AutomotiveEra |OT| Four are better than two

ShapeGSX

Member
Nov 13, 2017
1,294
this is probably not what you want to hear but if your goal is to get a used, reasonably reliable/won't break the bank when repairs are due, compact daily driver then you should go for the civic, corolla, mazda3, etc, like everyone else especially if you only need it for 2 years, drop down the manual tax if feeling sporty is really that important to you - save the used boxter/cayman/JDM import once you're really ready for it. I do not think you get any substantial benefit from getting a dart over any other compact commuter car, but test drive a few and see for yourself - my feeling is that you will find it is not especially sporty and the build quality will be lacking compared to the "boring" cars, but if it really clicks and you've done the research on the particular trouble areas for that car, go for it! Other options to consider that might be more fun/engaging to drive compared to the civic/corolla while remaining reasonably practical would be the Ford Fiesta especially in the ST trim, and i've heard similar things about the Honda Fit - may be worth researching as well.
I’ll second the ST. Great handling cars, super fun, and they’re pretty quick too. They were practically giving away new ones a couple years ago. The used market must be pretty cheap.
 

Fatoy

Member
Mar 13, 2019
1,890
I've chronicled my attempts to find a decent-sized (by European standards) all-wheel-drive family SUV that's either partly or fully electric, and that doesn't cost close to £100k, a couple of times before, but in case anyone's still interested, I've ended up settling for a "self-charging hybrid" in the form of the 2020 Toyota RAV4. It's not exactly what I wanted, but as I'll explain, I don't think that what I want actually exists yet.

First off, the car looks ok. It's not gorgeous, but neither is it actively offensive to look at. My wife took a while to warm to it in the showroom, but she liked the way it drove on a test drive and she's on-board with using less fuel, so we got there in the end. Second, it's not horrifically expensive. I'm getting it on a four-year lease for business reasons, but £35k isn't horrendous for a decent-sized family car with a hybrid engine. Third, it now has Android Auto. I'd previously discounted this car because I'd have been stuck with Toyota's rubbish infotainment, but that's not an issue any more. Fourth, it has AWD - not mechanical, but it'll be sufficient to deal with the snow we get up here.

Fourth: I think self-charging hybrids are in a good place for most people at the moment, and here's the thinking behind that.
  • If I want a pure battery EV, I either need to step down in size to a Hyundai Kona, or double my budget to approach a Tesla Model X or an Audi e-Tron. Neither of those was really an option. Plenty of automakers have more compelling EVs coming, but not until 2021 or later. I have a driveway and a garage, so charging at home isn't my reason for not going fully electric. Oh, I guess the MG ZS EV exists, but that's a bit unproven in terms of reliability so far.
  • Plug-in hybrids sound good, but their benefits are only going to be felt in a very narrow set of circumstances, which our daily pattern of driving falls outside of. My wife drives the car about 40 miles a day (to school and back, twice). Something like a Mitsubishi Outlander, which is by far the most popular PHEV in the UK, would do that journey on electric power in the morning, probably, then again in the afternoon - provided it was fully charged in between. That would be fine, except that any other journeys she'd need to do would then be using the petrol engine... and the added weight of the battery drags down the petrol fuel economy.
  • We use a sustainable electricity supplier, which means our electricity isn't massively cheap compared to petrol... which kind of negates the cost advantage of a PHEV. The same 40 miles in a PHEV would cost us £3.10ish versus £3.15ish in a self-charging hybrid. It's not exactly life-changing.
  • There's no need to charge the RAV4. Like I said, we could easily install a charge point on our driveway, but my wife (who routinely forgets to charge her phone) is never going to remember to plug a PHEV in twice a day. With a self-charging hybrid, she can just drive sensibly, not need to modify her habits too much, and get better fuel economy than in even a similarly-sized diesel.
So here we are. The new car will be delivered in May / June. I've talked about my wife a lot there, but she's our main driver; I work from home, so I only use the car on weekends or for occasional day trips for business.

I think when this lease ends - in four years' time - we'll be spoilt for choice in mid-to-large battery EV SUVs, but right now the sweet spot seems to be in more traditional hybrids. And honestly, I think PHEVs are only attractive if you fit a very niche usage profile or want to save on company car tax.
 
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SeanM

Member
Oct 26, 2017
834
USA
Hoping Era can help me out,

Parents are in the market for a compact SUV and I'm helping them pick one. They're in their late 60's and just do standard city driving mostly (no off-road stuff or anything like that) but they want an SUV to be higher up from the ground to feel more safe, and something that drives well in the snow. Aside from that they babysit my sisters child (3 yrs old) so they need something carseat-friendly and with USB's or power in the back so he can play on his iPad. And they typically lease their car and then buy it out after the lease is up, so trying to get something that would last 10+ years.

I've test driven the Subaru Forester, Mazda CX-5, Honda CR-V, Toyota RAV4, and plan to check out the Hyundai Santa Fe tomorrow. But so far we like the RAV4 the best overall and are leaning towards that one. Model we drove and liked is kinda on the pricey side tho, it's the 2020 RAV4 XLE Premium AWD with Audio Plus(JBL) + Weather Package. MSRP is $35,956. Is this a good choice or could we do better? Maybe look at the RAV4 Hybrid instead?

Wondering if there's any current or former RAV4 owners that could give real world opinions on the pros/cons? Or are there any other compact SUV's I should be checking out too?
 
Oct 25, 2017
379
My C8 Corvette order was originally planned for a late summer delivery but now they are expecting it in early to mid summer.

EXCITE! :D
 
Oct 30, 2017
412
Hoping Era can help me out,

Parents are in the market for a compact SUV and I'm helping them pick one. They're in their late 60's and just do standard city driving mostly (no off-road stuff or anything like that) but they want an SUV to be higher up from the ground to feel more safe, and something that drives well in the snow. Aside from that they babysit my sisters child (3 yrs old) so they need something carseat-friendly and with USB's or power in the back so he can play on his iPad. And they typically lease their car and then buy it out after the lease is up, so trying to get something that would last 10+ years.

I've test driven the Subaru Forester, Mazda CX-5, Honda CR-V, Toyota RAV4, and plan to check out the Hyundai Santa Fe tomorrow. But so far we like the RAV4 the best overall and are leaning towards that one. Model we drove and liked is kinda on the pricey side tho, it's the 2020 RAV4 XLE Premium AWD with Audio Plus(JBL) + Weather Package. MSRP is $35,956. Is this a good choice or could we do better? Maybe look at the RAV4 Hybrid instead?

Wondering if there's any current or former RAV4 owners that could give real world opinions on the pros/cons? Or are there any other compact SUV's I should be checking out too?
1. Those cars are appliances and all acceptable so just look at gas mileage, comfort, and how much they personally like them. Can't speak to their finances. Look at the Hyundai Tuscon and Kia Sportage too. More features less money and comparable reliability nowadays.
2. Do they really lease with the intent to buyout? Just buy the stupid thing then instead of wasting money.
3. Why the fuck are people giving three year olds iPads. I know it's a thing but it's always so shocking to me.
 
Oct 26, 2017
9,136
Car Era, thoughts?

I am currently driving a 2015 kia rio ex hatchback, I got in nov '14. I put 37k miles on it in 5.1 years.
condition is ok, 1-2 tiny dings, 2~ small scratches that I used a kia paint pen to cover.
what do you think my current car is worth?
No issues with the car, I get it oil changed regularly, but im started to look at newer cars, as I am worried I will shortly be leaving the maintenance free issue phase.

I was looking at the Kia Niro 2020's, and wanted to ask whats the real difference between the FE, Plug in hybrid and E?
 

Rayge

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,853
I'm looking to get out of my 2015 F-Type R so I went car shopping this weekend. I got to test drive the Supra and the M2 Competition. I'll say that when it came to performance and interior quality I'll have to say the M2 by a long shot. The base M2 isn't that much more than what they are selling Supras in my area. The M2s can also be tuned to 500+ hp for less than $1900. The thing about the M2 is that it has back seats and I hate having back seats in a sports car. The rear tires are not as wide as I thought they were too. I think the rear sits on 265s? I mean it's a tough looking car.

I guess the coolness factor goes to Supra for people who see it rolling down the street. For me though there were things that irked me about the car. It has non-functional air vents with no way to make them functional without actually cutting into the panels and doing other major body work. It really gives the car a cheap look to me. The body panels seemed off to me almost making it look like a kit car in some areas. The interior is also almost the exact same as an older BMW. Down to the knob control and the buttons on the dash. It's the exact same layout as my 2015 328i. The steering wheel is a BMW steering wheel. The air vents seem unique. Performance was ok. I'm sure you can spend money on it to bump it over 400hp but the same can be done to the M2 to get it to 500hp.

If the Supra actually sold for it's MSRP then I'd say it would be a deal. But the dealers in my area are selling the car for 57K to 58K with some marking them up to 70K.

Neither car is really for me. I was thinking about the new F-Type, but the 2021 face lift killed the cars design for me. Now it looks like all their other Jaguars. It's by no means ugly, but they just gave it the same design cues found in all their other vehicles. That and nothing has really changed outside an interior update and the R having the SVR tuned engine. I was under the impression that it would have a new powerplant.

Not much sub $100,000 looks good to me. The 718 is something else I'd like to check out. Any other $40-$100,000 sports cars to check out? I tried the Z06 and did not enjoy the transmission in it compared to the ZF in the F-Type. I also don't mind manual, but no one here sells manual cars. I'm almost about to just call it quits for like 2 years and wait for there to be a few used 2019 Vantages in the used car market.
 

EnronERA

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,417
i'd kill for a 2015 F-Type, lol. Instead, I have an ND Miata.

If you are driving an ftype, and you want somehting similar maybe a cayman?
 

nib95

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,483
I'm looking to get out of my 2015 F-Type R so I went car shopping this weekend. I got to test drive the Supra and the M2 Competition. I'll say that when it came to performance and interior quality I'll have to say the M2 by a long shot. The base M2 isn't that much more than what they are selling Supras in my area. The M2s can also be tuned to 500+ hp for less than $1900. The thing about the M2 is that it has back seats and I hate having back seats in a sports car. The rear tires are not as wide as I thought they were too. I think the rear sits on 265s? I mean it's a tough looking car.

I guess the coolness factor goes to Supra for people who see it rolling down the street. For me though there were things that irked me about the car. It has non-functional air vents with no way to make them functional without actually cutting into the panels and doing other major body work. It really gives the car a cheap look to me. The body panels seemed off to me almost making it look like a kit car in some areas. The interior is also almost the exact same as an older BMW. Down to the knob control and the buttons on the dash. It's the exact same layout as my 2015 328i. The steering wheel is a BMW steering wheel. The air vents seem unique. Performance was ok. I'm sure you can spend money on it to bump it over 400hp but the same can be done to the M2 to get it to 500hp.

If the Supra actually sold for it's MSRP then I'd say it would be a deal. But the dealers in my area are selling the car for 57K to 58K with some marking them up to 70K.

Neither car is really for me. I was thinking about the new F-Type, but the 2021 face lift killed the cars design for me. Now it looks like all their other Jaguars. It's by no means ugly, but they just gave it the same design cues found in all their other vehicles. That and nothing has really changed outside an interior update and the R having the SVR tuned engine. I was under the impression that it would have a new powerplant.

Not much sub $100,000 looks good to me. The 718 is something else I'd like to check out. Any other $40-$100,000 sports cars to check out? I tried the Z06 and did not enjoy the transmission in it compared to the ZF in the F-Type. I also don't mind manual, but no one here sells manual cars. I'm almost about to just call it quits for like 2 years and wait for there to be a few used 2019 Vantages in the used car market.
How about a used Porsche 911 Carrera S or Turbo?
 

turbobrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,733
Mesa, AZ
Car Era, thoughts?

I am currently driving a 2015 kia rio ex hatchback, I got in nov '14. I put 37k miles on it in 5.1 years.
condition is ok, 1-2 tiny dings, 2~ small scratches that I used a kia paint pen to cover.
what do you think my current car is worth?
No issues with the car, I get it oil changed regularly, but im started to look at newer cars, as I am worried I will shortly be leaving the maintenance free issue phase.

I was looking at the Kia Niro 2020's, and wanted to ask whats the real difference between the FE, Plug in hybrid and E?
I mean, if your goal is to keep costs low, you're better off keeping your current car. Its barely 5 years old, and only 37k miles, that's nothing. Any maintenance you'd do will still be cheaper than car payments. Your car is probably worth $4k - $7k depending on condition, and of course you'll get less if you trade it in.
 

dr.rocktopus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,467
Debating getting a jalopy ass F150 to keep on hand for hauling shit around for home renos. It should be cheap enough to make it worth it versus renting each time, plus once I'm done I can resell it. I'm like 99% sure I can fix the engine problems the seller has but I've never been a fan of buying other people's problems.

Please talk some sense into me.
 

ZOONAMI

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,150
Debating getting a jalopy ass F150 to keep on hand for hauling shit around for home renos. It should be cheap enough to make it worth it versus renting each time, plus once I'm done I can resell it. I'm like 99% sure I can fix the engine problems the seller has but I've never been a fan of buying other people's problems.

Please talk some sense into me.
Spend a bit more and buy something without engine problems?
 

rokkerkory

Member
Jun 14, 2018
4,746
Debating getting a jalopy ass F150 to keep on hand for hauling shit around for home renos. It should be cheap enough to make it worth it versus renting each time, plus once I'm done I can resell it. I'm like 99% sure I can fix the engine problems the seller has but I've never been a fan of buying other people's problems.

Please talk some sense into me.
Get a tundra
 

dr.rocktopus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,467
Spend a bit more and buy something without engine problems?
It's simply truck with problems + parts + my labour is less than the cost of buying a comparable, well running example. I'm talking under half the amount, I've just been watching this seller get slowly more and more desperate, lowering the price slowly.

My main issue is trusting people's diagnosis. Very rarely is it as simple as an ad makes it out to be. I have a game plan going in to see the truck tomorrow based on what I know the problems are, but ultimately it's taking a flyer on something that might have more problems.

If only I had the budget 😭 But for comparison sakes in my area a safetied mid 00s F150 is about half the price of a comparable age an mileage Tundra. Never mind this example, it's like a tenth lol.
 

Rayge

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,853
Car Era, thoughts?

I am currently driving a 2015 kia rio ex hatchback, I got in nov '14. I put 37k miles on it in 5.1 years.
condition is ok, 1-2 tiny dings, 2~ small scratches that I used a kia paint pen to cover.
what do you think my current car is worth?
No issues with the car, I get it oil changed regularly, but im started to look at newer cars, as I am worried I will shortly be leaving the maintenance free issue phase.

I was looking at the Kia Niro 2020's, and wanted to ask whats the real difference between the FE, Plug in hybrid and E?
I'd probably have your current car paid off and save up for a down payment on something else if you want something new. I still have my Scion TC that's paid off and I just pay for my maintenance whenever it needs it. The cost of maintaining a reliable car is cheaper than buying a new one just for a new warranty. Plus it's nice to have a car with some age on it that's paid off. You don't have to worry about someone dinging your brand new car. I don't know. I feel super comfortable driving around in my TC.

Also I second the Tundra. The reason Tundras have good resell is because they are super reliable. If not the Tundra, you could probably get by with a cheaper Tacoma if you don't need to haul as much. When I buy a truck it's going to be a Tacoma. But if you legitimately think you can get that engine problem repair and can save thousands of dollars, then go ahead. But you're resell is going to be even less than before where as a Tundra will fetch a bit more.
 
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BriareosGAF

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,248
We have a manual Taco shortbed, with the V6/hauling package, which I think is 5500 lbs, never had to tow anything more serious. We mostly use it to move livestock. So far so good although recently the entertainment center has started being flakey, but that's Toyota entertainment centers. The 4WD has been great punching through snowbanks recently.
 

ascii42

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,435
Debating getting a jalopy ass F150 to keep on hand for hauling shit around for home renos. It should be cheap enough to make it worth it versus renting each time, plus once I'm done I can resell it. I'm like 99% sure I can fix the engine problems the seller has but I've never been a fan of buying other people's problems.

Please talk some sense into me.
Main thing to ask is if a compact truck would be sufficient. I bought a standard cab stickshift 2006 Mazda B2300 for $3k a couple years ago for basically the same purpose. It gets the job done.
 

dr.rocktopus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,467
Main thing to ask is if a compact truck would be sufficient. I bought a standard cab stickshift 2006 Mazda B2300 for $3k a couple years ago for basically the same purpose. It gets the job done.
I think it would be, in fact I went to look at one but the seller sold it out from under me on the way there. Typically in my area you're looking at around $2.5k at least for a Ranger/B-Series. This wouldn't be the new daily driver so the cost of the F150 (seller asking $1200, I'm looking for less) in my mind gives me the leeway to spend the difference in repairs.

For a little more context, the seller says they are pulling codes for a misfire in cylinders 3, 5 and 8. This is on the 4.6 2 valve V8 so while it's dog shit slow it's also a fairly reliable engine. I want to pull codes myself, but if it's just the misfire codes on these engines it's typically just plugs and coils, maybe the injectors. Depending on how long it's gone, I may have some issues with the cats, due to fouling from unburned fuel. If I have any timing codes I'm walking away. Typically a timing set issue would affect a bank of cylinders though or come up as a cam position sensor code.

I also know it doesn't start, though it did last week apparently. I have my battery charger on me and multimeter to give it a quick top up if needed. If not, I'll diagnose the starter itself. If the start signal is getting to the starter and I'm getting battery voltage at the common for the solenoid, it's likely something with the solenoid internally. If I don't get a start signal I will walk away since those can be a bit of a chase through the harness if the start switch is OK.

Beyond that the risk is in things I won't be able to check unless I get it running. Does it shift well? Brakes, steering (potentially problematic on this gen F150 with leaks), suspension? The unknown and potential money put scares me beyond the known issues.
 

op_ivy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,765
I'm looking to get out of my 2015 F-Type R so I went car shopping this weekend. I got to test drive the Supra and the M2 Competition. I'll say that when it came to performance and interior quality I'll have to say the M2 by a long shot. The base M2 isn't that much more than what they are selling Supras in my area. The M2s can also be tuned to 500+ hp for less than $1900. The thing about the M2 is that it has back seats and I hate having back seats in a sports car. The rear tires are not as wide as I thought they were too. I think the rear sits on 265s? I mean it's a tough looking car.

I guess the coolness factor goes to Supra for people who see it rolling down the street. For me though there were things that irked me about the car. It has non-functional air vents with no way to make them functional without actually cutting into the panels and doing other major body work. It really gives the car a cheap look to me. The body panels seemed off to me almost making it look like a kit car in some areas. The interior is also almost the exact same as an older BMW. Down to the knob control and the buttons on the dash. It's the exact same layout as my 2015 328i. The steering wheel is a BMW steering wheel. The air vents seem unique. Performance was ok. I'm sure you can spend money on it to bump it over 400hp but the same can be done to the M2 to get it to 500hp.

If the Supra actually sold for it's MSRP then I'd say it would be a deal. But the dealers in my area are selling the car for 57K to 58K with some marking them up to 70K.

Neither car is really for me. I was thinking about the new F-Type, but the 2021 face lift killed the cars design for me. Now it looks like all their other Jaguars. It's by no means ugly, but they just gave it the same design cues found in all their other vehicles. That and nothing has really changed outside an interior update and the R having the SVR tuned engine. I was under the impression that it would have a new powerplant.

Not much sub $100,000 looks good to me. The 718 is something else I'd like to check out. Any other $40-$100,000 sports cars to check out? I tried the Z06 and did not enjoy the transmission in it compared to the ZF in the F-Type. I also don't mind manual, but no one here sells manual cars. I'm almost about to just call it quits for like 2 years and wait for there to be a few used 2019 Vantages in the used car market.
damn i want a M2 competition.
 

chokeartist

Member
Nov 12, 2017
909
Costco now sells their own full synthetic oil for $25US for 2, 5 quart bottles. This is even cheaper than Walmart's oil.
 

dr.rocktopus

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
4,467
So I bought the truck. Ended up getting it for $850, but the tow brought it back up to a little over the sellers asking price. Didn't realize CAA doesn't tow newly purchased vehicles and didn't even think to check it. The battery was done and wasn't taking any charge, but you could hear the starter try and the battery voltage was floating around 10-11V. Way too low to start a car. The frame and body are relatively rust free, but the body is full of small dings, scuffs and dents.

I have codes for the misfires, as expected, but I also have a code for a lean condition. Once I get the misfire fixed I'll be better equipped to diagnose that. I bought a new battery and oil (from Costco 😅) and will do a fluid flush over time. The weather is gonna suck the next few days but hopefully I'm at the point of investigating that lean code next week.
 

burgerdog

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,554
Caymans are back in the menu. It is hilarious seeing the 981s being more expensive than the 718s in the used car market. That 4.0 GTS is going to be glorious.
 

EnronERA

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,417
there's an '18 machine grey red top GT with <5k miles for 22k 200 miles away tho 👀 honestly if it's still there in a month i'll call the dealer
GT with less than 5k miles for 22k? wtf cheap

That might not last another month. As the weather warms up, these cars get snapped up

Best time to buy is when it's cold!
 
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Kromeo

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,798
My RX8 needs the engine rebuilding so it's pretty much scrap now, looking at leasing a Mercedes A200, the 250 has a long waiting list. Think they;re much better looking than 1 series BMW or Audi A3
 

Envelope

Member
Oct 25, 2017
704
Got a flat tire, hit the curb and passenger side fender liner came off. How urgently is it to get new liner?
Usually those are just held on by a few plastic clips - any chance you can reattach it yourself? It's not critical but if you're in a snow/salt area I would get that fixed sooner rather than later as it does help protect the inner fender and engine bay from splashes and road debris
 

EnronERA

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,417
Usually those are just held on by a few plastic clips - any chance you can reattach it yourself? It's not critical but if you're in a snow/salt area I would get that fixed sooner rather than later as it does help protect the inner fender and engine bay from splashes and road debris
oops replied to wrong person. sorry envelaap
 

EnronERA

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,417
Got a flat tire, hit the curb and passenger side fender liner came off. How urgently is it to get new liner?
typically 8mm or 10mm plastic pop clips. you can pick up a box of those for like 5 bucks at hardware stores or autozone/oreilly/etc. I had to replace a couple on the Miata when i got it. I usually keep a box of these things just in case in the toolkits I keep in the trunk of both of my cars. These little pop clips are used everywhere on a car, and they break more often than you think.

If the liner is torn through the clipholes, you might be able to punch a few new holes in yourself and ziptie them for now.
 

Aestivalis

Member
Nov 4, 2018
2,438
Usually those are just held on by a few plastic clips - any chance you can reattach it yourself? It's not critical but if you're in a snow/salt area I would get that fixed sooner rather than later as it does help protect the inner fender and engine bay from splashes and road debris
typically 8mm or 10mm plastic pop clips. you can pick up a box of those for like 5 bucks at hardware stores or autozone/oreilly/etc. I had to replace a couple on the Miata when i got it. I usually keep a box of these things just in case in the toolkits I keep in the trunk of both of my cars. These little pop clips are used everywhere on a car, and they break more often than you think.

If the liner is torn through the clipholes, you might be able to punch a few new holes in yourself and ziptie them for now.
Well, I lost the liner somewhere... When I was installing the spare, the liner was still somehow attached to the bumper. I started hearing something scraping the ground on my way home, thought it might be low pressure in the spare. The scraping sound went away some minutes later, and I got home to find the liner gone.

I plan to get a cheap generic one off ebay since it doesn't seem very hard to do it myself. But the tire shop dude told me I could wait til spring, I don't get it.

I'm also shocked how fragile these bumper components are.
 

EnronERA

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,417
Well, I lost the liner somewhere... When I was installing the spare, the liner was still somehow attached to the bumper. I started hearing something scraping the ground on my way home, thought it might be low pressure in the spare. The scraping sound went away some minutes later, and I got home to find the liner gone.

I plan to get a cheap generic one off ebay since it doesn't seem very hard to do it myself. But the tire shop dude told me I could wait til spring, I don't get it.

I'm also shocked how fragile these bumper components are.
you should have just removed the liner yourself and thrown it in the trunk. Never leave shit hanging off your car like that. at speed, stuff WILL rip off.

Also it might be a good idea to carry some tools and zip ties in your trunk in an emergency tool bag. In both my cars i keep a socket wrench set, a utility knife, a set of screwdrivers, a bag of zip ties, a funnel, pliers, vise grips, some work gloves, and jumper cables. it's saved my ass a few times over the years.