the relative weighting of affixes while restricting them to things that actual work on the item. Alternatively items could have an affix range, MW could roll 2-4 or 3-4 properties on creation so that there is still the same amount of item variance but the affixes that show up continue to still "work" on whatever they rolled on."​