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AV Club: Turns out Colin Trevorrow's version of Star Wars: Episode IX was good, actually

♡♪!?

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,878
There are parts I like better than what we got in TRoS, but there is one massive thing that makes me glad this was never made:

Ben being "unredeemable" and dying a villain. Fuck that.
I'm quite open minded, redeem him, kill him, exile him, whatever but I'd rather have no shit where he gets his big romantic moment after psychologically abusing Rey in the TLJ "You had no place in this story, you're nobody, but not to me" that was some nasty predatory shit, and Rey is like "I wanted Ben's hand" that's like "it's not him, it was the drink." rather fucked up writing IMO. Vader did some horrible things but this felt more personal and realistic.
 

Clu

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,475
The Grid
Only thing I liked from that fan fiction, which I will call it that till otherwise is that Luke Haunts Kylo, because after all Luke did say that to him in The Last Jedi and in ROS Luke talked to Kylo/Ben a total of zero times.
 

CrichtonKicks

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,763
I'm quite open minded, redeem him, kill him, exile him, whatever but I'd rather have no shit where he gets his big romantic moment after psychologically abusing Rey in the TLJ "You had no place in this story, you're nobody, but not to me" that was some nasty predatory shit, and Rey is like "I wanted Ben's hand" that's like "it's not him, it was the drink." rather fucked up writing IMO. Vader did some horrible things but this felt more personal and realistic.
It's so dumb- she never actually met "Ben". That moment only works if they had some sort of relationship prior to his turn.
 

PhaZe 5

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,237
I'm quite open minded, redeem him, kill him, exile him, whatever but I'd rather have no shit where he gets his big romantic moment after psychologically abusing Rey in the TLJ "You had no place in this story, you're nobody, but not to me" that was some nasty predatory shit, and Rey is like "I wanted Ben's hand" that's like "it's not him, it was the drink." rather fucked up writing IMO. Vader did some horrible things but this felt more personal and realistic.
I've got no idea how JJ settled on that.
 

Tavernade

Member
Sep 18, 2018
1,360
I only read a summary, but I like ghost Luke, more Rose, and Coruscant. Nothing in it (at least in said summary) made me mad, I imagine I would have liked it more.
 

♡♪!?

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,878
I've got no idea how JJ settled on that.
My guess is because Rey kissed him... it was her choice, and it would avoid unfortunate implications, but I think the audince, except from hardcore shippers, would have preferred if Rey just told him to fuck off with his crush, and I think that's what RJ was trying to do, when the dice dissapeared from his hand, and she closes the millennium falcon door on him (I think was a nod to the godfather ending but could be wrong)
 

chrisPjelly

Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
7,186
Aside from doing EXACTLY what they should've done with Kylo in the first place (i.e. send him to a an even darker, more deranged place) and having Luke the friendly ghost, this still has a lot of things that people make fun of RoS for (muddy plot, throwaway KoR, fan service up the wazoo). Then again, it's a (rumoured) plot treatment as opposed of an actual movie, so at least there was more room for improvement here.
 

RyougaSaotome

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,220
The bits I like here are bits that I like a lot more than everything we got in RoS.

I think it could use some serious cuts to it, but there's some good shit here and the fact that it doesn't just dump everything TLJ did is a good start.

Again, not all of it works (cthulu sith god?), but if they could shave it down to the stuff that works, I think this could've been rad.
 

daegan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
957
I absolutely can see where this would have been interesting but also the problems with the third act that would make Lucasfilm pull the rip cord.

I don't necessarily think what we got was better, but I think it was the bombast they were probably looking for. They clearly wanted it to feel like more of an event than TLJ did by "wrapping everything up" but that was too much pressure to put on one movie, period.
 

♡♪!?

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,878
Remember that in TROS, Rey is in love with a mass-murderer and makes out with him.
For me a big difference is how when Vader dies, he looks so weak and kind of pathectic underneath the mask, other people run past him like he's nothing, whereas Kylo is literally romanticised and I think there's something not quite right about two men writing how our heroine Rey should reward her abuser with a make out session.
 

Retromess

Member
Nov 9, 2017
143
Can I live in the parallel universe where we got this than the absolute pile of trash that was RoS?

This sounds like it actually follows The Last Jedi rather than spending half of its existence pretending that movie didn't exist. Definitely reads like a first pass at a script but there's a lot in there I would have loved to see, which is more than I can say about the like... two things that were enjoyable in RoS.
 

Bonefish

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,403
Listening to the podcast describing the script, it sounds like it was written by people who really love Star Wars, as opposed to people who just love the OT
 

LossAversion

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,071
Hey, you could probably make a really compelling movie if you took the good stuff from this leak and the good stuff from Rise and mashed it all together!
 

matrix-cat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,987
Just going by the raw bullet points, this sounds like the lesser of two evils compared to TROS, but then it's all in the execution.

A major point in its favour is that it is a sequel to The Last Jedi, and it's obviously written as an ending to Episodes 7 and 8 rather than the wrongheaded idea that Episode 9 had to be an ending to the entire trilogy of trilogies. To me that's what sank TROS more than anything else and made the ST characters feel like awkward bystanders in what should have been their own movie. This version keeps the focus on the new characters, doesn't try to dredge up old shit that was already dealt with 30 years ago. Character arcs and story threads follow on contiguously from TLJ; there's none of the clunky retconning that TROS did, no attempt to go back and retell the last movie before telling its own story.

On the other hand there's a bunch of dumb bullshit, too. It's ludicrously overstuffed and seems like it would have sailed past the three hour mark. There are so many new locations that it seems like it'd rival TROS's mcguffin quest in terms of planet-hopping. Introducing an ancient Sith for Kylo to go and find so he can do his own ESB Luke training montage seems nuts to try and pull off in the final movie, on top of him turning into a Vader-style metal man. I'm not completely against the idea of not redeeming Kylo, but revealing him as having killed Rey's parents is just one twist too many. More thematically-relevant than the Palpatine reveal is, at least, but still totally unnecessary.

I don't know, it is closer to what I think a logical, thematically-consistent followup to TFA and TLJ would have been, but I would still have had some serious complaints with this version of Episode 9. There's every chance this screenplay could have been botched and ended up even worse than TROS. My hope is that one day Rian Johnson might, on a whim, post some kind of out-of-the-blue, names-changed, gender-swapped story on a blog that details what his version might have been, ala Marc Laidlaw's Half-Life 3 plot.
 

€pcott

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,149
US, East Coast
Script would have benefitted from a bit of ironing out. Probably would have been preferable than starting from scratch with a new writer like they did.

Surprised there was no sign of that “Second Snoke apprentice” that was rumored to be in the cards.
 

Tuorom

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,679

Gamer @ Heart

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,949
The summary reads like an an actual sequel to 8, at least but I wouldn't call anything good. Things read better on paper where your head fills in the dots.

Ben being the one who killed her parents is laughable though. But him not getting redemption would have actually subverted expectations.
 

Rendering...

Member
Oct 30, 2017
10,153
Well shit, it really does sound much better than Rise of Skywalker. Needs some workshopping, but it would have been at least good with decent direction.
 
Dec 2, 2017
1,415
Now we just need the Jack Thorne version (the one where Rey was the daughter of the Organa family housekeeper) and the George version (with Whills and midichlorians).
I want to see the Lucas story treatments so badly. Midichlorians, Whills (finally!) and all his other whacky ideas. This aspect has always been one of my favourite of Star Wars and I love what they hinted at in the Yoda TCW episodes.
 

Ocarina_117

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,083
The concept of the whills, immortality and more Lucas craziness is infinitely more interesting than anything in the sequel trilogy.

Now find a way to throw lovecraftian dark side beings into the mix and we're talking.
 

antonz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,512
Force Ghosts being used as a means of Terrorizing people would completely destroy what the whole concept of Force Ghosts are. They aren't there so you can be an asshole to someone you want to torment. Force Ghosts exist to pass on Knowledge and in Lucas's case to keep the Order alive even if the last Jedi dies because select few Jedi were enlightened enough to transcend death and be able to pass on knowledge.

People cheer stuff like this on then complain Palaptine ruined the chosen one prophecy or other crap
 

Drewton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,295
Force Ghosts being used as a means of Terrorizing people would completely destroy what the whole concept of Force Ghosts are. They aren't there so you can be an asshole to someone you want to torment. Force Ghosts exist to pass on Knowledge and in Lucas's case to keep the Order alive even if the last Jedi dies because select few Jedi were enlightened enough to transcend death and be able to pass on knowledge.

People cheer stuff like this on then complain Palaptine ruined the chosen one prophecy or other crap
Agreed
 

ibyea

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,060
I wouldn't say good, but definitely better than what we got. I shouldn't have celebrated when Trevorrow was fired, lol, assuming this leak is true.