AV Club: Turns out Colin Trevorrow's version of Star Wars: Episode IX was good, actually

Lunar Wolf

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Nov 6, 2017
10,665
Los Angeles
Luke says no one is really gone, so I don't think it should be as simple as punishment. It's doing what good he can, even if it will never be enough to justify the genocide of the first order, it's better than nothing, and it's more thought provoking than just an ironic punishment. For a series that has often had a black and white depiction of redemption and of a villain like Palpatine's being 100% evil, throw awrench in the middle and give the audience something to contemplate with. Even though SW is a classic story of simple morals, you can always add a new layer.
Who says that he can't help people on Tatooine?

Ben can still be redeemed and punished without dying.
 

sphagnum

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Oct 25, 2017
12,077
Now we just need the Jack Thorne version (the one where Rey was the daughter of the Organa family housekeeper) and the George version (with Whills and midichlorians).
 

Lunar Wolf

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Nov 6, 2017
10,665
Los Angeles
I think "Sith", like "Jedi", is kind of meant to imply some kind of formal organization with goals and beliefs. Tor Vallum seems more like a chaotic being reveling in the dark side of the force. From that stand point I don't think it violate The Rule of Two.

Never mind that that the "Rule of Two" doesn't make a whole lot of sense anyway. Lucas himself ensured that when he had Ventress apprenticed to Count Dooku.
Ventress isn't a Sith Lord though. She's just an assassin and initially, she was a Count Dooku apprentice that Dooku was planning to help him with overthrowing Palpatine.
 

Sephzilla

Herald of Stoptimus Crime
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Oct 25, 2017
14,685
TBQH this doesn't read as much better to me, but it would have all been in execution. While I definitely would have appreciated a more tortured Kylo than we got, and I do think the Palpatine revival was really dumb I don't think this solves any of the real problems.

Also I don't think Star Wars purists would have liked this too much since this plot means that Palpatine was always breaking the rule of two all along: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Rule_of_Two
There's an argument to be made that Palpatine already broke the Rule of Two by letting Maul live
 

Surfinn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,846
USA
Feels like it doesn't know what it wants, just like TROS.

Rey disguised as a Tusken Raider is revealed to have created her own weapon (a double-blade lightsaber hybrid of her staff and Luke's cracked saber).

But I kinda love this
 

DIE BART DIE

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,553
I like that this script actually seemed to try and do proper world building.

e.g.
You have the Resistance trying to infiltrate and blow up Kuat Drive Yards which is pumping out the First Order destroyers and which has a proper history in the lore.
And in ROS, Palpatine just seems to conjure up 1000x Stardestroyers and pulls them out of the crust of Exogol.

Or how there is an uprising on actual Coruscant.
Agreed.
 

jelly

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,540
No matter which version they went with, one movie wasn’t enough. Should have been two movies, trilogy be damned. Call it the first Star Wars quadrilogy and move on.
Not even that, it should just be an ongoing series until they are done.

I doubt we will see an Episode X any time soon if at all, how on earth would you write that, they completely shat the bed. I suppose they might if their other side projects flop.
 

Hero_of_the_Day

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
4,975
I am confused by the end details.

Towards the end, Luke/Obi Wan/Yoda appear as Force Ghosts to save Ben, but are unsuccessful. Ben is "extinguished."
I literally don't understand what this means? Save him from what?

And why would Snoke have Kylo Ren kill Rey's parents. If I had a script and leaked a summary to the internet, that would be a pretty huge fucking thing that needs explaining.
 

Oozer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,722
As I posted in the Star Wars OT earlier today, it's hard for me to form a strong opinion on this without actually getting to read the script. What we have now is second had at best. Heck, if you're like me and haven't watched the video, it's third hand. It sounds interesting enough from the summaries.

A note: there's also at least one other Trevorrow/Connolly draft from spring 2017 that doesn't include Leia. And then writer Jack Thorne was brought in to give their last draft a rewrite. MakingStarWars claimed to have gotten information about that one.

Also, I feel it's important for this discussion to note that Colin Trevorrow did not write The Book of Henry. That script was a 10-years-in-the-making passion project for a writer named Gregg Hurwitz. And he probably kept adding and changing things trying to entice studios rather than trying to make it a better movie. This certainly does not absolve Colin of criticism for it, but I just wanted to point that out.

Leak the Lucas treatments!!! C'monnnnn...
Oh, how I want this. I just want to know what they are. They fascinate me. There's a George Lucas story for Episodes VII, VIII, and IX that differs from the officially made ones! And we know very little about it!

Now we just need the Jack Thorne version (the one where Rey was the daughter of the Organa family housekeeper) and the George version (with Whills and midichlorians).
I'd also like the "work-in-progress" draft of VII that Michael Arndt turned in to Lucasfilm in August of 2013 if anyone out there is taking orders.

What was the given reason for him being fired again?
The thing I wonder about is what are the sticking points that make KK want to fire you?

Because killing off Luke and Snoke was something she was cool with and allowed Rian the authority to do, but not redeeming Kylo Ren was sacrilege such that she was desperate to force TRoS into a rushed mess?

We don't know what Lord and Miller's intent was with Solo but there was nothing ambitious about the film we got. And it undercut Han's arc by making it turn out that he helped kickstart a rebel cell before even stepping foot on Tatooine?
The official reason is, essentially, creative differences. My guess, and it's just a guess, is that Kathy was never happy with any drafts that Trevorrow and Connolly turned in but couldn't put her finger on why. After J.J. came in and started pitching stuff, she realized that the problem she had with Trevorrow and Connolly was that they didn't redeem Kylo. She's stated that J.J. had a leg up because he helped break the story for the trilogy and was part of the discussions about where everything could go after Episode VII. I'm sure redeeming Kylo was discussed during the making of The Force Awakens and maybe Kathy really liked the idea but then it lay dormant.
 

sphagnum

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,077
You can see the building ocks of JJ's IX in this story. The Resistance getting all their allies foes final space battle, Rey being unsure of whether she wants to be a Jedi, Kylo following some secret dark lord out of nowhere, etc.
 

SlumberingGiant

alt account
Banned
Jul 2, 2019
1,389
Eyerolls for days at these parts:

Darth Maul-esque droid. He has stubble indicating search has been for a long time.

At some point is revealed Kylo killed Rey's parents at the behest of Snoke.

Still pretty much garbage tbh. Unimagintive and full of lazy fan service. Trevorrow is a hack.
None of that is as stupid as the real film
 

Lo-Volt

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Oct 27, 2017
1,735
New Yawk City!
The saucy lines implied here alone would have made this a fun watch if it came to pass. The sniping between Hux and Ren and the critical comments Rey threw out ("like their masters before them") would have been joyful to watch.
 
Original source

Oozer

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Oct 25, 2017
1,722
Just for bookkeeping purposes, the original source of this is a writer/director/producer turned YouTuber named Robert Meyer Burnett. Here's the video from yesterday where he originally talked about the script:


And here's a stream he just did where he talks about it more.

 
Oct 25, 2017
15,043
Especially because of the core difference between Kylo and Anakin: Anakin wanted to be a good man, but he fell to the dark side. Kylo wants to be a bad guy, and fights against the light purposfully.

It makes sense that one can be redeemed and not the other.
That's what people ignore about Anakin's arc his life started in abject misery, he became a famous war hero, and then fell. Ben is a super powered edgelord.
 

Hagi

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Oct 25, 2017
2,381
Just the simple thing of having Kylo Ren throw Vader’s helmet away is more interesting than anything we got in Rise of the Skywalker.

I’m not going to say we would would have ended up with a better end product but I’d rather have seen this version than what we got.
 

Oozer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,722
how could this be the leaked script when thry always planned on bringing palpatine back since the start?
Palpatine coming back was not in the plans until Trevorrow was fired and J.J. Abrams came in.

"Bringing back the Emperor was an idea JJ brought to the table when he came on board," Trevorrow says. "It’s honestly something I never considered. I commend him for it. This was a tough story to unlock, and he found the key."
 

Sargerus

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
8,670
My only real qualms with this are lack of Finn, Tor Valum being weird when we already know of Plagueis (though this could be explained in a cool way, I just wouldn't want to downplay Plagueis), and a lack of ANAKIN. Most of it sounds pretty solid
The way it was presented Tor Valum could work similar to Darth Maul as in former Sith no longer viewed as an active threat by the other Sith Lords. Or just dismiss it as a Sith Lord and just let it be a really powerful dark side user.
 

Seesaw15

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Oct 27, 2017
5,395
Just the simple thing of having Kylo Ren throw Vader’s helmet away is more interesting than anything we got in Rise of the Skywalker.

I’m not going to say we would would have ended up with a better end product but I’d rather have seen this version than what we got.
Say what you want about the overall quality of TFA and TLJ but the Kylo and Rey arcs were solid. TRoS either does nothing with their arcs or actively regresses them. I would have prefered this over what we got because it at least gave Adam and Daisy something to do.
 
Jan 29, 2018
2,305
I've seen all these movies except the prequel and I have no idea what this "Rule of Two" is that I keep seeing mentioned in these threads.
 

Truant

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Oct 28, 2017
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Love that kylo killed Rey’s parents at the behest of Snoke. Love Luke haunting Kylo. Lots of great ideas, but it seems like a two-parter.
 

Kamagii

Member
Oct 27, 2017
420
South of Heaven
I will say on paper it does sound great but would Disney actually green light a good portion of the cool stuff. I still think there was some validity to them cutting some of JJ’s stuff.
 

Truant

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,890
I've seen all these movies except the prequel and I have no idea what this "Rule of Two" is that I keep seeing mentioned in these threads.
Before TRoT, Sith were constantly backstabbing and plotting against each other. Darth Bane invented TRoT to make sure only the best Sith + 1 apprentice were working from the shadows, like Palpatine in the prequels.
 
Jan 29, 2018
2,305
There are only ever two Sith at a time, because in the days of the Old Republic their empire collapsed due to them constantly backstabbing each other in power grabs.
Before TRoT, Sith were constantly backstabbing and plotting against each other. Darth Bane invented TRoT to make sure only the best Sith + 1 apprentice were working from the shadows, like Palpatine in the prequels.
Thanks ya'll.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
19,305
I am confused by the end details.



I literally don't understand what this means? Save him from what?

And why would Snoke have Kylo Ren kill Rey's parents. If I had a script and leaked a summary to the internet, that would be a pretty huge fucking thing that needs explaining.
Snoke could see the future. It's not a stretch that he foresaw those parents would give birth to his rival in the Light and ordered Ren to kill them.
 

♡♪!?

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,297
Snoke could see the future. It's not a stretch that he foresaw those parents would give birth to his rival in the Light and ordered Ren to kill them.
Rey's parents should just be filthy junk traders who abandoned her like trash, and Rey is like fuck that, I'm going to be an awesome person anyway, I don't think they needed to be victims IMO, like the parents of a chosen one and who were was assassinated like a terminator film,
 

sphagnum

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,077
I suppose Kylo killing Rey's parents is supposed to be a "solution", so to speak, to the mystery box of "WHAT girl?!"
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,879
This just seems bad in different ways and in some ways worse. I think this script is reaping the benefits of grass-is-greener syndrome because people fueled by TRoS disappointment are willing to give it the benefit of the doubt. It does a couple things better sure, but on the whole I wouldn't endorse it. Easy to imagine something as good in your head when compared to something disappointing that actually exists.
 

Starphanluke

Member
Nov 15, 2017
2,107
There are parts I like better than what we got in TRoS, but there is one massive thing that makes me glad this was never made:

Ben being "unredeemable" and dying a villain. Fuck that.
 

polyphoria

Member
Oct 27, 2017
631
Ontario, Canada
This sounds absolutely terrible, and TLJ is my favourite in the whole series. I was pretty down on TROS at first, but I saw it again today and I think ...it's fine. (Other than basically writing Rose out.) I could have done without Palpatine, and it doesn't make a lot of sense, and some of it is silly, but it is kind of a fun movie and that essentially describes every Star Wars film ever made. Maybe I'm just in the acceptance stage lol.