Artifact |OT| Mangoj eebayted

Oct 27, 2017
1,023
I like the ideas of the puzzles but going off the ones I've seen people make so far people are too focused on going for huge and over the top and it just becomes chaos and not really all that hard. I feel like the better puzzles would come from more simple and specific instances. Dealing with 40 cards in your hand and 100 units on every board is just tedious at a certain point.
Yeah, the ones I've played have an interesting concept but they are very rough in execution. I've been thinking of doing one that is movement-related and much more intricate, involving all three lanes. But haven't had time, and I don't actually know if you can completely remove all elements of randomness from the bot using the puzzle script. For the existing puzzles I've played, there usually isn't one fixed strategy and random elements can change whether you win or not.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,576
Yeah, I think ramp is a very dispiriting thing. Artifact as a whole sometimes feels like Valve and Garfield haven't learned from the current generation of board games - that removing someone else's ability to play entirely (through Annihilation), or being unable to even push for a draw (through ramp+ToT), makes the game one-sided and not-fun for one of the players. I've sometimes surrendered right after the opponent has played ToT, because whilst I may be able draw, or even win, it just isn't fun. The same with board-wipes - Annihilation? Nah mate, you can have this game, I'll play against some other deck where it doesn't feel like I'm just wasting my time.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,720
Speed Force
Things like ramp and board clear don't really annoy me because there's actually answers to it. Every color has a way of shutting down heroes from turn four onward. If you've got initiative you can cut things off. Silencing heroes after they drop a Stars Align is a great denial tool. Blue heroes are very squishy and can easily get dueled/ganked/whatever meaning they have to commit two of them to a lane to guarantee an Annihilation.

The other thing is just mitigating the damage of big swing cards. Making sure not to over commit to any lane or having mobility so Annihilation doesn't take that much. Forcing your opponent to play all the lanes so they can't hit more than two heroes with ToT. The WePlay tournament was very interesting to watch because everyone saw the big stuff coming and it wasn't necessarily a game ender.
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,670
San Diego
I've won six games and I'm still stuck at 64. RIP.

Edit: Now I'm trash and can't win anything. All I play is fucking R/G ramp. So I decided to take a break and play random call to arms. First game up against the best deck (mono blue), so I lose. The next game I draw...fuck this I'm done for today.
 
Last edited:
Oct 30, 2017
3,670
San Diego
I don't even know how many games I've won anymore and I'm still at 64. Plus I'm getting a ton of hard matches, which makes it even more draining. The wall is real.

Edit: Perfect run and I'm still 64. lol

 
Last edited:

Won

Member
Oct 27, 2017
300
At this point I hope it is the latter.

For me January ended up looking pretty weak in terms of updates. Just nothing that moves the game forward or made me jump back in.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,614
I don't know what to expect anymore lol

At this point I half wonder if they're just going to wait for the first expansion to do a huge relaunch type of deal.
 
OP
OP
shira

shira

Community Resetter
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,303
I don't know what to expect anymore lol

At this point I half wonder if they're just going to wait for the first expansion to do a huge relaunch type of deal.
I expect massive changes after CNY.

They lost the entire Chinese market to Autochess, so it's either appeal to the superhardcore Western audience or . . .
 
Mar 16, 2018
378
Honestly I feel like a beta tester at this point. The patch that introduced skill rating was the last attempt to "save" the game after the disappointing release. After that no communication and small/medium adjustments; "in it for the long run" isn't communication, the need to say that just makes them look worse...

Personally I'm only playing a couple of times a week. The game's good but lacking it doesn't fill my competitive and creative itch. Skill rating is bad and currently there aren't enough cards or are they interesting enough to make me want to mess around that much.
This lack of communication and uncertainty also doesn't contribute.

They are probably planning something big with the expansion. I would turn the game free-to-play, give 5 packs to everyone and 20 more to us who bought the game. Give reasons for people to play the game, it's actually pretty good! It would help out clear a bunch of the bad advertisement it got like it's too complicated or too expensive. I bet if a lot of people tried it out, a bunch of them would change their mind.

All this while adding an actual competitive system. Use your tournament mode!
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,576
I'd love for them to add a hot-seat local vs mode. It'd be like wandering around to the local game store to play with store decks, or going round to a friend's house to borrow theirs. Obviously honour system for not peeking at your opponents hand. For what I imagine isn't a ton of work it'd give more value.
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
7,720
Speed Force
I haven’t been playing that much but it’s mostly due to RE2 and KH3 plus less free time in general. I still enjoy draft but I’m waiting before I invest anything into constructed.

Fuck auto chess
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,670
San Diego
The meta is annoying me atm and I don't feel like leveling up my draft. Good thing there is a bunch of other stuff to play atm.

Like when mono blue was meta, it wasn't that bad. You hit them early hard and fast, all their shit is late game, there was a counter. This R/G ramp meta is annoying as fuck. If they have the right hand you are screwed. Someone getting a 4/8 ToT completely fucks up the game and you have to play defense the rest of the time. It doesn't matter if you kill them, they are going to keep coming back, and the longer the game goes the strong they are going to get because of items. There is a reason why ToT is eight cost and shouldn't be seen that early in the game.
 
Last edited:
Mar 9, 2018
215
They are probably planning something big with the expansion. I would turn the game free-to-play, give 5 packs to everyone and 20 more to us who bought the game. Give reasons for people to play the game, it's actually pretty good! It would help out clear a bunch of the bad advertisement it got like it's too complicated or too expensive. I bet if a lot of people tried it out, a bunch of them would change their mind.
While I agree that going F2P and offering some reward to early adopters is probably going to be necessary, there’s more to fix than just getting more people exposed to the game. It peaked at like 60k players and dropped off pretty quickly to where it is now - that’s a lot of people who didn’t mind paying and still quit. They need to figure out what happened there.

I would not be surprised if they are planning some sort of soft relaunch where the game goes F2P and they massively overhaul the visuals. Something to make the game feel snappier and more lively. I expect a new game board and a lot of animation and Hearthstone-esque flourish. Maybe some slight rules changes to speed the game up too since it can feel like a bit of a slog at times, and often when finishing a close/exciting game I wanted to just take a break for the day rather than playing another.

They really need to just do something that will get a lot of people to try the game (again or for the first time) at the same time, since the biggest problem now is that the matchmaking pool is left of only the most dedicated and hardcore players. I played for 25 hours at launch, got bored and put the game down, then tried to come back after they dropped the skill rating patch but just ended up losing 10-12 games in a row. It’s not fun to slog through a 30 minute game where your opponent understands how to play and draft optimally and you’re still trying to figure things out. I’ve played a lot of card games and am not expecting to be able to compete with top tier players, but there’s not many others left to play against.

I hope whatever they are planning they realize they need to get enough people to join so the new player experience isn’t awful. A new expansion would get me interested, but if it just ends up I’m still only getting stomped by all the people who didn’t quit I’ll probably bounce off again. That’s why I think they are planning more significant changes to the game other than just new cards.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,614
While I agree that going F2P and offering some reward to early adopters is probably going to be necessary, there’s more to fix than just getting more people exposed to the game. It peaked at like 60k players and dropped off pretty quickly to where it is now - that’s a lot of people who didn’t mind paying and still quit. They need to figure out what happened there.

I would not be surprised if they are planning some sort of soft relaunch where the game goes F2P and they massively overhaul the visuals. Something to make the game feel snappier and more lively. I expect a new game board and a lot of animation and Hearthstone-esque flourish. Maybe some slight rules changes to speed the game up too since it can feel like a bit of a slog at times, and often when finishing a close/exciting game I wanted to just take a break for the day rather than playing another.

They really need to just do something that will get a lot of people to try the game (again or for the first time) at the same time, since the biggest problem now is that the matchmaking pool is left of only the most dedicated and hardcore players. I played for 25 hours at launch, got bored and put the game down, then tried to come back after they dropped the skill rating patch but just ended up losing 10-12 games in a row. It’s not fun to slog through a 30 minute game where your opponent understands how to play and draft optimally and you’re still trying to figure things out. I’ve played a lot of card games and am not expecting to be able to compete with top tier players, but there’s not many others left to play against.

I hope whatever they are planning they realize they need to get enough people to join so the new player experience isn’t awful. A new expansion would get me interested, but if it just ends up I’m still only getting stomped by all the people who didn’t quit I’ll probably bounce off again. That’s why I think they are planning more significant changes to the game other than just new cards.
It was literally a nothing reply, but the message Valve News Network got back really makes me think they're focused on some kind of relaunch. Saying they have their heads down and have ideas and plans but nothing to say yet makes me think they're not thinking about the short term and we're basically waiting for some big overhaul at this point.

 
Oct 31, 2017
594
MA
Yeah I've pretty much stopped playing. I've played like 150 hours since launch according to steam. I've got other games to play as well (Slay the spire in particular) I'll definitely be in for when it launches on phones or a new expansion or whatever.
 
Mar 9, 2018
215
It was literally a nothing reply, but the message Valve News Network got back really makes me think they're focused on some kind of relaunch. Saying they have their heads down and have ideas and plans but nothing to say yet makes me think they're not thinking about the short term and we're basically waiting for some big overhaul at this point.

That’s what it seems like. The skill rating patch was clearly an attempt to fix things in the short term and it didn’t really do anything. They probably realized the damage has been done and there isn’t much point in scrambling to hold on to the nearly non-existent playerbase. They are probably holding things back for a big patch/relaunch at this point. "Now releasing patch 1.1.4 with balance changes" is not going to attract a new community of players, but "Artifact 2.0! Now free to play and with massive changes!" might.
 

Hektor

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,012
Deutschland
I'm in the same boat as Kylac. Played it for over 110 hours thus far and am tired of the current cards and meta.
I'll definitely be back once a new expansion drops.
 
OP
OP
shira

shira

Community Resetter
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,303
Curious to know what they do. I think it might have to go Free to Play, remove barrier to entry.

Make initial cards unmarketable.
 

Tim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
318
I kind of think they'll just do a Hearthstone-style grind for cards, but with the marketplace instead of dust. F2P obviously. All the other options don't make a lot of sense without refunding the people who have invested in the game, which they would have already done if that was the plan. Like if they go the LCG route for future sets but keep set one like it is, that seems confusing.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,576
I still find it so satisfying to win, especially with mostly just wannabe-pros and meta decks being the majority of players now. Feeling a bit ill, so just played for the first time in a few days, against a Blue/Red deck - what I'm guessing was kind-of boardwipe, given the 2 At Any Costs that came down. But a Tyler Estate Censor on Lane 1, an Assassinate on a Blue Hero in Lane 1 and Echo Blast'ing another dead in Lane 3 meant they couldn't get any Blue of value off. Won it at the start of Mana Turn 8, after I Fissure-stunned their only (Blue) Hero in the Lane. They sat their for a good 30 seconds, trying to work out if they could avoid the loss. I could almost taste the saltiness of their tears. :p
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,023
It was literally a nothing reply, but the message Valve News Network got back really makes me think they're focused on some kind of relaunch. Saying they have their heads down and have ideas and plans but nothing to say yet makes me think they're not thinking about the short term and we're basically waiting for some big overhaul at this point.

I wonder if it's worth buying cards to make a bunch of decks I had ideas for now. On the one hand, prices are really great now. On the other, this email seems to indicate they might make big changes that might later on invalidate the value of the cards I want to get.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,576
I wonder if it's worth buying cards to make a bunch of decks I had ideas for now. On the one hand, prices are really great now. On the other, this email seems to indicate they might make big changes that might later on invalidate the value of the cards I want to get.
I don't see them doing anything major to the current cards. I can see some more balance tweaking for a few cards - maybe upping the cost or lowering the bonuses of ToT or something - but I doubt it'll be anything crazy. I'm not sure if I would buy cards now or wait a little longer to see if there's further drop in prices, though.
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,720
Speed Force
I feel like the current set is quite well balanced. If they want to keep buffing weaker cards I won’t complain though, I really like how it makes draft even better and more varied.
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,670
San Diego
Just played the most annoying match. B/G and he just spammed improvements. I have Smash Their Defenses and Punga in my deck and it was still too much. The game was like 40 minutes. Luckily he fucked himself with the Oath and couldn't play Gank or Coup de grace.

Shit like that makes me want to put a Raze in my deck.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,614
I was actually curious to see a stream going.

Artifact has 89 viewers.

Games currently with more viewers:
Zelda: Wind Waker
Pokemon: Heart Gold, Soul Silver
Spore
Skies of Arcadia
Killer 7
Half Life: Counter Strike
PEOPLE DAY TRADING STOCK AND BONDS, not even a game, literally trading in stocks!
 

Won

Member
Oct 27, 2017
300
Unrealistic expectations time:

I wonder for a while now if they are going full on dota and make all the cards free in the future, monetizing only cosmetics.

I don't see how else they would get any mindshare back at this point, especially within this genre. (Even Hearthstone feels like a fading star on twitch sometimes)

I also have no other ideas why they wouldn't follow up the progression system from december with anything else by now, if they aren't rebuilding the whole economy/reward backend they had planned.


Alternatively: What the hell are Valve doing?!?!
 

Tim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
318
Yeah, I've been thinking about that a lot too, and agree that giving the cards away for free is the only path to recovery. But I also feel like if that was the plan they would have refunded people by now? Like every second they let the marketplace live the more of a pain in the ass refunding becomes. And refunding is the only way they can go the dota route, right?

Nothing else would be enough though.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,614
I will never understand what changed from when they were saying "Strength of the card will not determine value" and making it sound like there would be alternate versions of cards to literally the only cards of value being the strong ones that are in every deck.

Make cards or make there be a base version of cards that are stupid cheap and make card cosmetics and alternate versions be the money sink.

I don't care if cards even continue to cost, I would probably still put a lot of money into cosmetics.
 

Tim

Member
Oct 25, 2017
318
I will never understand what changed from when they were saying "Strength of the card will not determine value" and making it sound like there would be alternate versions of cards to literally the only cards of value being the strong ones that are in every deck.

Make cards or make there be a base version of cards that are stupid cheap and make card cosmetics and alternate versions be the money sink.

I don't care if cards even continue to cost, I would probably still put a lot of money into cosmetics.
Yeah, the reason seems like draft. OG Drow was too powerful as a common in draft, and that caused her to change rarity.

TBH draft in artifact, while a lot of fun, is a mess structure-wise. Feels like they were trying to force MTG's format onto a game that doesn't fit it. Square peg, round hole. Nostalgia for MTG feels like Artifact's cardinal sin.
 
Last edited:
Oct 27, 2017
3,614
Yeah, the reason seems like draft. OG Drow was too powerful as a common in draft, and that caused her to change rarity.

TBH draft in artifact, while a lot of fun, is a mess structure. Feels like they were trying to force MTG's format onto a game that doesn't fit it. Square peg, round hole. Nostalgia for MTG feels like Artifact's cardinal sin.
The crazy thing is I think the draft mode is the most fun part of the game. Constructed will probably be more fun long term, but to me it's too stale at the moment.
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,367
I was actually curious to see a stream going.

Artifact has 89 viewers.

Games currently with more viewers:
Zelda: Wind Waker
Pokemon: Heart Gold, Soul Silver
Spore
Skies of Arcadia
Killer 7
Half Life: Counter Strike
PEOPLE DAY TRADING STOCK AND BONDS, not even a game, literally trading in stocks!
spore

okay now i'm kinda sad today
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,720
Speed Force
Both Lifecoach and Swim are waiting for a significant update before they play again.

That’s basically it. Everybody knows a big change is coming so there’s no point investing time into it (especially for streamers who played in beta, they’ve been at this game for nearly a year now).
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,720
Speed Force
Why announce anything when you could keep your mouth shut while the last few loyal fans abandon the game?
If they're not ready to announce they're not ready to announce

Every time people seem to forget that things go badly when companies announce too early

They've indicated they're sticking with the game. Until they've got a full plan and timeline to roll out, which is probably new monetization, new expansion and new platforms, they can't say much.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,576
Oof, I'm just getting creamed now. The cards stay the same, but the players are getting better.
Which is good (it shows that there's a decent skill ceiling that people are getting better with the same cards), but is going to be an issue if/when Valve announce a reboot of it, surely? It's already an unfriendly game for newbies given the high opponent skill level, but if the skill ranking reset is timed alongside it going f2p then that influx of new users might just be pushed away as they're consistently outplayed be the wannabe pros who have been with it since Day 1. The skill rankings would shake out eventually, but how many would stick with it to that point?
 
Oct 30, 2017
3,670
San Diego
I just had a really good game to finish my streak. It was against another mono red deck. It came down to the final tower. He was only off by one damage and it would have been a draw, but I had initiative and Enough Magic so I won.
 
Oct 25, 2017
3,576
So... I'm rank 60 in Constructed, but I started playing Phantom Draft yesterday, and I've lost every match. :o I've not drafted in any physical card game before, so whilst I understand how it works, it feels like I'm not "getting" something during the drafting process. Any pointers for what I should be looking out for?
 
Oct 25, 2017
7,720
Speed Force
So... I'm rank 60 in Constructed, but I started playing Phantom Draft yesterday, and I've lost every match. :o I've not drafted in any physical card game before, so whilst I understand how it works, it feels like I'm not "getting" something during the drafting process. Any pointers for what I should be looking out for?
What are you struggling with in particular? The general idea is pick the best cards of any color first two rounds, and from there you pick the best colors to focus on. Within the two colors (third for splash maybe) you draft to fill the tools you need, keep a relatively solid curve, and whatever good stuff you get etc. I personally draft for solid cards over situational stuff, things that work with any color, really solid minions, etc. Also the power curve is different to constructed, as there's less removal and nukes anything with board presence is a lot better. There's different trains of thought on how important hero choice is, I personally think you should prioritize good staple cards over heroes because the base heroes are fine, but obviously any top tier heroes you pick first up. Also a good hero isn't worth splashing alone for, you need at least 2-3 other decent cards of the color.

I've saved some of my recent perfect run decks if you want an idea of what works. You might be able to tell by the color combinations what I favor in draft...