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Oct 27, 2017
4,504
Eren just embodies the motto of "one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter".


I'm starting to remember now. The Reiss family tried to get rid of everyone that couldn't be controlled by the Founding Titan, so for all we know, there could have been a ton of different races besides asians and Eldians on Paradis at one point but they've all probably been taken out.

Holy shit.... that's fucking terrible, Isayama

I don't think the Reiss family actively hunted down everyone not controllable by the founding titan. There were a bunch of noble families (Eldians who are not subjects of Ymir, as Erigu said) who were not influenced by the founding titan and sucked up to the king so that they could rule the walls from within. Ackermans were opposed to the first king's ideology and so they became enemies of the royal family, hence their persecution.
 

tellNoel

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,254
I don't think the Reiss family actively hunted down everyone not controllable by the founding titan. There were a bunch of noble families (Eldians who are not subjects of Ymir, as Erigu said) who were not influenced by the founding titan and sucked up to the king so that they could rule the walls from within. Ackermans were opposed to the first king's ideology and so they became enemies of the royal family, hence their persecution.
I guess I assumed that they were hunted/killed because there are no other races to be seen on Paradis besides Eldians.
So, either they were killed or Fritz was like "hey, the asians and some other eldian noble families can come, but no one else."


And i'm still wondering about all the colossal titans in the wall. We don't know of the colossal titan (Bert/Armin) having an ability that grants him to turn others into colossi, do we?
 

Brickhunt

Member
Feb 4, 2018
999
Brazil
Realistically, the rumbling as a deterrent is the best option. To make demonstration that makes the world stand back from Paradis.

The thing is, Eren's current state of the mind is a mystery.

He made a vow in front of Reiner to "destroy all his enemies until the end". Can we trust Eren to really be rational and expect him to not unleash the rumbling all over the world? Does he want Paradis to be left alone? Does he want to restore the Eldia Empire? Does his definition of freedom mean only Eldians living and the other races annihilated?

While I understand Eren is motivated into freeing his people, I can't help but being annoyed of how Zeke and Yelena undermined all possible paths for Paradis to take once they learned the truth. Paradis had a 4 year break from any Marley incursion save for the survey ships, but there very moment the first ship with Yelena arrived, Zeke essentially took control of Paradis.

Rather than allow Paradis to deal with the Marleryan prisoners by itself, which could had established the first formal contact with Marley's government, Yelena took control of the narrative, ensuring no communication/negotiations with Marley at all and making Paradis establish contact with a nation that sabotaged their diplomatic efforts with other countries. Yes, Marley declared war against Paradis, but there was 4 years of radio silence from the island except for the fact all their ships never returned. Yelena and Zeke ensured that the narrative of Paradis being threat to Marley remained and ensured the declaration of war would happen after their war with the Middle-east union was wrapped up.

In addition, was the Liberio massacre really necessary? Wasn't it possible to perform a more discrete operation to sneak Zeke out of Marley? The massacre felt more like a maneuver to force Paradis into the rumbling plan, rather than a act first strike self-defense.

Don't get me wrong. Without Zeke and Yelena geopolitical's input, it is possible that Paradis could have made a series of amateur and disastrous diplomatic mistakes, but it seems to me that Paradis itself has been more like a pawn if Zeke's plan, who doesn't give a shit about the nation, and is more concerned with his race itself and Paradis never had a chance to be it's own nation. Because of Eren and Zeke, Armin and Hange's plans of diplomacy were sabotaged from the very beginning.

It is a complicated situation and it is far from being a good vs evil scenario. Which is why I love this series so much.
 

Erigu

Member
Nov 4, 2017
2,936
i'm still wondering about all the colossal titans in the wall. We don't know of the colossal titan (Bert/Armin) having an ability that grants him to turn others into colossi, do we?
Since Reiss had that vial of "armor" serum and was talking about how he picked the right kind of Titan for Historia, I think it's safe to assume Erdia knew how to create specific types of Titans, or possibly customize them (presumably by using the shifters' spinal fluid?).
 

tellNoel

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,254
Since Reiss had that vial of "armor" serum and was talking about how he picked the right kind of Titan for Historia, I think it's safe to assume Erdia knew how to create specific types of Titans, or possibly customize them (presumably by using the shifters' spinal fluid?).
I figured. And that leads to the ultimate question: who tf would they do such a thing to?
 

BigWinnie1

Banned
Feb 19, 2018
2,757
Realistically, the rumbling as a deterrent is the best option. To make demonstration that makes the world stand back from Paradis.

The thing is, Eren's current state of the mind is a mystery.

He made a vow in front of Reiner to "destroy all his enemies until the end". Can we trust Eren to really be rational and expect him to not unleash the rumbling all over the world? Does he want Paradis to be left alone? Does he want to restore the Eldia Empire? Does his definition of freedom mean only Eldians living and the other races annihilated?

While I understand Eren is motivated into freeing his people, I can't help but being annoyed of how Zeke and Yelena undermined all possible paths for Paradis to take once they learned the truth. Paradis had a 4 year break from any Marley incursion save for the survey ships, but there very moment the first ship with Yelena arrived, Zeke essentially took control of Paradis.

Rather than allow Paradis to deal with the Marleryan prisoners by itself, which could had established the first formal contact with Marley's government, Yelena took control of the narrative, ensuring no communication/negotiations with Marley at all and making Paradis establish contact with a nation that sabotaged their diplomatic efforts with other countries. Yes, Marley declared war against Paradis, but there was 4 years of radio silence from the island except for the fact all their ships never returned. Yelena and Zeke ensured that the narrative of Paradis being threat to Marley remained and ensured the declaration of war would happen after their war with the Middle-east union was wrapped up.

In addition, was the Liberio massacre really necessary? Wasn't it possible to perform a more discrete operation to sneak Zeke out of Marley? The massacre felt more like a maneuver to force Paradis into the rumbling plan, rather than a act first strike self-defense.

Don't get me wrong. Without Zeke and Yelena geopolitical's input, it is possible that Paradis could have made a series of amateur and disastrous diplomatic mistakes, but it seems to me that Paradis itself has been more like a pawn if Zeke's plan, who doesn't give a shit about the nation, and is more concerned with his race itself and Paradis never had a chance to be it's own nation. Because of Eren and Zeke, Armin and Hange's plans of diplomacy were sabotaged from the very beginning.

It is a complicated situation and it is far from being a good vs evil scenario. Which is why I love this series so much.


Man its like Israel trying to get diplomatic connections to Nazi Germany when are keeping Jewish citizens in ghetto's and deathcamps. Nothing good was going to come from diplomacy from Marley because Paradis doesn't have enough leverage to talk on even footing. You have Power and fear and than you get on the diplomatic soft power because people fear your other hand.

If they tried to trade the Iceburg Stones in some type of Diplomatic Gesture I can only guess that the crusade to exterminate Paradis would ahve happened earlier. I mean they didn't even ahve a port to properly get Envoys or recieve diplomatic overtures to almost 2 years back. A year ago they just finished their first train. They have no power to diplomazize with anyone.

If they had more power other countries would have been willing to defy Marley and side with them but at the moment no-one sides with them because they have nothing to gain from it and can easily exploit them later for what ever resources they do have.

The killing was a show of force to the world and beheaded all of their enemies by taking out their leaders and top military brass to help even the playing field. Now they need one last push and they will be able to stand above every one else and unite their fractured people into a nation again, probably take over the coast territory of Marley also while they are at it.

I mean the Eldians may have been dicks a long time ago but they have now been persecuted for thousands of years. At this point they are justified in any retribution they decide to hand out.
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
Since Reiss had that vial of "armor" serum and was talking about how he picked the right kind of Titan for Historia, I think it's safe to assume Erdia knew how to create specific types of Titans, or possibly customize them (presumably by using the shifters' spinal fluid?).
I missed/forgot about the "right type" line of dialogue. There's the Ymir->Crappy Jaw Titan explanation.
 

Dragoon

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
11,231
Man if Eren keeps this up he is going to be my favorite anime character next to Lelouch.
Funny you mention that name.. because I think Punished Eren is Lelouching all of us. I refuse to believe dude is turning into a full blown villain.

giphy.gif
 

Dragoon

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
11,231
He destroyed Mikasa's soul and bullied Armin, that was harsh.
giphy.gif


I feel like Mikasa kinda needed it so she doesn't remain like a useful Sakura. Both her and Armin have tepid post TS, so I'm guessing this is when they start taking action big time, be it vs Eren, Reinier / Co., Eren's twaty brother or all of the above.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,921
giphy.gif


I feel like Mikasa kinda needed it so she doesn't remain like a useful Sakura. Both her and Armin have tepid post TS, so I'm guessing this is when they start taking action big time, be it vs Eren, Reinier / Co., Eren's twaty brother or all of the above.
Mikasa needed it yes, but Armin? Dude's always been Eren's bro. I guess Eren wants Armin to do more suicide gambles.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,921
Punished Eren wants Armin to act like Armin, not a soft ass timid punk like he's been since he got the Titan powers.
I guess Bertoldt put too much bitch into him. Though with how the passed memories of users influence a person how much of Eren is even in Eren anymore? It already got hella weird when the Owl in the past was getting some sort of memory feedback loop from Eren.
 

The Silver

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,719
I guess Bertoldt put too much bitch into him. Though with how the passed memories of users influence a person how much of Eren is even in Eren anymore? It already got hella weird when the Owl in the past was getting some sort of memory feedback loop from Eren.
There's another interpretation of the the attack titan influence theory that I personally like more. It's that Eren is to the Attack Titan what the original King Fritz is to the Founding Titan. Eren himself isn't being influenced but his will is so damn strong it's being sent(through paths) into the past hosts of the Attack Titan.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,921
There's another interpretation of the the attack titan influence theory that I personally like more. It's that Eren is to the Attack Titan what the original King Fritz is to the Founding Titan. Eren himself isn't being influenced but his will is so damn strong it's being sent(through paths) into the past hosts of the Attack Titan.
I guess watching your mom getting eaten by your dads ex will do that to you.
 

Ricelord

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
6,478
There's another interpretation of the the attack titan influence theory that I personally like more. It's that Eren is to the Attack Titan what the original King Fritz is to the Founding Titan. Eren himself isn't being influenced but his will is so damn strong it's being sent(through paths) into the past hosts of the Attack Titan.

An feedback loop that causes the host to want more freedom.
 

Hypron

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,059
NZ
Yeah Eren has had a few loose screws since he was a kid lol. Dude was a ball of raw emotion, now and now that he's calmed down he's become a stone cold killer haha
 

Astral

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
28,115
Can someone tell me what the huge thing that happened in the latest chapter is? I don't care about spoilers.
 

tellNoel

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,254
Can someone tell me what the huge thing that happened in the latest chapter is? I don't care about spoilers.
Eren telling Mikasa that he never loved her and than he proceeds to call both her and Armin slaves, while taking Armin to the ground and punching him.

Oh yeah, and Zeke runs away, activates his scream ability and turns all the soldiers guarding him in treetops into falling titans while Levi is left surrounded and stunned at the end of the chapter
 

Astral

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
28,115
Eren telling Mikasa that he never loved her and than he proceeds to call both her and Armin slaves, while taking Armin to the ground and punching him.

Oh yeah, and Zeke runs away, activates his scream ability and turns all the soldiers guarding him in treetops into falling titans while Levi is left stunned at the end of the chapter

Lol as a huge Mikasa hater, I love this. I don't believe him though.
 

Joni

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,508
It might also be that Eren is dehumanizing Armin because he knows he'll have to kill Armin to achieve his plan.
 

Hypron

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,059
NZ
Considering Eren's actions are putting him in direct confrontation with Levi, I wonder if they're going to end fighting each other.

Man, imagine if Eren killed Levi lol
 

Dragoon

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
11,231
I can't get over the last chapter. Eren captures almost his entire team, shits on Mikasa and completely fucks with her mind, which means we will finally see some character development from her. Then literally beats the shit out of Armin for being indecisive and weak. Then Levi watches rerun #2431 of his teammates dying right in front of him, turning into Titans, which will force him to kill them again while the guy he wants dead more than anything in the world runs away.

On top of that, we still have Reiner and Co. awaiting in the shadows, wine that has been drunk by high officials, and the rest of the world that is potentially awaiting to make some sort of move. This is Game of Thrones tier storytelling where we have 5-6 different plot lines and no one fucking knows what or when things are going to pop off. Except unlike George, Isayama doesn't need 40 years to finish writing it.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,921
I can't get over the last chapter. Eren captures almost his entire team, shits on Mikasa and completely fucks with her mind, which means we will finally see some character development from her. Then literally beats the shit out of Armin for being indecisive and weak. Then Levi watches rerun #2431 of his teammates dying right in front of him, turning into Titans, which will force him to kill them again while the guy he wants dead more than anything in the world runs away.

On top of that, we still have Reiner and Co. awaiting in the shadows, wine that has been drunk by high officials, and the rest of the world that is potentially awaiting to make some sort of move. This is Game of Thrones tier storytelling where we have 5-6 different plot lines and no one fucking knows what or when things are going to pop off. Except unlike George, Isayama doesn't need 40 years to finish writing it.
Armin seriously needs to awaken Annie and take some fighting lessons from her.
 

tellNoel

Member
Oct 26, 2017
10,254
Let not forget the fact that Eren walks in with his hand cut, which pretty much means "I will kill everyone in this place if you don't cooperate with me"

GODDAMN
 

Redfox088

Banned
May 31, 2018
2,293
It's crazy to think the minor character mystery of why Mikasa didn't let the titan kill her when she thought Ereh was dead is finally revealed just in the latest chapter. That's almost 100 chapters of forethought on Yama-sama's Part.
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,921
It's crazy to think the minor character mystery of why Mikasa didn't let the titan kill her when she thought Ereh was dead is finally revealed just in the latest chapter. That's almost 100 chapters of forethought on Yama-sama's Part.
I will always applaud the amount of forethought and world building in AOT. Isayama probably regularly rereads this thing to address lingering plot points. It's such a good read/watch knowing what happens with certain things.
 

BrickArts295

GOTY Tracking Thread Master
Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,764
LMAO good point. What the hell happens in the dark version if this is the lighter variant?
He was basically going to kill them all, who knew that ending would have been more merciful then what were getting XD. You can even see some bits in the first episode of the anime, which means he probably still had that plan in mind, but I guess he changed his mind after the huge popularity wave the manga got after S1.
 

The Silver

Member
Oct 28, 2017
10,719
After interviewing Armin and Mikasa scientists have put together a gif of what they believe to be their perspective of the events that played out when meeting Eren

giphy.gif

TepidRevolvingCony-max-1mb.gif
 

Dragoon

Banned
Oct 31, 2017
11,231
Anyone think that maybe the reason Eren is more desparate for freedom is that he smashed Historia, and wants the kid to be born free? That way he will do anything to make that happen before the baby is born?


Also, what are we even going to do when people start speculating on the anime topics lol? Yikes. This is going to be me every time I read a speculation post

tenor.gif


tenor.gif



I still laugh my ass off when I remember that one guy saying Erwin is sure to be safe in the next arc because he doesn't have an arm. LOL
 
Oct 25, 2017
26,921
Anyone think that maybe the reason Eren is more desparate for freedom is that he smashed Historia, and wants the kid to be born free? That way he will do anything to make that happen before the baby is born?


Also, what are we even going to do when people start speculating on the anime topics lol? Yikes. This is going to be me every time I read a speculation post

tenor.gif


tenor.gif



I still laugh my ass off when I remember that one guy saying Erwin is sure to be safe in the next arc because he doesn't have an arm. LOL
"Don't worry guys, Erwin's getting to that basement" as Erwin devises his suicide mission against the beast titan.