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Gotten vaccinated yet?

  • Had my first dose!

    Votes: 33 23.6%
  • Had my second dose and fully vaccinated!

    Votes: 86 61.4%
  • Nope!

    Votes: 21 15.0%

  • Total voters
    140
  • Poll closed .

newmoneytrash

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,981
Melbourne, Australia
we went to costo at docklands this morning. we got there about 10 minutes before opening and the line was *incredibly* long to get in, but still moved pretty quickly. we only stood in line for about 15-20 minutes before going in and everything seemed to be in stock. managed to find toilet paper and flour that we just haven't been able to find in the supermarket at all for weeks. if you're having trouble finding some basic stuff and can afford the costco membership it might be worth doing
 

igordennis

Member
Oct 25, 2017
385
Why are our new cases following this weird trend that's not exponential? Australia is definitely not doing nearly enough for the virus to not be spreading like wildfire.



Not enough testing or what?

The graph's latest entry is inaccurate as the new cases number for the last day were updated to be 469, but it still seems low that the cases have not jumped to thousands a day like other countries.
 
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Deleted member 25600

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,701
Why are our new cases following this weird trend that's not exponential? Australia is definitely not doing nearly enough for the virus to not be spreading like wildfire.



Not enough testing or what?

The graph's latest entry is inaccurate as the new cases number for the last day were updated to be 469, but it still seems low that the cases have not jumped to thousands a day like other countries.

I know in SA they are barely testing for community transmission. Basically if you present with symptoms but haven't had contact with a confirmed case or travellers they won't test you.
 

Psittacus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,927
One of the reasons the curve is a weird shape is because most cases that are being detected are imported. As time goes on and the number of travelers decreases the cases go down, until community spread increases to a point where it's visible in the total.

I know in SA they are barely testing for community transmission. Basically if you present with symptoms but haven't had contact with a confirmed case or travellers they won't test you.
To be fair to SA Health if they did that they would instantly run out of tests. People with bad enough symptoms or that have a viral panel done are still being screened, which is how we've found 4 community cases so far. Once the number of kits and community spread both ramp up they'll expand the criteria.
 

i_am_ben

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,010
Victorian testing has slowed recently.

I wonder if tests are being diverted to NSW given they have higher cases of community transition.
 

Shaneus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,896
People are fucking muppets
870346600_640.jpg

Seriously, our country needs to fucking suffer if this is "Aussie spirit" or whatever jingoistic bullshit our PM is spouting.
 

gilded_Pb

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,190
I love how they included the look of disgust in the pic. But yea people are complete idiots. Is it so hard to just stay home
 

BAGERK

Member
Oct 27, 2017
71
Sydney
I work for a surveying and land development company and the whole industry is in serious trouble. We are all surviving on a day to day basis. One of my bosses is having a real tough time dealing with it so I have been running our office and scheduling work. I spent most of Friday trying to figure out who to tell to not come into work on Tuesday until at the last minute we had a couple of jobs accepted by clients so I can keep everyone on staff until Wednesday. The constant pressure I feel having to make decisions that affect if people I have worked with for years can afford to pay their rent or mortgages is fucking killing me. Man... this shit is fucked. That's all without me questioning if I will have a job or not in a week. Fuck me.
 

Deleted member 28474

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 31, 2017
6,162
Food supplies are normalizing in my area. They were still out of every type of flour but fresh produce and meat were all stocked well. Hopefully this continues to be the case and gets better everywhere.
 
Oct 29, 2017
1,032
I'm sorry to hear all the hard stories in this thread. I just wanted to say something positive, at the end of things there are still plenty of good people who will help each other out.

Right now it's particularly hard but they will when get the chance to put things back together we can all be there to support each other. Yes, there will still be shitheads everywhere but there's still a lot we can do and we will.

At the moment it's just trying to make it through to the other side of this and at least you can always complain about the shitheads here.
 

JasonV

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,967
National cabinet today, news about a UK-esque 80% wage subsidy to come out soon.

apple.news

UK-style wage subsidy on the way in Morrison's plan to pay workers who lose jobs — The Sydney Morning Herald

Australians who lose their jobs will be given a wage subsidy to guarantee a share of their income as the coronavirus crisis wipes out hundreds of thousands of jobs, in a government plan to be announced within days

Does the 80% wage subsidy seem like a bad idea?

Why not increase the centrelink paymnent and increase staff there to improve access?
 

laoni

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,710
Peter Gutwein (Premier of Tasmania) has said he will be implementing any lockdown arrangements the larger states (NSW/Vic/QLD) put in place and he would have more to announce after national cabinet.

We also have 2 cases on the North West Coast now where the source of infection is unknown
 

Psittacus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,927
People are fucking muppets
870346600_640.jpg

Seriously, our country needs to fucking suffer if this is "Aussie spirit" or whatever jingoistic bullshit our PM is spouting.

Local nurse Stephanie Durran said she and her family went for a drive in the afternoon sunshine and were shocked to see the number of people defying isolation rules.

"I was honestly horrified," Stephanie told Geelong broadcasters.

"All my colleagues and I are out there trying to protect this community, it's disappointing and highly disrespectful," she said.
Thousands of HCWs must be looking at this shit and wondering why they even bother putting their lives on the line for us
 

Cvie

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,258
Does the 80% wage subsidy seem like a bad idea?

Why not increase the centrelink paymnent and increase staff there to improve access?
Centrelink alreaady getting doubled if you increase it much more then low paid part timers and casuals who still have to work would get more money on centrelink and not have to risk getting sick. I make 1300-1500 a fortnight part time, the increased newstart(is it still called that?) + rent assistance would be around 1200? + you would get a healthcare card.

What they should be doing is just blanket UBI
 

JasonV

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,967
Centrelink alreaady getting doubled if you increase it much more then low paid part timers and casuals who still have to work would get more money on centrelink and not have to risk getting sick. I make 1300-1500 a fortnight part time, the increased newstart(is it still called that?) + rent assistance would be around 1200? + you would get a healthcare card.

What they should be doing is just blanket UBI

"What they should be doing is just blanket UBI"

I agree with that. Or reduce the income test so those making less money still qualify for centrelink.

What I think is a terrible idea is that the UK system caps at about 10 thousand Australian a month; no one should be getting 10 thousand a month while other people are getting 2 thousand; its insane.
 

viciouskillersquirrel

Cheering your loss
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,872
Fuck no, lol. And the current regime is DOUBLE what the previous was. Imagine the reaction if people were exposed to how truly wretched and punitive the real welfare system is.
I saw people on Facebook complaining about how unfair it was that existing unemployed were getting the boosted payment as well as hardworking folk like themselves. People have no idea.
 

shinra-bansho

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,964
Biggish case jump in Vic (111) over past days, but hopefully a function of expanded testing, returned travellers in quarantine and/or a traceable cluster.
So following up on this, it does seem to at least partially reflect increased testing. Total cases rose by 84 today to 769, but the number of community transmissions (no known link) is still 21, but not sure how many are still under investigation. The % positive rate fell slightly to below 2%.
 

Antiwhippy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,458
What is with the discrepancy of the number of recovered in Vic compared to the rest of the country>?
 

LuigiV

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,684
Perth, Australia
"What they should be doing is just blanket UBI"

I agree with that. Or reduce the income test so those making less money still qualify for centrelink.

What I think is a terrible idea is that the UK system caps at about 10 thousand Australian a month; no one should be getting 10 thousand a month while other people are getting 2 thousand; its insane.
That doesn't sound that insane to me. Presumably if you qualify for $10K a month, your prior salary was $12.5K+ a month and you probably have more accrued debt that needs to be covered than someone who only qualifies for $2K a month. Liquidity isn't exactly high at the moment, so it's not like they can just sell off their assets to reduce their total debt and live off less.

Anyway, chances are if you're already earning 12.5K or more a month, you're probably in a position were you can more easily work from home and won't lose your job. I would wager very few people would actually receive payments near the cap. Most will be on the lower end of the scale.

That said, I do believe the system would be a little more fair if it were tiered like taxes, so low income workers get 100% income compensation whilst high income workers at the $10K cap are only getting 80% or less. That 20% gap is going to be a bigger deal the lower your base income was.
 

JasonV

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,967
That doesn't sound that insane to me. Presumably if you qualify for $10K a month, your prior salary was $12.5K+ a month and you probably have more accrued debt that needs to be covered than someone who only qualifies for $2K a month. Liquidity isn't exactly high at the moment, so it's not like they can just sell off their assets to reduce their total debt and live off less.

I don't think people with greater resources should be given more assistance. That does seem insane to me. We should provided rent/mortgage/credit relief to those in need. We should not increase payments to meet lifestyle requirements.

That said, I do believe the system would be a little more fair if it were tiered like taxes, so low income workers get 100% income compensation whilst high income workers at the $10K cap are only getting 80% or less. That 20% gap is going to be a bigger deal the lower your base income was.

This would exclude the long term unemployed, disabled, or people fired just before the crises. Or even sole traders, self-employed. There's a reason Boris went with this plan. Its more trickle down nonsense.
 

LuigiV

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,684
Perth, Australia
I don't think people with greater resources should be given more assistance. That does seem insane to me. We should provided rent/mortgage/credit relief to those in need. We should not increase payments to meet lifestyle requirements.
Those greater resources are mostly imaginary and are temporarily worthless but someone somewhere still needs to collect the debt. No one should have to file for bankruptcy and we're just discussing different methods of achieving that goal. The higher income earners are still getting more assistance either way. Which is the better method for fairness and long term economic health? I don't know. I just don't think it's insane to give out aid based on lost income. Maybe the cap should be a bit lower but I don't think it's by any means an unreasonable approach. Not for a short term stimulus anyway.

If it can allow the majority population to go through a (let's say) one month total lockdown and allow them to come out the other end not too much worse off, then it's done it's job. If it goes on long term (6+ months) then I agree, it's a farce. The long term unemployeed should all be on even grounds regardless of their prior lifestyle.

This would exclude the long term unemployed, disabled, or people fired just before the crises. Or even sole traders, self-employed. There's a reason Boris went with this plan. Its more trickle down nonsense.
I'm not sure about Boris's implementation but shouldn't the long term unemployed and disabled be covered by the existing wealthfare system. They shouldn't be seeing any difference from what they were getting before, if such a system were implemented properly.

As for those made redundant before the crisis, sole-traders and the self-employed, ideally the income test should be designed broadly enough to cover them too.

Whether or not ScoMo goes with something like that, I don't know, but that's about execution of the details. I don't think the high level concept is fundamentally broken.
 

Maximo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,152
Another pathetic announcement from Scott Morsion, asking buisnesses and property owners to somehow get in contact and come together with renters and figure something out, doesn't have anything else to help those in need just more dumb as fuck lip service and good old aussie spririt.
 

JasonV

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,967
Those greater resources are mostly imaginary and are temporarily worthless but someone somewhere still needs to collect the debt.

We should provide debt/credit/mortgage relief as needed. Assets are not temporary and or imaginary- im not sure what you mean.

No one should have to file for bankruptcy ...

I agree.

I just don't think it's insane to give out aid based on lost income. Maybe the cap should be a bit lower but I don't think it's by any means an unreasonable approach. Not for a short term stimulus anyway.

I dont think we should have a class based stimulus package that favours the wealthy who are more capable of weathering the storm. Welfare should scale down as wealth increases, not up.

If it can allow the majority population to go through a (let's say) one month total lockdown and allow them to come out the other end not too much worse off, then it's done it's job. If it goes on long term (6+ months) then I agree, it's a farce. The long term unemployeed should all be on even grounds regardless of their prior lifestyle.

Even in the short term, I believe it is farcical to scale the level of assistance with wealth, it just seems ludicrous.

I'm not sure about Boris's implementation but shouldn't the long term unemployed and disabled be covered by the existing wealthfare system. They shouldn't be seeing any difference from what they were getting before, if such a system were implemented properly.

I have bad news about the system being implemented properly. There's a reason the first thing scomo did was double the newstart payment- the LNP did not want to expose the wider community to the brutality of the neoliberal welfare state.

As for those made redundant before the crisis, sole-traders and the self-employed, ideally the income test should be designed broadly enough to cover them too.

How would a test like that be designed, and enforced? I have no idea, and neither does scomo. It will either be too narrow and exclude the needy, or too wide which would allow massive fraud by business.

Whether or not ScoMo goes with something like that, I don't know, but that's about execution of the details. I don't think the high level concept is fundamentally broken.

I think the notion is regressive, punitive and another example of a middle class hand out. A simple payment in the style of a UBI dispensed through the ATO like the rudd stimulus would the most effective and equitable response; in addition to rent/mortage/credit relief where needed.
 

bomma man

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,068
Another pathetic announcement from Scott Morsion, asking buisnesses and property owners to somehow get in contact and come together with renters and figure something out, doesn't have anything else to help those in need just more dumb as fuck lip service and good old aussie spririt.

We've got a new section in our Tenancy legislation which codifies the same thing, mutually reducing the rent (which.... could've happened anyway) but if there's no mechanism to force the landlord to engage then why would they? It completely ignores the inherent asymmetry of the relationship.
 
OP
OP
브라이언

브라이언

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
3,169
Shopping centres still open.

Two people minimum limit now applies to all households and outdoor gatherings (except for family). Five wedding, ten funeral still applies.
 

i_am_ben

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,010
brb going to horde jigsaw puzzles


edit: you know what, I'm not going to fix that spelling mistake
 

Maximo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,152
We've got a new section in our Tenancy legislation which codifies the same thing, mutually reducing the rent (which.... could've happened anyway) but if there's no mechanism to force the landlord to engage then why would they? It completely ignores the inherent asymmetry of the relationship.

He just vomits *business business business* without enacting any rules or financial help as you said why would a landlord engage in any sympathetic way, they also have mortgages and utilities in an extreme economic downturn...they ain't helping anyone.
 

Antiwhippy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,458
I really should quit my job and apply for jigsaw puzzle manufacturing. That's the most stable job in this situation.