Except Destiny is well regarded by a huge chunk of people as being the best feeling fps on the market. You may not think that but it is naive to pretend a ton of people don't.
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Axios: Xbox chief thinks today’s Microsoft could have kept Bungie
- Thread starter szuhaadalis
- Start date
Bungie would be so much better with funding from Xbox and GP being a bed for them to try more cool stuff. Thing is for Xbox now are Bungie the same as they were back when they made Halo? how many people are even still there, Destiny 2 has been a bit iffy on many things and I dropped it very quickly and never went back.
How can the company that makes the fps with the best gun play not be one of the best fps developers? That doesn't make any sense. Also they are the only one making Raids which imo are the most interesting thing in the FPS space right now and no other developer is even close to what bungie is doing with FPS raids.
They might have kept them long enough to fund Destiny initially but it seems Bungie was going to go indie eventually. I think they made the wrong choice partnering with Activision and allowing Sony to moneyhat them but hey make mistakes, make up for it and I believe they have for the most part. I was ok with Bungie leaving as long as that meant their employees felt comfortable and secure and fired up to make some great games.
They make fun gameplay. They don't make the best. The best gunplay doesn't require that much ridiculous auto aim, which is why so many people think it's fun.
That's another good point. Destiny aside, Bungie is continuously praised as one of the best workspaces in the industry for its employees, as well as one of the most vocal and supportive LGBTQ+ allies.
Say what you will about Destiny, but I'm sure these are being taken into consideration with the statements as well.
since this is a Destiny thread now - it's one of those games I enjoy for hours then bounce off hard. Shooting wise I can't agree it feels great, the enemies all seem various forms of cumbersome sponges…who you repeatedly fight,..repeatedly.
I see what people like but it's not for me. Will be interesting to see what Bungie do next.
I see what people like but it's not for me. Will be interesting to see what Bungie do next.
Gun play is not the only thing that makes for a great game. Halo 4 had great gun play, the multiplayer was not great. Halo 5 had fantastic gun play, the campaign did not hit the right marks.
Bungie gets gun play, but the launch of Destiny was a mess; took two expansions to get it right. Destiny 2 was a mess: took two expansions to get it right.
I am sure they have but Bungie's asking price is probably too high for it to make sense. Look at the two IPOs for Roblox and PUBG. That is the most likely path forward for them.
Don't think I agree with Phil on this one, because this is only secondarily about money, so I'm not sure he truly understands what Bungie really wanted.
As a developer working for a platform owner, you're obviously going to be limited to what benefits the platform holder the most. I think Bungie was interested in creating their own 'platform', a game that people can play everywhere, on every system, something where players are globally connected to one another. No boundaries.
That'd never be possible with Microsoft, even todays Microsoft. Would MS be okay spending hundreds of millions of dollars on a game that the developer then also wants to port to PS5, so that everybody can play together? I have my doubts.
I think Microsoft is in this weird 'between a rock and a hard place' position where they're saying that this is the vision that they want to see happening in the future, no artificial walls, no boundaries, but then they're not necessarily acting accordingly, I think mostly because the other parties aren't playing along. Microsoft would probably keep going into this direction if other parties would participate, as in, if Nintendo / Sony would allow some of their games to be playable on Xbox, but that's just not where the industry is at at this point. These corporations still very much believe in walled-gardens and are scared of change... so be it.
And I get Bungie - This is also one of the main reasons why we decided to make our next game with Private Division instead of Microsoft. We always got so many gamers saying that they love Ori, but hate that they can't play it on PlayStation. Well, why not? Because it was funded by Microsoft, hence they call the shots. Luckily, we got Microsoft to allow us to port Ori to the Nintendo Switch, but that didn't come for free and they probably only allowed it cause the title was small enough to not cause any fuss. Our next game has a grand vision where we want everyone to be able to play together, across all systems, where Moon owns the platform and the IP and we can steer it into the best direction in order to hopefully make as many people as possible happy without having to tell some of them that they're shit out of luck... cause business. I believe gamers don't necessarily care about the business part behind it all, they just want to play games that make them happy. And by creating a walled garden, you're directly or indirectly just fuming the flames of the platform-war hooligans who just want to see someone win and someone else fail.
I personally wish Microsoft would have the guts to just go through with their vision. Make their games and port them to ALL platforms, not leave anyone behind. The 13 year old kid whose parents were able to only afford to buy one system for their child now won't grow up playing Halo because Microsoft believes that it makes the most financial sense to leave PlayStation players out. How does that benefit anyone but Microsoft? Yeah, you'll probably sell a bunch more Xbox's, but you lose out on millions of potentially dedicated fans.
Show the industry that that's how you get the most amount of players to play your games. Didn't Minecraft show that that's the right way forward? If they'd do that, I'm sure pretty quickly everyone would follow suit, because usually all these corporations copy what makes the most amount of money... and on top of that, it's the best thing for the players out there.
Your goal as a platform holder should be that these games play the best on your box, not that you force people to buy your box cause you're creating an artificial barrier for other players out there who weren't able to afford buying the system you're making. I hope I'll live long enough to see the industry embracing this kinda openness.
As a developer working for a platform owner, you're obviously going to be limited to what benefits the platform holder the most. I think Bungie was interested in creating their own 'platform', a game that people can play everywhere, on every system, something where players are globally connected to one another. No boundaries.
That'd never be possible with Microsoft, even todays Microsoft. Would MS be okay spending hundreds of millions of dollars on a game that the developer then also wants to port to PS5, so that everybody can play together? I have my doubts.
I think Microsoft is in this weird 'between a rock and a hard place' position where they're saying that this is the vision that they want to see happening in the future, no artificial walls, no boundaries, but then they're not necessarily acting accordingly, I think mostly because the other parties aren't playing along. Microsoft would probably keep going into this direction if other parties would participate, as in, if Nintendo / Sony would allow some of their games to be playable on Xbox, but that's just not where the industry is at at this point. These corporations still very much believe in walled-gardens and are scared of change... so be it.
And I get Bungie - This is also one of the main reasons why we decided to make our next game with Private Division instead of Microsoft. We always got so many gamers saying that they love Ori, but hate that they can't play it on PlayStation. Well, why not? Because it was funded by Microsoft, hence they call the shots. Luckily, we got Microsoft to allow us to port Ori to the Nintendo Switch, but that didn't come for free and they probably only allowed it cause the title was small enough to not cause any fuss. Our next game has a grand vision where we want everyone to be able to play together, across all systems, where Moon owns the platform and the IP and we can steer it into the best direction in order to hopefully make as many people as possible happy without having to tell some of them that they're shit out of luck... cause business. I believe gamers don't necessarily care about the business part behind it all, they just want to play games that make them happy. And by creating a walled garden, you're directly or indirectly just fuming the flames of the platform-war hooligans who just want to see someone win and someone else fail.
I personally wish Microsoft would have the guts to just go through with their vision. Make their games and port them to ALL platforms, not leave anyone behind. The 13 year old kid whose parents were able to only afford to buy one system for their child now won't grow up playing Halo because Microsoft believes that it makes the most financial sense to leave PlayStation players out. How does that benefit anyone but Microsoft? Yeah, you'll probably sell a bunch more Xbox's, but you lose out on millions of potentially dedicated fans.
Show the industry that that's how you get the most amount of players to play your games. Didn't Minecraft show that that's the right way forward? If they'd do that, I'm sure pretty quickly everyone would follow suit, because usually all these corporations copy what makes the most amount of money... and on top of that, it's the best thing for the players out there.
Your goal as a platform holder should be that these games play the best on your box, not that you force people to buy your box cause you're creating an artificial barrier for other players out there who weren't able to afford buying the system you're making. I hope I'll live long enough to see the industry embracing this kinda openness.
"Apple's Steve Jobs premieres world exclusive first look at new first person shooter, Halo, at Macworld" will never not be a wild sentence.
Destiny 1 was not on PC and D2 is still not on the Switch. For the first three or four years of the franchise they were under contract creating exclusive PS content. That aside, I agree with your vision.
Timed-exclusive*, important distinction.
It was an awful feeling playing D1 on XBOX (because friends) knowing I was missing out on a gun or a strike, even though it would eventually make its way to our platform. Missing out on Y1D1 Hawkmoon is something I haven't fully gotten over.
I'm glad Bungie has moved away from those practices.
I think the story goes that Jobs made an angry phone call to Bill Gates after Bungie's purchase, but don't quote me on it.
Well, timed exclusive in name only. In reality it was functionally just exclusive to the PlayStation platform. Content that was exclusive for a year got extended in its exclusivity because the expansions releasing that would make the exclusive content irrelevant was delayed.
It was one of the worst practices and examples of "timed" exclusive content.
That said, maybe Microsoft could have convinced Bungie if they were the Microsoft of today? Supposedly they almost came back to Microsoft after meeting with Activision before ultimately going with Activision. Microsoft wanted IP ownership which was a non-starter.
But, I think Bungie wanted independence. Not the ability to make what they wanted. They probably could have had that back then if that was all they wanted. Destiny itself is very similar to Halo anyway so it feels like it was way more than being stuck on Halo for a decade.
The Bungie under Microsoft was also better :/
Bungie is not the company today that they were when they created Halo. The split caused people to ultimately leave anyway and Destiny never felt like it lived up to the potential at least I expected from the creators of Halo. Conceptually it did. But not in its execution.
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Microsoft would be the dumbest company in the history of gaming.
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Bungie made the right choice. Destiny is taking them to new heights, and they're expanding to grow other IP in addition to crossing Destiny over into different media.... the road is longer going independent, but its worth it.
Aha, why? Because you're literally just trading hardware sales vs. software sales. I believe software sales would make up for lost hardware sales. And Microsoft should care more about creating dedicated fans that love their games vs. dedicated followers that love their box. Whether you like it or not, your box is going away in the long run. Microsoft already allows everybody with a GamePass subscription to play their games on phones and such. So what's the difference? Just provide your service on MORE platforms.
So again, why exactly would they be 'the dumbest company in the history of gaming'? Love the hyperbole, btw.
It's not gonna happen and you need to move on from this idea. I can see why you'd want it though.
Edit: oh shit you made Ori. Is that why?
MS will publish their games on any system that allows for Gamepass 100% including third party content they buy out.
MS has just released the cheapest next next gen system. Cheaper than the OG Swtich ffs - are we really doing the 'oh but what about the person who can only buy one system' thing? No reason to press that on a single company.
MS has just released the cheapest next next gen system. Cheaper than the OG Swtich ffs - are we really doing the 'oh but what about the person who can only buy one system' thing? No reason to press that on a single company.
I'm kinda glad they moved away from MS. I was really done with Microsoft by the end of the 360/PS3 era. It felt like they abandoned their console down the stretch while PS3 was getting incredible games like Last of Us. I probably would have never played Destiny if it was an MS exclusive since I didn't get an Xbox One until many years after the PS4 dropped.
D1 was confusing and annoying to figure out as a solo player in the first year but the switch from a mostly hip-fire shooter like Halo to the aim-down-sights based shooting of Destiny felt amazing gameplay-wise. Even now I struggle to go back to Halo for long periods of time as it feels like going back to Goldeneye 64 from twin stick shooters like Halo CE.
These days I'm on Xbox more than PlayStation but I still prefer Bungie to be multi platform. Being able to pick up D2 on PS5 or on my web-browser with Stadia is great and I doubt MS would let that happen.
D1 was confusing and annoying to figure out as a solo player in the first year but the switch from a mostly hip-fire shooter like Halo to the aim-down-sights based shooting of Destiny felt amazing gameplay-wise. Even now I struggle to go back to Halo for long periods of time as it feels like going back to Goldeneye 64 from twin stick shooters like Halo CE.
These days I'm on Xbox more than PlayStation but I still prefer Bungie to be multi platform. Being able to pick up D2 on PS5 or on my web-browser with Stadia is great and I doubt MS would let that happen.
1. On Minecraft, it was multiplatform even before Microsoft bought Mojang.
2. Selling individual exclusive games is not the business. The business is the walled garden......it is where you sell your software, it is where you make commissions on third party games, it is where money is made from services.
3. Microsoft/Sony/Nintendo take some of the profits that they make in those walled gardens to fund those exclusives in return looking to make more money. There is zero incentive for someone on PlayStation to get into the Xbox ecosystem if they can have all Xbox games available on PlayStation.
That is the quickest way to kill Xbox as a business. This is what people expected when they bought Bethesda too.
The box is going away, but they are just storefronts. Those storefronts are not going away.....you might see some consolidation, but that will be it.
If someone is taking money from a platform holder on a publishing deal, their remit is to make a game that makes that platform shine. Dedicated fans on other consoles will not pay bills, if anything, it is making Sony/Nintendo money because they still make a commission.
I think one can argue it was an Activision thing or at least that's what I keep telling myself
We'll get there with GamePass eventually. Although it is more than just lost hardware sales. It's accessories, XBL, growing the ecosystem aka Xbox store. That said, they have made a bunch of concessions to get their games on Steam which has been a massive success so far.
I mean the last few seasons haven't been hot either to be honest.
Witch Queen is looking okay though.
Bungie was better before MS IMO. I always thought they would have grown into a publisher as big as EA or Activision if they had stayed independent with Halo.
And who's to say they wouldn't have kept the same attitude towards Bungie? That's kinda the point, they pick a team and say 'you're making X forever' and that was the case until they left when they wanted to do more.
What the hell is this post😂😂😂. The story, the art, music, gameplay, deep lore, and the amazing creative weapons in this game are enough for people to consider it great. Those vaulted destinations aren't gone forever btw. They're being remade with modern assets according to Astecross that he got directly from Bungie.
What the hell is this post? Remade with modern assets? Lol How could anyone see what Bungie did with the Cosmodrome and still have any faith in them. Also deep lord. Good one.
But at that point, why would anyone buy a Xbox console? Why would Microsoft even make a Xbox console? Everyone would just buy a Playstation, where they can play the Sony exclusives/timed exclusives AND play all Xbox games too. The only reason anyone would stick around is because of brand loyalty.
The general population doesn't care about where games play the best. They used to, back in like the PS3-360 generation cause there were noticeable differences but now, especially when PC comes to play, you can't even tell the difference unless Digital Foundry tells you
Exclusives are what separates these platforms/consoles. When we look back on consoles, all of them are defined by their exclusives and how they innovated gaming. Microsoft putting their exclusives on other console platforms is essentially them going 3rd party. Which is not good for the industry. Sony and Nintendo need competition. Sony especially
The Series S is an incredibly good machine on a budget. I'm thinking of getting one just because of how convenient it is.
Lets say Halo, Forza, Starfield, Avowed, etc were all also available on the PS5. Would you still buy a Series S, If so, why?
Cosmodrome looks amazing. You're on your own on this one. Just because you lapsed as a player doesn't mean Destiny isn't thriving. Theres problems with the systems/ economy of materials in this game but that's where the problems end imo. What are your problems with the cosmodrome that has you up in arms?
Why does it exist? Why is it so lifeless and boring? Why isnt it the complete cosmodrome? Why was no effort put into it to make it a patrol you'd want to visit? It exists for no reason other than nostalgia.
It would not make up for revenue from services tho. Microsoft can't offer Xbox live and Game Pass to Playstation owners because Sony won't let them.
Destiny 2 has the very real problem of being unwelcoming to both new and returning players.
Bungie retained its excellent gunplay and presentation, but the story and content that Bungie produced in their Halo years far exceeds that of their Destiny years. The core of Destiny 2 just feels shallow.
Bungie retained its excellent gunplay and presentation, but the story and content that Bungie produced in their Halo years far exceeds that of their Destiny years. The core of Destiny 2 just feels shallow.
Absolutely they could have. For as much as Bungie joked about leaving, they didn't actually attempt to leave until Microsoft started preventing them from doing things they wanted to do. If Microsoft let Bungie go make Destiny like they wanted, then Bungie would have remained a Microsoft Studio. 100%
Microsoft of today would have hapily just spun up another Studio or let Bungie hire a "Non Halo Team"
Microsoft of today would have hapily just spun up another Studio or let Bungie hire a "Non Halo Team"
The lore in Destiny is comparable to Haloverse novels included.
How exactly did Bungie leave Microsoft ? Microsoft didn't just let them go for nothing did they ?
I'm just referring to the game story as presented, which is extremely poor compared to Halo's presentation of its story.
As far as I know, the only real deal was Microsoft gets Halo, Bungie was signed on for two Halo projects — Reach and ODST, and Microsoft got right of first refusal for their next project.
Bungie were about to collapse until MS bailed them out. Made bad bets on other titles I believe.
And Halo wouldn't be what it is if it didn't focus solely on console. It revolutionised console FPS and multiplayer and used Xbox features (which at the time was ahead of everything) to its fullest. LAN gaming with Xbox was only a thing because of MS having the foresight to stick a network card into a console and Bungie putting everything they had to make MP special. One of those rare moments in history when everything comes together to make magic.